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Borrowing here, borrowing there... Early Cinema 007 influence & formulation

chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
edited January 2013 in Bond Movies Posts: 17,830
Just finished watching Hitchcock's North By Northwest, and it occurs to me that the screenwriter had definitely read a Bond novel or two before writing his story, and similarly, the film-makers of Dr. No had definitely seen North By Northwest before filming their movie. Interesting, the give & take- Terence Young was obviously a Hitchcock fan, as were the producers, ya think?

Comments

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    We can discuss this here:
    http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/4290/references-to-other-movies-in-bond/p1
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,830
    That's a thread about other movie references in Bond movies, this is about discussing how early Bond movies came to be what they were based on sources influencing each other (written & film- content & style). So yeah, we could discuss it there, but why not discuss it here seeing as it's pretty much a completely different topic? ;)
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    In that thread I recall talking with others about NBNW and how it and Hitch could have deeply affected how EON handled the Bond films (and we made note of their winks to NBNW in FRWL). But I will let the mods decide how to handle this. If they decide to let this run, I will be more than happy to hop in and join the discourse. :)
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    edited January 2013 Posts: 12,837
    Not really borrowing for all of them but these are the Bond films that I think were influenced.

    FRWL- NBNW
    LALD- Blaxpoitation
    TMWTGG- Kung Fu flicks
    TSWLM- Jaws (the name, nothing else)
    MR- Star Wars
    CR- Batman Begins
    QOS- Bourne

    The Brosnan era feel like 90s action flicks and LTK feels like an 80s action flick but that's not really borrowing. More them being a product of their times.
  • RC7RC7
    edited January 2013 Posts: 10,512
    thelivingroyale wrote:
    Not really borrowing for all of them but these are the Bond films that I think were influenced.

    FRWL- NBNW
    LALD- Blaxpoitation
    TMWTGG- Kung Fu flicks
    TSWLM- Jaws (the name, nothing else)
    MR- Star Wars
    CR- Batman Begins
    QOS- Bourne

    The Brosnan era feel like 90s action flicks and LTK feels like an 80s action flick but that's not really borrowing.

    I'd add SF - TDK to that list. Not sure about TSWLM, I think the main influence on that film was probably YOLT, for obvious reasons.

    Maybe Bond 24 will be in a position to buck the trend, and set the standard.
  • GerardGerard
    Posts: 6,022
    Well, the plane scene from Norht by Northwest certainly influenced the helicopter scene from FRWL. Anyway, there were many "hitchcockian" elements in the early Bonds which later on became less and less obvious. The Royal Albert Hall concert from both versions of The Man Who Knew Too Much being one such examples, having found its way in TSWLM (the Pyramids) and QOS (Tosca, the best scene from that movie).
  • thelordflasheartthelordflasheart
    Posts: 1,370
    RC7 wrote:
    thelivingroyale wrote:
    Not really borrowing for all of them but these are the Bond films that I think were influenced.

    FRWL- NBNW
    LALD- Blaxpoitation
    TMWTGG- Kung Fu flicks
    TSWLM- Jaws (the name, nothing else)
    MR- Star Wars
    CR- Batman Begins
    QOS- Bourne

    The Brosnan era feel like 90s action flicks and LTK feels like an 80s action flick but that's not really borrowing.

    I'd add SF - TDK to that list. Not sure about TSWLM, I think the main influence on that film was probably YOLT, for obvious reasons.

    Maybe Bond 24 will be in a position to buck the trend, and set the standard.

    I would also add that LTK was influenced by Miami Vice (the TV show), as well as the "War On Drugs" too (by the way, the war ended years ago and drugs won. What a waste of resources). I'd also say that TND was influenced by the growing popularity (at least in the US) of Chinese action films and martial arts films in the 90s.

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited January 2013 Posts: 17,830
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote:
    we made note of their winks to NBNW in FRWL).
    That helicopter attack on Bond was clearly lifted from the biplane attack on Thornhill, but what interests me more is the genesis of Bond particularly as it applies to Dr. No.
    When writing the script for NBNW I imagine some of the more absurd moments of Fleming's works came to mind, as well as spy stuff in general from movies and novels of the fifties, of course. But that chase around Mt. Rushmore was a step past what had been done in cinema up to that point, and I'm betting we have the influence of Bond to thank for that. Conversely, when planning Dr. No it seems clear to me now that a decision to 'lighten' Bond up some (those early novels had little or no humour in Bond's character) was DIRECTLY influenced by the character of Roger Thornhill, who seems to me to basically be Bond without the killer instinct (a lot like Roger Moore's Bond, strangely enough). Terence Young & Co deliberately imbued Connery's Bond with a slightly darker version of the wit that Grant employed with great success...
    Ticket Seller: Something wrong with your eyes?
    Roger Thornhill: Yes, they're sensitive to questions.
    This early decision on the very first film IMO affects to this day the cinematic version of Bond that we see.
    So, Bond influences Hitchcock, who in turn influences Bond.

  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    thelivingroyale wrote:
    Not really borrowing for all of them but these are the Bond films that I think were influenced.

    FRWL- NBNW Disagree, besides the helicopterchase in the highlands FRWL is fairly faithfull to the earlier Fleming book.
    LALD- Blaxpoitation
    TMWTGG- Kung Fu flicks
    TSWLM- Jaws (the name, nothing else) This is by all means an original take upon the early 007 movies/books, added was a grander scale.
    MR- Star Wars Not specific SW or ST but the general popularity of scifi, smart move by Broccoli. And the MR special effects are still superiour to the CGI of DAD & QoS.
    CR- Batman Begins, BB did some serious borrowing from the Shadow (in my view bordering on plagiarism) so at least CR borrowed from a better movie and older hero. ;)
    QOS- Bourne, specificly The Bourne supremacy, which carries a better carchase than the opening of QoB, the footchase and fight by Bourne is better and one can actually see what happens. QoB lacks the actual decent script that its direct competitor does have.

    The Brosnan era feel like 90s action flicks and LTK feels like an 80s action flick but that's not really borrowing. More them being a product of their times.

    LTK has borrowed to much from the Miami Vice storybook, only lacked the coolness of Johnson and his ferrari.
    TLD felt much more like a movie suited for the skills of Brosnan and/or Moore, so in essence it borrowed from the Moore-era.

    The Brosnan movies were more or less influenced by other movies, unless one looks at TND which has a strong female martial art actress, which was popular actually in those days. I think the Brosnan era is actually hindered by the changing world were nobody actaully was quite sure what was about to happen. The great threats were somewhat gone hence I feel the political choice for making a North Korean a baddie who only wants to give his country some greatness in the face of the US as only lasting superpower.

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    LTK does have the look of a Miami Vice episode.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,830
    I found an interesting article:
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2009/jun/13/alfred-hitchcock-north-by-northwest
    "North By Northwest has been called the first James Bond movie (screenwriter Ernest Lehman called it "the ultimate Hitchcock picture" while he was writing it, but no matter). And the similarities are evident. In 1960 Hitchcock himself briefly considered directing Thunderball. Ian Fleming originally wanted Grant (who was a good friend of Bond producer Cubby Broccoli) to play 007 in Dr No, and North By Northwest surely had a lot to do with that (Grant turned down the part). 1959 was also the year Fleming published Goldfinger, the first truly ridiculous Bond novel (delightful though it is), which, as the third Bond movie, would perfect the NXNW-style template from which the series would barely deviate until the advent of Daniel Craig."
    Hmmm, I guess this is old stuff to some of you guys... :)>-
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