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I could probably post way more if I ditched all other free time hobbies and movie-watching, but it's also one of those things where I've said so much about all of the films and eras over the years that I don't know what else to share that would be not only a repeat of things I've said previously but something others are interested in reading and responding to. It's a bit defeating making lengthy, passionate posts on here that fall to the wayside and incite no discussion at all, but it happens.
And then they summarily killed Mathis off... :( Shades of deaths to come?
Vesper's death in CR is integral to understanding the Bond character, just as Tracy's death demonstrates the constraints of Bond's profession.
But some of these other deaths have been more done for shock value, almost as if Eon learned the wrong lessons from CR.
Or maybe CR was always lightning in a bottle, down to the casting of Vesper (last-minute, can you imagine this film succeeding without Eva Green? I can't) and Mathis, and Eon was doomed to try to recapture the success of CR, and fail.
@Creasy47, I can relate to all that. Feeling like I was repeating myself over and over was one of the biggest reasons for me just taking a long break. After a while, you really do feel you've said all you can say at that time and place in your life, or every discussion you have goes in circles over and over. Either way, you strive to break the cycle and give your brain a rest.
@echo, I guess I'd be more upset about Mathis being killed a bit swiftly if he was a major Fleming character. That being said, from all that I've read of the Fleming books, he's never a big feature. I'm certainly more fascinated and engaged with how he's used in CR or QoS than in the books, as he just has more to do and is more integral to the overall story and this Bond's development. I would've loved to have more of him, but I think he served a wonderful purpose and is one of the main reasons and influences as to how Craig's Bond becomes the man he's destined to be. Can't ask for much more beyond that, especially since he wouldn't have easily fit in the other movies after QoS story wise. It was hard enough squeezing Felix in there one last time.
What felt fresh to me about CR is that they were really going all-in on Fleming in so many exciting ways, including introducing Mathis.
And I did like that they successfully introduced a character who, while different from the novel version, could easily have had more longevity with the series. Not unlike, say, the Minister of Defence who kept popping up throughout the Moore era and was always a joy to see.
@echo, I just think there's a big difference between a location and a character being written into a story. There's always a way to make it so that Bond has to return to a location, particularly or especially if he's had history there, and you can write any kind of action or plot into a place no matter what it is, but it's a lot harder to justify writing a whole character into a story because they have to belong there, or you'll immediately feel they're out of place. I can't imagine how anyone outside of the UK based characters we already saw in the film would've factored into SF, for example, and NTTD was particularly strong because it focused more on Bond and his core interactions from the whole series without it all feeling too heavily loaded. Having more characters on board would've unfocused it, and the pacing would suffer for it.
SP is really the only time I could see characters like Felix or Mathis factoring in, as they knew about Quantum and could help Bond face SPECTRE once they were out of the shadows, but even then I just don't see how it would've worked properly. I was much happier having Mathis's dynamic with Bond wrapped up in QoS, with him being the driving force to make Bond forgive himself and Vesper, then have a character like White haunt him from the past into the present in SP to show him that some things can never be forgotten. I think having Felix written in would've been a bit too much as well, as the story worked best with Bond and Madeleine facing it all together while building their dynamic in ways that pay off in NTTD big time. I far prefer Felix just being mentioned by name by Bond instead of directly being featured, as the writers' way of saying, "there wasn't really a place for Felix in the story, but we want you to know he's still out there doing his thing."
I guess I'm not concerned about any characters having longevity, I just like a character to be featured as much as they deserve to be, or need to be to service the story. I only care if a character feels under featured and I want more of them that we didn't get, or if they are too shoe-horned into the story to the point that it feels disingenuous and awkward. I think the Craig era did a brilliant job of finding that unique balance, where characters had their time to shine, and either faded away at a fitting moment or came back briefly to haunt or honor Bond in some manner. I can't think of any characters I was dying for more of, or characters that I couldn't wait to see go.
Mathis is a favorite character from my favorite Fleming novel, and how he was used in the film just adds to my feelings. Smart for the filmmakers to contrast a new double-O with a long-time agent, and then show him taking one mission too many.
Maybe inevitable for agents like Mathis, Leiter, and Bond. And good storytelling.
@RichardTheBruce, I agree. One of the core ideas in those films is people doing things too long, and that is definitely underscored by characters like Mathis, and even M herself. White is also a haunting reminder of what happens when you try to move on too late, and what happens to your soul. But that job becomes part of their life, and it becomes hard for them to detach from it.
I think part of what makes Bond special in particular is that while he stayed on the job too long, he came back and died with his soul at its fullest, knowing he was dying for those he loved and everyone else all over the world. More than any other character we lost, he died at his most complete, instead of being an old dog going white in the face whose soul was battered or in pieces. Even when he dies, he does so with pride, with a bit of a grin to his face. He knows his sacrifice is a worthy one, and that he is leaving behind a legacy to be proud of. I don't think Mathis, M, or Felix could say as much, and certainly not the guilt ridden White.