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  • SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ Lekki, Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 2,016
    007HallY wrote: »
    SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ wrote: »
    007HallY wrote: »
    I think making it (at least in part) a musical could have worked. It's certainly not uncommon to include musical numbers in otherwise dark films/tv shows (I'm thinking of something like 'The Name Game' in the second season of American Horror Story, which I think was the kind of tone they wanted with Joker 2).

    I dunno, I think a lot of the ideas were there for an interesting sequel that could have easily have been better than the first (I'd argue the first one isn't a particularly interesting film in general really).

    Exactly. The first one isn't exactly spectacular. It's quite a depressing film to be honest.

    The first one just made me want to rewatch The King of Comedy. Not to say the fact that Joker bears a lot of similarities to that or Taxi Driver is a bad thing. It's just that I feel something like KOC is much more twisted and darkly comedic, which I'd say is what I'd expect from a movie about the Joker.

    Yes. That's a better film to use as an example. It's more balanced and delivers what it aims for.
  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns I am trying to get away from this mountan!
    edited October 15 Posts: 25,106
    The Penguin episodes 3 and 4 are very good, the show went in the direction i hoped they would. the recasting of a certain character worked very well as there is a lot more menace.

    Cristin Milioti will be a superstar, brilliant actress.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,629
    Fire_and_Ice_Returns wrote: »
    The Penguin episodes 3 and 4 are very good, the show went in the direction i hoped they would. the recasting of a certain character worked very well as there is a lot more menace.

    Cristin Milioti will be a superstar, brilliant actress.

    I find it funny (no pun intended) that The Penguin is getting raves, but Joker 2 is getting slammed. Two Batman villain spin-offs on the opposite end of the spectrum. It be interesting to see if WB and DC will move forward with other villains.
  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns I am trying to get away from this mountan!
    edited October 15 Posts: 25,106
    MaxCasino wrote: »
    Fire_and_Ice_Returns wrote: »
    The Penguin episodes 3 and 4 are very good, the show went in the direction i hoped they would. the recasting of a certain character worked very well as there is a lot more menace.

    Cristin Milioti will be a superstar, brilliant actress.

    I find it funny (no pun intended) that The Penguin is getting raves, but Joker 2 is getting slammed. Two Batman villain spin-offs on the opposite end of the spectrum. It be interesting to see if WB and DC will move forward with other villains.

    The Penguin is just written well with great acting and characterization, I have not rushed to see Joker 2 I will wait until streaming which seems immanent.

    From what I have read Joker 2 was a disaster waiting to happen, it will be lucky to get close to The Flash box office numbers which is really bad.

    If WB hire the right people another villain spinoff will work, I am hoping that The Penguin gets another season as they have a hit show here.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,183
    SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ wrote: »
    If Todd Philips had done it like a normal film, instead of a musical, it wouldn't have been this bad. But then again, it's a sequel no one really wanted.
    Musicals don't work all the time. But it can be an entertaining and successful genre, if done right.

    That’s the thing, it wasn’t done right. I think the first or two musical sequences worked to an extent, but afterwards each new set piece felt disconnected from the story and felt like filler. It’s like a movie where we keep getting dream sequences over and over with no point to them. Then there’s the ending of the film which sounds like it wasn’t meant to do anything other than upset fans of the first.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,629
    I just picked up Batman: Resurrection by John Jackson Miller. It's set between the two Tim Burton movies. He signed my book today! Clayface is reinvented brilliantly, fitting into Tim Burton's Gotham City. The reviews are great. I should be reading it soon. There is a sequel on the way: Batman: Revolution, planned for fall 2025. Some questions will be answered from Batman 89. It's a decent time to be a Batman fan!
  • 007HallY007HallY
    Posts: 4,139
    Fire_and_Ice_Returns wrote: »
    MaxCasino wrote: »
    Fire_and_Ice_Returns wrote: »
    The Penguin episodes 3 and 4 are very good, the show went in the direction i hoped they would. the recasting of a certain character worked very well as there is a lot more menace.

    Cristin Milioti will be a superstar, brilliant actress.

    I find it funny (no pun intended) that The Penguin is getting raves, but Joker 2 is getting slammed. Two Batman villain spin-offs on the opposite end of the spectrum. It be interesting to see if WB and DC will move forward with other villains.

    The Penguin is just written well with great acting and characterization, I have not rushed to see Joker 2 I will wait until streaming which seems immanent.

    From what I have read Joker 2 was a disaster waiting to happen, it will be lucky to get close to The Flash box office numbers which is really bad.

    If WB hire the right people another villain spinoff will work, I am hoping that The Penguin gets another season as they have a hit show here.

    I was sceptical about Penguin but I must admit I’ve heard very good things about it. I know Matt Reeves has a background in writing/producing for television so it seems like it’s been well thought out by everyone involved and not just a cash grab after The Batman. I’ll have to give it a watch.
  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns I am trying to get away from this mountan!
    Posts: 25,106
    007HallY wrote: »
    Fire_and_Ice_Returns wrote: »
    MaxCasino wrote: »
    Fire_and_Ice_Returns wrote: »
    The Penguin episodes 3 and 4 are very good, the show went in the direction i hoped they would. the recasting of a certain character worked very well as there is a lot more menace.

    Cristin Milioti will be a superstar, brilliant actress.

    I find it funny (no pun intended) that The Penguin is getting raves, but Joker 2 is getting slammed. Two Batman villain spin-offs on the opposite end of the spectrum. It be interesting to see if WB and DC will move forward with other villains.

    The Penguin is just written well with great acting and characterization, I have not rushed to see Joker 2 I will wait until streaming which seems immanent.

    From what I have read Joker 2 was a disaster waiting to happen, it will be lucky to get close to The Flash box office numbers which is really bad.

    If WB hire the right people another villain spinoff will work, I am hoping that The Penguin gets another season as they have a hit show here.

    I was sceptical about Penguin but I must admit I’ve heard very good things about it. I know Matt Reeves has a background in writing/producing for television so it seems like it’s been well thought out by everyone involved and not just a cash grab after The Batman. I’ll have to give it a watch.

    From what i have read the show is gaining more viewers by each week, I like to see a series do well based on word of mouth.

    After watching episode 4 and how it makes you view earlier episodes differently i am eager to rewacth The Batman to see if it adds layers to that film also.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    Fire_and_Ice_Returns wrote: »
    007HallY wrote: »
    Fire_and_Ice_Returns wrote: »
    MaxCasino wrote: »
    Fire_and_Ice_Returns wrote: »
    The Penguin episodes 3 and 4 are very good, the show went in the direction i hoped they would. the recasting of a certain character worked very well as there is a lot more menace.

    Cristin Milioti will be a superstar, brilliant actress.

    I find it funny (no pun intended) that The Penguin is getting raves, but Joker 2 is getting slammed. Two Batman villain spin-offs on the opposite end of the spectrum. It be interesting to see if WB and DC will move forward with other villains.

    The Penguin is just written well with great acting and characterization, I have not rushed to see Joker 2 I will wait until streaming which seems immanent.

    From what I have read Joker 2 was a disaster waiting to happen, it will be lucky to get close to The Flash box office numbers which is really bad.

    If WB hire the right people another villain spinoff will work, I am hoping that The Penguin gets another season as they have a hit show here.

    I was sceptical about Penguin but I must admit I’ve heard very good things about it. I know Matt Reeves has a background in writing/producing for television so it seems like it’s been well thought out by everyone involved and not just a cash grab after The Batman. I’ll have to give it a watch.

    From what i have read the show is gaining more viewers by each week, I like to see a series do well based on word of mouth.

    After watching episode 4 and how it makes you view earlier episodes differently i am eager to rewacth The Batman to see if it adds layers to that film also.

    Me too.

    And yes, this series is excellent!!!!!!
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,629
    MakeshiftPython wrote: »
    SecretAgentMan⁰⁰⁷ wrote: »
    If Todd Philips had done it like a normal film, instead of a musical, it wouldn't have been this bad. But then again, it's a sequel no one really wanted.
    Musicals don't work all the time. But it can be an entertaining and successful genre, if done right.

    That’s the thing, it wasn’t done right. I think the first or two musical sequences worked to an extent, but afterwards each new set piece felt disconnected from the story and felt like filler. It’s like a movie where we keep getting dream sequences over and over with no point to them. Then there’s the ending of the film which sounds like it wasn’t meant to do anything other than upset fans of the first.

    https://www.cbr.com/hideo-kojima-joker-2/

    I agree with him. Joker 2 does have the possibility to become a cult classic. For now, my wishes for the cinematic versions of Batman and Superman (and to a degree Supergirl) are a mixed bag.
  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns I am trying to get away from this mountan!
    edited November 12 Posts: 25,106
    The Penguin season finale got very dark.

    Overall excellent season, the last episode was intense, good
    Penguin organ story.
    .

    Great last shot.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    The last episode was everything great about the show condensed into one hour, with almost no weaknesses. It was excellent.
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    edited November 12 Posts: 4,629
    The last month with the Penguin and Joker 2 brings up a continuous debate: Marvel might make better movies on average, while DC makes the better TV shows on average. Clearly, Matt Reeves was the right choice to guide Batman in more than one way. As much as I like Man of Steel, it is a sad "what if" if Matt Reeves had been able to direct it.
  • Fire_and_Ice_ReturnsFire_and_Ice_Returns I am trying to get away from this mountan!
    edited November 12 Posts: 25,106
    MaxCasino wrote: »
    The last month with the Penguin and Joker 2 brings up a continuous debate: Marvel might make better movies on average, while DC makes the better TV shows on average. Clearly, Matt Reeves was the right choice to guide Batman in more than one way. As much as I like Man of Steel, it is a sad "what if" if Matt Reeves had been able to direct it.

    I think bar a couple of decent films Marvel has been on a very bad run with movies and even worse with TV. The Batman's first two act's are great but Reeves really dropped the ball with the final act IMO. Admittedly something great came from the third act of The Batman in the form of The Penguin TV show. I will have to rewatch The Batman to see if the ending works better post The Penguin.
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