Is TWINE the most divisive film in the series?

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  • Posts: 2,341
    TWINE the most divisive in the series? NO WAY.
    LTK is would fit in this category and Timothy Dalton as the most divisive Bond.
    OHMSS is such a good film and has acquired quite a following (and cult status) over the years but LTK has not been so fortunate.

    TWINE is universally despised among die hard fans.
  • Posts: 15,233
    OHMSS69 wrote:
    TWINE the most divisive in the series? NO WAY.
    LTK is would fit in this category and Timothy Dalton as the most divisive Bond.
    OHMSS is such a good film and has acquired quite a following (and cult status) over the years but LTK has not been so fortunate.

    TWINE is universally despised among die hard fans.

    I don't think it is despised, it has its fans, or at least people who like it. But it is not very divisive compared to say MR. Maybe it is the most divisive of Brosnan's.
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,255
    OHMSS69 wrote:
    TWINE is universally despised among die hard fans.

    Hmmm, I consider myself a die hard fan and like it quite a bit. See how divisive it is!


    ;)
  • edited May 2013 Posts: 3,494
    @Sir_James- thank you for the second, intentional or not. Many people, even some of my fellow originals have fallen into the "let's excuse Lazenby" trap due to how awesome the film is. He deserves the least amount of credit for the film's renaissance over the years. It was the 99 cent, bargain bin DAD of it's day even into the 1990's as you noted.

    Agreed on all counts @SirHenry and you put it better than I did. Lazenby gets a pass as his performance isn't utterly dreadful but he's the weakest of the six Bond actors by a considerable margin and it's no coincidence that he's the only one who was unable to establish a career beyond Bond.

    I remember at about the time of either GE or TND Brosnan gave an interview in which he said he would like to remake OHMSS as it had the most interesting material for Bond's character. The general consensus on alt.fan.james-bond at the time was that remaking any of the existing films was a bad idea but, if it were to happen, OHMSS would be the most suitable film as it was the most forgettable entry and also the biggest missed opportunity of the series! Hard to imagine now. I remember it quite clearly because I was a big defender of it, even then, and I often found myself taking the then-controversial view that it was a good film.

    What gets me critical about TWINE's script and direction is a film like TLD as the most recent example of a psychological thriller at that time. When you first watch TLD, it's like trying to find your way out of a maze without directions- you have to follow the paths to see where it takes you. TWINE is like being in the same maze with a set of directions. The film doesn't accomplish what it sets out to do the second Renard utters Elektra's line. And Brosnan's all too obvious "huh?" gives it away even more. No element whatsoever of surprise as far as who the bad guys were. With TLD you didn't know for a good long time if Koskov or Pushkin were lying. That's why I prefer TND- it doesn't pretend to be anything it isn't, a tick the box retro nod to the 60's classics and Spy. Arnold delivers a terrific soundtrack that pays homage to Barry and the Bond sound he created, it's a fun popcorn film that doesn't push Bond somewhere he shouldn't be nor fail in telling the story. It's my favorite Brosnan performance as well, as he gets the pure spectacle of the film in much the same manner of Connery in YOLT and Moore in Spy. None of Brozzer's films fall into classic status for me, although GE could have done so if it had only had proper Bondian music and not the aural crapfest that only a musically challenged person with zero good taste would enjoy.

    I'm not for remaking an original film, as much as MR in particular as a Fleming work could stand for that. I loved the novel and was glad some of it made it into GE. Some of it and other novels have unused material that could still be used and extrapolated on.

  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,345
    I'd add that QoS is probably the most divisive film in the series, not really TWINE, and I like QoS!
  • Dragonpol wrote:
    I'd add that QoS is probably the most divisive film in the series, not really TWINE, and I like QoS!

    At the moment, this is correct. I like QOS too, but like TWINE just not one of my favorites. I like QOS ahead of (in order) DAD, MR, DAF, TWINE, TMWTGG, and AVTAK. In short, a bottom 10 film but not a bottom five and QOS is much like OHMSS in a very important way- the acting itself in QOS (except for Lazenby who does about as well as Elvis except for obviously being more useful and a better fighter) is top notch and what makes the film for me aside from the powerful last half hour which mostly removes the odorous emanations of Forster and his camera crew I can almost literally smell.

  • edited May 2013 Posts: 4,412
    TWINE also marks the point where he becomes a little lazy with his Irish-Ango-American accent ("Call him off!" becomes "CALIMOV!"). A few nice bits and pieces with MI6's Highland base and the painting of Messervy.

    Really? If we start down this road it's only fair to say that DC becomes more monotone by the time of SF. On my last watch of SF I thought a few of his line deliveries were just plain flat.
    http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/vanilla/post/editcomment/245373


  • edited May 2013 Posts: 11,189
    I think Brosnan's performance in TWINE is...inconsistant. He's clearly confident in the role and has some very good moments ("I never miss") but also has some TERRIBLE moments.

    The "confronting Electra" scene is infamous. I love Brosnan but I swear he took advice from this Terl bloke before shooting that scene.



    I agree that LTK is the most divisive film - not TWINE.
  • edited May 2013 Posts: 388
    TWINE also marks the point where he becomes a little lazy with his Irish-Ango-American accent ("Call him off!" becomes "CALIMOV!"). A few nice bits and pieces with MI6's Highland base and the painting of Messervy.

    Really?

    Really. He audibly attempts an English accent in GE and TWINE. It's not quite RP but it's a decent attempt. This begins to fall away in TWINE and he's in full-on transatlantic mode by the time of DAD.
  • Posts: 11,189
    I've never really had much of a problem with Brosnan's accent to be honest. True there is a bit of an American twang at times but I wouldn't say its full on yank.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    I have never had a problem with Brosnan's accent at all. I hope it is not a real issue for anyone.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,345
    TWINE also marks the point where he becomes a little lazy with his Irish-Ango-American accent ("Call him off!" becomes "CALIMOV!"). A few nice bits and pieces with MI6's Highland base and the painting of Messervy.

    Really?

    Really. He audibly attempts an English accent in GE and TWINE. It's not quite RP but it's a decent attempt. This begins to fall away in TWINE and he's in full-on transatlantic mode by the time of DAD.

    I thought at times at some of the premiers that he had an Irish accent or a very polite English accent - he seemed to change it. Quite odd.
  • If you think about it, the literary Bond probably had an interesting accent as well, being the son of a Scotsman and a Swiss woman, partially raised in Germany and France, educated at Eton, and having spent a large portion of his adult life trotting the globe.
  • I have never had a problem with Brosnan's accent at all. I hope it is not a real issue for anyone.

    I don't think it's a big problem. Just interesting that he lets go of the English accent after TND.

    Dalton lets his accent slip a few timed in LTK too ("things were about to turn nasteh")
  • Aziz_FekkeshAziz_Fekkesh Royale-les-Eaux
    Posts: 403
    I agree with SirHenry in regards to TND. Nice to have fellow fan of the film.

    Just from the responses here, I think my premise has some validity to it haha. In regards to OHMSS, maybe back when it was released it was controversial but today it's almost universally praised. Same with LTK, which I think lands all over the ranking spectrum. But TWINE is either loved or loathed in the community, from what I can see.
  • Same with LTK, which I think lands all over the ranking spectrum. But TWINE is either loved or loathed in the community, from what I can see.

    I'd have figured to be the other way around. LTK is either loved or loathed, while TWINE can show up anywhere from the top five to the bottom of the barrel.

  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    edited May 2013 Posts: 8,255
    As far as his accent, Bond is a man of the world; As a result his accent has become a bit homogeneous; it refrects the many cultural influences that he has encountered. Alright, It's a lame way to explain lapses but I thought I'd give it a try.
  • Same with LTK, which I think lands all over the ranking spectrum. But TWINE is either loved or loathed in the community, from what I can see.

    I'd have figured to be the other way around. LTK is either loved or loathed, while TWINE can show up anywhere from the top five to the bottom of the barrel.

    Agreed with this @Soundofthesinners.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,835
    To ME, the most divisive Bond movie is FYEO. This is the movie many cite as Moore's best (which I personally can't see at all), many feel it's just okay (I'm in there), some hate it, and indeed hate most Moore films (I think that's a little extreme; he's a fun Bond). It's a bit like DAD in that its tone is uneven, but it's easier to dislike DAD because it changes radically half way through, whereas FYEO spreads the tonal changes throughout.
  • Posts: 4,762
    I'm one who actually enjoys TWINE a good bit. It's funny, when I first watched it, I loved it, then later on I grew to hate it, and now I'm back to liking it once again! Most of my temporary hate for it was due to one friend's opinion which sort of "decided for me", if that makes sense. Then I re-watched it more and more and realized I enjoyed this one all along, but had to look for the good again. Since it is a Brosnan 007 movie, that automatically means it receives instant plus points for having THE MAN in it; aside from that, I really enjoy the action sequences (minus the parahawk ski chase- blehh!), the soundtrack, Elektra and Renard as villains (particularly Renard), Zukovsky's reappearance, and Brosnan's peformance as our favorite agent.
  • hullcityfanhullcityfan Banned
    Posts: 496
    Not according to this guy:



    By the way, check out this guy's reviews; they're really well done and smart.

    She was so hot back then but now she's had plastic surgerey she is ugly and its all creasing.
  • edited May 2013 Posts: 11,189
    Is Christmas the worst Bond girl as the bloke above claims? Nah Jinx is. Christmas is just unintentionally funny.
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    chrisisall wrote:
    To ME, the most divisive Bond movie is FYEO. This is the movie many cite as Moore's best (which I personally can't see at all), many feel it's just okay (I'm in there), some hate it, and indeed hate most Moore films (I think that's a little extreme; he's a fun Bond). It's a bit like DAD in that its tone is uneven, but it's easier to dislike DAD because it changes radically half way through, whereas FYEO spreads the tonal changes throughout.

    That's an interesting pick. You're right in that many people claim that this is Moore's best film because it is a serious, back to basics and somewhat Fleming inspired tale. Yet there many examples of the standard Moore era silliness and light hearted approach crammed in. Some people just find this film to be flat out boring. Oh, and there is that little matter of the Bill Conti score.
    I really like FYEO. I think that it's good but not great. People have it ranked all over the board. Could you please do me a favor though and never compare it to DAD again?
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,835
    pachazo wrote:
    Could you please do me a favor though and never compare it to DAD again?
    Oh, of course, I'm sorry, I didn't mean they were comparable as overall movies- FYEO is clearly far, FAR superior!!

  • hullcityfanhullcityfan Banned
    Posts: 496
    BAIN123 wrote:
    Is Christmas the worst Bond girl as the bloke above claims? Nah Jinx is. Christmas is just unintentionally funny.

    No Christmas was great so was Jonx in my opinion Kimblerly Jones from AVTAK.
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    No Christmas was great so was Jonx in my opinion Kimblerly Jones from AVTAK.

    I now have the inescapable feeling that if her name was Jonx that I would like her better.
  • Posts: 15,233
    Bond girls during the Brosnan era were overall weak and disappointing. Jinx was the worst but Christmas was bad, utterly miscast, Xenia was a caricature, Paris was a plot excuse and the others could have been better.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,345
    Ludovico wrote:
    Bond girls during the Brosnan era were overall weak and disappointing. Jinx was the worst but Christmas was bad, utterly miscast, Xenia was a caricature, Paris was a plot excuse and the others could have been better.

    I thought that Natalya from GoldenEye was not too bad.
  • Posts: 15,233
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Ludovico wrote:
    Bond girls during the Brosnan era were overall weak and disappointing. Jinx was the worst but Christmas was bad, utterly miscast, Xenia was a caricature, Paris was a plot excuse and the others could have been better.

    I thought that Natalya from GoldenEye was not too bad.

    Yes she was quite good. But that is one. Some were ok, but could have been better.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,345
    Ludovico wrote:
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Ludovico wrote:
    Bond girls during the Brosnan era were overall weak and disappointing. Jinx was the worst but Christmas was bad, utterly miscast, Xenia was a caricature, Paris was a plot excuse and the others could have been better.

    I thought that Natalya from GoldenEye was not too bad.

    Yes she was quite good. But that is one. Some were ok, but could have been better.

    Well, I'm glad that we're in agreement there, although I think I'm right in saying that Wai Lin was pretty good as a Major Anya Amasova "being Bond's equal" type, too. Yes?
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