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George Miller and James Mangold do not belong in that cash-cow-milkers-catergory I mentioned. They're outliers, and that's why their films worked. And that's why they refused many other offers.
And you thing TESB was made for the sole consideration of money making? Take one of the nth Disney remakes that are out in the cinemas as we speak, and tell me what purpose does it serve? Money making, that's all.
I do understand that Money was always an issue. It's a Show BUSINESS, I know that. But there were more Millers and Mangolds back then. It irks me when someone compares Spielberg - the king of blockbusters - with JJ Abrams, the king of...lens flares. There are outliers out there. Brilliant new directors and actors and even producers. They just don't have their seats on the front row of the industry any more. That's what I'm saying.
For pete's sake, Scorsese's The Irishman was made by Netflix because the "main, bigger" studios wouldn't touch it.
We do have projects of love, still. But they just don't fill the cinemas. What fills the bloody cinemas are films like Fast and the Furious 11. There's no denying that the love that was infused to films by studios and producers in the past decades has been, well, in decay.
But hurray for outliers. I'm all for outliers. And Logan and MMFR were outliers. So was Joker, this year. And films which are outliers on their own right, like The Favourite or The Lighthouse fortunately still get made every year.
But sequels to action films that had their roots in the 80s and 90s tend to fail, because they thrive on nostalgia, cameos, references, poor CGI and poor scripts.
But hey, all of this is my opinion. And only that.
And I agree to a certain extent. On the other hand, I´d say that there has been a diversification. There´s probably more crap now then there was back then, mostly CGI vehicles, which pains me endlessly, but it´s not like the 80s/90s didn´t bring forth crappy movies also. I wasn´t talking at all about TESB, but look at all the action flics with Chuck Norris, Schwarzenegger, or Seagal. I wouldn´t put FF above those films, but FF does have some really nice action setpieces, and a playfulness I appreciate.
I do miss films like Heat, or The Untouchables. But to be fair, those were exceptional films even in their respective times. Think about Jaws, or Raiders, or the original SW films, they were far beyond the average in those years too.
Making a Mad Max film that stays true to its roots and at the same time is a mainstream blockbuster is thing I don´t remember from the 80s/90s. The same goes for films like Joker, or Logan, mainstream films with an R rating. And yes again, The Road Warrior not being a mainstream film only enhances the magic.
There was this film by Robert Altman in the early 90s, that complained about Hollywood always trying to press film projects into molds. It´s an old phenomenon.
I think it´s a bit like every generation saying that the following generation is more degenerated like the past ones. Maybe it´s just that there´s a constant change, and filmmakers as well as audiences have to learn to adapt.
https://collider.com/terminator-dark-fate-to-lose-130-million-sequels-cancelled/
It seem to be heading to be a major failure at the box office.
I'm fine with another film akin to the first two so long as it manages to be exciting, engaging and not feel like a complete retread. I saw someone mention the other day on Reddit that a cool idea would be Skynet sending a Terminator back in time to protect one of their key employees while the Resistance sends back a human/a reprogrammed Terminator to stop him and assassinate the employee.
This is no surprise at all, I think most of us knew this would happen.
i was casually optimistic and thought that bringing Cameron on board would help...
But his influence is barely noticable, if at all.
Absolutely. I thought it might end up faring a bit better due to the return of Linda Hamilton's Connor, but alas, it seems to have started out with the same box office returns as Genisys, which makes for a huge bomb. All that money lost, there's no chance it gets a sequel.
It was inevitable, no matter how good or bad the film turned out to be.
Unfortunately I have little faith in Cameron regarding the recent Terminator films, he basically applauded Dark Fate in the same way he did Genysis. Now if Cameron outright directed another film himself I would be certainly interested though that won't happen with the multitude Avatar films ongoing.
I semi-understood it with Dark Fate since he had a proper hands on role this time around, but still, the trailers did nothing to instill any confidence or optimism and I figured it'd be more of the same. I'd certainly love to see another installment, though, with him writing and directing and having complete control.
Cameron distancing himself from the film immediately after release speaks volumes. Then again, he was apparently responsible for some of the worst ideas in the film, such as:
*shocking*
I heard people saying it's even worse than Genisys.
Or the production company sends people back in time to prevent most of these films from being made, so they have a clean sheet.
I'd say it was slightly better than Genisys, but that's really not saying much.
That opening has put many off for sure and undermines the first two films which is dumb, the amount of writers involved was more than CR67 which tells you a lot.
Funnily enough just watched a clip with Cameron being very negative toward the films in between T2 and DF, he changes his tune quicker than my MP3 player.
The reason T2 works so well is that they expanded upon the storylines introduced in the first movie and expanded the characters. All sequels since then, including Datk Fate just rehash T2. It’s made audiences numb to the franchise.
Could not agree more, they should have continued the Bale storyline.
I've seen it twice now. It's entertaining - with good action (though very CG heavy in the final third), a strong performance from Hamilton and a good villain. Davis is also pretty great in it.
But it has some baffling story choices and ultimately doesn't justify its existence, so I guess it should be seen as a failure in that regard - even though it's enjoyable enough in its own right.
Perhaps, after some 25 years to think about it, he thought, ah f*** it, not such a bad idea after all :-)).
I don´t give a **** about what Cameron says, since I heard him praise that Alita movie.
+1
I must jump in and defend T4 here. T4 certainly didn´t rehash anything much. Quite the opposite, the film tried to do what Cameron himself said after T2, that he wanted to make a third film that´s set in the future. Unfortunately the film has a look as if they couldn´t fulfill their ambitions, wether creatively or financially I don´t know. But I love the FX, and the indie feel the film has. And those sounds those early Terminators make :-)!
Also there should contuned with sequels. Not liked 4th movie, but i stl hoped there make a fifth with better explanation. I was confused too because i also watched 1,5 of tv series before channel quite. Genisys was on tv last weak and wil give it a try and try to vergot i think it is t2 remake. So far from Dark Fate i get idea it is t3 prequel. Earlier before it be confirmd other way around, i was expecting to see 3 age difrent Sarah.
Dvd get difrent color
The covers possible can change, inspecialy because on those pictures are producer/directer text in German. Or Fox must have choosen to at text in German and Dutch on back insteed of normal French and Dutch. Not big problem, better then having French title on front too. I hope of course it not a sign France release get bonus we don't get.. The fifth whas released by Paramount and both 3D and 2D not get the bonus disc. But with fox moost of time all releases are same and bonus disc wil possible not credit even it is there. And from releases like Kingsman but also from last X-men Phoenix movie we know there can make good bonusmaterial releases with DTS-HD MA 7.1 when it be one disc. Whyle stil a shame there quite with slipcovers with there 3D releases before there quite with 3D and there not move over slipcover too 2D . It be good signal the movie is not released under Disney. If Dark Fate is released in 3D too, then it be confirmd there wil no 3D release. Only Dvd, BD and 4K Bluray (4K+BD).
Of course there mabey should have considerd to make BD BD/DVD combo again or release BD/DVD steelbook release as other release.
Sounds like Cameron is now downplaying his role in DF.
The movie pretty definitively reaches an end point of Sarah’s timeline. Were there aspects of the mythology that you created with the first two films that you didn’t have an opportunity to previously explore?
CAMERON: I don’t want to take the position that I was the one driving this. I came in, I said, “Look, guys, I want to be of value to you,” speaking specifically to Tim Miller, as the director of the film. He pre-dated me on the project. I said, “I want to be a resource. You can have the benefit of my thinking on the matter, but you’re going to do your own thing. You’re going to follow your own muse.” David Ellison also was a very passionate voice. So, I think ultimately, the film reflects those things that we all agreed on would be cool. It’s pretty much that simple.
Was there a part of the movie that you guys repeatedly fought over because of different opinions?
CAMERON: I would say many. And the blood is still being scrubbed off the walls from those creative battles. This is a film that was forged in fire. But that’s the creative process, right? I mean, my work with Robert on Alita was very different. Robert loved the script, loved everything, said, “I just want to make this movie. I want to make the movie the way you see it.” I was like, “No, you got to make it your movie.” I had the reverse experience with Tim, which is Tim wanted to make it his movie. And I’m like, “Yeah, but I kind of know a little about this world.” So I had the matter and the anti-matter version of that producorial experience.
When the next Terminator film is in production Cameron will no doubt say 'Well this is the real Terminator 3, the other films don't exist in Canon and were not very good, this new film is the start of a new trilogy. We are going back to the feel of the first two films, Robert Patrick will be returning as the T-1000 with the use of de aging technology. We will come up with fresh ideas.'
It would not suprise me :))
There is one chance, and one chance only i would pay for another Terminator film (and i would have to give it some thought even then) which is if Cameron WROTE and DIRECTED it.
But as it seems he will be occupied with Avatar for the next decades, and i don't think he would care to continue Terminator anyway, judging from most of his comments.
So as far as i am concerned, the franchise is pretty much dead.
If Cameron actually helmed and put effort into a Terminator film I would pay more attention. One thing has crossed my mind recently watching many of his interviews is he either is just going through the motions and could not care less about Terminator sequels or he really has lost it and the Avatar sequels (4 films I think) are going to be a disaster