Batman V Superman: Dawn of Justice (2016)

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  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,169
    @Thunderfinger

    I agree about humour. I guess this is a reaction to

    A) Batman & Robin:
    DC and Warner still haven't fully recovered from all the hate that big 120 minute joke got.

    B) Marvel:
    Marvel goes for cosy fun (except for X-Men perhaps), so obviously DC has to show us the darker side of the superhero spectrum. And why not? Batman, ever since the late 70s, found its darker tone working better for its readers. The comics went there, the animated stuff went there and the movies, since '05, went there too - successfully I might add.

    But as I stated before, some Batman incarnations were able to get the comedy down, albeit in a downplayed way. Keaton is my go-to reference. His facial expressions are precious sometimes. You may be amidst a lot of chaos and madness and the clock may be ticking, but he enjoys sticking some TNT in a guy's pants...
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,169
    Looks like BvS isn't doing too bad after all. Nearly 700 mill after a little over a week...
  • Artemis81Artemis81 In Christmas Land
    edited April 2016 Posts: 543
    Dalton12 wrote: »
    I feel numbers 3-5 are one that I had issues with:
    #3: When this happened on screen, I was like "really, this is how this ends?" I didn't like it, it felt too lazy.
    #4: Yes, it's nice not spoon-feed the audience, but I feel like they should have explained a few things especially since there aren't any other movies to build up the characters that we saw here. At times I kept thinking if I was the casual audience, I would be lost with what was going on.
    #5: I felt that the senate hearing would have been a good way to hear all sides of this story and to hear Superman speak against all that was being said about him. Sadly that didn't happen.
  • Posts: 9,846
    So e and my wife Finally saw batman v superman together and it was her first comic book movie and she said it was ok...

    However here is her points
    1. It was way too long: She literally asked me during the doomsday fight if she could go for a walk because the film was just way too long for her she had this critism with Spectre and in thinking on both films I have to agree with her slightly because of marvel it feels every movie has to be an event (something I also fear is moving toward music as well specifically classic rock bands) we can't just have Bond 24 it has to be SPECTRE and the return of Blofeld and he was behind it all... same here the film could of ended on the shot of the trinity and it would of been still amazing and in fact had they done the and the end of dawn of justice be the beginning of Justice league you could of had a great and shocking opener for Justice league the trinity fight doomsday superman dies and Batman and Wonder woman find the others it turns out Luthor was infected with the Brainiac virus (either during the battle in man of steel or well when he was in the ship) which would explain his erratic behavior and Would allow for Brainiac (and a controlled Superman) to be the main enemies of Justice league part one with Batman (in a transformers styled Justice Buster Suit) Wonder Woman Flash Aquaman and Cyborg working together to free superman from the mind control and stop Luthor/Brainiac (with some hilarious commentary during the fight of Alfred trying to set up wonder woman and batman to date)

    2. Way too unrealistic: She has said she prefers Bond movies over the one batman film she has seen because at least with 007 it's kind of plausible (though she didn't like the last two she did like Casino royale Quantum of Solace and Live and let die and that is as much as she has seen) with Batman t was way too unrealistic and honestly throw as much pseudoscience as you want I have to agree with her slightly. adding doomsday in with no real explanation of how and why could be a bit Jarring for someone who Loves only John Hughes films, Rom Coms and Across the universe (though I am slowly getting her to branch out) As for how to do it again the explanation of doomsday could of come after the trinity fight him.


    3. Ben Affleck was good as batman: She liked him she actually liked him which I am happy with. While she won't be excited for Affleck's solo batman film she will watch it with me.

    4. It was Better then How to stay single in New York: THIS IS HUGE for me she preffered it over a rom com is just fantastic.


    Over all this film is still good and more then likely the best of the year for me

    Though I will be of course seeing Suicide Squad, Star Wars Rogue One X men Apocalypse and Batman V Superman the marvel version... I mean Captain America Civil war (I actually re watched the second trailer for Civil war... yeah it's the same damn plot I mean EXACTLY the same as Batman v Superman)


    As for what is really exciting me now I turn my attention to television Night manger in two weeks and MacGyver in the fall.

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited April 2016 Posts: 23,883
    @Risico007, I'm glad your wife watched BvS with you as her first 'comic book' experience.

    From reading her comments in your post I think you should try to persuade her to watch the Nolan Batman films. If she feels 007 is 'sort of plausible' compared to BvS, then I'm confident she will have a much higher opinion of the Nolan trilogy. In fact, she may enjoy it, especially Batman Begins.

    PS: I'm not surprised she preferred BvS to How to Stay Single. Even though I haven't seen that work of genius (cough) yet, I'm certain any comic book film will be superior to something starring Rebel Wilson
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Looks like BvS isn't doing too bad after all. Nearly 700 mill after a little over a week...

    Eh? The film is at 681 million WW with a budget of over 400 million (including Marketing), has no competition and people were/are on holiday break. This film is a disaster financially. The Force Awakens hit $1 billion in 12 days and Jurassic World hit $1 billion in 13 days. This is batman and superman in the same movie. The numbers are an overwhelming and embarrassing disappointment. This won't even make 350 million domestic.

    Jungle book is released this week in some territories and that movie is already got serious positive buzz and is going to really slit BvS' throat and with civil war circling, when it dives in it's going to rip BvS' financial opportunity into shreds. It's practically game over for BvS and they'll be lucky to make it to 850 million!

    GameOver.gif




  • Posts: 9,846
    doubleoego wrote: »
    DarthDimi wrote: »
    Looks like BvS isn't doing too bad after all. Nearly 700 mill after a little over a week...

    Eh? The film is at 681 million WW with a budget of over 400 million (including Marketing), has no competition and people were/are on holiday break. This film is a disaster financially. The Force Awakens hit $1 billion in 12 days and Jurassic World hit $1 billion in 13 days. This is batman and superman in the same movie. The numbers are an overwhelming and embarrassing disappointment. This won't even make 350 million domestic.

    Jungle book is released this week in some territories and that movie is already got serious positive buzz and is going to really slit BvS' throat and with civil war circling, when it dives in it's going to rip BvS' financial opportunity into shreds. It's practically game over for BvS and they'll be lucky to make it to 850 million!

    GameOver.gif





    So you will take anything and turn it into a negative lmao....
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139

    No I'm just stating the facts and the reality of the situation. Anyone can take these results and spin it to make it look good to those who don't know better but the truth and reality is, this film was supposed to carry so much weight and create a massive favourable impact for WB/DC but this film isn't even divisive it's been panned across the board and is a critical flop and a financial disappointment.

    WB's marketing team deserve a raise to be fair because they've done an excellent job with their damage control but unfortunately the figures are there for all to see. The numbers don't lie. This film was so heavily frontloaded with huge ticket sales coming from pre-bookings. This film was always going to open big and the first 2 weeks are critical for any movie but word of mouth on a global level has been harmful to this movie and we're seeing this now.

    This film should easily have been able to make a billion dollars; it'll be lucky to make 850 million and if it does, there's no guarantee that it would break even with its theatrical run. Make no mistake there are going to be some serious reshuffling with DCEU's movie slate and executive positions at WB HQ.
  • Posts: 9,846
    doubleoego wrote: »
    No I'm just stating the facts and the reality of the situation. Anyone can take these results and spin it to make it look good to those who don't know better but the truth and reality is, this film was supposed to carry so much weight and create a massive favourable impact for WB/DC but this film isn't even divisive it's been panned across the board and is a critical flop and a financial disappointment.

    WB's marketing team deserve a raise to be fair because they've done an excellent job with their damage control but unfortunately the figures are there for all to see. The numbers don't lie. This film was so heavily frontloaded with huge ticket sales coming from pre-bookings. This film was always going to open big and the first 2 weeks are critical for any movie but word of mouth on a global level has been harmful to this movie and we're seeing this now.

    This film should easily have been able to make a billion dollars; it'll be lucky to make 850 million and if it does, there's no guarantee that it would break even with its theatrical run. Make no mistake there are going to be some serious reshuffling with DCEU's movie slate and executive positions at WB HQ.

    Which Scares me honestly as I fear Affleck's solo Batman film will be a bland Batman vs Joker story to "play it safe" and also the last time DC/WB tried to shift things to please the masses we got these





    so yeah I almost would preffer they stick with their guns because... I don't want Schumacher back. No I would take Snyder directing the next 10 Batman films over that
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,963
    The film had huge weekend drops this past weekend, the biggest for a movie of this size. As I said before the movie even released, I don't see this having legs, which seems to be the case. It may have a hard time turning profit at this rate.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    edited April 2016 Posts: 11,139
    Yep. It's going to have to make at least 850 million just to break even. It's a mess. These bloated budgets are a joke, especially more so when you put it in the hands of the likes of Snyder who hasn't even delivered a hit and has a track record of not delivering.

    This is a classic real time case study that Branding is so bloody important and that just because your name is superman or batman or spider-man or James Bond or whoever, your name will only carry so much weight, you actually have to be good!

    Seriously, Ant-Man, GoTg...who the hell are they compared to superman and batman...but guess what? Marvel put in the time to earn the trust of the GA, stengthened and legitimised their brand and people went out to see these movies. Marvel can make a movie about Squirrel girl and it'll be a success because they know wtf they're doing.

    Add Deadpool to the aforementioned...all comparatively obscure comic book characters to the GA who got their own movies and were critical and financial successes all because the people behind them put in the care and work to entertain the masses and not a sub section of people within an already minority group of people (fanbase). WB/DC failed to do this.

    Again, how do you mess up a film with batman and superman in it, especially when you have more than 70 years worth of source material to draw from? This film butchered it's characters, was tonally imbalanced and was just horribly written. Apparently, Snyder made a 6 hour cut! Why in the hell would you make a 6 hour movie, knowing it's going to be cut down to about 2 and a half hours, meaning there are going to be some serious and likely pivotal footage omitted from the theatrical cut...now because of the success of Deadpool, there's talk of releasing an R-rated version of BvS...it's ridiculous that BvS should even have an R-rated version. WB are acting scatter-brained.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,169
    Batman Begins made, in its entire run, half of what BvS made in a little over a week. Yet Batman Begins, I will agree, is a far better film than BvS, and it was made by excellent filmmakers overall. In fact, I'd call BB a success in the sense that while it itself struggled to break even, it paved the way for TDK being the gold mine that it was, and TDKR being a gold mine it in my opinion deserved much less to be than BB.

    Sometimes, an investment will pay off in the long run. BvS will reach that 850 mill, it will break even and it will continue to make money afterwards. But yeah, these ridiculous budgets are unnecessary. A few minutes less of extravaganza do not a worse film make... or something wise sounding like that. ;-)
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    To be fair to BB, many people didn't even know that film was coming out and on top of that, it was the first batman movie after the genre-killing batman and robin. Back then, that film was always going to do moderate business. When people caught on to how good the movie was and the direction this new batman was taking, by the time the excellent TDK came out, it took home more than a billion dollars!

    If a good movie lives up to the hype, its nothing but skips and smiles all the way to the bank.
  • Posts: 5,993
    Seems to me that we're back to the situation as it was in the 60s. DC had the most famous characters, but Marvel had the best comics, and a bigger market share. The same seems to be true now regarding the movies. Funny that.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    Even in the comics. the likes of deadpool are outselling superman comics.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    tumblr_o547tvHqbc1rhuguao1_1280.jpg


    the-general-train-crash.gif
  • Posts: 5,993
    doubleoego wrote: »
    Even in the comics. the likes of deadpool are outselling superman comics.

    Yes, but the comic book market is, in America, a niche market. The general public had no idea who Deadpool was before the movie. In fact, at the time the first X-Men movie was released, there were reporters who couldn't believe that a comic book they've never heard about was outselling Superman or Batman. Or that there were still comics being made, simply because they didn't see any in drugstores or supermarkets anymore, everything being now sold in specialty stores.

  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    My friend who owns the local cinema complex told me today that the second weekend was a disaster, 80% less ticket sales for BvS.
    If he could he would throw out BvS this Wednesday (limit to screenings only on the weekend) but he can't, as there are contracts with the distributor. He'll limit BvS to one screening a day from Thursday on.
    London Has Fallen sold more tickets last weekend.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    London Has Fallen sold more tickets last weekend.
    That is indeed tragic, because I saw this PoS, and it was a huge disappointment in nearly every way imho.

  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    My friend who owns the local cinema complex told me today that the second weekend was a disaster, 80% less ticket sales for BvS.
    If he could he would throw out BvS this Wednesday (limit to screenings only on the weekend) but he can't, as there are contracts with the distributor. He'll limit BvS to one screening a day from Thursday on.
    London Has Fallen sold more tickets last weekend.

    Your friend has the right idea. In China, this thing is flopping exceptionally hard and they've cut the number of screens almost down to zero because BvS will just lose them money. No one's paying to see this thing so why keep it around? That image I posted of people talking about empty screens from all over the world is an endless nightmare for WB.

  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited April 2016 Posts: 12,480
    This film will be talked about for a long time - very differing opinions. But great box office.
    Even with a major drop second week, I think it is not going to cause loss of sleep for producers.
  • Posts: 9,846
    Yeah lets limit viewings so we can gaurentee no one will see it so marvel can win win win WIN...


    sigh I don't want DC to retool I really don't if Affleck does only batman V Superman I will be EXTREMLY pissed.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    Great Box Office??

  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    Forgotten by most, but probably not most of the hardcore comic fans (which you are, Birdleson). It has split opinions everywhere it seems. Even just the way it has performed at the box office will be remembered for a while and compare this one to other new films, etc.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    BvS has turned into a living nightmare for all DC fans imo because Warner has gambled huge and they can't stop JL now,
    JL is almost a guaranteed money grave, only die hard DC fans will go and see it next year, and after that it's probably over for the planned series of films.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    Birdleson wrote: »
    I just wish there were some comic books that I cared to read featuring these characters anymore (I'm down to BATMAN '66 and SCOOBY TEAM-UP, I used to spend $40 a week on these things). In the end I don't give a shit about the cinematic interpretations.

    I LOVE the Scooby Batman team ups!
  • Posts: 9,846
    doubleoego wrote: »
    Great Box Office??

    How much is Disney paying you honestly? Just want to point out a few things


    http://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2016/04/03/batman-v-superman-box-office-dawn-of-justice-tops-man-of-steel-with-681m-worldwide-cume/#5d4cef37504f


    to sumn up the article in simple terms

    Batman V superman has currently out grossed
    X-men (2000)
    X-men 2
    X men 3
    X-men First Class
    X Men Origins Wolverine
    The Wolverine
    Fantastic 4
    Fantastic 4 2 rise of silver surfer
    Fantastic 4 reboot
    Iron Man
    Iron Man 2
    Spider man
    Spider man 2
    Spider man 3
    The Amazing Spider Man
    The Amazing Spiderman 2
    Ghost rider
    Ghost Rider 2

    And I am pretty sure it has also out grossed (though I don't have the figures
    Daredevel
    Elektra
    Blade 1-3
    Batman 1-4 (the Burton Schumacher era) and possibly even Batman begins


    we really want to start talking about bombs in a month from now BVS could easily over take X-men days of future past AND Deadpool and make a billion. I am seeing it Saturday for a third time!
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited April 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I'm really not all that surprised that it hasn't come close to the Marvel products. I never thought it would though, given MoS wasn't all that huge to begin with, and that film was in a way supposed to be DC's version of Iron Man (the kick off for the whole Marvel thing).

    They needed an Iron Man equivalent to start things rolling properly and they didn't have it. This was their 2nd choice option (imho) which was to frontload the character introductions (hopefully successfully) and then branch out from there.

    I think where they may have made a mistake is rolling out 3 combo ensemble pieces in a row (BvS, Suicide Squade & JL). They should have picked one of BvS or JL and then done the solo films directly after that. Retire Supes (as a standalone) for a while.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    @Risico007
    Box office doesn't mean anything if there is no or only little profit.
    BvS was supposed to do 1.5 to 2 billion.
    It becomes a monetary grave.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,169
    Where do we get this "it's supposed to do 1.5 to 2 billion" figures from? Is this some weird calculation based on the budget of the film? No-one at WB in their right mind would have guessed this thing could hit like that Star Wars film we've been waiting for since '83.

    I'm going to remember the words of Kevin Smith: people think they know about Hollywood business, but they don't.
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