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Where Would You Rank 'RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK' If Placed In The Bond Series?

WillyGaloreWillyGalore
edited July 2013 in General Movies & TV Posts: 6,396
Having recently watched Raiders for the first time recently in a couple of years, it got me thinking. I'm sure we've all done our own list of ranking all 23 Bonds films from first to last, but if you were to put Raiders into that list, where would it come?

I placed it 3rd on my list behind TSWLM and GF.
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Comments

  • JWESTBROOKJWESTBROOK
    Posts: 5,745
    Last. It's a terrible James Bond movie.
  • SirHenryLeeChaChingSirHenryLeeChaChing
    Posts: 3,494
    I fail to see where there is a comparison to any Bond movie in content. Yes it's a big, grandiose adventure along the lines of Spy and MR but Jones isn't a spy, he's an archaeologist more concerned with the historical value of the Ark and his own glory and boost to his reputation in finding the object, than the Allied war effort against the Nazis or any sense of politics.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    Sorry, don't think I worded it quite as well as it sounded in my head ;)

    As Indiana Jones was born out of Spielberg's desire to direct a Bond film and clearly many of it's influences stem from Bond (pre-credits type sequence, romantic interest, exciting set pieces etc), I was just wondering how the quality of the film itself stacks up against Bond films.

    Is it better than For Your Eyes Only (released in the same year) or is it worse than From Russia With Love for instance.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    JWESTBROOK wrote:
    Last. It's a terrible James Bond movie.

    My thoughts exactly. Not a big Indy fan, though I have them on DVD, strangely.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    I've always love Raiders, dislike Temple of Doom, only like Last Crusade because of Connery's performance and Crystal Skull is just utter cack.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    WillyGalore wrote:
    I've always love Raiders, dislike Temple of Doom, only like Last Crusade because of Connery's performance and Crystal Skull is just utter cack.

    Funny, Last Crusade is probably my favourite of the original three - though not seen the new one or very much of Temple of Doom which didn't seem too great either. I really need to sit down and watch them all in a row at some point.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    Dragonpol wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    I've always love Raiders, dislike Temple of Doom, only like Last Crusade because of Connery's performance and Crystal Skull is just utter cack.

    Funny, Last Crusade is probably my favourite of the original three - though not seen the new one or very much of Temple of Doom which didn't seem too great either. I really need to sit down and watch them all in a row at some point.

    I can save you the trouble with Crystal Skull. Just think of DAD, but with even worse special effects!

  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    WillyGalore wrote:
    Dragonpol wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    I've always love Raiders, dislike Temple of Doom, only like Last Crusade because of Connery's performance and Crystal Skull is just utter cack.

    Funny, Last Crusade is probably my favourite of the original three - though not seen the new one or very much of Temple of Doom which didn't seem too great either. I really need to sit down and watch them all in a row at some point.

    I can save you the trouble with Crystal Skull. Just think of DAD, but with even worse special effects!

    Really? That does sound bad...

    How do they get around Indy's invincibility from the Last Crusade. That was always meant to hold the new 4th film back, was it not? Is it dealt with at all in Crystal Skull?
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Crystal Skull oh my god talk about a disappointment. It just proves that 2000's Lucas should have retired after Return of the Jedi.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    Dragonpol wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    Dragonpol wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    I've always love Raiders, dislike Temple of Doom, only like Last Crusade because of Connery's performance and Crystal Skull is just utter cack.

    Funny, Last Crusade is probably my favourite of the original three - though not seen the new one or very much of Temple of Doom which didn't seem too great either. I really need to sit down and watch them all in a row at some point.

    I can save you the trouble with Crystal Skull. Just think of DAD, but with even worse special effects!

    Really? That does sound bad...

    How do they get around Indy's invincibility from the Last Crusade. That was always meant to hold the new 4th film back, was it not? Is it dealt with at all in Crystal Skull?

    If I remember correctly, the Knight says to Indy "the Grail cannot pass beyond the Great Seal. That is the boundary and the price of immortality". So I'm guessing that eternal life was confined to that cave, which if you ask me doesn't seem like much fun.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117

    I would have to say it would be certainly top 5. Probably top 3. It really is a phenomenal action film and sadly it was very blinkered of Cubby not to hire Spielberg in the late 70's.

    The first half of Raiders is pretty damn good but the second half really cranks it up with the iconic well of souls, the epic punch up with Pat Roach and then one of the best set pieces of all time. The final reel is a bit of a come down after that but overall (and speaking objectively) there are very few Bond films that can hold a candle to Raiders - only OHMSS, FRWL and CR in terms of the overall film and perhaps TSWLM, OP and GE in terms of action/adventure.

    If Raiders isnt in your top ten list of action films you really dont have a clue what you are talking about.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    I would have to say it would be certainly top 5. Probably top 3. It really is a phenomenal action film and sadly it was very blinkered of Cubby not to hire Spielberg in the late 70's.

    The first half of Raiders is pretty damn good but the second half really cranks it up with the iconic well of souls, the epic punch up with Pat Roach and then one of the best set pieces of all time. The final reel is a bit of a come down after that but overall (and speaking objectively) there are very few Bond films that can hold a candle to Raiders - only OHMSS, FRWL and CR in terms of the overall film and perhaps TSWLM, OP and GE in terms of action/adventure.

    If Raiders isnt in your top ten list of action films you really don't have a clue what you are talking about.

    I agree with you for the most part. The last paragraph could be deemed as a tad harsh

    :))
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    WillyGalore wrote:

    I agree with you for the most part. The last paragraph could be deemed as a tad harsh

    :))

    Not really. Name 10 better action films.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    I'm not saying your wrong. It would easily be on my list. Doesn't mean everyone will think that way. It's just a matter of opinion
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    I would think Raiders would share a spot side by side with the best Bond.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    WillyGalore wrote:
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    I would have to say it would be certainly top 5. Probably top 3. It really is a phenomenal action film and sadly it was very blinkered of Cubby not to hire Spielberg in the late 70's.

    The first half of Raiders is pretty damn good but the second half really cranks it up with the iconic well of souls, the epic punch up with Pat Roach and then one of the best set pieces of all time. The final reel is a bit of a come down after that but overall (and speaking objectively) there are very few Bond films that can hold a candle to Raiders - only OHMSS, FRWL and CR in terms of the overall film and perhaps TSWLM, OP and GE in terms of action/adventure.

    If Raiders isnt in your top ten list of action films you really don't have a clue what you are talking about.

    I agree with you for the most part. The last paragraph could be deemed as a tad harsh

    :))

    I don't think that's harsh at all. Raiders is one of the archetypal action/adventure films. It's pretty much seamless and an almost flawless blueprint for the genre.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    RC7 wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    I would have to say it would be certainly top 5. Probably top 3. It really is a phenomenal action film and sadly it was very blinkered of Cubby not to hire Spielberg in the late 70's.

    The first half of Raiders is pretty damn good but the second half really cranks it up with the iconic well of souls, the epic punch up with Pat Roach and then one of the best set pieces of all time. The final reel is a bit of a come down after that but overall (and speaking objectively) there are very few Bond films that can hold a candle to Raiders - only OHMSS, FRWL and CR in terms of the overall film and perhaps TSWLM, OP and GE in terms of action/adventure.

    If Raiders isnt in your top ten list of action films you really don't have a clue what you are talking about.

    I agree with you for the most part. The last paragraph could be deemed as a tad harsh

    :))

    I don't think that's harsh at all. Raiders is one of the archetypal action/adventure films. It's pretty much seamless and an almost flawless blueprint for the genre.

    Where would you rank it up against Bond films? I put only TSWLM and GF above it.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited July 2013 Posts: 9,117
    WillyGalore wrote:
    I'm not saying your wrong. It would easily be on my list. Doesn't mean everyone will think that way. It's just a matter of opinion

    Yeah but I'm sick of idiots being let off the hook with this get out of jail free card of 'I'm entitled to my opinion.' Why can't we name and shame the cretinous by telling them they are just plain wrong?

    As RC7 its pretty much flawless and the blueprint for how an action film should be - simple A to B storytelling with people chasing a Macguffin and no pissing about with fancy editing or arty shots (I'm looking at you Marc Forster). It's close to perfection. Taking my Bond hat off for a minute it's difficult to say that any Bond film actually tops it.

    The real shame is that Spielberg was gagging to do Bond and Cubby binned him off.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    Although they are separate series I can see the comparison, I rate Raiders as the greatest action adventure film of all time so while wiping the floor with all Bond entries might sound harsh, I'll just say it surpasses every entry ever made, if Bond ever gets to this level I will be very surprised.

    The true genius of Spielberg is seen in this and Jaws and not the more earnest material he has won Oscars for, the 2 greatest blockbusters of all time period.
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    there are very few Bond films that can hold a candle to Raiders - only OHMSS, FRWL and CR in terms of the overall film and perhaps TSWLM, OP and GE in terms of action/adventure.

    That sounds like a pretty accurate assessment to me.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Shardlake wrote:
    The true genius of Spielberg is seen in this and Jaws and not the more earnest material he has won Oscars for, the 2 greatest blockbusters of all time period.

    I'd be hard pushed to disagree with this sentiment. I'd also add E.T. and Jurassic Park to the mix. For a director to make one of these films is impressive, to make four is beyond human.

  • socaljon3socaljon3
    Posts: 27
    Okay, here we go:

    1. Raiders (IJ1), my #3 movie of all time.
    2. CR, my #7...
    3. Last Crusade (IJ3), my #13...
    4. GF, #21...
    5. FRWL, #33...
    6. SF, #36...
    7. GE, #56...
    8. DN, #60...
    9. Temple (IJ2), #76...
    10. TB, #77...
    11. Crystal Scull (IJ4), #85 (sorry IJ4 haters, but I enjoy any plot with Indiana Jones or James Bond.
    12. TSWLM, #92...

    Yep, you guessed it, I've got my fav 100 movies ranked.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    Here I am, out on a limb, and I'm sure someone will attempt to cut it out from under me, but in thinking about it, IMO no single Bond film ever made was better than Raiders, and some of them only equal it musically.
    That said, as a series, Bond is vastly superior to Jones given the scope, longevity & adaptation to the eras in which they were made.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    chrisisall wrote:
    Here I am, out on a limb, and I'm sure someone will attempt to cut it out from under me, but in thinking about it, IMO no single Bond film ever made was better than Raiders, and some of them only equal it musically.
    That said, as a series, Bond is vastly superior to Jones given the scope, longevity & adaptation to the eras in which they were made.

    Yes I'd pretty much go along with that. I enjoy TSWLM and GF more but that's probably more out of sentiment being they were 2 of the first 3 Bond films I ever watched. Raiders was as good as it got for Indy though. The following films paled by comparison.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    socaljon3 wrote:
    Okay, here we go:

    1. Raiders (IJ1), my #3 movie of all time.
    2. CR, my #7...
    3. Last Crusade (IJ3), my #13...
    4. GF, #21...
    5. FRWL, #33...
    6. SF, #36...
    7. GE, #56...
    8. DN, #60...
    9. Temple (IJ2), #76...
    10. TB, #77...
    11. Crystal Scull (IJ4), #85 (sorry IJ4 haters, but I enjoy any plot with Indiana Jones or James Bond.
    12. TSWLM, #92...

    Yep, you guessed it, I've got my fav 100 movies ranked.

    Correct me if I'm wrong but you are rating Indy and the Crystal Skull above OHMSS and TLD?

    I'm not about to lay into anyone for saying Raiders might be better than all of the Bond films but this is mental.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    socaljon3 wrote:
    Okay, here we go:

    1. Raiders (IJ1), my #3 movie of all time.
    2. CR, my #7...
    3. Last Crusade (IJ3), my #13...
    4. GF, #21...
    5. FRWL, #33...
    6. SF, #36...
    7. GE, #56...
    8. DN, #60...
    9. Temple (IJ2), #76...
    10. TB, #77...
    11. Crystal Scull (IJ4), #85 (sorry IJ4 haters, but I enjoy any plot with Indiana Jones or James Bond.
    12. TSWLM, #92...

    Yep, you guessed it, I've got my fav 100 movies ranked.

    Correct me if I'm wrong but you are rating Indy and the Crystal Skull above OHMSS and TLD?

    I'm not about to lay into anyone for saying Raiders might be better than all of the Bond films but this is mental.

    I wondered this also. But I'm tired and don't have the energy to tear @socaljon3 a new one.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    Just remember, one person's Citizen Kane is another person's Batman & Robin. And that person is in a mental asylum ;-)
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    WillyGalore wrote:
    Just remember, one person's Citizen Kane is another person's Batman & Robin. And that person is in a mental asylum ;-)

    Glad to see you on message at last!
  • Suivez_ce_parachuteSuivez_ce_parachute
    edited July 2013 Posts: 2,015
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    Yeah but I'm sick of idiots being let off the hook with this get out of jail free card of 'I'm entitled to my opinion.' Why can't we name and shame the cretinous by telling them they are just plain wrong?
    Wow, and what about all those superior beings like me out there who laugh at people who can't help ranking movies, creating "top 10", or, well, even ranking sound editors's second movies :)

    Have you seen That Man From Rio ?


  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    Just remember, one person's Citizen Kane is another person's Batman & Robin. And that person is in a mental asylum ;-)

    Glad to see you on message at last!

    Well kind of. There is no right or wrong to this type of debate. It's purely a matter of taste, irrespective of whether anyone agrees with us or not. As I said, I personally love Raiders. I consider it Spielberg's best film (after Jaws) but I don't have a problem with those people who don't like it. It doesn't matter to me what anyone else thinks. There is no right or wrong, it's purely subjective.

    Plus wouldn't the world be so boring if we all liked and disliked the same things? It's what makes for interesting debate ;-)
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