Was Mr Big in the film version of LALD based on real-life American drug kingpins of the early 1970s?

Dragonpol

I personally think that Mr Big may have been based on certain (black) drug dealers in New York, as an update to the character from the original 1954 novel, which of course did not concern drugs, but the smuggling of gold coins to finance Soviet (SMERSH) operations in the United States.

So, my question remains, was Mr Big, as written by Tom Mankiewicz, based on real life drug kingpins of the early 1970s in America? If so, whom, would you say? A book I bought recently has given me a few possibles, but I'd like to hear from the good folks here on MI6 Community first of all to see if there any any alternative views on this one.

WillyGalore

I'm only aware that Mankiewicz was heavily influenced by the Blaxploitation films of the period when it came to writing his LALD screenplay but it would be fascinating to hear the responses from other members on this topic.

Dragonpol

WillyGalore wrote:

I'm only aware that Mankiewicz was heavily influenced by the Blaxploitation films of the period when it came to writing his LALD screenplay but it would be fascinating to hear the responses from other members on this topic.

Thank you. Yes, other blaxploitation films were certainly one influence, but there were other influences, I would contend. I too await any fascinating responses our fellow MI6 agents may have on this topic. We have a very well equipped membership here on MI6 Community.

Perdogg

Dragonpol wrote:

I personally think that Mr Big may have been based on certain (black) drug dealers in New York, as an update to the character from the original 1954 novel, which of course did not concern drugs, but the smuggling of gold coins to finance Soviet (SMERSH) operations in the United States.

So, my question remains, was Mr Big, as written by Tom Mankiewicz, based on real life drug kingpins of the early 1970s in America? If so, whom, would you say? A book I bought recently has given me a few possibles, but I'd like to hear from the good folks here on MI6 Community first of all to see if there any any alternative views on this one.

@Dragonpol

Here is an interesting tidbit from The James Bond Bedside Companion (Boxtree Ltd - page 207)

"Mankiewicz told Bondage magazine that he had written the script before he knew Roger Moore was going to be play Bond.

As usual, Fleming's original story was thrown out. Because it was felt that the novel's treatment of blacks was patronizing, the filmmakers decided to create a high-class criminal organization as opposed to Fleming's group of second-rate crooks. The results was a SPECTRE-like organization operating from the Caribbean island of San Monique."

further more "[LALD] script is witty and entertaining, but not very original" (R Benson)

Dragonpol

Perdogg wrote:

Dragonpol wrote:

I personally think that Mr Big may have been based on certain (black) drug dealers in New York, as an update to the character from the original 1954 novel, which of course did not concern drugs, but the smuggling of gold coins to finance Soviet (SMERSH) operations in the United States.

So, my question remains, was Mr Big, as written by Tom Mankiewicz, based on real life drug kingpins of the early 1970s in America? If so, whom, would you say? A book I bought recently has given me a few possibles, but I'd like to hear from the good folks here on MI6 Community first of all to see if there any any alternative views on this one.

@Dragonpol

Here is an interesting tidbit from The James Bond Bedside Companion (Boxtree Ltd - page 207)

"Mankiewicz told Bondage magazine that he had written the script before he knew Roger Moore was going to be play Bond.

As usual, Fleming's original story was thrown out. Because it was felt that the novel's treatment of blacks was patronizing, the filmmakers decided to create a high-class criminal organization as opposed to Fleming's group of second-rate crooks. The results was a SPECTRE-like organization operating from the Caribbean island of San Monique."

further more "[LALD] script is witty and entertaining, but not very original" (R Benson)

Thanks for that, @Perdogg. I read that entry some time ago as I have both the 1984 and 1988 editions. I'm working on a blog piece on Fleming's influence on the LALD script beyond the action LALD novel itself, of which very little was used in the film version.

Dragonpol

Any additional views on this one? I'm all ears.

Perilagu_Khan

Bumpy Johnson?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bumpy_Johnson

I suspect, however, that Mr. Big was simply a generic, black urban drug lord spiffed up to Fleming/Bond standards. And relatedly, I reject the notion that the criminals in Fleming's novel were "second rate." Specifically, to apply that epithet to Fleming's Mr. Big is laughable. Mr. Big was the very opposite of second rate. Likewise, I fail to see how the henchmen in Fleming's novel were in any ways inferior to those in the film.

Dragonpol

Perilagu_Khan wrote:

Bumpy Johnson?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bumpy_Johnson

I suspect, however, that Mr. Big was simply a generic, black urban drug lord spiffed up to Fleming/Bond standards. And relatedly, I reject the notion that the criminals in Fleming's novel were "second rate." Specifically, to apply that epithet to Fleming's Mr. Big is laughable. Mr. Big was the very opposite of second rate. Likewise, I fail to see how the henchmen in Fleming's novel were in any ways inferior to those in the film.

I agree that Fleming's Mr Big was a villain way ahead of his time and that he was in no way "second rate" either.

And thanks so much for that link to Bumpy Johnson - never heard of him before. Perhaps Tee-Hee Johnson and he were related?

Perilagu_Khan

Dragonpol wrote:

Perilagu_Khan wrote:

Bumpy Johnson?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bumpy_Johnson

I suspect, however, that Mr. Big was simply a generic, black urban drug lord spiffed up to Fleming/Bond standards. And relatedly, I reject the notion that the criminals in Fleming's novel were "second rate." Specifically, to apply that epithet to Fleming's Mr. Big is laughable. Mr. Big was the very opposite of second rate. Likewise, I fail to see how the henchmen in Fleming's novel were in any ways inferior to those in the film.

I agree that Fleming's Mr Big was a villain way ahead of his time and that he was in no way "second rate" either.

And thanks so much for that link to Bumpy Johnson - never heard of him before. Perhaps Tee-Hee Johnson and he were related?

Note that Bumpy met his wife at Frazier's Restaurant in 1948. In the novel, one of the establishments Bond and Leiter patronize is Ma' Frazier's.

Dragonpol

Perilagu_Khan wrote:

Dragonpol wrote:

Perilagu_Khan wrote:

Bumpy Johnson?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bumpy_Johnson

I suspect, however, that Mr. Big was simply a generic, black urban drug lord spiffed up to Fleming/Bond standards. And relatedly, I reject the notion that the criminals in Fleming's novel were "second rate." Specifically, to apply that epithet to Fleming's Mr. Big is laughable. Mr. Big was the very opposite of second rate. Likewise, I fail to see how the henchmen in Fleming's novel were in any ways inferior to those in the film.

I agree that Fleming's Mr Big was a villain way ahead of his time and that he was in no way "second rate" either.

And thanks so much for that link to Bumpy Johnson - never heard of him before. Perhaps Tee-Hee Johnson and he were related?

Note that Bumpy met his wife at Frazier's Restaurant in 1948. In the novel, one of the establishments Bond and Leiter patronize is Ma' Frazier's.

Thanks Khanners, all grist to the mill.

Ludovico

Perilagu_Khan wrote:

Bumpy Johnson?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bumpy_Johnson

I suspect, however, that Mr. Big was simply a generic, black urban drug lord spiffed up to Fleming/Bond standards. And relatedly, I reject the notion that the criminals in Fleming's novel were "second rate." Specifically, to apply that epithet to Fleming's Mr. Big is laughable. Mr. Big was the very opposite of second rate. Likewise, I fail to see how the henchmen in Fleming's novel were in any ways inferior to those in the film.

Yes, I really find Mankiewicz's comment baffling. If anything, the novel's Big is far superior to his movie counterpart: he is the leader of a SMERSH cell for crying out loud, in fact directs an autonomous organization and is respected by highest members of SMERSH and by M himself. Kananga is a ruthless drug lord and a corrupted politician, but he is hardly at the same level.

Dragonpol

Ludovico wrote:

Perilagu_Khan wrote:

Bumpy Johnson?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bumpy_Johnson

I suspect, however, that Mr. Big was simply a generic, black urban drug lord spiffed up to Fleming/Bond standards. And relatedly, I reject the notion that the criminals in Fleming's novel were "second rate." Specifically, to apply that epithet to Fleming's Mr. Big is laughable. Mr. Big was the very opposite of second rate. Likewise, I fail to see how the henchmen in Fleming's novel were in any ways inferior to those in the film.

Yes, I really find Mankiewicz's comment baffling. If anything, the novel's Big is far superior to his movie counterpart: he is the leader of a SMERSH cell for crying out loud, in fact directs an autonomous organization and is respected by highest members of SMERSH and by M himself. Kananga is a ruthless drug lord and a corrupted politician, but he is hardly at the same level.

Yes, and Dr Kananga's Mr Big alter ego (and terrible make-up job) is laughable to say the least and certainly the weakest part of the film. But blame Yaphet Kotto for that, fine actor that he is, as he insisted on his own make-up team and they did a crap job in my view. Mr Big in the film was merely a parody (as so much is with Tom Mankiewicz) of a black gangster and drug kingpin.

Ludovico

I like the film, but it is a weak adaptation of the novel.

Dragonpol

Ludovico wrote:

I like the film, but it is a weak adaptation of the novel.

Indeed it was, and I liked it too.