Star Wars (1977 - present)

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  • jake24 wrote: »
    For anyone who saw it, was the NTTD trailer attached?

    In the UK a butchered version of the trailer with a narration by Q played before TROS

    I'm in the UK, I had the full trailer before TROS.

    Did you have Q sat at a desk talking about Bond?

    No it was the original trailer.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited December 2019 Posts: 4,343
    jake24 wrote: »
    For anyone who saw it, was the NTTD trailer attached?

    In Italy, yes. Stunning on the big screen.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,592
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited December 2019 Posts: 4,343
    jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    Do you mean like throwing in the trash major plot points and character development from the previous one? Ok.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,592
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    Do you mean like throwing in the trash major plot points and character development from the previous one? Ok.
    Yes, exactly.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    jake24 wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    Do you mean like throwing in the trash major plot points and character development from the previous one? Ok.
    Yes, exactly.

    So it’s a nice way to wrap up JJ’s vision, definitely not the overall trilogy.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,592
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    Do you mean like throwing in the trash major plot points and character development from the previous one? Ok.
    Yes, exactly.

    So it’s a nice way to wrap up JJ’s vision, definitely not the overall trilogy.
    Ok. Cool. :-bd
  • jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    I thought it was good and greatly enjoyed it. Obviously it had some flaws, but there aren't many films that don't. E.g. Skyfall is easily one of the best Bonds, but the whole Silva purposely got himself caught stuff is ludicrous.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,248
    I'll be seeing the film next Monday. I'm going to have to avoid this thread until then. ;-)
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,722
    Just under 30 minutes now until I see The Rise of Skywalker.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    I saw it myself. I'll be honest, I never got so bored while watching a Star Wars movie.

    I enjoyed all movies so far, even those I have issues with (and I've got many, many issues with TPM, AOTC and TFA) still manage to entertain me. But this one was almost painful to watch. I only wanted to see
    Rey and Kylo fight Palpatine
    .
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,230
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    Do you mean like throwing in the trash major plot points and character development from the previous one? Ok.
    Yes, exactly.

    So it’s a nice way to wrap up JJ’s vision, definitely not the overall trilogy.

    I highly doubt this is how JJ envisioned it. The overall trilogy suffered by making a finale style story in the second installment, regardless of how one views TLJ.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    Do you mean like throwing in the trash major plot points and character development from the previous one? Ok.
    Yes, exactly.

    So it’s a nice way to wrap up JJ’s vision, definitely not the overall trilogy.

    I highly doubt this is how JJ envisioned it. The overall trilogy suffered by making a finale style story in the second installment, regardless of how one views TLJ.

    I highly doubt JJ ever had a vision.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,230
    matt_u wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    Do you mean like throwing in the trash major plot points and character development from the previous one? Ok.
    Yes, exactly.

    So it’s a nice way to wrap up JJ’s vision, definitely not the overall trilogy.

    I highly doubt this is how JJ envisioned it. The overall trilogy suffered by making a finale style story in the second installment, regardless of how one views TLJ.

    I highly doubt JJ ever had a vision.

    I doubt anyone did.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    edited December 2019 Posts: 4,343
    matt_u wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    Do you mean like throwing in the trash major plot points and character development from the previous one? Ok.
    Yes, exactly.

    So it’s a nice way to wrap up JJ’s vision, definitely not the overall trilogy.

    I highly doubt this is how JJ envisioned it. The overall trilogy suffered by making a finale style story in the second installment, regardless of how one views TLJ.

    I highly doubt JJ ever had a vision.

    I doubt anyone did.

    Johnson had a clear vision. Like it or not he was able to make a SW film open to the future. He made bold decisions and ironically TLJ is the only film of the sequel trilogy Lucas really appreciated.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    edited December 2019 Posts: 8,230
    matt_u wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    matt_u wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Saw the film last night. I thought it was excellent. I honestly couldn't think of a better way to wrap of the sequel trilogy.

    Do you mean like throwing in the trash major plot points and character development from the previous one? Ok.
    Yes, exactly.

    So it’s a nice way to wrap up JJ’s vision, definitely not the overall trilogy.

    I highly doubt this is how JJ envisioned it. The overall trilogy suffered by making a finale style story in the second installment, regardless of how one views TLJ.

    I highly doubt JJ ever had a vision.

    I doubt anyone did.

    Johnson had a clear vision. Like it or not he was able to make a SW film open to the future. He made bold decisions and ironically TLJ is the only film of the sequel trilogy Lucas really appreciated.

    I'm not a TLJ hater really, but I can't agree with this in the context of having a clear vision for the trilogy. Johnson may have had a vision for the future of the franchise, but he ironically compromised the creative path of the current trilogy to illustrate it. A decision being bold (and yes, they certainly were) doesn't guarantee that they were good (some were, but plenty weren't).

    If we were to have only these two directors direct the same number of films in the ST, I'd have preferred Abrams to take the reigns on the first two and Johnson helm the final installment. His approach to TLJ lends well to a finale film, not the meat between the bread.

    So I'd argue that Johnson was the one that completed his vision, rather than what was good for the overall trilogy. Not Abrams, who evidently had to pick up the pieces and bolt some sort of story together.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    The course correction Abrams and Disney did in TRoS was caused primarily by the Civil War that happened between fans after TLJ. So those supposed fans - fueled even by Mark Hamill - are really the one to blame for such a schizophrenic finale. TRoS is a big middle finger to Rian Johnson entry. That’s frustrating. We are talking about a film
    that makes canonic Palpatine fucking LOL and having a child.
    . Something that makes Brofeld a bold idea.
  • MinionMinion Don't Hassle the Bond
    edited December 2019 Posts: 1,165
    matt_u wrote: »
    The course correction Abrams and Disney did in TRoS was caused primarily by the Civil War that happened between fans after TLJ. So those supposed fans - fueled even by Mark Hamill - are really the one to blame for such a schizophrenic finale. TRoS is a big middle finger to Rian Johnson entry. That’s frustrating. We are talking about a film
    that makes canonic Palpatine fucking LOL and having a child.
    . Something that makes Brofeld a bold idea.
    I think that's getting in the uncomfortable realm of victim blaming, especially since Disney has stuck to the byline that the outcry over TLJ was overblown, a vocal minority, and overwhelmingly fueled by Russian bots. They could have stayed the course, but they didn't. As much as I disliked TLJ, I'd be far more interested to see where Rian took it with the concluding chapter, and Disney compromised themselves by reneging on that.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,230
    matt_u wrote: »
    The course correction Abrams and Disney did in TRoS was caused primarily by the Civil War that happened between fans after TLJ. So those supposed fans - fueled even by Mark Hamill - are really the one to blame for such a schizophrenic finale. TRoS is a big middle finger to Rian Johnson entry. That’s frustrating. We are talking about a film
    that makes canonic Palpatine fucking LOL and having a child.
    . Something that makes Brofeld a bold idea.

    Maybe so, but it was inevitable considering where TLJ left the story, regardless of what the fans thought. So that to me is just window dressing for poor planning, and that includes what Johnson did with TLJ. He should have been hired for the finale.

    The lack of foresight on Disney's part has been this sequel's undoing. And I liked all three films to an extent.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    The good news is that the film has been reviewed poorly and it’s going to make less money than TLJ. But those studios will never learn. Just look at Justice League...
  • MinionMinion Don't Hassle the Bond
    edited December 2019 Posts: 1,165
    Everyone wins! :D

    I read a rumor that there were two cuts of TROS - one by JJ and KK, and another by Lucas who was brought in by Bob Iger. They say Lucas' cut was more postively received by screening audiences, but JJ/KK went forward with their cut anyway. Could be complete hearsay, but it does appear consistent with LucasFilms' tendency to cut off their nose to spite their face. Good thing Kathleen Kennedy is already rich, because I could see her "stepping down" once her contract is up in 2021.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,201
    matt_u wrote: »
    So those supposed fans - fueled even by Mark Hamill - are really the one to blame for such a schizophrenic finale.

    Here's the thing, Mark Hamill loved what RJ did with Luke. He had his concerns at first, but seeing how it played out he said he was ultimately wrong. And then a bunch of fans on the internet basically use only the soundbites from interviews of his initial concerns to drive a narrative that Mark Hamill was really unhappy with the movie and the treatment of Skywalker. It's total disingenuous bullshit. And what's worse is that when these fans are confronted with Hamill's endorsement of RJ's decision they just write it off as Hamill being forced/paid by Disney to lie, turning the whole thing into a conspiracy.

  • Posts: 12,514
    Though I don’t love the film, I thought Mark Hamill’s performance / Luke’s character was easily the strongest aspect of TLJ.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,230
    FoxRox wrote: »
    Though I don’t love the film, I thought Mark Hamill’s performance / Luke’s character was easily the strongest aspect of TLJ.

    Same here. I actually quite liked that aspect of the film.

  • Posts: 1,314
    I saw it today - not a geek fan but a child of the 80s who loved The OT as a kid. I thought it was mediocre. I kind of hate that something once as culturally relevant and different as Star Wars is now an exercise in just bending over to give whiny man babies what they demand.

    I thought JJ Abrahms did a great job setting up a potential trilogy in TFA. Rian Johnson took it sideways rather than forwards which i don't mind, blue tit milk aside, , at least he was trying to do something different, But then when Abrahms literally has the entire opening 20 minutes of this new film just reassuring said man-babies that all the plot of TLJ is jettisoned because "We at Disney know you don't like that and want to ensure we get your money in future" it just reeks of manipulation and pandering. And great stories do not come from that place. its kind of like Spectre in that regard.

    Aspects of the film were good. I really like Daisy Ridley. Finn has had zero character arc. Poe i like too. I thought it was threepios best film since Empire. But as a trilogy the three films are completely incoherent. This film feels like a climax to a trilogy where the first two films haven't been made. Its more of the same but bigger.

    I dunno the star wars i like is basically good and bad people doing cool stuff in space. The Homer-lite attempt at mythologising the entire universe doesn't appeal to me.

    I think in truth the last Star Wars film to be made that was more than "decent' was in 1980.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,201
    It's probably my favorite Luke story of all the films. The whole thing with his stance on Crait may bet the most Jedi thing ever.
  • Posts: 1,314
    FoxRox wrote: »
    Though I don’t love the film, I thought Mark Hamill’s performance / Luke’s character was easily the strongest aspect of TLJ.


    I really have no issue with Lukes Character arc in TLJ. Its perfectly reasonable that he's a bitter old man rather than an idealistic young farm boy. Its like most of the people i went to school with who i haven't seen in 20 years who are now on facebook!
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,201
    I think him being "idealistic" gets pretty inflated by fandom. The only time he was consistently idealistic was regarding his father and that there's still good in him. Otherwise he tended to be doubtful and close minded, which Yoda always berated him for.

    "I don't believe it!"
    "That is why you fail."

    That's why Yoda appearing in spirit is such a wonderful scene to me, as it's Yoda telling Luke to just get his shit together, that failure is a part of life and you shouldn't let it get you down.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    matt_u wrote: »
    So those supposed fans - fueled even by Mark Hamill - are really the one to blame for such a schizophrenic finale.

    Here's the thing, Mark Hamill loved what RJ did with Luke. He had his concerns at first, but seeing how it played out he said he was ultimately wrong. And then a bunch of fans on the internet basically use only the soundbites from interviews of his initial concerns to drive a narrative that Mark Hamill was really unhappy with the movie and the treatment of Skywalker. It's total disingenuous bullshit. And what's worse is that when these fans are confronted with Hamill's endorsement of RJ's decision they just write it off as Hamill being forced/paid by Disney to lie, turning the whole thing into a conspiracy.

    No he didn't. He just regretted sharing his insecurities regarding RJ vision for Luke. Right after the release of the film he said he "still hasn't accepted what happens to Luke in TLJ" and that Luke in TLJ wasn't "his Luke". He consistently support people's "hate" toward Luke in TLJ on Twitter:



    Hamill just had to face the fact that this wasn't Luke story anymore.

    Having said that he was great in TLJ, his best performance ever, for sure.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited December 2019 Posts: 8,201
    Interesting, because there’s interviews of him saying he was wrong for doubting in RJ’s take on Luke. That’s the kind of stuff that gets edited out by those fueling their hatred for TLJ.
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