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Comments
Funny to think that once Bond 26 is made, Sir Rog and Connery will represent half the franchise (13 out of 26 films).
see what works for the new guy. Many have commented on how LALD and
TMWTGG were still being written with Connery in mind. It wasn't until TSWLM
That they got Roger's take on 007.
That's not the same thing. They made many creative choices to distinguish Moore from Connery, like how he smoked cigars instead of cigarettes.
On this point. :)
The best thing about A View To A Kill, IMO.
- Rog is a bit long in the teeth, granted. He's also not very wel stunt-doubled, also granted. But the man still gives it his all actingwise and I love the disgust he shows whenever Zorin pops up.
- speaking of Zorin, great villain. With a great clan too: May Day, Scarpine, the mad doctor Mortimer and of course Jenny Flex.
- May Day turning to the good is better handled here than Jaws in MR. When she blows up, that's actually a very chilling moment.
- Pola Ivanova!
- title song and soundtrack.
- locations: Bond's only trip to the USSR when it still existed, Paris, the lovely Château de Chantilly and San Francisco.
- excellent PTS! I also love that iceberg sub. And what's in it. Bond wears a lovely Seiko Quartz Chronograph too, and Mary Stavin isn't too bad of a companion either. The great Rog also managed to snatch some fine wodka and caviar out of Russia. Got to love that bon vivant !
- everything in the château! Some true detective work too.
- the Rolls!
- Patrick Macnee.
- the blimp.
- the Golden Gate Bridge climax and the Eiffel Tower stunt.
- etc.
Stacey is a totally helpless in the elevator fire, the ensuing fire engine chase is embarassing and the fisticuffs with the guards in the château is poor too. Apart from those things, can't say I've got many complaints.
I think the steeplechase scene is very well done. Bond gets bashed about a good bit, and something we haven't seen before. Its such a pity the fire engine chase is played for laughs. Could heve been a great sequence but is really cringey to watch! Climax on the bridge is excellent!
On the whole I think its one of the most entertaining. Any criticisms of it also tend to be valid, however.
Watched Octopussy last night, and Moore was still great in that imo. The way he wins at backgammon is cool as ice, and the fight in Octopussy's bedroom with the assassins with the yoyo is also one of the best fight scenes of the series. He pulls out some great moves.
Plus I think it manages one of the filthiest double entendres in all of Bond when James tells Moneypenny that he'll 'fill her in later'. Bad James! :)
Well yes, this is the thing, isn't it? When you're a kid, all adults look old don't they? I don't ever remember thinking he looked more old than other grown ups at the time. He just looked like James Bond.
Compared to Maud Adams, Caroline Munro, Valerie Leon etc, who were all nice and happy to chat about their time in Bond.
I also had a nice conversation with John Glen about his approach to shooting action scenes, who until Martin Campbell is the best director of action in the series imo.
You'd rather watch AVTAK and have more fun with it than DN? Maybe that should go in the controversial opinions thread.
Did the series develop from DN, yes if you count FRWL and GF bringing the series to new heights. But I can't agree that too many of the films following those improve on what DN did very well on its first time out, setting the pace for the series and establishing initial interest in this hero and his world.
I know AVTAK has its fans and if you enjoy it that's fine. I don't put anybody down for their choices, but I've had it at the bottom or near it in my rankings since the weekend it premiered, and as such I have a hard time imagining preferring a film that has Tanya Roberts screaming "James" every few minutes, Beach Boys covers during action sequences, comedy chases in fire trucks with bumbling cops...I'll stop there - over one with scenes like Bond's introduction in the casino, Dent's interrogation by Dr. No, the assassination of Dent, Honey's emergence from the sea and so on. It's like they're not even in the same series. AVTAK is viewed by some as a GF remake, so there's that and it often feels more like a Matt Helm or Flint film than Bond.
What? I don’t follow your logic. You think that means I don’t prefer any of the other ones? That’s mental.
Personal preference I understand and I'm sure you're not alone in not holding DN in high esteem. For year's it wasn't one of mine but has risen in my estimation over the years. But it's it's a stretch to say DN was merely a product of its time, isn't it? It's influence is still felt in series' tropes today from the gunbarrel to the Walter to byplay with Moneypenny and on and on.
You don't think the Bond films improved after Dr No? It's pretty well known the 'fan community' that Goldfinger introduced the lauded 'Bond formula' that basically everyone likes. To say they didn't improve on whilst invoking the wisdom of the fan community seems contradictory.
Just because it has some influences it doesn't mean it's not a product of its time. It is the first one in the series, but it's the most like a 50s/early 60s British film whereas the ones that followed started to find their own energy and moved on dramatically. It's a good film for what it is and does nothing wrong by its own terms but I prefer what came later, I hope that clears it up for you.
Although my head can never quite adjust to the bit where Bond hangs onto the airship all the way from that lovely chalk pit in Sussex to San Francisco!
:D
In conclusion, yes, I actually did point out in a previous post that FRWL and GF in particular improved on DN, and I certainly like TB and OHMSS more personally and several others afterwards. Some hardcore fans even state it was all downhill after GF and the films often became remakes of each other beginning with YOLT, which some saw as a larger-scale remake of DN and then copied itself 3 more times down the line. AVTAK is often looked at as an inferior GF remake. The series itself also gets pointed to for following trends from blaxploitation, kung fu and Star Wars to Indiana Jones and Bourne.
I wasn't trying to say it was all downhill after DN by any means, just it shouldn't be discounted for what it did for the series, and the films you put in your original post such as DAF and TMWTGG were clearly not improvements, but with a series this many entries there are bound to be hits and misses. It's what makes being a fan interesting.
And I do agree that DN has a lot about it that seems apart from what came after. It really feels like a hard-boiled detective story more than a spy story and the music adds to the datedness too. I've enjoyed the spirited discussion.
I can't say I'm convinced. If AVTAK isn't a bad movie than it's no better than mediocre. I loved AVTAK when I was a child, but as an adult with adult standards I can't in good conscience consider it a good movie.
I give the author props for linking to an article praising Gold, one of Roger's best non-Bond films (and directed by Peter Hunt).
But if you have to defend a Bond movie like AVTAK by praising it as "a glorious romp, silly and camp," you're already in trouble. AVTAK is often more of a slog than a romp, and the Bond films have never been at their best when silly or camp. No one has ever felt the need to apologize for liking the first three classic films, because while they had an excellent sense of humor they didn't indulge in camp, which is fatal to any film that aspires to genuine tension, danger, and suspense. Camp is fit for self-parody, not an effective thriller.
Is Zorin "one of the great Bond villains"? I don't he think he rises beyond a couple of gimmicks and Walken's mannerisms. He doesn't have any chemistry with Moore either (no one in the film does, aside from Patrick Macnee). The author tries defending Zorin's sadism (partly by quoting Christopher Hitchens's worst article on Fleming), but the scene of Zorin gunning down his men feels contrived--the filmmakers are straining hard to say "look how evil he is!" Zorin's sadism isn't creative enough to be effective or worthy of a Fleming villain.
Grace Jones’s May Day is praised for bringing "rare diversity and agency" the series. Perhaps, though her agency doesn't really kick in until when it's convenient for Bond. And again, she and Moore have no chemistry--they might as well be in different movies. Throw in Duran Duran and the increased violence, and Roger looks completely out of place in AVTAK, like Queen Victoria at a death metal concert.
Of course I agree with the author's praise of John Barry's score. Without it AVTAK would be a much worse film. Barry was the sort of master composer whose scores could unify a film.
And yes, the stuntwork is excellent, but isn't that true of every Bond film? It's the bare minimum one expects.
It's ludicrous to argue "A View to a Kill is the pinnacle of Moore and therefore the pinnacle of Bond." AVTAK shows the series in a state of exhaustion, playing it safe by patterning the script on the GF formula and relying on a clearly too-old incumbent Bond but trying to make up for it by clumsily playing around with up-to-date elements. Glen and Maibaum and the rest of the team were plainly revitalized when they made TLD, so AVTAK represents the sort of inevitable low-point reached when any long-running series ends up in a rut and hasn't yet performed a gear-switch big enough to climb out.
Any article that uses AVTAK and pinnacle in the same sentence is bound to not be taken seriously. I'm all for people defending things they believe in, especially bad moves but this goes pretty indefensible. Calling May Day the best Bond girl, no, just no. I call her one of the most disappointing. Even the various Fiona Volpe clones - Fatima Blush, Xenia Onatopp - are more entertaining and interesting.
I've noticed a lot more love over the years for AVTAK, but as someone who saw it on opening weekend and cringed all the way through, it's never left the bottom or near it in my rankings, which are so informal it's one of the few consistencies. I guess it must help to have seen it while discovering the other films. There's nothing that stands out in AVTAK you'd ever put in a top list. The Eiffel Tower jump is standout, but is lowered by so many other great stunts and that's about the action highlight.
Part of the reason is the uneven tone between the camp and the serious. From people being dropped from great heights, dropped into spinning rotors, shot at point blank range in cold blood and machine gunned in cold blood one moment and then shifting to moments of hanging off firetrucks chased by comic cops and drunks caught up in watching Bond escape from the City Hall fire. It's such a glaring contrast, as Revelator mentioned, to the throwaway lines following danger that made the early films so fresh.
I still think a critic in '85 may have summed it up best, saying "It's like they just got together and said 'Come on guys, it's time to make another Bond film.'" So to the author of the story, please spare Roger Moore and admit it isn't his finest moment, much less a worthy addition to the series.
Well okay, I quite like that though. I much prefer the bigger, broader Octopussy and AVTAK to the pure seriousness of FYEO, which I find a little on the dull side. Give me a mix of the serious and the silly any day. The whole climax does feel nicely serious to a kid, with John Barry really ramming home that this is all very important and dangerous.
I really like the level at which AVTAK is pitched at, it's perfect comfort Bond for me. It hits a flat spot just after they travel to San Francisco, but it's not the only Bond to run out of steam in its second major location.
And is Zorin one of the great Bond villains? Yes, absolutely! He's brilliant. Best Bond villain of the entire decade in fact, I'd say. Sanchez comes second I guess, but he has a touch of the rent-a-baddie about him: he could be in any non-Bond action movie. Zorin and Mayday could only be from a Bond, and they're played brilliantly.