How close were we to seeing Brosnan in 'Casino Royale'?

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  • Posts: 7,427
    BT3366 wrote: »
    Aleander wrote: »
    11) I cannot stress enough how good Brosnan would've been in CR. And the slight remark that he was less of a Bond than Craig? Nonsense! Brosnan's the truest representation of Fleming's Bond. Just try and read TMWTGG without Brosnan in mind.
    Couldn't disagree more on the truest representation of Fleming's Bond comment. For me, that would be Dalton.

    Absolutely.
    Brossa doesn't come anywhere near Fleming's Bond, in my humble opinion.
    The smugness alone rules him out!
  • Posts: 7,653
    While I would not have minded Brosnan in the 007 part for CR I think that Craig did a fabulous job and immediately owned the part and movie, he was undermined in his movies by the pretentiousness of Mendes movies lets hope he gets the swansong Brosnan never got after DAD.
  • NS_writingsNS_writings Buenos Aires
    Posts: 544
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    BT3366 wrote: »
    Aleander wrote: »
    11) I cannot stress enough how good Brosnan would've been in CR. And the slight remark that he was less of a Bond than Craig? Nonsense! Brosnan's the truest representation of Fleming's Bond. Just try and read TMWTGG without Brosnan in mind.
    Couldn't disagree more on the truest representation of Fleming's Bond comment. For me, that would be Dalton.

    Absolutely.
    Brossa doesn't come anywhere near Fleming's Bond, in my humble opinion.
    The smugness alone rules him out!

    Goldeneye-Tan-Suit-2.jpg

    He wasn't as close to Fleming's Bond as Dalton, granted.
    But I do think there were some Fleming elements on him. A highly trained 00 agent feeling the strain of his profession, reflecting on his job (and the upcoming confrontation with a former friend), sitting on a Caribbean beach. This moment has always reminded me to the beginning of Goldfinger (book) where he reflects on killing the capungo.
  • DrClatterhandDrClatterhand United Kingdom
    Posts: 349
    Craig elevated the material. His performance was magnetic, enthralling, kinetic, and had a truth to it that Brosnan never had the chops for. Brosnan isn't half the actor Craig is. Craig has a depth and intelligence that far surpasses Brosnan. Craig is the best thing to happen to Bond since Connery. He made Bond cool after the mouth-breather fodder that is Dire 'Nother Day.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    edited October 2019 Posts: 16,351
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  • Posts: 17,756
    Craig elevated the material. His performance was magnetic, enthralling, kinetic, and had a truth to it that Brosnan never had the chops for. Brosnan isn't half the actor Craig is. Craig has a depth and intelligence that far surpasses Brosnan. Craig is the best thing to happen to Bond since Connery. He made Bond cool after the mouth-breather fodder that is Dire 'Nother Day.

    That's debatable. Personally I much prefer Brosnan to Craig, so each to their own.

    CR with Brosnan would have been really interesting, IMO. It's a shame he never got a story like CR to work with.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    edited October 2019 Posts: 16,351
    Casino Royale with Brosnan would have been awesome!
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  • DrClatterhandDrClatterhand United Kingdom
    Posts: 349
    Murdock wrote: »
    Casino Royale with Brosnan would have been awesome!
    vtg7gT4l.jpg

    Mmmmmmm... Eva Green.
  • Posts: 7,427
    Murdock wrote: »
    Casino Royale with Brosnan would have been awesome!
    vtg7gT4l.jpg

    Mmmmmmm... Eva Green.

    True...but who's the waiter in front of her?
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,187
    I thought Brosnan peaked with DAD. It was really the first time for me that he felt like like he was in charge with the role.

    That said, I wasn't missing him by CR.
  • AleanderAleander Kavala, Greece
    Posts: 33
    The "rookie agent" angle was just a pet project of Wilson, who had been wanting to do that idea as far back as 1986.
    Indeed. And I think the only reason for that was to show the pre-credits scene where he earns his 00 status. I can actually imagine Wilson wanting such a scene for TLD but being overruled by Cubby.

    Bar that opening sequence, the rookie agent angle really should've been dropped. They could have easily intimated it took place a while back, to help establish him at his beginnings but not his very start. That part has always bugged me as well.
  • RoadphillRoadphill United Kingdom
    Posts: 984
    Casino Royale was excellent as it was, but with Brozza it could have been equally as so. The rookie agent stuff would have to be dropped (In reality Craig was too old at the time to be a fresh agent too, but the film was good enough that we all bought it) Ultimately I would have loved Pierce to get a 5th, harder edged Bond film. My only issue for it is that it would surely be Pierce's last, and it fits better being at the start of someone's run, than being at the end.

    Interesting idea, though.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,187
    Roadphill wrote: »
    it fits better being at the start of someone's run, than being at the end.

    I think that was pretty much EON's mindset. They acquired the rights to the novel in 1999 but seemed to have no intention of making it with Brosnan, as he confirmed he no longer had the role months before it was officially announced that Bond 21 would be CASINO ROYALE.
  • AleanderAleander Kavala, Greece
    Posts: 33
    Few people seemingly know, however, that the book Barbara Broccoli had given to Brosnan when he got the role FOR SURE in 1994, as a first generation print of Casino Royale. I think Brosnan himself had the expectation he might do it one day, and Tarantino surely wanted to do it with Brosnan as the lead, and no one else.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,187
    Hadn’t heard of that, but I have heard that Brosnan brought a copy of Goldfinger onto the set as part of a way of tapping into the character.
  • AleanderAleander Kavala, Greece
    Posts: 33
    Hadn’t heard of that, but I have heard that Brosnan brought a copy of Goldfinger onto the set as part of a way of tapping into the character.
    I read this in Some Kind of Hero: The Remarkable Story of the James Bond Films, which I read earlier in the year. It certainly adds a layer in this conversation, don't it.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,187
    CR is a good book to tap into the genesis of the character if you want to study for the role, but I dunno if the idea of them hoping he’d make be in an adaptation was actually a thing. EON getting the rights to that only came about when McClory tried to team up with Sony, as they were at the time hungry for establishing their own franchises and they had just happened to own the rights to the novel. Funnily, I think news reports stated that what they got out of the settlement was the rights to the 1967 film. The New York Times article makes no mention of the novel, probably due to negligence on their part.

    But it is telling that they held back on making CR when Brosnan had been abundantly clear that he wanted to take the films in a darker and grittier route. TWINE was certainly an attempt to give him his own OHMSS, but that lost its way in the insistence on formula instead of honoring the 1969 film.
  • AleanderAleander Kavala, Greece
    edited October 2019 Posts: 33
    While I agree that Brosnan's TWINE wasn't quite the OHMSS they were going for (uneven tone, mainly), and that its adherence to formula dilluted it greatly, nevertheless it still is my favorite of Brosnan's, one which I've grown to like over Skyfall a good deal (I mean, the villain's scheme in SF shares the killing-M one in TWINE, surely).
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,187
    There’s similarities between TWINE and SF for sure, but I argue the latter has more verve. For every interesting idea TWINE toys with it takes two steps back as if it’s afraid of turning away audiences. SF proved they could have taken it that far in 1999 and audiences would have embrace it if done right.

    As it is, it’s my least favorite Bond film, with Brosnan giving his worst performance, which I pin on the director because nobody is particularly great in it. What could have been a pretty amazing scene with the confrontation between Bond and Elektra feels like a bad soap opera.



  • QQ7QQ7 Croatia
    edited October 2019 Posts: 371
    I'm always down for some Broz but Craig did quite fine I would say, so no too much hard feelings.

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  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    Posts: 3,497
    Murdock wrote:
    People make the "bad script" argument for Pierce and I don't buy it. Craig had overall one of the worst scripts, directors, and overall films in the series with QoS yet his performance is beyond brilliant.

    Could Craig save DAD?

    Not even God could save DAD! ;-)

    And don't think I didn't try. ;)

    The only thing I know for sure is that Pierce stated that he would have loved to do final one in the style of CR.

    I think TWINE is his best performance as Bond.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited October 2019 Posts: 8,187
    I thought his best performance was in DAD, particularly the first half of the film. He feels in charge in a way he never quite did in the first three films.
  • JamesCraigJamesCraig Ancient Rome
    edited October 2019 Posts: 3,497
    I thought his best performance was in DAD, particularly the first half of the film. He feels in charge in a way he never quite did in the first three films.

    Oh yes, it's my second favourite Brosnan performance. He's great in the early scenes, unshaven. The least problematic "un"word that can be used to describe DAD. ;-)

    And who would've thought that Rosamund Pike would turn out to be such a brilliant actress?
  • Posts: 15,122
    I'll repeat it again : Brosnan in CR would have looked like an old fool. Nothing against him, he was too old for the role, rookie Bond or not. Bond in CR is in his prime. He's mentored by Mathis, he is relatively new to the 00 section, etc. Have Brosnan falling for Vesper, or anyone Brosnan's age at the time the movie was shot, and you have a farce instead of a tragedy.
  • Posts: 1,970
    Brosnan 100% should of done a 5th movie, just not CR.
  • edited October 2019 Posts: 1,680
    Brosnan looked even younger in 2005 and 2007. He could’ve easily done 2 more.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    I wish he did.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,976
    I would've loved another Brosnan installment or two. I wouldn't change CR for the world but I'll forever wonder how a Tarantino-directed, Brosnan-led adaptation would've played out.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited October 2019 Posts: 8,187
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I'll repeat it again : Brosnan in CR would have looked like an old fool. Nothing against him, he was too old for the role, rookie Bond or not. Bond in CR is in his prime. He's mentored by Mathis, he is relatively new to the 00 section, etc. Have Brosnan falling for Vesper, or anyone Brosnan's age at the time the movie was shot, and you have a farce instead of a tragedy.

    There also would have been a sense of repetition with Brosnan Bond being fooled by a female double agent, given the same thing had happened in DAD only without the love story angle. Come to think of it, it would have been the third time a Bond girl betrayed him in a row.
  • Posts: 19,339
    I think Brosnan could have done 2 more, but I don't think he would fit into CR very well as it turned out.
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