Brosnan's Bond Popularity

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Comments

  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited February 2014 Posts: 12,480
    Is that yours, Murdock?? :)
    Hmmm. Maybe no, but you make awesome props for sure.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Is that yours, Murdock?? :)

    No I wish though. :p
  • Posts: 12,473
    A quick run-through of his films I want to include (best to worst):
    1. GoldenEye
    A Bond classic for me from start to finish. My favorite scenes include the PTS, tank chase, and finale. I thought Alec was a terrific villain and the movie itself was just the most well-made and enjoyable of the Brosnan era.
    2. The World is Not Enough
    Unfairly hated on by many. I love the PTS and action of this one; it feels a lot more complete than TND and DAD for me. I know a lot of people felt like it was either melodramatic or too cheesy, but despite its flaws, I really enjoy this one.
    3. Die Another Day
    Yes, DAD is above TND here. I thought the first half of DAD was very good, particularly the PTS and fencing scene. Second half completely fell apart, especially the last hour or so. Villains were lacking, girls were lacking, and the story itself was just crazy.
    4. Tomorrow Never Dies
    This film commits a cardinal sin: being totally forgettable and generic. At least DAD was its own movie most of the time; the only things I really like about TND were Brosnan, the main girl, and the motorcycle chase. Otherwise it just felt like another random action film to me. I thought the villain was really bad too.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited February 2014 Posts: 12,480
    Oh my goodness, how we disagree on TND! It is definitely my favorite Brosnan Bond film, even more than the wonderful GE. In TND, Brosnan he shows a good range, and depth as well as charm. It is great fun, has some exciting moments, an excellent PTS, too, and a fine performance by him. I could have done without Teri, but other than that it is a great Bond film, in my opinion.

    DAD was a mess but Brosnan was good in it, and I enjoy most of the first half of the film.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    1.GE
    2.TWINE
    3.TND
    4. DAD
  • Posts: 11,189
    I think its generic and cheesy...but definitely not as insane as DAD. Wai Lin alone elevates the film somewhat...at least compared to Jinx.
  • Posts: 12,473
    Oh my goodness, how we disagree on TND! It is definitely my favorite Brosnan Bond film, even more than the wonderful GE. In TND, Brosnan he shows a good range, and depth as well as charm. It is great fun, has some exciting moments, an excellent PTS, too, and a fine performance by him. I could have done without Teri, but other than that it is a great Bond film, in my opinion.

    DAD was a mess but Brosnan was good in it, and I enjoy most of the first half of the film.

    I wish I liked TND, but it's so bland to me. Brosnan's good in all of his films, but I thought TND had the weakest PTS of the four too. And yeah nothing great about Teri either. I just didn't like it all that much.
  • Seeing as this thread has steered away from its intended purpose, I believe that if Brosnan is a superhero than so is Craig. Brosnan has unlimited ammo and invincibility. Craig has video-game type healing, in that wait a few seconds and he's back to normal.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited February 2014 Posts: 17,800
    Oh my goodness, how we disagree on TND!
    Well, WE don't.

    Best to worst:

    Tomorrow Never Dies
    Pierce in top form in his OTT Stop-World-War-III actionfest. Now completely comfortable in the role (and with some additional weight), he owned it. The movie is filled with clever & funny innuendo, cool hand-to-hand clashes, and classic 90's gunplay. And it begins with one of the 3 or 4 best PTS mini-movie scenes we've ever gotten.
    The art direction is reminiscent of Adams without seeming like copycat-ing, Arnold's score is brash & Barry-esque, and the miniatures are worthy of Meddings.
    The Bond girl as played by the world renowned actress & martial arts films star Michelle Yeoh is arguably the best ever in the 'agent pair up' category. The chemistry between Lin and Bond is palpable, and even the stunt-casted Teri Hatcher turns in a fine (if generally unappreciated) performance as an old flame that chose the wrong romantic road out of pain. Jonathan Pryce's Carver was deliciously slimy & ultimately supremely worthy of his fate.
    Okay, narratively speaking, we've seen most of this before, but not with this level of sophistication and style. Cinematic Bond at his best.

    Goldeneye
    Our re-introduction to Bond after decades of absence (well, it SEEMED like that). Brosnan followed Dalton's pattern from the previous Bond, but added a dash of Remington Steele, and a pinch of Moore, all to great effect. The Bond girl is refreshingly real, and the henchwoman is a reminder of that which can be deadlier than the male. Alec Trevelyan is THE PERFECT anti-Bond, and Sean Bean was THE PERFECT actor to play him. The climactic confrontation rivalled even the classic train fight in From Russia With Love. Even a bit too much Bor-eees could not ruin the perfection of this movie. And Eric Serra's often haunting & cold score was, again, highly unappreciated.

    The World Is Not Enough
    By now Pierce had it down so well we didn't even think to question him as Bond (unless, er, we hated him to begin with, that is...). An awesome & record-breaking PTS, an uber-sexy (what would turn out to be) main villain, and a mis-adventure by M make this a singular Bond movie (until, y'know, they recycled some of these ideas for Skyfall). Renard was definitely not all that he could have been, but I think it was a choice not to go for an Oddjob redux at the end. Lack-O-pain doesn't automatically translate into super strength... oh well. Still, an excellent entry, and another triumph for Mr. Brosnan. And a sweet goodbye to Desmond...

    Die Another Day
    Much like Mark Hamill did for Return Of The Jedi, Pierce Brosnan was the glue that held this movie together.
    Or almost.
    All right, ROTJ is WAAAY better, but the point is, Brosnan is the best thing about this movie.
    Get your DAF sensibilities on, toss back a few, & enjoy the mayhem. Graves is pretty hilarious.

  • Posts: 12,473
    chrisisall wrote:
    Oh my goodness, how we disagree on TND!
    Well, WE don't.

    Best to worst:

    Tomorrow Never Dies
    Pierce in top form in his OTT Stop-World-War-III actionfest. Now completely comfortable in the role (and with some additional weight), he owned it. The movie is filled with clever & funny innuendo, cool hand-to-hand clashes, and classic 90's gunplay. And it begins with one of the 3 or 4 best PTS mini-movie scenes we've ever gotten.
    The art direction is reminiscent of Adams without seeming like copycat-ing, Arnold's score is brash & Barry-esque, and the miniatures are worthy of Meddings.
    The Bond girl as played by the world renowned actress & martial arts films star Michelle Yeoh is arguably the best ever in the 'agent pair up' category. The chemistry between Lin and Bond is palpable, and even the stunt-casted Teri Hatcher turns in a fine (if generally unappreciated) performance as an old flame that chose the wrong romantic road out of pain.
    Okay, narratively speaking, we've seen most of this before, but not with this level of sophistication and style. Cinematic Bond at his best.

    Goldeneye
    Our re-introduction to Bond after decades of absence (well, it SEEMED like that). Brosnan followed Dalton's pattern from the previous Bond, but added a dash of Remington Steele, and a pinch of Moore, all to great effect. The Bond girl is refreshingly real, and the henchwoman is a reminder of that which can be deadlier than the male. Alec Trevelyan is THE PERFECT anti-Bond, and Sean Bean was THE PERFECT actor to play him. The climactic confrontation rivalled even the classic train fight in From Russia With Love. Even a bit too much Bor-eees could not ruin the perfection of this movie. And Eric Serra's often haunting & cold score was, again, highly unappreciated.

    The World Is Not Enough
    By now Pierce had it down so well we didn't even think to question him as Bond (unless, er, we hated him to begin with, that is...). An awesome & record-breaking PTS, an uber-sexy (what would turn out to be) main villain, and a mis-adventure by M make this a singular Bond movie (until, y'know, they recycled some of these ideas for Skyfall). Renard was definitely not all that he could have been, but I think it was a choice not to go for an Oddjob redux at the end. Lack-O-pain doesn't automatically translate into super strength... oh well. Still, an excellent entry, and another triumph for Mr. Brosnan. And a sweet goodbye to Desmond...

    Die Another Day
    Much like Mark Hamill did for Return Of The Jedi, Pierce Brosnan was the glue that held this movie together.
    Or almost.
    All right, ROTJ is WAAAY better, but the point is, Brosnan is the best thing about this movie.
    Get your DAF sensibilities on, toss back a few, & enjoy the mayhem. Graves is pretty hilarious.

    Pretty good points listed here, even though I don't agree with TND of course. Though it's not always the case, sometimes for me a Bond movie is only as great as its villain, and TND fails big there. So did DAD of course. As a whole I would definitely say Brosnan's run was underrated, but the jury on him seems to be very divisive.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,800
    FoxRox wrote:
    sometimes for me a Bond movie is only as great as its villain, and TND fails big there.
    I added a bit to it; I love Carver.
  • Posts: 12,473
    chrisisall wrote:
    FoxRox wrote:
    sometimes for me a Bond movie is only as great as its villain, and TND fails big there.
    I added a bit to it; I love Carver.

    ...Nvm haha
    I respect your opinion though.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    Craig does have a tendency to mumble his lines.

    Neither did anything new, but I would choose Brosnan over Craig. Brosnan might not have had the best era, but watching his films, I never got the feeling that all involved were embarrassed to be making Bond films.

    And that's the problem. After GE, all involved should have been embarrassed because the series spiralled out if control into becoming a mockery even unto itself. The Craig era has restored class, credibility and serious talent that ordinarily may have thumbed their noses at doing a Bind film after what it had become. I'm tired of the free pass some people try to give the series, "its just a Bond film" as if that makes it ok and exempt from getting away with adverse elements that really bring the movies down. Bond can, should and is offering audiences more right now and long may it continue and get even better.

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,800
    doubleoego wrote:
    After GE, all involved should have been embarrassed because the series spiralled out if control into becoming a mockery even unto itself.
    WHAT????? Holy crap! Brosnan's movies are "a mockery" but MR is okay? Or DAF?
    I think you need to look at the overall scope of Bond movies; some will be for the literary fans, some will be for the masses that want a fun time, and some, like Brosnan's, are somewhere in between. In a strange confluence of political times, global events & EON choices, Craig's movies have been more or less 'literary' Bond. Cool. But denigrating particular past successes without calling the nonsense in ALL the previous movies seems silly to me.
    (I tried to be civil here)

  • doubleoego wrote:
    Craig does have a tendency to mumble his lines.

    Neither did anything new, but I would choose Brosnan over Craig. Brosnan might not have had the best era, but watching his films, I never got the feeling that all involved were embarrassed to be making Bond films.

    And that's the problem. After GE, all involved should have been embarrassed because the series spiralled out if control into becoming a mockery even unto itself. The Craig era has restored class, credibility and serious talent that ordinarily may have thumbed their noses at doing a Bind film after what it had become. I'm tired of the free pass some people try to give the series, "its just a Bond film" as if that makes it ok and exempt from getting away with adverse elements that really bring the movies down. Bond can, should and is offering audiences more right now and long may it continue and get even better.

    Bond has become Bourne. I think the producers during Brosnan's era were just going along with other major action movies during his era. The Bourne series popularized a more down-to-earth approach, which EON copied for the reboot. I don't see a reason why everyone should have been embarrassed after GE.
  • doubleoego wrote:
    Craig does have a tendency to mumble his lines.

    Neither did anything new, but I would choose Brosnan over Craig. Brosnan might not have had the best era, but watching his films, I never got the feeling that all involved were embarrassed to be making Bond films.

    And that's the problem. After GE, all involved should have been embarrassed because the series spiralled out if control into becoming a mockery even unto itself. The Craig era has restored class, credibility and serious talent that ordinarily may have thumbed their noses at doing a Bind film after what it had become. I'm tired of the free pass some people try to give the series, "its just a Bond film" as if that makes it ok and exempt from getting away with adverse elements that really bring the movies down. Bond can, should and is offering audiences more right now and long may it continue and get even better.

    Bond has become Bourne. I think the producers during Brosnan's era were just going along with other major action movies during his era. The Bourne series popularized a more down-to-earth approach, which EON copied for the reboot. I don't see a reason why everyone should have been embarrassed after GE.

    This has been a tendency of the series since the Moore era, and one of the things that keeps the Series alive: going with the fashion and influences of the time:

    LALD: Blaxplotation
    TMWTGG: Martial arts films
    MR: Star Wars
    OP: Indiana Jones
    LTK: Cannon Films + Miami Vice with, again, a little dose of Indy
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited February 2014 Posts: 12,480
    doubleoego wrote:
    Craig does have a tendency to mumble his lines.

    Neither did anything new, but I would choose Brosnan over Craig. Brosnan might not have had the best era, but watching his films, I never got the feeling that all involved were embarrassed to be making Bond films.

    And that's the problem. After GE, all involved should have been embarrassed because the series spiralled out if control into becoming a mockery even unto itself. The Craig era has restored class, credibility and serious talent that ordinarily may have thumbed their noses at doing a Bind film after what it had become. I'm tired of the free pass some people try to give the series, "its just a Bond film" as if that makes it ok and exempt from getting away with adverse elements that really bring the movies down. Bond can, should and is offering audiences more right now and long may it continue and get even better.

    Bond has become Bourne. I think the producers during Brosnan's era were just going along with other major action movies during his era. The Bourne series popularized a more down-to-earth approach, which EON copied for the reboot. I don't see a reason why everyone should have been embarrassed after GE.


    Well, I do disagree with saying "Bond has become Bourne."

    And of course I feel nobody should be embarrassed about GE through TWINE; DAD is a different finished product and some should be embarrassed. But doubleoego you and I will never agree on Bond films; we seem to be watching different films entirely or at least you enjoy things I really don't and vice versa. C'est la vie.
  • edited February 2014 Posts: 1,778
    doubleoego wrote:
    Craig does have a tendency to mumble his lines.

    Neither did anything new, but I would choose Brosnan over Craig. Brosnan might not have had the best era, but watching his films, I never got the feeling that all involved were embarrassed to be making Bond films.

    And that's the problem. After GE, all involved should have been embarrassed because the series spiralled out if control into becoming a mockery even unto itself. The Craig era has restored class, credibility and serious talent that ordinarily may have thumbed their noses at doing a Bind film after what it had become. I'm tired of the free pass some people try to give the series, "its just a Bond film" as if that makes it ok and exempt from getting away with adverse elements that really bring the movies down. Bond can, should and is offering audiences more right now and long may it continue and get even better.

    Bond has become Bourne. I think the producers during Brosnan's era were just going along with other major action movies during his era. The Bourne series popularized a more down-to-earth approach, which EON copied for the reboot. I don't see a reason why everyone should have been embarrassed after GE.

    I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one. You're acting like the Craig Era is the first time the series has gone down this more serious and character driven route. I'm sorry but Bourne didn't invent the serious spy movie. Lazenby, Dalton, and early Connery were doing it before anyone even knew who Matt Damon was. Hell Bourne isn't even a spy. While I'll agree that there are some influences of the Bourne films on the action scenes of QOS (same fight coordinator BTW) other than that Bond is still very much Bond.

    Besides the first two Bourne films didn't exactly set the box office world on fire. I'm not sure why EON would want to rip them off. But like I said I think those films were just one of many influences that got Bond back on track for more down-to-earth espoinage.
  • edited February 2014 Posts: 11,189
    ...and lets not forget that Bourne was pulled out of the water suffering from memory loss. That first happened to Bond in the YOLT novel. Bourne took from Bond and Bond then took it back ;)
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Murdock wrote:
    More Brosnan bashing. What a shame. 8-|

    I will stay out then, as I have nothing nice to say, :))
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,800
    BAIN123 wrote:
    ...and lets not forget that Bourne was pulled out of the water suffering from memory loss. That first happened to Bond in the YOLT novel. Bourne took from Bond and Bond then took it back ;)
    Quite!
    B-)
  • Posts: 7,653
    BAIN123 wrote:
    ...and lets not forget that Bourne was pulled out of the water suffering from memory loss. That first happened to Bond in the YOLT novel. Bourne took from Bond and Bond then took it back ;)

    I expected this to implimented in SF with 007 trying to assassinate M, and sadly they have not taken this bit of Fleming to the movies. With the PTS of SF it would be brilliantly placed.

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,800
    Back on topic....

    Without Pierce, we probably would never have gotten Dan.
  • edited March 2014 Posts: 7,653
    chrisisall wrote:
    Back on topic....

    Without Pierce, we probably would never have gotten Dan.

    Listen I know you are not a great fan but do not blame everything on Pierce.

  • MrcogginsMrcoggins Following in the footsteps of Quentin Quigley.
    Posts: 3,144
    That's not really called for is it .
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    chrisisall wrote:
    doubleoego wrote:
    After GE, all involved should have been embarrassed because the series spiralled out if control into becoming a mockery even unto itself.
    WHAT????? Holy crap! Brosnan's movies are "a mockery" but MR is okay? Or DAF?
    I think you need to look at the overall scope of Bond movies; some will be for the literary fans, some will be for the masses that want a fun time, and some, like Brosnan's, are somewhere in between. In a strange confluence of political times, global events & EON choices, Craig's movies have been more or less 'literary' Bond. Cool. But denigrating particular past successes without calling the nonsense in ALL the previous movies seems silly to me.
    (I tried to be civil here)

    DAF and MR knew what sort of movies they were. They were intentionally silly and goofy. TND through to DAD is a series of creative misfires that dabbled in parody and pastiche all the while shockingly trying to take themselves seriously. I'm not handing out free passes to certain films but things are as they are and for me, by the time DAD came around Bond had become a lucrative embarrassment and for the record Pierce himself deserves very little of the blame.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Pierce deserves none of the blame. After all, he did not write, direct or even cast himself.
  • edited March 2014 Posts: 3,566
    SaintMark wrote:
    I think we can blame Dan on a certain Barbara and a some soaked knickers of hers. :\"> ;)
    Mrcoggins wrote:
    That's not really called for is it.

    I must echo @Mrcoggins here. We can credit both Barbara Broccoli and Michael G. Wilson for Daniel Craig's remarkable tenure as Bond; both of them need to be in agreement on an issue of this magnitude in order for a decision to be made. I really do not understand the disrespect that some parties feel entitled to toss about regarding Ms. Broccoli, and feel that such comments are entirely out of place on this forum.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    edited March 2014 Posts: 40,976
    Pierce deserves none of the blame. After all, he did not write, direct or even cast himself.

    I think most would disagree with you in terms of some of his acting (some think he's terrible), his pain faces, his stretching out of words ("Knew all about my shoulllder, knew exactly where to hurrrt me."), etc. Most of you gents know where I stand on Brosnan, so I never see faults in the man, but I can accept other's thoughts on the matter.

    It's a bit refreshing to see some people agreeing with those that have opposite views of them. I thought I would enter this and just see page upon page of more Brosnan bashing, which is the last thing this forum needs.
  • Posts: 12,837
    doubleoego wrote:
    DAF and MR knew what sort of movies they were. They were intentionally silly and goofy. TND through to DAD is a series of creative misfires that dabbled in parody and pastiche all the while shockingly trying to take themselves seriously. I'm not handing out free passes to certain films but things are as they are and for me, by the time DAD came around Bond had become a lucrative embarrassment and for the record Pierce himself deserves very little of the blame.

    I think this applies to DAD but not TND and TWINE.

    TWINE takes itself seriously because it is a more serious film and TND never tries to be anything more than a fun action film.
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