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I like the guy that played Dent.I hope they don't over use the Big Bad Harve persona,though.
Riddler was great again.Nice to get those odd little moments from him,though they still seem natural.
Penguin got short shrift,but I don't really get what his plan is for Liza.We all know he's playing all sides, so something is up.
Of course,the big news was the Bruce/Selina meeting.I liked all of it,despite my reservations for injecting such an important relationship into these early years.My only problem was, I don't see how come Bruce didn't question her about his parents death.I mean,he's doing this whole detective thing and doesn't question a witness?I guess his being a "mini adult" had to give way to his discovering GIRLS!I liked Alfred throughout.
Oh...and Arkham becoming Arkham at the end.
P.S. Barbara is so stupid I really hate her now She needs to go. This is literally nothing more than a cause for unnecessary drama .
And Renee Montoya... wow, waited until Jim was proven innocent and then seduced his girlfriend. I think she's gonna want to transfer to Metropolis when Jim makes Commissioner. Also, I don't think there's going to be any Batgirl in this continuity.
And next week's mid-season finale' looks like it's gonna be epic.
But, the budding romance between Bruce and Selena is working out well. Clearly, Bruce is thinking with his dick when it comes to Selena living in his house. He willfully breaks stuff just to fight her for a kiss, after all.
So, really, this episode was kind of wasted. Harvey Dent (in all of three brief scenes, despite the the episode being named after him) can only be there for minor Easter eggs, no real foreshadowing, even. Disappointing.
Agreed . And I don't find Fish Mooney so annoying now but Barbara wow just....wow.
Agreed. Jim deserves better. At this point I'm hoping Jim meets another woman named Barbara and starts over again.
Right on. She loves him, but runs to another woman arms, and bed, first bloody chance she gets. I hope the writers will discover that James Gordon deserves so much better.
Right now, I can't think of a reason, much less a good one, James Gordon would ever want her back.
GOTHAM: It Seems 'Gordon' & 'Dr. Thomkins' Will Be More Than Just Friends
http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/notyetamovie/news/?a=110699
Even before the first episode premièred, many people failed to see the point of a show like Gotham...and not just because it would be a "Batman story without Batman". The feeling was that because so many (let's be honest, with the exception of Fish Mooney, all!) of the players were younger versions of established DC Comics characters that have a role to play in Bruce Wayne's life when he eventually dons the cape, that there would be a lack of surprise and overall suspense knowing that there's no way they'd ever be killed off. Well, that might not strictly be the case! EW ask Heller about deviating from canon by possibly sending someone down for the dirt nap, and here's what he said.
"I wouldn’t say it’s iron clad. You’d need a damn good reason to do it and a damn good end game to justify it. We’re certainly just learning the ropes at this stage. Not to be modest about it, but we’re still learning how to do a show this big. I’m always deeply reluctant to kill off characters simply for the shock value of killing them off. I’m not averse to cheap tricks. But apart from anything else, this season literally every actor has come through and [performed really strong]. I would hate to lose any of them. Killing off Sean Bean in the first season of Game of Thrones made everyone go, “Oh, what a good idea that is!” But I don’t think it’s a good idea if you’ve got Sean Bean. The bad one was on Deadwood, when they had David Carradine doing that marvelous Wild Bill Hickok, and then he was gone."
A lot of fans have taken issue with Gotham for the liberties it's taken already, I think if they killed off someone like The Penguin or The Riddler before Batman even has a chance to introduce himself it might be the final straw. Still, it sounds like it's only a possibility and not certain to happen. Heller also teases what's in store for Jim Gordon (Ben McKenzie) down the line, saying he eventually says "screw it" and takes the fight straight to the gangsters and corrupt politicians that run the city. "And just when Jim thinks he’s achieved a certain level of success against the powers-that-be, they pull a vicious table-turn on him that will play out in the last episodes of the season in a very big, scary theatrical way.". Much more at the link below.
http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/11/20/gotham-interview-killing-characters/
Alfred: "Endure, Master Gotham. Start killing off Batman's most classic villains. They'll hate you for it, but that's the point of Gotham, it can be the outcast. It can make the choice that no one else can make, the rating-boosting choice."
Harvey Dent, for instance. (And on another note: Props to Gotham for having two characters named Harvey.) He's a contemporary of Jim Gordon, as opposed to a contemporary of Bruce Wayne. He's already showing intense signs of his other side. His coin is already set up. I can deal with his age, because watching Teen Batman would be a little stupid, but they shouldn't have shown us his coin or his other persona in his debut episode. His coin, if nothing else, should have simply been something he was flipping, a nod that fans would love that people who don't know Harvey Dent would just look at as a neat character quirk. "Oh, hey, he absent-mindedly flips a coin. Cool."
Ivy Pepper, who will obviously grow up to be Poison Ivy, was thrown in just to be an Easter egg. She served no purpose. Toss her. She didn't need to be there. The Pepper's could easily have just had a kid in the background watering plants, nobody would have cared. The fact that they changed her name just to show off that she's Poison Ivy shows that the writers either don't think anybody will make the connection or that they didn't want that cameo for fan purposes, which is all it amounted to anyway!
Gotham is ridiculously corrupt. To the point where every single cop save the Major Crimes Unit and Bullock were ready to sell him out when Cobblepot showed up alive after he was supposed to be dead. Yes, in the comics, Gotham was a corrupt city, but this is pushing it. They weren't even willing to solve crimes a couple episodes in. Gordon had to give them a kick in the ass to do anything. Are Jim Gordon and Edward Nygma (of all people) the only two people on the Gotham police force who actually like their jobs?!
Barbara has been handled poorly. 'Nuff said.
But, then there's the things that are done right. Cobblepot is played well, if sometimes (like just this past episode) under-used. He's the right combination of class and creepy that makes him look like some weird melding of Danny DeVito and Burgess Meredith but normal human height instead of short.
Back to Harvey Dent. He was played well. Even though the actor can't really do anything with the role, he did that well. That's pretty much the best compliment anybody but Gordon and Bullock can get on this show. Ivy can't really pop in to do anything but water flowers, Nygma has to just be the awkward forensics guy who tells riddles, even Bruce f*cking Wayne can't do anything except start to turn into the character we know him as.
So, yeah. This knowledge that killing established characters isn't off the books doesn't sit right with me. And, to be honest, aside from Barbara and Fish Mooney (who desperately needs to die), nobody has done anything to deserve to die. Their deaths would just seem cheap, a way to say, "See! We don't have to slavishly follow the comics!" If they're going to do that, follow Smallville's example. That had the right balance of introducing Superman to the world and still showing off elements of his mythos. Granted, they killed off his three major villains before he ever donned the costume, but they didn't suffer the same kind of "We can show you this, but we can't show you this" that Gotham is pretty much forced to do.
Great post =D> I agree with everything mate :)
So funny and true :D
Great post. Another issue I have with the show is that it is too often a villain-of-the-week kind of show: criminal X shows up, then Gordon and Bullocks solve the case. It seems these two can handle Gotham City by themselves and do not need Batman.
But the greatest problem with the show is that when Batman will be active, he'll be fighting geriatric supervillains, with heart condition, or half blind, or deaf...
Gordon has little room to breath because he's pretty much already the character he will be when he grows a mustache. They tried to do the "corrupt yet honest cop" thing by having him fake Cobblepot's death to appease Falcone and keep his conscience clear, but he's been such an honest cop since that that's pretty much thrown out the window, aside from being a minor element in those two~three episodes where Cobblepot was believed dead.
Bullock was set up as a corrupt cop at first, but then comes the episode about the psychiatrist making people kill rich kids where we find out that, yeah, he's a corrupt cop but, g*ddamnit, he's got a heart of gold.
These sorts of things clash with the image that she show wants to create. If nobody's really gonna change, why have the show so far ahead of Batman's first appearance? Why not just make a show that starts with Bruce putting on cowl and then cut to Gordon and Bullock and make Batman a shadowy figure that you never actually see?
But if I do have a complaint, I would like if they got away from the self-contained villain-of-the-week type plot more often. The best episode of the show so far was Penguin's Umbrella which dealt almost exclusively with long running characters and plot threads, and I don't think that was a coincidence. Pretty much every episode the most interesting stuff involves the longer running plots dealing with Penguin, Falcone, Bruce, etc.
A show like Boardwalk Empire would be my model to use. Tons of characters juggling multiple plots spread over an entire (or multiple) seasons.
Believe me... The Shadow Knows !
This episode was chock full of wonderful, often heart-warming moments. Seeing Bruce and Alfred really bond over their training, becoming less master and butler and more father and son was stellar. I think Alfred enjoys these kinds of activities because he finally has something valuable to offer Bruce beyond his attempts at reassuring him that everything will be alright, which he knows doesn't work. He realizes Bruce isn't the type to let this thing go, and his drive, ambition and commitment to solving the murder of his parents is why he will never drop it. Now we see Alfred has accepted the temperament of his young master and has joined him in his cause other the past episodes, embracing Bruce's desire to see this thing through. Seeing him and Bruce do their training was satisfying on a very geeky level for me, especially in light of the relationship they grow to have, where Alfred is very much Bruce's Batman. I also loved it when Bruce said he was building his own curriculum for schooling so he could hone in on the things he thinks are the most important to learn, a total Batman move as his knowledge of forensics, criminology and more attests to. They've adapted Bruce's character so perfectly here, and shown his impressive intellect off so damn well. I can't wait to see more.
I have been waiting to see Selina back again beyond a minor appearance in this show, which I was overjoyed to get this week. I love the actress (Camren Bicondova) they've cast and her interpretation of the character, which is spot on. Her dynamic with David Mazouz as Bruce is equally as perfect, as their complex relationship just gets its beginnings. We see their transition from rough acquaintances to playful, budding friends as the episode goes on. The cherries on top of the cake were the moments where the two discussed their fractured family lives, having both lost a strong family unit to watch over them. Because of this, both have had to do some growing up for themselves, which is partly why Bruce and Selina feel so mature and independent at such a young age. I loved the scene where they're both making a mess of the manor and Alfred looks on, happy just to see Bruce smiling again. They've really begun to get his character and the relationship he has with Bruce, which is fantastic.
Dent was okay in this episode, nothing startling but not disappointing either. The introduction we get to him and his coin trick was a nice nod of things to come, as was the other personality that popped out a bit. The actor did an okay job of playing Dent, but as I said, I wasn't over the moon about his acting. I look forward to seeing the character developed, including the inevitable moment acid will hit his face and change things for good. It'll be cool to see Ben's Gordon face off with Dent as a villain after having him as an ally for so long.
As many have said, Fish has gone from insufferable to moderately tolerable in comparison to Barbara. I find it so annoying that Barb basically takes everything out on Gordon when she is the cause of all her suffering in the first place. He went out of his way to keep her safe, yet she stuffed that plan down the drain when she tried to meet with Falcone (against all his wishes) and actually thought she could spare his life, even though he's warned her time and time again about the don. After all this she has the nerve to leave Jim when he needs her support most, and gets back with Montoya, who she knows is nothing but trouble. So much for Montoya and Gordon being allies, eh? I can't wait to see Jim's reaction when he finds out how much Barbara has done him in this time. Three strikes, she's out! I mean come on, he's the one who's supposed to be having the affair here, not Barb! I'm curious if he and Essen will ever get together in this show. It seems like now the writers just want to make Gordon as much of a boy scout as possible, and maybe add some faults to his character later on, his affair with Essen included. We shall just have to wait and see...
Next episode's preview got me pumped, and the episode looks thrilling, with Bruce going street, Alfred showing off some pugilism, and Gordon and Bullock going on the defensive. Should be an exciting mid-season finale.
Now, a question for my fellow Bat-geeks. With Selina talking about her parents this week, I got to thinking: do you think Heller and co. will go with the continuity where Selina is Falcone's daughter? It could make things really interesting and tie Selina even more to the Wayne's deaths through her father. She could also be the reason Falcone gets the scars on his face, the result of her act of revenge on him when she discovers he has involvement in Thomas and Martha's deaths.
Wow that would be great...you should write the show mate :) I sure hope that they have a great plan with the show.
We Have The Same Goal :)
Nice to see Alfred take part in some of the action. this is most badass live action version of Alfred we have gotten thus far.Sean Pertwee has become my favorite live action Alfred and This was his best episode yet.The Alfred we need and deserve.
Oh and no No Barbara/Montoya! YEEEEESS !
Overall,I did like Selina & Bruce's little adventure.Bruce jumping the building after her was a nice bit of foreshadowing.I liked the ending as well. At least she finally kissed him after teasing the poor kid with it for a week. Still don't know what it is she stole. Cigarette case?
But why do these shows have to take a hiatus? Oh well..
New GOTHAM Promo Looks Ahead To 2015; First Footage Of 'Dr. Leslie Thompkins'