NO TIME TO DIE (2021) - Critical Reaction and Box Office Performance

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Comments

  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 1,351
    And now it's happened, because I didn't listen to you guys and continued reading stuff and just assumed that one of the biggest newspapers in Germany wouldn't put spoilers in the first paragraph of their review...
    So, if there are any Germans here: Avoid Die Zeit for now.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,183
    matt_u wrote: »
    After 5 years a lot of people still say that SP has Moore-esque influences. I remember that back in 2015 the mantra was Craig meets Moore, SP meets camp. I still don’t see any Moore-esque stuff in SP. So I don’t bother those camp comments.

    I saw a little bit of Moore with the references to LALD, but what I really got out of it was that it’s an amalgamation of 60s films, particularly concerning SPECTRE. The crater base feels very DN with the chauffeur and hospitality at the crater base, then we have a train fight like in FRWL, Bond sporting a white tuxedo much like Connery’s in GF, a board room meeting that includes an execution of a member like in TB, Blofeld’s scarring like in YOLT, finally Blofeld being essentially crippled like in OHMSS. All deliberate attempts at doing an all in one.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited September 2021 Posts: 8,395
    We're seeing a similar pattern to SP it seems, following an initial wave of buzz people are being more critical and judging the film based on its actual merits, not hyped and dazzle factor. It'll be interesting to see how general audiences respond, but the first impressions seem quite mixed. People seem to agree, it's the middle entry for Craig in terms of quality. Not his best, but not terrible either.
  • Posts: 1,630
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed. The films needn't keep increasing in budget and runtime, that's for sure. Sometimes you can do a lot more when you're more constrained.

    I don't know about that. When the producers had to slim budgets -- no choice about it -- in LALD and especially in TMWTGG, it showed. When they turned it on again in TSWLM, it showed, in a positive way, and the audiences came back. If the Bond producers "went lean and mean" there'd be many disappointed fans -- this is not a LeCarre story, with any Bond, after all. If they try to put a big story up on the big screen, and don't produce something Bond-ian, they'll suffer comparisons with the M:I films and others. You need not spend more each time than before, you can plan and keep things under control, but the Bond folks better put something BIG up on the screen ! What they need are great action set-pieces which are extended, tense, spectacular, dangerous -- as you may have noticed, the M:I films don't have the trickiest plots since the first one, but starting with the third one (first one great, second a let-down, from third on better and better) they've used this technique to great effect. Their action set-pieces are memorable, and that boosts the film itself, and the audience enjoyment, etc. What I am saying is that a Bond film should be big, but need not spend more and more and more. But some tight, tense, personal spy drama ? Nope. Not sure that's what you were suggesting, though...
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    Since62 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed. The films needn't keep increasing in budget and runtime, that's for sure. Sometimes you can do a lot more when you're more constrained.

    I don't know about that. When the producers had to slim budgets -- no choice about it -- in LALD and especially in TMWTGG, it showed. When they turned it on again in TSWLM, it showed, in a positive way, and the audiences came back. If the Bond producers "went lean and mean" there'd be many disappointed fans -- this is not a LeCarre story, with any Bond, after all. If they try to put a big story up on the big screen, and don't produce something Bond-ian, they'll suffer comparisons with the M:I films and others. You need not spend more each time than before, you can plan and keep things under control, but the Bond folks better put something BIG up on the screen ! What they need are great action set-pieces which are extended, tense, spectacular, dangerous -- as you may have noticed, the M:I films don't have the trickiest plots since the first one, but starting with the third one (first one great, second a let-down, from third on better and better) they've used this technique to great effect. Their action set-pieces are memorable, and that boosts the film itself, and the audience enjoyment, etc. What I am saying is that a Bond film should be big, but need not spend more and more and more. But some tight, tense, personal spy drama ? Nope. Not sure that's what you were suggesting, though...

    I certainly wouldn't mind something that's akin to DN - stripped back, tight, focused heavily on one locale, more spy elements, but yes, that wasn't what I was suggesting either. I think you can go big and bombastic without needing to spend more and more, certainly without having to go into the $300 million + range. SP cost that much and I rarely felt like I saw the money on screen. I do think the budget needs to be bigger than your average, everyday film, but I want it to be used more wisely.
  • Posts: 1,092
    Since62 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed. The films needn't keep increasing in budget and runtime, that's for sure. Sometimes you can do a lot more when you're more constrained.

    I don't know about that. When the producers had to slim budgets -- no choice about it -- in LALD and especially in TMWTGG, it showed. When they turned it on again in TSWLM, it showed, in a positive way, and the audiences came back. If the Bond producers "went lean and mean" there'd be many disappointed fans -- this is not a LeCarre story, with any Bond, after all. If they try to put a big story up on the big screen, and don't produce something Bond-ian, they'll suffer comparisons with the M:I films and others. You need not spend more each time than before, you can plan and keep things under control, but the Bond folks better put something BIG up on the screen ! What they need are great action set-pieces which are extended, tense, spectacular, dangerous -- as you may have noticed, the M:I films don't have the trickiest plots since the first one, but starting with the third one (first one great, second a let-down, from third on better and better) they've used this technique to great effect. Their action set-pieces are memorable, and that boosts the film itself, and the audience enjoyment, etc. What I am saying is that a Bond film should be big, but need not spend more and more and more. But some tight, tense, personal spy drama ? Nope. Not sure that's what you were suggesting, though...

    You can have a bigger budget and still make a tight film. I think the issue I have with some of the newer Bond films is simply that I don't see the budget up there on screen. The excesses are a waste of time and money.

    Did SP need to be 250 million? How much did they spend on that one explosion? It was an an explosion that added little to the film. Whereas the train fight was amazing, one of the best fisticuffs in the franchise, and probably did not cost much overall.
  • RainyRainy Skyfall
    Posts: 40
    89% after 62 reviews on RT as of now.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    The_Reaper wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed. The films needn't keep increasing in budget and runtime, that's for sure. Sometimes you can do a lot more when you're more constrained.

    I don't know about that. When the producers had to slim budgets -- no choice about it -- in LALD and especially in TMWTGG, it showed. When they turned it on again in TSWLM, it showed, in a positive way, and the audiences came back. If the Bond producers "went lean and mean" there'd be many disappointed fans -- this is not a LeCarre story, with any Bond, after all. If they try to put a big story up on the big screen, and don't produce something Bond-ian, they'll suffer comparisons with the M:I films and others. You need not spend more each time than before, you can plan and keep things under control, but the Bond folks better put something BIG up on the screen ! What they need are great action set-pieces which are extended, tense, spectacular, dangerous -- as you may have noticed, the M:I films don't have the trickiest plots since the first one, but starting with the third one (first one great, second a let-down, from third on better and better) they've used this technique to great effect. Their action set-pieces are memorable, and that boosts the film itself, and the audience enjoyment, etc. What I am saying is that a Bond film should be big, but need not spend more and more and more. But some tight, tense, personal spy drama ? Nope. Not sure that's what you were suggesting, though...

    You can have a bigger budget and still make a tight film. I think the issue I have with some of the newer Bond films is simply that I don't see the budget up there on screen. The excesses are a waste of time and money.

    Did SP need to be 250 million? How much did they spend on that one explosion? It was an an explosion that added little to the film. Whereas the train fight was amazing, one of the best fisticuffs in the franchise, and probably did not cost much overall.

    That's what I'm saying (and I believe SP even stretched closer to $300-330, at least from all the estimates I've seen since 2015). Hey, I won't complain if I can see $300 million unfolding on screen but I absolutely didn't. That explosion seemed nothing more than a back-patting session, it's almost cringe watching everyone jump up and down in excitement after filming it. Completely useless money waster there.
  • matt_umatt_u better known as Mr. Roark
    Posts: 4,343
    It was cool to watch.
  • Posts: 3,276
    RottenTomatoes is shi....

    Some of the reviews deemed "fresh" are more negative than some of the reviews deeming it "rotten." Like this for example:
    https://www.hollywoodintoto.com/no-time-to-die-review/
  • RainyRainy Skyfall
    Posts: 40
    Zekidk wrote: »
    RottenTomatoes is shi....

    Some of the reviews deemed "fresh" are more negative than some of the reviews deeming it "rotten." Like this for example:
    https://www.hollywoodintoto.com/no-time-to-die-review/

    Metacritic is probably more accurate in that regard. They further categorize reviews at mixed. NTTD is 73 there currently based on like 28 reviews.
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,587
    Zekidk wrote: »
    RottenTomatoes is shi....

    Some of the reviews deemed "fresh" are more negative than some of the reviews deeming it "rotten." Like this for example:
    https://www.hollywoodintoto.com/no-time-to-die-review/

    Then you'll get the ones deemed positive and it's categorized at negative. Like they'll take a 3 of 5 star review as negative. The threshold should be 3 out of 5 and 2.5 out of 4 or higher as positive and anything lower as negative.
  • edited September 2021 Posts: 3,276
    The review on Metacritic from Screendaily giving the worst score - "50" - would certainly be deemed "fresh" on RT.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    edited September 2021 Posts: 8,183
    FYI, when critics submit their reviews to RT, they clarify whether their reviews are fresh or rotten. That’s why you may see 3/5 scores either being positive or negative.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    Zekidk wrote: »
    RottenTomatoes is shi....

    Some of the reviews deemed "fresh" are more negative than some of the reviews deeming it "rotten." Like this for example:
    https://www.hollywoodintoto.com/no-time-to-die-review/

    I pay no mind to RT for many reasons, that one in particular.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,395
    Zekidk wrote: »
    RottenTomatoes is shi....

    Some of the reviews deemed "fresh" are more negative than some of the reviews deeming it "rotten." Like this for example:
    https://www.hollywoodintoto.com/no-time-to-die-review/

    Then you'll get the ones deemed positive and it's categorized at negative. Like they'll take a 3 of 5 star review as negative. The threshold should be 3 out of 5 and 2.5 out of 4 or higher as positive and anything lower as negative.

    No, because "fresh" doesn't mean anything above absolutely average.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,383
    He also compares the tone to that of TSWLM

    Oh I could deal with that! :)
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,183
    Mendes4Lyfe being a negative nancy as usual. It probably kills him that SF was as adored as it was.
  • ProfJoeButcherProfJoeButcher Bless your heart
    Posts: 1,711
    And now it's happened, because I didn't listen to you guys and continued reading stuff and just assumed that one of the biggest newspapers in Germany wouldn't put spoilers in the first paragraph of their review...
    So, if there are any Germans here: Avoid Die Zeit for now.

    I'm assuming you live in Germany too.... This sounds absolutely normal to me! I avoid German media specifically, all of it, when there's a big new film coming. In the run up to The Dark Knight Rises I even stopped following German acquaintances on Facebook.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,383
    And now it's happened, because I didn't listen to you guys and continued reading stuff and just assumed that one of the biggest newspapers in Germany wouldn't put spoilers in the first paragraph of their review...
    So, if there are any Germans here: Avoid Die Zeit for now.

    No Time To Die Zeit
    The_Reaper wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed. The films needn't keep increasing in budget and runtime, that's for sure. Sometimes you can do a lot more when you're more constrained.

    I don't know about that. When the producers had to slim budgets -- no choice about it -- in LALD and especially in TMWTGG, it showed. When they turned it on again in TSWLM, it showed, in a positive way, and the audiences came back. If the Bond producers "went lean and mean" there'd be many disappointed fans -- this is not a LeCarre story, with any Bond, after all. If they try to put a big story up on the big screen, and don't produce something Bond-ian, they'll suffer comparisons with the M:I films and others. You need not spend more each time than before, you can plan and keep things under control, but the Bond folks better put something BIG up on the screen ! What they need are great action set-pieces which are extended, tense, spectacular, dangerous -- as you may have noticed, the M:I films don't have the trickiest plots since the first one, but starting with the third one (first one great, second a let-down, from third on better and better) they've used this technique to great effect. Their action set-pieces are memorable, and that boosts the film itself, and the audience enjoyment, etc. What I am saying is that a Bond film should be big, but need not spend more and more and more. But some tight, tense, personal spy drama ? Nope. Not sure that's what you were suggesting, though...

    You can have a bigger budget and still make a tight film. I think the issue I have with some of the newer Bond films is simply that I don't see the budget up there on screen. The excesses are a waste of time and money.

    Did SP need to be 250 million? How much did they spend on that one explosion? It was an an explosion that added little to the film. Whereas the train fight was amazing, one of the best fisticuffs in the franchise, and probably did not cost much overall.

    Yeah I keep saying it but the Mission Impossible films have had much lower budgets, and although they haven't made quite as much cash I'd say that they've been possibly even slightly more spectacular than the recent Bonds- it doesn't seem, erm, impossible ;)
    But then I guess we've got Amazon involved now so spending less cash seems unlikely!

  • foo_yukfoo_yuk Canada
    Posts: 26
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    I hope these are right but these early reactions are always highly exaggerated it seems.

    Absolutely. I mean, if you were lucky enough to get an invite, would you trash the film
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    skropper13 wrote: »
    AA Dowd who I respect as a critic and often, though obviously not always, agree with said he thinks NTTD is the weakest of the Craig Bond films. I think it’s fair to say that’s a fringe opinion at this point, but I certainly hope I don’t agree!

    All a matter of opinion of course, but I don’t think any film from Craig could let me down more than SP.

    That's the one shining light for me - even if I don't like it, I can't imagine it's worse than SP.
    mtm wrote: »
    And now it's happened, because I didn't listen to you guys and continued reading stuff and just assumed that one of the biggest newspapers in Germany wouldn't put spoilers in the first paragraph of their review...
    So, if there are any Germans here: Avoid Die Zeit for now.

    No Time To Die Zeit
    The_Reaper wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    Creasy47 wrote: »
    Agreed. The films needn't keep increasing in budget and runtime, that's for sure. Sometimes you can do a lot more when you're more constrained.

    I don't know about that. When the producers had to slim budgets -- no choice about it -- in LALD and especially in TMWTGG, it showed. When they turned it on again in TSWLM, it showed, in a positive way, and the audiences came back. If the Bond producers "went lean and mean" there'd be many disappointed fans -- this is not a LeCarre story, with any Bond, after all. If they try to put a big story up on the big screen, and don't produce something Bond-ian, they'll suffer comparisons with the M:I films and others. You need not spend more each time than before, you can plan and keep things under control, but the Bond folks better put something BIG up on the screen ! What they need are great action set-pieces which are extended, tense, spectacular, dangerous -- as you may have noticed, the M:I films don't have the trickiest plots since the first one, but starting with the third one (first one great, second a let-down, from third on better and better) they've used this technique to great effect. Their action set-pieces are memorable, and that boosts the film itself, and the audience enjoyment, etc. What I am saying is that a Bond film should be big, but need not spend more and more and more. But some tight, tense, personal spy drama ? Nope. Not sure that's what you were suggesting, though...

    You can have a bigger budget and still make a tight film. I think the issue I have with some of the newer Bond films is simply that I don't see the budget up there on screen. The excesses are a waste of time and money.

    Did SP need to be 250 million? How much did they spend on that one explosion? It was an an explosion that added little to the film. Whereas the train fight was amazing, one of the best fisticuffs in the franchise, and probably did not cost much overall.

    Yeah I keep saying it but the Mission Impossible films have had much lower budgets, and although they haven't made quite as much cash I'd say that they've been possibly even slightly more spectacular than the recent Bonds- it doesn't seem, erm, impossible ;)
    But then I guess we've got Amazon involved now so spending less cash seems unlikely!

    I gotta say I was actually salty as a Bond fan when I enjoyed MI Fallout as much as I did. The generous use of the iconic theme in the score, the “WOW” moments were so plentiful that you forgave the silly plot, even enjoyed it… Coming off the heals of Spectre, I definitely tipped my cap to that movie.
  • While I still prefer Craig’s Bond films overall to the recent MI movies, there’s no doubt that Fallout ate Spectre’s lunch. Will be interesting to compare NTTD to MI7.
  • fadetoblack7fadetoblack7 Chicago IL
    Posts: 60
    Are American critics allowed to post their reviews as well, or do they have to wait until next week?
  • Posts: 380
    The video reviews I'm watching on YouTube all seem to praise NTTD as imperfect but really good. This may be too hard to fully parse but I think you'll see a split between Bond fans and major critics, while audiences and professional (sliding scale) bloggers will give the film consistent praise.
  • RainyRainy Skyfall
    edited September 2021 Posts: 40
    Are American critics allowed to post their reviews as well, or do they have to wait until next week?
    Plenty of American critics have released their reviews as well. It isn't as splintered as the review cycle for Spectre where if I remember correctly, a lot of the UK reviews came first.

    It's down to 86% after 74 reviews on RT. Will probably settle somewhere in the mid to low 80s after most of the reviews come in.
  • Posts: 3,276
    While I still prefer Craig’s Bond films overall to the recent MI movies, there’s no doubt that Fallout ate Spectre’s lunch. Will be interesting to compare NTTD to MI7.

    Spectre was up against MI:5 Rogue Nation.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,383
    Zekidk wrote: »
    While I still prefer Craig’s Bond films overall to the recent MI movies, there’s no doubt that Fallout ate Spectre’s lunch. Will be interesting to compare NTTD to MI7.

    Spectre was up against MI:5 Rogue Nation.

    Same result though! :)
  • Yeah same result lol. I actually like Rogue Nation even more than Fallout.
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,547
    It’s always a bitter pill to swallow for me how deftly Rogue Nation handled the arch-nemesis dynamic over Spectre. Still love Spectre though.
  • Red_SnowRed_Snow Australia
    Posts: 2,538
    ‘No Time to Smile’: Swiss Audience Conflicted Over James Bond Premiere at Zurich Film Festival
    https://variety.com/2021/film/global/james-bond-zurich-film-festival-daniel-craig-1235076781/
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