Where does Bond go after Craig?

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  • edited September 15 Posts: 946
    He doesn't need to win anyone's favour. Bond is timeless and above fads, social media could collapse in a decade from now. Vaping? Smoking dope? What!

    I think just some cool tech will do. Whatythat Q-Spider thing in the PS2 game, have some miniaturised version of that he can use. Maybe the bad guys chase him with drones that he has to outsmart. Hmm could he have an AI assisted tech, or is that too Iron Man/Jarvis.

    I'd like to see space tourism being featured.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    He doesn't need to win anyone's favour. Bond is timeless and above fads, social media could collapse in a decade from now. Vaping? Smoking dope? What!

    I think just some cool tech will do. Whatythat Q-Spider thing in the PS2 game, have some miniaturised version of that he can use. Maybe the bad guys chase him with drones that he has to outsmart. Hmm could he have an AI assisted tech, or is that too Iron Man/Jarvis.

    I'd like to see space tourism being featured.

    It's time for the MR remake.
  • Posts: 1,996
    .
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I can't see a way in which Higson's Bond wasn't just the Bond we've always known but in the modern day. I think it's slightly confused and contradictory to say that he should be unconcerned by what's in vogue and yet wear fashionable suits and drive the latest car. Which is it.

    I could have phrased that better. Nice car and suits are some of the tools of Bond's trade, as he tends to move among the rich and powerful.

    I'll be interested in how Bond is updated to appeal to younger audiences. I don't know what that looks like.
  • Posts: 4,166
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I can't see a way in which Higson's Bond wasn't just the Bond we've always known but in the modern day. I think it's slightly confused and contradictory to say that he should be unconcerned by what's in vogue and yet wear fashionable suits and drive the latest car. Which is it.

    The only time I got a sense that Higson's Bond was 'modern' was maybe when he noted that the villain's meeting was a room full of white people/had no diversity or whatever. Apart from that it's a relatively straightforward Fleming-esque Bond portrayal. The story itself obviously touches on things like right wing grifters and current politics, but apart from me personally not liking the approach/writing, it wasn't unrecognisable as James Bond.
    I'm quite certain you could've had this discussion any time since Connery left. Will the next Bond be a dope smoking pacifist to satisfy the burgeoning Baby Boomers? Will he be a nihilistic slacker to win favour with Generation X?

    Were such concerns warranted? You tell me.

    Yeah, agreed. There's always been a consistency of sorts to the Bond character, even with the different actors bringing their own traits to the role.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited September 15 Posts: 16,423
    CrabKey wrote: »
    .
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I can't see a way in which Higson's Bond wasn't just the Bond we've always known but in the modern day. I think it's slightly confused and contradictory to say that he should be unconcerned by what's in vogue and yet wear fashionable suits and drive the latest car. Which is it.

    I could have phrased that better. Nice car and suits are some of the tools of Bond's trade, as he tends to move among the rich and powerful.

    Bond enjoys the finer things in life: that's always been part of his character right from the books. He doesn't just use them, he likes them. He's not particular about his three-ringed cigarettes and the particular vintage of his Bollinger just for show. That's quite a basic tenet of the character.

    007HallY wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I can't see a way in which Higson's Bond wasn't just the Bond we've always known but in the modern day. I think it's slightly confused and contradictory to say that he should be unconcerned by what's in vogue and yet wear fashionable suits and drive the latest car. Which is it.

    The only time I got a sense that Higson's Bond was 'modern' was maybe when he noted that the villain's meeting was a room full of white people/had no diversity or whatever. Apart from that it's a relatively straightforward Fleming-esque Bond portrayal.

    To be honest I didn't find that hugely modern, even- Bond was making an observation that it was a very unapologetically old-school white male crowd, and he doesn't make a value judgement on it either way. Bond of the 50s wouldn't have noticed that, no, but that was because of the world around him: if he didn't notice that today he'd be rather lacking in observation skills. Well I say that, even Fleming's Bond would probably make some sort of comment if he were at a drinks party where there were no women! :)
  • Posts: 4,166
    mtm wrote: »
    CrabKey wrote: »
    .
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I can't see a way in which Higson's Bond wasn't just the Bond we've always known but in the modern day. I think it's slightly confused and contradictory to say that he should be unconcerned by what's in vogue and yet wear fashionable suits and drive the latest car. Which is it.

    I could have phrased that better. Nice car and suits are some of the tools of Bond's trade, as he tends to move among the rich and powerful.

    Bond enjoys the finer things in life: that's always been part of his character right from the books. He doesn't just use them, he likes them. He's not particular about his three-ringed cigarettes and the particular vintage of his Bollinger just for show. That's quite a basic tenet of the character.

    007HallY wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Yeah I can't see a way in which Higson's Bond wasn't just the Bond we've always known but in the modern day. I think it's slightly confused and contradictory to say that he should be unconcerned by what's in vogue and yet wear fashionable suits and drive the latest car. Which is it.

    The only time I got a sense that Higson's Bond was 'modern' was maybe when he noted that the villain's meeting was a room full of white people/had no diversity or whatever. Apart from that it's a relatively straightforward Fleming-esque Bond portrayal.

    To be honest I didn't find that hugely modern, even- Bond was making an observation that it was a very unapologetically old-school white male crowd, and he doesn't make a value judgement on it either way. Bond of the 50s wouldn't have noticed that, no, but that was because of the world around him: if he didn't notice that today he'd be rather lacking in observation skills. Well I say that, even Fleming's Bond would probably make some sort of comment if he were at a drinks party where there were no women! :)

    Under the circumstances yes, I can see why it was noticed.

    To be honest, I actually felt OHiMSS was a bit safe in terms of what Bond thought about politics, especially far right/far left types (ie. the they inevitably meet in the middle and he views them as similarly militaristic). Fleming's Bond was way more subversive (and I suppose individualistic) in his cynicism. This is a character who openly thought in GF that 'prohibition is the trigger of crime' in relation to a job he has to do involving a drug operation. Or who claimed that the Cold War was a game of 'chasing the red Indian' in CR, and that good and evil didn't truly exist. It felt far more toned down/diluted compared to Fleming, but I can understand why it's perhaps tricky for a continuation author to do.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,423
    Yes I think that’s fair, he was rather less outspoken (even just in his own head!) than Fleming’s version, which made him seem rather less passionate somehow.
  • ArapahoeBondFanArapahoeBondFan Colorado
    Posts: 65
    echo wrote: »
    He doesn't need to win anyone's favour. Bond is timeless and above fads, social media could collapse in a decade from now. Vaping? Smoking dope? What!

    I think just some cool tech will do. Whatythat Q-Spider thing in the PS2 game, have some miniaturised version of that he can use. Maybe the bad guys chase him with drones that he has to outsmart. Hmm could he have an AI assisted tech, or is that too Iron Man/Jarvis.

    I'd like to see space tourism being featured.

    It's time for the MR remake.

    With SpaceX! Lol
  • Posts: 1,996
    @echo -- I'd like to see another version of any film from the Moore era.



  • Posts: 1,860
    CrabKey wrote: »
    @echo -- I'd like to see another version of any film from the Moore era.

    Same here.

  • Posts: 1,368
    Skyfall seems extremely dated to me now. There isn't even an ounce of Gen Z in that film. Its a terminally millenial treatise.

    Hopefully there will NEVER be an ounce of Gen Z in an Bond film ever.

    Well, Zendaya is very slim...
  • Posts: 3,276
    The Craig-era was rich on themes, like rebirth, revenge and resurrection. It had a lot of grief, loss and betrayal. I don't figure they will continue down that path. But at the same time they need to keep Bond as a three-dimensional character, but what is there left to exploit?
  • sandbagger1sandbagger1 Sussex
    Posts: 942
    I think we’ll probably get more personal themed stories, and within the next three films we’ll get a plot involving a shock centred on Bond’s parents:

    They were secretly involved in the intelligence community, and Bond must tie up a loose end they left dangling:

    They’re rumoured to be still alive and held by the enemy; is it a trap?

    There’s someone assassinating agents and Bond suspects it’s his supposedly long-dead father.

    These are the kind of stories Marvel and DC Comics generate for long standing heroes who are still selling. Not something I’d look forward to because things start to get silly or contradictory, but I think if I was a jobbing writer trying to pitch a story to Eon, that’s the sort of story I’d choose.

  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited September 16 Posts: 16,423
    That's kind of where Deaver was going with his storyline in Carte Blanche which didn't go anywhere because there was no follow up.
    It's a bit hackneyed, sure, but I don't think I'd be entirely averse to it. The parents were still dead but I think it was part of some grander scheme which Bond was beginning to uncover (was it called Iron Fist or something?). Maybe a bit similar to the Andrew Garfield Spider Man film though, yes.
  • sandbagger1sandbagger1 Sussex
    Posts: 942
    … and The Batman had Bruce discovering his father was linked to organised crime and his mother had mental issues that were covered up.

    It tends to be a good source of angst.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    What's cyclical is that what seemed so fresh with Die Hard has become so hackneyed.

    I want personal stakes in a Bond film but I'd like to see a new angle, somehow.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,423
    echo wrote: »
    I want personal stakes in a Bond film but I'd like to see a new angle, somehow.

    Same here; and yes I can't think of a way either!
    Unless they do do a proper 'life of Bond' thing, starting earlier than CR did. I don't know if the audience would want that though.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    mtm wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    I want personal stakes in a Bond film but I'd like to see a new angle, somehow.

    Same here; and yes I can't think of a way either!
    Unless they do do a proper 'life of Bond' thing, starting earlier than CR did. I don't know if the audience would want that though.

    Personal stakes could be the mission itself.

    What if agent 007 has lost the faith of M— and Bond knows it too?

    What if we hear that the last two missions were barely accomplished because of mistakes and impulses that this once star agent fell into?

    What if, because of this, Bond has also lost faith in himself as well? That he just hasn’t let the old man down, but himself too? Has he, at (say) age 30, really lost his edge? Has he really lost his instincts?

    And what if the next assignment is a loose adaptation of THE MAN WITH THE GOLDEN GUN: M knows that the young 007 is at a fork in the road and sends him on a mission that will likely see him fall by the sword, but, if James Bond does survive, it’ll see him become a better man/agent than the one that started this story.

    And Bond is fully aware that this assignment could be a suicide mission, but accepts it anyways…

    Just spit-balling … Stakes, but without it being about a lover lost, or something floating up from the past…
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,423
    Yes, that's nice thinking. I've always disliked the TMWTGG brainwashing plot as it's a bit too silly and 60s for me, but I guess it did work for Jason Bourne to be introduced like that, and you perhaps wouldn't have to go the whole brainwashing hog but perhaps have him return in a very damaged state from a mission we don't see and has to rediscover himself in a make-or-break way.
    Hmm, but then that's Skyfall I guess, isn't it! :D
    It's tricky.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    mtm wrote: »
    Yes, that's nice thinking. I've always disliked the TMWTGG brainwashing plot as it's a bit too silly and 60s for me, but I guess it did work for Jason Bourne to be introduced like that, and you perhaps wouldn't have to go the whole brainwashing hog but perhaps have him return in a very damaged state from a mission we don't see and has to rediscover himself in a make-or-break way.
    Hmm, but then that's Skyfall I guess, isn't it! :D
    It's tricky.

    I wonder if the PTS could be this explosive introduction to the new Bond, BUT, it shows him making the mistake (whatever that may be)? Yes, he finishes the assignment, but just barely, and we see the flaw in his character (with the choice he made).

    It can differ from Skyfall.

    With Skyfall, Bond “died” and was “resurrected” .

    But with this other concept, we have a youthful, charismatic man of action, under control and blasting his way through the PTS, but he makes a near-fatal decision that almost costs him the assignment. And his life.

    After the PTS we have M giving him a dressing down. We will hear that this wasn’t the first time he’s slipped up. We can hear (of how his damn (beretta) jammed on the assignment before last). M has no idea what’s got into his double-O. He came into the service as the top candidate, but, he’s been slipping, and slipping badly.

    He dismisses Bond and tells him to go home and figure out if he’s actually cut out for this way of life.

    A young agent who meets the fork in the road.

    So when this suicide mission comes across the desk, both Bond and M know what’s at stake. And the question of, is this the life he really wants, will only be answered by his success, or failure, of the assignment.

    It could be very different from SF (?).
  • talos7talos7 New Orleans
    Posts: 8,217
    Well, if they’re going for a really younger audience…

    RW3Atsv.jpg
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    talos7 wrote: »
    Well, if they’re going for a really younger audience…

    RW3Atsv.jpg

    😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂
  • Posts: 1,860
    Call me old fashioned but the less we know about Bond personally the better. Just send him on an assignment and let us enjoy the ride as he get's closer to his target and finally vanquishes his latest larger-than-life foe.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    mtm wrote: »
    Yes, that's nice thinking. I've always disliked the TMWTGG brainwashing plot as it's a bit too silly and 60s for me, but I guess it did work for Jason Bourne to be introduced like that, and you perhaps wouldn't have to go the whole brainwashing hog but perhaps have him return in a very damaged state from a mission we don't see and has to rediscover himself in a make-or-break way.
    Hmm, but then that's Skyfall I guess, isn't it! :D
    It's tricky.

    Yes, the brainwashing is a hoary '50s-'60s trope at this point. I suppose it could appear that Bond has turned but Bond is actually a triple-agent against the Russians or whoever and he didn't even tell M for his safety (?).

    I feel like this is already turning into a Gardner plot. :-O
  • MaxCasinoMaxCasino United States
    Posts: 4,637
    I think we’ll probably get more personal themed stories, and within the next three films we’ll get a plot involving a shock centred on Bond’s parents:

    They were secretly involved in the intelligence community, and Bond must tie up a loose end they left dangling:

    They’re rumoured to be still alive and held by the enemy; is it a trap?

    There’s someone assassinating agents and Bond suspects it’s his supposedly long-dead father.

    These are the kind of stories Marvel and DC Comics generate for long standing heroes who are still selling. Not something I’d look forward to because things start to get silly or contradictory, but I think if I was a jobbing writer trying to pitch a story to Eon, that’s the sort of story I’d choose.
    mtm wrote: »
    That's kind of where Deaver was going with his storyline in Carte Blanche which didn't go anywhere because there was no follow up.
    It's a bit hackneyed, sure, but I don't think I'd be entirely averse to it. The parents were still dead but I think it was part of some grander scheme which Bond was beginning to uncover (was it called Iron Fist or something?). Maybe a bit similar to the Andrew Garfield Spider Man film though, yes.

    Yes, it is a bit of a shame that CB never properly finished its dangling story threads. IFP got COLD when they shouldn't have.
    … and The Batman had Bruce discovering his father was linked to organised crime and his mother had mental issues that were covered up.

    It tends to be a good source of angst.

    Sure as long as Blofeld doesn't have any connection to the Bond family again.
  • Posts: 1,996
    delfloria wrote: »
    Call me old fashioned but the less we know about Bond personally the better. Just send him on an assignment and let us enjoy the ride as he get's closer to his target and finally vanquishes his latest larger-than-life foe.

    Battling personal demons, daddy and mommy issues, never having recovered from the lost loves of his life, his love-hate relationship with M, and, of late, adopted sibling rivalry, the mission that almost killed him or will kill him have all become cliche.

    Dispense with that stuff and bring us a competent and committed Bond unburdened with angst.

    I'd much rather wonder what motivates Bond rather than two and half of attempting to explain what motivates Bond.

    The adopted brother nonsense should serve notice how pointless all that was. Connery never had a moment of self-reflection and not for a second did I wonder about his emotional health.

    I watch a lot of British crime drama and I am amazed at how almost everyone comes from a broken marriage, they've had some sort of trauma, or they have an aged parent with dementia. Sure, those things affect people in real life, but when all that stuff becomes de rigueur in our television shows and films it becomes a bore.

    Let the mission be the challenge, not his head.
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    edited September 17 Posts: 3,789
    talos7 wrote: »
    Well, if they’re going for a really younger audience…

    RW3Atsv.jpg

    That would've likely to happen if Disney acquired James Bond, oh my.....
    And you have teenagers or a love teams from Disney films and shows singing the Bond themes 😂
    delfloria wrote: »
    Call me old fashioned but the less we know about Bond personally the better. Just send him on an assignment and let us enjoy the ride as he get's closer to his target and finally vanquishes his latest larger-than-life foe.

    After the Craig Era, this is what we really need for a breathe of fresh air.
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,586
    Honeychile's a polydactyl!
  • SIS_HQSIS_HQ At the Vauxhall Headquarters
    Posts: 3,789
    I wish the next Bond posters were great looking, not like Photoshopped or plain like the last two recent Bond posters (SP & NTTD), still missing the hand made and very creative Bond posters in 60s-80's though.
  • sandbagger1sandbagger1 Sussex
    Posts: 942
    SIS_HQ wrote: »
    I wish the next Bond posters were great looking, not like Photoshopped or plain like the last two recent Bond posters (SP & NTTD), still missing the hand made and very creative Bond posters in 60s-80's though.

    Yes. I think my favourite Bond poster might be Live and Let Die:
    qioyso3.jpg
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