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Would you rather Bond return to his cultural knowledge OR Bond return to the one-liner?

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  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,582
    I don't have the Stradivarius or the Faberge but I do have the address card from the cello case plus a handful of quail eggs.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    edited November 18 Posts: 5,431
    Would you rather Bond return to his cultural knowledge OR Bond return to the one-liners?

    Both of these were in short supply in the Craig era of films so a return to one of them would likely be a welcome return.

    Bond was once a cultural snob, or do we say a cultural encyclopedia? Often able to quote the best wines, the best food and always knew a little bit about everything. The correct temperature of sake, the taste for indifferently blended brandy. James would often show off his knowledge, especially in the office. I learned quite a bit about things through my love of James Bond movies.

    OR would you prefer a lighter Bond.

    Bond was also once known to dispense a one-liner or two when facing danger. In the Sean Connery and Roger Moore eras these were often used to break tension and give the audience some humour. I'm thinking of "What a helpful chap." "Do you mind if my partner sits this one out, she's just dead."

    Bonus marks if you want to share your favourite cultural knowledge OR favourite one-liner
  • NickTwentyTwoNickTwentyTwo Vancouver, BC, Canada
    Posts: 7,551
    Cultural Knowledge I guess! I like when Bond correctly describes the flaws in the Brandy in (I think?) Goldfinger. Or the butterfly in OHMSS.
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,037
    I'm also for cultural knowledge...though in small doses. He must not come across as a show-off, as seems to have been the Bernard Lee M's impression occasionally. But the quality of one-liners has gone down so much over time, even with entire character names created for the sole purpose of triggering a bad pun and reaching their nadir in the Brosnan era, that I'm actually happy they restricted themselves considerably during Craig's reign.
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,122
    Tough one again. I think sometimes his knowledge went way too far. But I do like him being as cultured and a bit of a snob. But not a know-it-all. I liked how he was subtly depicted as cultured in the Craig era, like when we saw he had a good command of Italian. I do like solid one liners, but not too many and not bad puns. I prefer stronger dialogues. So I'll chose cultured by default, but not too strongly.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,304
    I think we've gone as far with the one-liners as I think we can go. TWINE was quippe vomitus.

    I vote for sophistication.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    edited November 18 Posts: 7,131
    Nothing against a successful oneliner, but sophistication always wins. I like my Bond to be a citizen of the world, with plenty of cultural knowledge (and language skills).
  • 007ClassicBondFan007ClassicBondFan
    Posts: 2,270
    I don’t see why we can’t have both. The one liners and Bond’s sophistication often goes hand in hand. To have one without the other would feel incomplete.
  • CrabKeyCrabKey
    Posts: 1,993
    One liners go hand in hand with sophistication if they are witty.
  • 007ClassicBondFan007ClassicBondFan
    Posts: 2,270
    Exactly which is why I think (most) of the one-liners in this series work.
  • thedovethedove hiding in the Greek underworld
    Posts: 5,431
    007ClassicBondFan wrote: »
    I don’t see why we can’t have both. The one liners and Bond’s sophistication often goes hand in hand. To have one without the other would feel incomplete.

    We could have both, this thread is dedicated to would you rather so we always pose a question for people to share their thoughts.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,803

    Cultural entendre.
  • 007ClassicBondFan007ClassicBondFan
    Posts: 2,270
    thedove wrote: »
    007ClassicBondFan wrote: »
    I don’t see why we can’t have both. The one liners and Bond’s sophistication often goes hand in hand. To have one without the other would feel incomplete.

    We could have both, this thread is dedicated to would you rather so we always pose a question for people to share their thoughts.

    Oh yeah I completely understand. I just think that both humor and sophistication are both crucial elements to the Bond character that to lose one in favor of the other would result in losing some of the elements that make Bond so unique.

    That’s just my two cents of the subject matter. I suppose I’d like to see Bond be a bit more “cultured” than he has been throughout some of the Brosnan/Craig films though. I guess that part of the character was alluded too in Casino Royale but we’ve never really seen a full blown, culturally sophisticated Bond since at least the Dalton years.
  • DwayneDwayne New York City
    Posts: 2,847
    Excellent points @007ClassicBondFan, cultural knowledge is something that has been generally downplayed since the Dalton days.

    I raised this very issue on another thread. Maybe the producers think that would come across as too snobbish or (even) culturally inappropriate to modern audiences. I tend to disagree. I think that it makes Bond appear to be really acknowledgeable (one of the major reasons that I fell in love with the character in the first place), and those moments - to me anyway - are a sign of respect to foreign cultures.
  • 007ClassicBondFan007ClassicBondFan
    Posts: 2,270
    Dwayne wrote: »
    Excellent points @007ClassicBondFan, cultural knowledge is something that has been generally downplayed since the Dalton days.

    I raised this very issue on another thread. Maybe the producers think that would come across as too snobbish or (even) culturally inappropriate to modern audiences. I tend to disagree. I think that it makes Bond appear to be really acknowledgeable (one of the major reasons that I fell in love with the character in the first place), and those moments - to me anyway - are a sign of respect to foreign cultures.

    I agree; it’s hard to pinpoint a reason why that part of the character has been downplayed lately. It’d be nice to see the next Bond be a bit more culturally enriched than he has been lately.

    As much as I admire Brosnan, I do have a hard time believing he’d figure out the problem with drinking red wine with fish ;).
  • CrabKeyCrabKey
    Posts: 1,993
    Of all the Bonds, Moore's Bond seems the most snobbish. But I think a lot of that was due to his persona. Unlike the harder edged Bonds, he's a bit of a dandy. The humor during his run seemed less witty and more along the lines of schoolboy humor.

    I would like to see the return of a witty and sophisticated Bond. Elevate the audience instead of dropping down to its level.
  • 007HallY007HallY
    edited November 19 Posts: 4,158
    They kind of go hand in hand. I do find some of Bond’s ‘one upping’ of M about brandy in the Hamilton films a bit annoying and something that doesn’t always endear audiences to the character. But it can be done well and so long as it doesn’t make Bond look like a complete a*sehole I’ll go for a cultured Bond.
    007ClassicBondFan wrote: »
    Dwayne wrote: »
    Excellent points @007ClassicBondFan, cultural knowledge is something that has been generally downplayed since the Dalton days.

    I raised this very issue on another thread. Maybe the producers think that would come across as too snobbish or (even) culturally inappropriate to modern audiences. I tend to disagree. I think that it makes Bond appear to be really acknowledgeable (one of the major reasons that I fell in love with the character in the first place), and those moments - to me anyway - are a sign of respect to foreign cultures.

    I agree; it’s hard to pinpoint a reason why that part of the character has been downplayed lately. It’d be nice to see the next Bond be a bit more culturally enriched than he has been lately.

    I think it’s more that it was something the films exaggerated by the 70s/Moore era. It gets to the point Bond immediately knows about obscure tropical plants. And yes, it can make Bond look arrogant and smarmy.

    But I can see it being done well. Bond in the books doesn’t know everything, but he has his interests and is even asked by people like M to recount what he knows about something. You could even have him learning something for a mission and having to use that knowledge/recount something relevant to the Bond girl or whoever.
  • LudovicoLudovico
    Posts: 15,122
    007HallY wrote: »
    They kind of go hand in hand. I do find some of Bond’s ‘one upping’ of M about brandy in the Hamilton films a bit annoying and something that doesn’t always endear audiences to the character. But it can be done well and so long as it doesn’t make Bond look like a complete a*sehole I’ll go for a cultured Bond.
    007ClassicBondFan wrote: »
    Dwayne wrote: »
    Excellent points @007ClassicBondFan, cultural knowledge is something that has been generally downplayed since the Dalton days.

    I raised this very issue on another thread. Maybe the producers think that would come across as too snobbish or (even) culturally inappropriate to modern audiences. I tend to disagree. I think that it makes Bond appear to be really acknowledgeable (one of the major reasons that I fell in love with the character in the first place), and those moments - to me anyway - are a sign of respect to foreign cultures.

    I agree; it’s hard to pinpoint a reason why that part of the character has been downplayed lately. It’d be nice to see the next Bond be a bit more culturally enriched than he has been lately.

    I think it’s more that it was something the films exaggerated by the 70s/Moore era. It gets to the point Bond immediately knows about obscure tropical plants. And yes, it can make Bond look arrogant and smarmy.

    But I can see it being done well. Bond in the books doesn’t know everything, but he has his interests and is even asked by people like M to recount what he knows about something. You could even have him learning something for a mission and having to use that knowledge/recount something relevant to the Bond girl or whoever.

    That's one thing I loved about OHMSS: Bond is no heraldist and, even though he did his homework, he slipped. Bond should be cultured and knowledgeable, but not a know-it-all. Which means some people, villains and allies, should know more than he does on some subjects.
  • DEKE_RIVERSDEKE_RIVERS
    Posts: 1,365
    Bond must be a sybarite, that's all. He doesn't need to know everything.

    so, I choose the on-liners.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,976
    I'd rather the cultural knowledge and insights personally, as I thought (as has been mentioned) I thought both were sorely lacking in the Craig era.
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,260
    I'm not a fan of oneliners in any film, to be honest. A pin now and then may work, but that's it. Above all, James BOnd is a 'secret agent' or intelligence officer. Those are supposed to be able to pretent to be someone else, so a broad knowledge on many subjects is something they train on. Indeed, I think (especially in the Moore era) they've over done it way too many times. But the way Moore does explain his knowledge of Scaramanga, i.e., is a good way of having a bit more knowledge, but not too much.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,217
    Cultural knowledge, thank you very much.
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