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Marc Forster still defending his work on 'Quantum of Solace'

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  • BillNighy4QBillNighy4Q
    Posts: 2
    Such a tough film to like is QOS and for the reasons many have already mentioned.. I guess if I have to think this long and hard to try and like it more than dislike it then there's got to be something very wrong with it. Forster was ultimately the wrong choice, but to be fair he didnt really want to do it in the first place and Eon had to charm him into it meaning its more the producers fault perhaps. As a direct sequel to CR it didnt work at all unless you had the same director,cameraman,editor or simply just a less painfully pretentious and dull director. Forster is good at his own films but Bond is an art in itself which needs to be left to the Campbells,Nolans,Camerons of this world. CR you can tell was a film absolutely clear as to what it was suppose to be at all times, QOS felt it was trying too hard and in a panic. Action scenes, boat chase in particular, felt crowbarred in and that fast editing is something you do in a low budget flick trying to look better than it is or for viewers that have the attention span of a nat.
    (Tosca and Yousef confrontation scenes were not too bad though)
  • DoctorKaufmannDoctorKaufmann Can shoot you from Stuttgart and still make it look like suicide.
    edited October 2012 Posts: 1,261
    QoS has some major flaws, as many have stated here. IMHO it's too fast
    paced and too tightly edited, too much action and not enough storytelling and character development. But to say, that the horrid DAD is be a better movie, is beyond me.
  • JBFan626JBFan626
    edited September 2011 Posts: 1,497
    Another problem seemed to be Quantum Of Solace focused more on how Bond was feeling and coping with Vesper as the main plot (which was done well in my opinion) with Greene and co. as superfluous stuff on the side that was there just because it's expected in a Bond film which actually ended up as being very weak.
    I had a different reaction. I felt the movie didn't focus enough on the Bond coping with Vesper angle since this is how it was set up to be at the end of CR. The film halfheartedly wanted us to believe at times that it was, which is evident in badgering lines M gives Bond throughout about killing everyone--contrived, contrived, contrived.... The real heart of the story was surrounded around Camille's tragedy and her dealing with revenge. I never really got the sense from Bond that he was on a revenge mission, but rather just another standard Bond mission. The Greene and co. plotline, to me was the central plotline with Camille story adding some depth. But what Foster is saying here, and what I agree with, about the the third act not being fully developed, is really about getting deeper at the core of BOTH Camille and Bond's pain. I know Bond fans say they are sick of Bond "dealing with his feelings" and want Bond23 to be more traditional faire. The issue is though, that QOS handled this subject poorly, for what CR set-up. Had it been delivered better, like say the way it is in OHMSS, we would have had a much better, original Bond picture in QOS. And dare I say, would leave a lot of us wanting more of this kind of a Bond film.

  • 00130013
    edited September 2011 Posts: 1,817
    In my opinion, 3 things would be enough in making QOS a lot better (while not perfect):
    - traditional gunbarrel at the begining;
    - more presence of the Bond theme in the soundtrack (specially at action scenes);
    - Bond ending in bed with Camille.
    What I'm aiming to is to a more "formula" structure, while keeping the innovations of its creators and the director.
    Anyway, it is what it is and we can not change it... we are not George Lucas.
  • Baltimore_007Baltimore_007
    Posts: 5,634
    He's trying to defend QOS? Good luck to him, I say. It's easily the worst Bond of it's decade, and one of the worst Bonds in the cannon.
    Hurrah, as most people who argue that Quantum is a poor effort usually end up getting castigated for their thoughts

    I will always maintain it's a lame exercise, despite only seeing it the one time, not for the first time, I will always remember leaving the theater the night of release and walking away somewhat disgruntled.

    Many people shared similar sentiments and some didn't even stay until the end..

    Next years Craig release HAS to be an improvement.

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    I posed this question in another thread a small bit ago. Was the drought in Bolivia and the captured water Quantum were after the water aspect of Forster's elements plan??
  • civil_servantcivil_servant
    Posts: 6
    Better than 'Die Another Day' by a mile, although suffers in comparison with 'Casino Royale'. Impossible NOT to compare it with 'CR' as well, due to it continuing the same story. Seriously-is it worse than 'Moonraker', 'Octopussy' or even 'Diamonds Are Forever'? 'QoS' is great from a design perspective, but maybe a bit low on decent narrative and the action scenes are a bit messy, but it's not a bad film. The negative comments have obviously hit Forster hard...
  • 00130013
    Posts: 1,817
    I don't know if you have already discussed this before, but what do you think of the oil homage to Goldfinger?
  • thelordflasheartthelordflasheart
    Posts: 1,370
    I posed this question in another thread a small bit ago. Was the drought in Bolivia and the captured water Quantum were after the water aspect of Forster's elements plan??
    0Brady - the "elements" idea that Forster talked about was having action scenes based on each of the four basic elements - earth, water, air, and fire. So - lots of action that took place on the ground (earth), the boat chase for water, the plane scene for air, and the hotel inferno for fire.

  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,355
    'QoS' is great from a design perspective, but maybe a bit low on decent narrative and the action scenes are a bit messy, but it's not a bad film. The negative comments have obviously hit Forster hard...
    Maybe on paper it was great and as Craig said before began filming it was "ours to **** up". Maybe they did.

    Of course recently Craig thought the script was "cobbled together" due to the strike, so who knows what to believe?
  • UlyssesGamma_HoseUlyssesGamma_Hose
    Posts: 73
    I hated QoS at the cinema. I've grown to love it; once one has seen the action scenes a few times, and you understand what is happening, the fast-cutting is very effective in creating tension and excitement. The cinematography and editing of the the film overall is superb.

    And here's the important thing; Marc Forster gets the style of the early Bonds like no-one else has done. The effortless cool of Goldfinger, the less-is-more approach to action when fights would just errupt and end suddenly, the contrast between serenity and brutality that Terrence Young created - Forster recreates that and updates it for QoS.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    UlyssesGamma_Hose wrote:
    Marc Forster gets the style of the early Bonds like no-one else has done. The effortless cool of Goldfinger, the less-is-more approach to action when fights would just errupt and end suddenly, the contrast between serenity and brutality that Terrence Young created - Forster recreates that and updates it for QoS.

    While I do not share the extreme enthusiasm of my esteemed colleague here, I have to say it was a good film.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    UlyssesGamma_Hose wrote:
    I hated QoS at the cinema. I've grown to love it; once one has seen the action scenes a few times, and you understand what is happening, the fast-cutting is very effective in creating tension and excitement. The cinematography and editing of the the film overall is superb.

    And here's the important thing; Marc Forster gets the style of the early Bonds like no-one else has done. The effortless cool of Goldfinger, the less-is-more approach to action when fights would just errupt and end suddenly, the contrast between serenity and brutality that Terrence Young created - Forster recreates that and updates it for QoS.

    I disagree with this. Maybe in his head it sounded great but the execution of it all was a failure.
  • myworldisenoughmyworldisenough
    Posts: 1,143
    I actually watched QOS today and have to say I really enjoyed it. Yes, it's not long enough, has it's issues with editing and lack of character development in certain characters but it deserves credit for being brave enough to be different. I think it is very stylised with some fantastic moments. The two leads are excellent and you get the scense of their emotions and the personal demons that needed to be exercised. It deserves more credit than it gets.
  • Vancouver007Vancouver007
    Posts: 42
    The pre-title sequence and the last 5 mins of QOS alone are better then 3 of the 4 PB movies. And that's not including the mesmerizing opera scenes and some other wonderful moments. QOS is flawed but you know what... so was Bond and maybe that's why the whole mess works for me. I have tried not to love it, but I can't do it. Considering what he had to work with (script wise) Forster should be proud....
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    QoS does have some great moments and to be fair, every Bond film has a few great moments in them but I'm still of the opinion that Forster failed to achieve what he wanted and should have done, regardless of how stylish an approach he took. A monkey can throw poo at a wall in a stylish way but it doesn't change the fact that it's still a bunch of s**t that's being dealt out.
  • petergreenhill5petergreenhill5
    edited October 2012 Posts: 824
    Worse than TND and DAD?. Not in my opinion.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,217
    I hated it the first time I saw it. But it has grown on me. There are some really nifty scenes. The editing is a problem but I think the way some of the scenes are shot (lighting, colour textures, framing) is exceptional. It is very much film noir Bond in a lot of scenes. Craig is very good. Kurylenko is very good. The score is very good.

    It's an average release overall, not beating the first three Brosnan releases and not coming close to CR, but it's worth the watch.
  • Gareth00789Gareth00789
    Posts: 655
    Bad director when it comes to action films sorry. quantum and machine gun i found terrile. he needs to stick to some german movies . sorry. but he ruined part of the bond franchise, had ot say it.
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 12,837
    doubleoego wrote:
    QoS does have some great moments and to be fair, every Bond film has a few great moments in them but I'm still of the opinion that Forster failed to achieve what he wanted and should have done, regardless of how stylish an approach he took. A monkey can throw poo at a wall in a stylish way but it doesn't change the fact that it's still a bunch of s**t that's being dealt out.

    You summed it up nicely, I agree with you here.
  • Gareth00789Gareth00789
    edited October 2012 Posts: 655
    thelivingroyale wrote:
    doubleoego wrote:
    QoS does have some great moments and to be fair, every Bond film has a few great moments in them but I'm still of the opinion that Forster failed to achieve what he wanted and should have done, regardless of how stylish an approach he took. A monkey can throw poo at a wall in a stylish way but it doesn't change the fact that it's still a bunch of s**t that's being dealt out.

    You summed it up nicely, I agree with you here.

    To be onist, i think he was the wrong choice of director he never did an action film before and he doesnt do them well. sorry.
  • 001001
    Posts: 1,575
    doubleoego wrote:
    QoS does have some great moments and to be fair, every Bond film has a few great moments in them but I'm still of the opinion that Forster failed to achieve what he wanted and should have done, regardless of how stylish an approach he took. A monkey can throw poo at a wall in a stylish way but it doesn't change the fact that it's still a bunch of s**t that's being dealt out.

    What do you think were some great moments in qos?
    The editing stuffs up some potential great moments imo.

  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    001 wrote:
    doubleoego wrote:
    QoS does have some great moments and to be fair, every Bond film has a few great moments in them but I'm still of the opinion that Forster failed to achieve what he wanted and should have done, regardless of how stylish an approach he took. A monkey can throw poo at a wall in a stylish way but it doesn't change the fact that it's still a bunch of s**t that's being dealt out.

    What do you think were some great moments in qos?
    The editing stuffs up some potential great moments imo.

    I agree that the editing really ruins some great moments but I do think that the following were pretty good.

    Bond rumbling Quantum at the opera
    Bond evading Greene's goons at the opera
    Bond and Mathis on the plane
    Bond holding a dying Mathis
    M confronting Bond at the hotel just before Bond realises Fields is dead

    That's all I can think of at the moment.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    PeterGreenhill wrote:
    Worse than TND

    More Bond movies are worse than TND than aren't, FYI. [-X
  • UlyssesGamma_HoseUlyssesGamma_Hose
    Posts: 73
    It's weird how Craig and Forster were trying to write QoS themselves onset, and yet Die Another Day is the one that sounds like the actors made it up on the spot.
  • FromCanadaWithLoveFromCanadaWithLove Canada
    Posts: 612
    Quantum is better than TND, TWINE, and DAD (in my books). So, for the recent Bond outings, he's in the top 3 (until Skyfall comes out).

    Quantum had some really awesome scenes. Personally, I feel like the opening car chase and the opera house shootout are some of the most stylish scenes in the entire franchise. It's not a horrible movie. Better than average.
  • lewisblakelewisblake
    edited October 2012 Posts: 188
    This does need putting straight - at times it's not the acting or the directing that's at fault, it's the script or the screenplay. Overlooking this simple fact maybe resultant of the film industries taboo over how much credit script and screenwriters get etc Often resulting in the director and actors (and even producers) being more popular than the chap who wrote it.
    With QOS it's very frustrating because you can tell there are all the elements there to make a great film - it's just that some elements of the script and basic screenplay are a mess, thus infecting the rest of the film and tainting elements of the film which were on par with CR. Of course, if we use logic or ockhams razor it's obvious to see that the writer's strike thingy had a major impact on QOS.

    After watching QOS I was hoping they'd release a directors-cut or something that radically added clarity to the mess of the screenplay or switched pieces of the jigsaw around so they'd fit to make the great film QOS could have been.
    But again the director isn't to blame.....maybe he could have delayed the filming so we would have resulted in a better written film but that's all he could have done. Director's don't write scripts and screenplays unless they are auteurs.

    QOS is a damn sight better than many Bond films, and indeed arguably most of Brosnan's prior Bond films, and yet; in between Casino Royale and Skyfall QOS will stick out like a sore thumb in Craig's tenure as Bond.
  • doubleohdaddoubleohdad
    Posts: 1,146
    Forster made an uneven film in story but solid in tone. All he needs to do is put his film next to the last three Brosnan films to feel better about himself.
  • RisicoRisico
    Posts: 97
    Quantum of Solace put James Bond in a pair of white jeans. I have little else I wish to contribute to this thread. In fact, I think I need a lie down...
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    And turned mi6 into the starship enterprise.
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