Seriously now- which is worse, TWINE or DAD

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  • Posts: 1,548
    DAD by a long long way. Although to me it's a moot point because I like TWINE alot. Almost as much as Goldeneye in the Brosnan years. Still miles behind CR or QOS though.
  • I love TWINE! And David Arnold! There, I said it! This forum is weird...
  • edited October 2012 Posts: 51
    TWINE is the better Bond film although I still enjoy watching either (more so than QOS as well). Apart from the Christmas Jones character, there's nothing really wrong with TWINE and its a solid film if somewhat unremarkable and lacking in anything distinctive.

    When I first saw DAD in theaters I immediately thought it was Brosnan's best, but the more I watch it the worse it becomes. Honestly, if a lot of things were removed it would be a great film. The unnecessary CGI really killed the film, and the remarkable thing is that most of the CGI scenes could be removed without negatively affecting the plot one bit (especially the completely pointless rocket sled scene, which is probably the worst of all of Brosnan's action sequences). Halle Berry was a poor choice for a Bond girl and didn't handle the role well at all.

    The unnecessary fluff meant to draw mainstream audiences (well it definitely was successful) really hurt the movie in a big way.
  • Posts: 4,762
    Anyone else really, really dislike Gustav Graves and Zao? I for one believe that they ruin too much of DAD. Their corny dialogue plagues the movie! If there were a better main villain and a better main henchman, I believe DAD would most likely be more accepted than it currently is.
  • 0013 wrote:
    Definitely Die Another Day, some really good action scenes. But with this scene


    Even Brosnan laugh about it in the Everything or Nothing documentary.

    Vic Armstrong did not like it either and the stunt work in DAD is really good !

  • Halle Berry is up there with Denise Richards as one of the worse bond girls !
  • Posts: 1,405
    DAD is the worst Bond movie ever. Even if the first half is very good (minus Halle Berry), there is too much nonsense to ever consider it "good". The CGI scene almost made me left the theatre. Final 10 minutes was to say the least miserable.
  • DAD is the worst Bond movie ever. Even if the first half is very good (minus Halle Berry), there is too much nonsense to ever consider it "good". The CGI scene almost made me left the theatre. Final 10 minutes was to say the least miserable.

    It's not very good but the first half saves it from being awful and also puts it above QOS imo.
  • 0013 wrote:
    At least TWINE, GN and TND don't have that final insult to Moneypenny. The VR training is plain stupid but that last one is just a spit in the face of Lois Maxwell and her legacy.

    Best post of the day and possibly the week right here. The entire Brosnan tenure was an insult to Lois and the class she brought to the role. It's a shame, Brosnan and Bond had great chemistry but someone obviously decided that Moneypenny's usual repartee needed to be updated from a woman who flirted with class, to spout lines straight out of a porn film in TND, and later come off like a jealous little twit in TWINE with Dr. Warmflash. That's not Moneypenny. The desk scene is just the icing on a cake that was already plenty distasteful. It's just not what the character was ever supposed to be and after this, I'm in no rush to have the character back if this is what they have in mind.

  • edited October 2012 Posts: 11,189
    who flirted with class

    You mean the one who talked about Bond putting a wedding ring on her finger shortly after his wife was killed ;)

    to spout lines straight out of a porn film in TND

    I always smile at that line - she delivers it well :( It's probably just my immature taste in humour.
  • I haven't seen DAD since it first came out but it was the most fun that I had watching a Bond film in the theatre - the audience was so excited, like it was a huge party. Whether you like the style of DAD or not, they went full force with it. So for the type of movie it was, it was well done. For example, all those single entendre lines betwenn Bond and Jinx? The opening night audience I saw loved them. Did they think they were super cheesy and did the audience groan? Yep, they did - but in a way that tehy enjoyed it too. The film-makers were in on the joke.

    With TWINE, the film never achieved what it tried to be. There were good elements but bad acting, poor direction, and a listless, dreary tone really sank it. I rewatched it a few months back and like when it first came out, I appreciated what the filmmakers *tried* to do. But they couldn't do that type of film well. Even the para-hawks action scene, which should have been a slam dunk, was terrible. And let's not not start on the "confronting Elektra" scene.

    Now, is DAD my favourite type of Bond film? Oh god no, in fact it's the opposite. I'm much more partial to TWINE's style. So it's not that I *like* DAD more than TWINE, it's that I think they gave us the type of film that they tried to - an over-the-top, groaning and laughing giant piece of eye-candy that you'll forget about the next day.
  • Posts: 1,146
    I've written this before, but Bond has the gun on the bad guy halfway through the film and does not kill him, and the audience I saw him with shouted, shoot him! lol

    It wouldn't have killed him anyway, remember? He's invincible. He can't feel pain and will get stronger and stronger until the day he dies.

    "You can't kill me, I'm already dead"
    I've written this before, but Bond has the gun on the bad guy halfway through the film and does not kill him, and the audience I saw him with shouted, shoot him! lol

    It wouldn't have killed him anyway, remember? He's invincible. He can't feel pain and will get stronger and stronger until the day he dies.

    "You can't kill me, I'm already dead"

    He's stronger and impervious to pain, but still can die with a round to the noggin.
  • It wouldn't have killed him anyway, remember? He's invincible. He can't feel pain and will get stronger and stronger until the day he dies.

    "You can't kill me, I'm already dead"

    He's stronger and impervious to pain, but still can die with a round to the noggin. [/quote]

    Wasn't there glass there or something? I really can't remember.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    It wouldn't have killed him anyway, remember? He's invincible. He can't feel pain and will get stronger and stronger until the day he dies.

    "You can't kill me, I'm already dead"

    He's stronger and impervious to pain, but still can die with a round to the noggin.

    Wasn't there glass there or something? I really can't remember.[/quote]

    Yes, He got in the elevator that was protected by bullet proof glass.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    Die Another Day is the weaker of the two, easily. Thanks to reason we have discussed ever since its release 10 years ago.

    The World is Not Enough is flawed (especially in the final act) but overall pretty solid, and I'll never understand the hatred people put towards it. It's nowhere near the bottom, for me anyway.
  • Posts: 6,709
    DUD sucks.
  • Posts: 11,425
    The Brosnan films were so bad that Mendes didn't even bother seeing them.

    http://www.metro.co.uk/film/915607-skyfall-director-sam-mendes-wasnt-interested-in-james-bond
  • X3MSonicXX3MSonicX https://www.behance.net/gallery/86760163/Fa-Posteres-de-007-No-Time-To-Die
    Posts: 2,635
    Okay. This is it. I tell that DAD is the worst Bond film but i never said some short justifications. The first part - until the Theme song, because, it sucks also - It's the best part. However, After it, the whole film - except for the Ice Chase - is a horrendous and horrible whole thing, it would have been better to Brosnan to end up with Everything Or Nothing (2004). The surfing scene is Awesome, If it wasn't in a Bond movie. IF it was made in 007 Legends, it would be a great action made on it.

    TWINE is strong from the beggining to its ending. But i think that if the Bond women were inverted - Denise as villain and Sophie as the Good one - it would have been even greater.

  • I must say, as a Tomorrow Never Dies fan, how pleased I am to see it's genereally regarded more highly than Brosnan's later two films.

    I always thought TND was unpopular on the internet.
  • X3MSonicX wrote:

    TWINE is strong from the beggining to its ending. But i think that if the Bond women were inverted - Denise as villain and Sophie as the Good one - it would have been even greater.

    But Denise Richards doesn't have the acting skills to play Elektra. She barely has the acting skills to play Christmas Jones. And Sophie Marceau would be wasted in the Christmas role, which amounts to very little.
  • Posts: 11,119
    0013 wrote:
    Definitely Die Another Day, some really good action scenes. But with this scene


    Even Brosnan laugh about it in the Everything or Nothing documentary.


    Bond should have DIED in this one. Ughhh, it's so....so......I cannot find the words.
  • If I'm not mistaken, it was even worse in the cinema version. It was 'improved' for the DVD release.
  • Posts: 11,425
    I must say, as a Tomorrow Never Dies fan, how pleased I am to see it's genereally regarded more highly than Brosnan's later two films.

    I always thought TND was unpopular on the internet.

    TND is, relatively speaking, a classic, compared to Brozza's other outings.
  • I must say, as a Tomorrow Never Dies fan, how pleased I am to see it's genereally regarded more highly than Brosnan's later two films.

    I always thought TND was unpopular on the internet.

    I like TND. I prefer GE and TWINE, but TND is a fun popcorn film that I really enjoy. My one problem is when it goes into action overload in the 2nd half.
  • I loved GE, and I thought the first half of TND was excellent up until Wai Lin is introduced. TWINE was alright, but it just felt cold and a little off to me - didn't have the heart of a normal Bond film. DAD was immensely disppointing to me, even when I first saw it at 12 years old. Too cliched, with one liner after one liner, one over the top gadget or scene trying to out do the one before it, terrible acting from the lead villain and girl, etc.
  • anything to do with Laser is wrong in Bond.......
  • anything to do with Laser is wrong in Bond.......

    NOT if it results in the awful Halle Berry character being killed off..

    Sadly Mr Kil, became Mr Incompetent, and so Ms Berry survived and we had to live with it for the rest of that years release..

    Is this thread still going on incidentally ?

    I'll make it easy for everyone - "The World Is Not Enough is a far better movie than Die Another Day"

    It was then, it is now, and will be, until the end of Mankind

    Pretty simple math
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    edited October 2012 Posts: 4,399
    DAD is the worst.. hands down...

    TWINE, while it's not terrific, tries to maintain a level of intelligence through it's plot.. Brosnan gives (IMO) his best performance as Bond, and Sophie Marceau gives just as good of a performance as Elektra... the glaring faults of TWINE is in it's execution - it's a film thats caught in between identities - does it want to be traditional Bond?, or does it want to be a melodrama, and take risks in exploring new territories with the characters?... it's a film that seems like it will deliver both, but in the end it falls flat.... oh yeah - it has Denise Richards as well....

    but that still can't trump the awesome debauchery that is DAD.... its just sad that Brosnan got handed these two as his last 2 Bond films... sad.... but dems da dice...
  • TWINE is the better movie, but TWINE definitely has the worst action scenes of the series. Ski-chase? Rubbish. Shootout in the missile silo? Dull. Helicopter attack? Embarrassing. Final fight with Renard? A joke.
  • Posts: 11,425
    TWINE is the better movie, but TWINE definitely has the worst action scenes of the series. Ski-chase? Rubbish. Shootout in the missile silo? Dull. Helicopter attack? Embarrassing. Final fight with Renard? A joke.

    It felt that with TWINE the producers gave Brosnan the 'character' driven vehicle he wanted. However, he was not very good in it and the producers realized that with Brosnan they would always be reliant on Action and cheap one liners. Hence the next movie was DAD.

    I actually had high hopes for TWINE when it came out but was very disappointed by the movie. Having hated GE, TND was a big improvement in my eyes and at the time I thought that TWINE would mark a return to true form. But it turned out to be just as bad, may be worse than GE. It was then that I realized there was no saving Brosnan's Bond - he was doomed to be mediocre (and that's being generous). DAD was no surprise to me at all. It was the logical conclusion to the worst casting mistake that EON ever made - PB.
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