It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
^ Back to Top
The MI6 Community is unofficial and in no way associated or linked with EON Productions, MGM, Sony Pictures, Activision or Ian Fleming Publications. Any views expressed on this website are of the individual members and do not necessarily reflect those of the Community owners. Any video or images displayed in topics on MI6 Community are embedded by users from third party sites and as such MI6 Community and its owners take no responsibility for this material.
James Bond News • James Bond Articles • James Bond Magazine
Comments
My reasons for liking him actually don't have a lot to do with the alleged 'seriousness' of his two films. In fact, I see TLD as in a similar vein to FYEO and OP. LTK I don't even particularly like as a film over all. I just think he was excellent in the role. I think he nailed it from the first scenes in TLD. He is charismatic and commanding as Bond and brings (IMO) a Rogeresque ability to turn swiftly from deeply serious to light hearted. This probably flies in the face of what most people think but I don't see his Bond as the total rejection of Moore that it's sometimes made out to be. His Bond forms a continuity with Connery and Moore IMO. Different, obviously, but not a complete departure from where the series was previously. For me the actual real break came with PB, but that's for another thread.
@Getafix It is nice when someone sees it how it is. When I saw TLD in the cinema, I had been watching A View To A Kill every day as that was the only Bond available in my local video store for weeks. Believe me, Dalton was not this shock or wet blanket as I would have noticed the sharper contrast. I had no problems accepting him.
And he did play the suave parts beautifully like when he is in the Universal Exports office smoking a cigarette. He looks the classic Bond in M's office and holds the screen. Dalton's Bond had the sophistication the part required but in smaller doses.
And I saw TLD with two women who had a crush on Roger as Bond, and they loved the film. I did not hear complaints until Goldeneye came out and the anti-Dalton hype was in full swing. Just like now Craig's ass is being kissed at Brosnan's expense.
And Dalton almost carries LTK with the help of Davi. That is something. The newer Bond actors have greater backing than ever before in the franchise's history.
I reallylike Craig in the role, but to me he is not better than what has come before. The modern cinematic style also helps them come across as superficially better. But Bond is way more than just a man of action. Roger Moore had great moments and could be deadly serious. So could Connery.
And that is not a put down to Craig supporters but you have to respect those who did it first. Craig had 4 years to prepare for Skyfall. Connery had a year between FRWL to Goldfinger. And then look at the scale of TB a year later. Of course it would have been better if they had 4 years.
Older Bonds had less time to get it right. It was a sharp learning curve. I respect that!
Well given how popular the "Grey" series is at the moment I'd still say say quite a lot ;)
To be honest I'm really not sure Dalton carries LTK. I get the impression Davi is the one who leads the film. I can't quite put my finger on it but there is just something more genuinely chilling about him.
I still think he gets all the best lines in the film.
...also, I really don't think Dalton could carry off the Moore-esque humour. One reason I think I like Craig better is because he CAN do the playful lines convincingly.
Dalton is the reason Davi was hired. Dalton is the perfect Bond for that villain and their scenes together were great! In the casino, Dalton smolders confidence and menace! He's a Bond you don't F with!
Davi is a great villain but Dalton's scenes like where he lays explosives were revolutionary. The film was too clever for it's time, and the sophistication of the story passed by an audience who thought Schwarzenegger was a good actor.
"What did he promise you...his heart? Give her his heart!!"
Ooohh!!!
I'm no fan of The Daily Mail but I'd agree with this assessment:
Fast, frenetic, and among the most exciting Bond films. Q (Desmond Llewellyn) is drafted in to supply light relief, leaving Dalton free to take the plot seriously and be even more of an action man than previous Bonds. Unfortunately, he still lacks either the presence of Sean Connery or the charm of Roger Moore. When Dalton's on screen with the villain, it's the villain you watch. One other caveat: this is easily the most violent of the Bond pictures.
Dalton was not trying to be Moore and said so in interviews. Producers wanted his stamp but the Q scene with Dalton is hilarious and very comical. Great chemistry.
Daniel does the playful lines because I said earlier, the producers know you cannot be without them or audiences will call you a miserable Bond. Dalton did say his third film was to expose that element of humour more. And Dalton experimented with what he could get away with.
In TLD I liked Dalton's one liners like "Salt Corrosion!". Why should he be Moore like any more than Moore should be Connery like?
I agree completely, I think he completely stole the show!
It's an opinion. I personally believe Dalton has presence and I love the Connery films. They tried to make Brosnan the Bond to please the journalists and we almost got the death of the series. I prefer actors who do their own thing and screw Mr Critic. I have also read other newspaper reviews where they say the opposite.
@Bain123 I think for myself and do not need the crutch of a newspaper article to talk about why I like or dislike an actor or film. I think it was an unfair assessment of Dalton who was commanding. He actually wanted to make Sanchez have the big role during development to show how much of an opponent he was.
But the villain in Bond is always supposed to be Bond's equal. Dalton played it great!
I think Dalton was better with the "you should have brought lillies" line.
The "dead end" line near the end of LTK is pretty poor. It doesn't feel right.
As I've said before Dalton CAN do humour when given the right material (Hot Fuzz is a great example) but I always got the feeling his one liners in Bond were put in there to please audiences who were weaned on Moore (in fairness this is probably understandable).
@Bain123 I think for myself and do not need the crutch of a newspaper article to talk about why I like or dislike an actor or film. I think it was an unfair assessment of Dalton who was commanding.
I don't agree with every negative review there was about Dalts (the Empire review you mentioned a few days earlier was downright nasty - and normally I like Empire) and I do try to take what critics say with a pinch of salt.
...but I can't help agree with that one. Davi certainly gets most of the memorable lines in the film.
Incidently, that same journalist gave Skyfall a raving review. Wonder whether he'd go back and revise his views.
Not to take away from Dalts but having scene SF twice in the last few days I still feel Craig has a slightly more alluring presence - despite his shorter height.
I do think one of the problems Dalton had - particularly in LTK - were the rather shabby clothes he had to wear. IMO that added to the "TV feel" the film had (and maybe lessened his presence a bit).
I actually used to prefer Dalts in the role (believe it or not) but recenctly I re-evaluated.
Also, and I've been thinking about this for a while now, I have wondered if one of the reasons why some people feel as though he lacks screen presence is (yes some of the clothes he had to wear) but also, how good looking he is.
Miranda Wielding of Cinematic Passions explained how good looking he is perfectly here:
http://cinematicpassions.wordpress.com/2008/11/20/the-living-daylights/
All of the actors that portrayed JAMES BOND have been – at the very least – attractive.
But TIMOTHY DALTON is so extravagantly beautiful he’s breathtaking – a lean, athletic 6’2″, dark hair, perfectly chiseled features, mellifluous voice, classically trained. He’s equal parts ultimate alpha male and refined English gentleman: incredibly elegant but maddeningly dangerous. He’s like a sinuous emerald eyed jungle cat poised to pounce.
I think for some men, he is just too good looking to be believable in the role? Whereas Craig and Connery have more Clark Gable-ish features, not as perfectly good looking so they look like they could be more realistic? Something about their face is not as "beautiful", gives of a more rugged vibe and also they are broader as well.Compound this with Dalton's general disregard for going out of his way to charm women on screen and the impression that he's not as big on screen is complete. (though I particularly loved how he managed to charm Sanchez. That was a feat.).
I am just attempting to put my finger on why some people have this impression, which is something that I never felt about Dalton because he was great in the role for me all along, and I totally bought his Bond.
From Rediff:
The most underrated James Bond ever
http://www.rediff.com/movies/2006/nov/21bond.htm
Some notable excerpts, although the whole article is very well written and well worth a read:
"Mostly everyone shies away from George Lazenby's foray into MI-6, but the injustice lies in how Timothy Dalton, possibly the purest of all Bonds, remains criminally overlooked."
"Now, to Dalton. By the time he got his turn as Bond, Rog had already reduced the character to a comic detective with his arching eyebrow as his greatest mission. The plots had gotten consistently ridiculous, and the time had come for the franchise to reinvent itself. In 1987's The Living Daylights, audiences were stunned to discover a very different James Bond. Truer than any to Ian Fleming's pages, Dalton's Bond was darker, more brooding, and his humour was wry. The film was a smash success, not only outgrossing Moore's last couple of films, but also topping American action blockbusters Die Hard and Lethal Weapon."
His humour isn't usually as over-the-top, but only Connery could be that exaggerated as well as credible. Dalton brought considerable depth to the role, and while Rog fans might accuse him of lacking charm, it was just because he wasn't as overt. Don't believe the 'boring' tag till you see the athletic, rugged Dalton at work.
"He quipped, sure, but Dalton delivered his punchlines deadpan, as you'd expect from a tough guy."
"Dalton is tough, dramatic and fiercely 007."
"Back in 1989, a film where Bond quits the service was unthinkable. It's a film that defied the franchise valiantly, but was ahead of its time. Critics called it too renegade, and not Bond enough. But as a character, it's strikingly true to James. Watched today, in an age where even the Caped Crusader and the Dark Knight are going raw, it's a refreshingly fine and most underrated watch."
I couldn't agree more with everything said on this article.
Fair enough, though when Dalton goes into tuxedo Bond mode, I think he has it. Yes, Davi is cool and arguably one of the best villains in the series.
I think considering the writers strike leaving Michael G Wilson to finish the script as well as the measly budget of $30 million, I think the film is excellent.
QOS had a budget of $135 million plus marketing and you begin to realise how good LTK is. And it is the last film Cubby was involved in. But QOS did have some great moments and Daniel Craig like Dalton did the best job he could.
I really think that the third Dalton Bond is where he would have tried to put everything together. But I love Dalton's image as Bond in terms of his sharp face and deadly voice.
Anthony Hopkins once remarked that he hated critics and how they would destroy actors careers. I will concede that some of the LTK clothes were shabby and too casual. I feel that was to keep Bond more relevant to the American action heroes of the time.
By the way, if you notice my avatar that was the Bob Peak poster they never used and it would have helped sell more tickets than the terrible photo style they used. Skyfall is inexcusable for a 50th anniversary.
A journalist from The Times newspaper I once rang to criticise an article he wrote criticising Dalton's Bond admitted to me he was too harsh and way too subjective. He then told me he was in a bad mood that day and admitted he should not have written what he wrote.
By the way, when I called him up years ago, he stuttered thinking I was Dalton's lawyer. As he did write that Dalton's Bond films palpably failed when they took more than 5 times their budget at the box office.
They are no different than you and me. Say if I wrote you are an idiot, is it true?, and why should others believe me when they have not checked it out for themselves.
I hope it makes sense. As for the Skyfall reviews, there are aspects of the film I don't like and when the hype dies down in a few years, only then will we see how the film truly is. But they had the best script, director, supporting cast and crew. I would damn well expect it to be good.
Thanks @Regan You would be amazed how many cool free thinking people I have met that love Dalton's Bond and ignore the media telling them which Bond they should like the most. But I don't have to criticise Daniel Craig to make Dalton look good. Dalton's work takes care of that.Daniel is a great guy in real life as someone told me today who knew him years ago. Small world as Sean said in Diamonds Are Forever in the funeral car!:)
[/quote]
I'd definitely agree with that. He looks a bit like Bruce Willis (scorched jacket and open shirt) in the shot where he steps into Pam's tanker just after killing Sanchez.
[/quote]
I'd definitely agree with that. He looks a bit like Bruce Willis (scorched jacket and open shirt) in the shot where he steps into Pam's tanker just after killing Sanchez. [/quote]
You forgot to mention that he looks a bit thespy and can't deilver his one-liners.
Tim was closest to the Fleming Bond books, to those that care not or haven't read them, I can see how his Bond might be off-putting. At least he didn't take tranquillizers like in the novels... /:)
The Bond of the books was not only a bit boring and a bit of an ass, but was quite sexist and clearly, while it is his worst trait in hindsight, Sean embodies that much better than Tim does, who to me comes off as the second most effeminate actor after Roger. The Bond of the books is also quite tuff and cynical, something which Sean and Craig do much better than Timmy. Also, Sean was the only actor ever to sit down and talk with Fleming himself to get an idea of how he should play the character, and while Sean did do some things on his own he more-or-less worked directly with Cubby and Fleming to get the character down in DN. Sean is Bond, and because Craig is more like Sean, he's the better Bond.
Same. YOLT and DAF really drop off fast...
Effeminate? I'm... speechless, simply speechless. As a woman, thats a word I'd never even think of using to refer to either Moore or Dalton but hey, I'm convinced that just when one thinks one's heard it all... turns out that's not the case.
As to Craig being more like Sean and therefore being the better Bond... I haven't seen SF but to me, as a new fan and having recently watched Sean for the first time, to me they appeared very very different in their approach to the character.
Ditto. Its was really annoying that when CR was first released so many were claiming it to be "the best Bond film" and DC "the best Bond." Personally I think the film and actor were both great, but after a lull in Bond films (such as prior to TSWLM, Goldeneye, and CR) the trend seems to be heap praise upon the new release. This "recency bias" unjustly casts a shadow on previous actors and films.
As for Dalton I do feel he was the "darkest Bond" (including Craig) for better or for worse (I can't imagine Moore playing Bond in LTK). He totally lacked the wit and humor that goes along with the character. Even when he smiled it appeared forced and the way he delivered Bond's famous one liners was in an almost resentful way which sharply contrasts with Moore's typically good-natured delivery (no matter how serious the situation).
Dalton also looked the least comfortable of all Bonds in a tuxedo, and looked more at home in stealth/scuba diving/military garb. The opposite was true for Moore, although Connery (and the other actors for the most part) looked great in either. Don't get me wrong, I think that all the actors, except Lazenby who was only "decent," were great in their role as Bond, but they all brought something different to the table.
Don't they say it's eclipsed every Bond before him? Some claim even Connery. Good for Craig. Production value is off the charts with SF, great promotion, great scripts, great cinematography, great directors and great cast can truly enhance an actor's ability and make it shine.
Look, I don't mind people preferring Craig... that's only natural and understandable. He IS after all the current Bond and a couple of the movies he's been in have been some of the best in the franchise. All I've tried to say is that you have to evaluate actors in their right context and that especially, Dalton got a lot of unfair criticism in the role. He was right for Bond and some of us even prefer him to the others.
@acoppola, you seem quite happy enough to quote critics and accept their assessment when it's positive about Dalton, so please accept opinions that go against what you think.
You have argued rationally and well about Dalton, but please accept that he isn't everyone's cup of tea. @BAIN123 has been quite fair minded in his judgement, and his feelings about who commands the screen when Dalton is with Davi is perfectly acceptable.
That you are passionate enough to keep ringing up a critic who wrote something bad about Dalton to the point that he was clearly feeling a little nervous, that shows your true passion for Dalton's portrayel. BUT it would never be enough to convince someone like me. I agree with Kingsley Amis's opinion when he said that when Dalton was on the screen you found yourself looking at the man in the background carrying the tea tray.
But that's just me. And I love TLD.
When did he actually say that? I'm sometimes critical of Dalts but that's pretty harsh.
I remember that quote and I feel the same sometimes, and I'm a Dalton fan! For me he misses something essential and although I enjoy his portrayal of Bond (more in TLD and LTK) he doesn't carry the same screen gravitas as Connery or Craig.
Besides it's just a critical opinion, and as @acoppola says, you don't need 'the crutch of a newspaper article' to help you with your opinions, so it won't bother him one jot.
And rightly so.