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The Score of Skyfall

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  • boldfingerboldfinger
    Posts: 5,767
    DoctorKaufmann wrote:
    boldfinger wrote:
    This score creates a great fear in me that Hans Zimmer will be the next Bond composer.

    I thought you liked Hans Zimmer? :-O :O If Mendes returns, Newman will, too, Zimmer would come on board with Chris Nolan...
    Oh, and within the movies the soundtrack works perfectly...
    Zimmer usually has several outstanding ideas. And 80% mud. Or perhaps it´s just the overdose of droning and banging. He´s not exactly the subtlest one. Arnold and Zimmer are similar in that both of them mix Orchestra and Electronics, but Arnold gives a lot of room to breathe, despite being noisy many times, while Zimmer basses up his sound until it smothers everything else.
    SF´s score has very cool elements in it, and I agree that it works better in the film, but even in the film it kind of eats itself.

  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,256
    I can honestly say that, having listened to the score multiple times, I consider it a near-victory. Newman delivers good stuff, I think, with occasionally a very Barry-esque touch. Tracks like 'Chimera' and 'Séverine' are a pure indulgence IMO. The few moments where the Bond Theme plays are wonderful. But, I'm not completely sold on it. One cannot deny the influences of the likes of Powell or Zimmer from - here goes - the Bourne and Batman scores, during for example the PTS music. Generic modern spy electronics with repressed guitars in the back and pulsating basses in control are nothing new. Entire seconds are wasted on just those 'effects' whereas Barry used up every single second for musical elegance. These are different times, I do realise that, but somehow I'm troubled by the fact that Newman almost gets there, but no quite. Still, I welcome the effort as a game changer after all those years of Arnold. I was never an Arnold basher, not at all, but I appreciate the fresh and inspiring touches Newman delivers.
  • MalloryMallory
    edited November 2012 Posts: 2,171
    FilmMusicMag have a very fascinating, and in-depth, interview with Newman about the Skyfall score, his approach and the behind the scenes stuff.

    http://www.filmmusicmag.com/?p=10217

    The main points:
    FilmMusicMag wrote:
    The Broccoli family has a legendary level of control over the franchise. How much of that did you feel during the scoring process, or did Sam keep you separate from it?

    Sam sheltered me up to the point of the recording sessions, which the Broccolis were present for. They were not shy to speak up. But in fairness to them and Sam, the communication was always through Sam in the recording environment.

    Did it always go smoothly with the Broccolis?

    I think it did go smoothly. They’re kind and good people. Obviously, they’re not going to stop until they get what they want, but they were never ferocious about it. They were always very respectful of me, even if they weren’t going to be shy about making sure I understood any issues they may have had.
    FilmMusicMag wrote:
    The Adele theme song is only reflected in the cue “Komodo Dragon.” Did you want to incorporate it anywhere else in the score?

    Michael Wilson had asked where I was going to use the Adele song so that it didn’t appear as a kind of “one off” at the top of the movie. And the scene where he enters the Macau casino with his new, shaved appearance and tuxedo was a real moment of “Bond” swagger. The Adele tune has that quality to it too, so that seemed like a good place to reprieve the song.

    Did you have any interaction with Adele or the writers of the song?

    While I did not get to meet with Adele, I did with Paul Epworth, who was the co-writer and producer of the song, He really wanted to evoke the early Shirley Bassey arrangements with “Skyfall,” and talked to me about arranging the strings and brass to that effect But my task was already so huge and daunting that my orchestrator J.A.C. Redford, who’s a great composer in his own right, ended up doing the arrangements.
  • fire_and_icefire_and_ice
    Posts: 6,432
    it was better than i expected though can't remember any of it lol it did not have what i call the tnd factor. tnd is not one of my favourite bond movies though i was humming the surrender theme for days after watching it at the cinema.

    i have no desire to buy the soundtrack for skyfall which is unusual for me, having bought pretty much every bond soundtrack days after watching the respective movies.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,356
    Very interesting. Wilson should have pushed for more of the theme to be used, mind. Hearing it only once during the film was a shame, quite a let down.
  • boldfingerboldfinger
    Posts: 5,767
    The theme is the one thing used best in the score. Noone since Barry used bits and pieces of the theme so cleverly throughout the film.

    To be fair, this score could be a grower. I´m experiening days when I like it. It seems there´s a chance I´m going to get the right access to it.
  • KlausHergesheimerKlausHergesheimer
    Posts: 152
    I just got back from my first viewing of Skyfall and I wasn't a big fan of Newman's score on its own before watching the film. After seeing Skyfall, however, I feel as though the score worked very well with the movie and wasn't that bad at all.
  • dchantrydchantry
    Posts: 278
    Soundtrack discussions seem to be getting a lot of discussions after the release of Skyfall, rightly so.
    One thing certain I feel with the score of the Bond film. If the composer can compose a reasonable variation of the Bond theme (Barry/Martin/Hamlish/Conti/Kamen) then the soundtrack can be bearable if not memorable. If they can't produce a decent variation (Serra/Newman) then it makes the soundtrack of the film (not the CD, the film itself) at least need a very good title song to compensate, which Goldeneye and Skyfall excel.

    With regards to the Soundtrack for SF, I've had chance to listen to it a few times now and it is growing on me, although I do find it a little unmemorable in places. It lacks that re-occuring theme that composers usually did by having a couple of nice variations of the title song (OK so it does it once).

    Newman also obviously doesn't get the whole Bond theme aspect and although David Arnold tended to over use the theme at times (probably to death) at least he understood it.
    Its almost as if Newman only listened to QOS and CR (if any) to see what was expected and as we know, thats when DA did a 180 flip in its use.

    That said, I find the tension and drama of the whole of the Skyfall scenes where it is mostly driven by the music is superb.

    Overall, not the best Bond soundtrack, but by no means as bad as some of the previous ones that have gone by and which I have chosen not to list and start another debate :)
  • MalloryMallory
    Posts: 2,171
    The Bond theme is a very powerful weapon in any Bond composer's arsenal. Deploy it correctly and you can add wonder and joy to the scene, elevating it in ways unimaginable. Overuse it, however, and it explodes back at you, removing any tension from the scene, smothering it in a bond mist which completely wreck the other elements of the scene.

    Newman understands this, I feel. The theme is used at the right times, never overused, to great effect, and elevates the great scenes to even higher levels.
  • brinkeguthriebrinkeguthrie Piz Gloria
    Posts: 1,400
    Just listening to it now, came in from Amazon. Would sure like to hear a big huge brass fanfare like Surrender.......
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,231
    Mallory wrote:
    The Bond theme is a very powerful weapon in any Bond composer's arsenal. Deploy it correctly and you can add wonder and joy to the scene, elevating it in ways unimaginable. Overuse it, however, and it explodes back at you, removing any tension from the scene, smothering it in a bond mist which completely wreck the other elements of the scene.

    Newman understands this, I feel. The theme is used at the right times, never overused, to great effect, and elevates the great scenes to even higher levels.

    Newman got the usage of the Bond theme right, can't fault him there. I just wished he'd given us some more of the title melody, something to hum other than the Bond theme.
  • brinkeguthriebrinkeguthrie Piz Gloria
    Posts: 1,400
    I'vealmost listened all the way thru---is there ANY usage of the ba DA DA DA, da da da part? Anywhere?
  • BriggonSnowBriggonSnow
    Posts: 22
    Tennyson. Wow. I loved that track before seeing the film...but now having seen what that music cue is matched to...chills. That was a high watermark during the film most definitely.
  • petergreenhill5petergreenhill5
    Posts: 824


    I found this track on youtube. It isn't on the Skyfall cd or used in the film. If it's not from Skyfall what is it from?

    Thanks for any info.
  • MrBondMrBond Station S
    Posts: 2,044
    @PeterGreenhill that one is from the video game Mafia II from 2010.
  • TrueMiracle85TrueMiracle85
    Posts: 300
    Has anyone purchased the soundtrack on vinyl? Is it worth the extra bucks to get it on the format? Keep in mind I'm a big fan of the score. :)
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,256
    TrueMiracle85 wrote:
    Has anyone purchased the soundtrack on vinyl? Is it worth the extra bucks to get it on the format? Keep in mind I'm a big fan of the score. :)

    I think you just answered your own question, friend. ;-)
  • GetafixGetafix
    edited November 2012 Posts: 11,425
    CraigMooreOHMSS wrote:
    Mallory wrote:
    The Bond theme is a very powerful weapon in any Bond composer's arsenal. Deploy it correctly and you can add wonder and joy to the scene, elevating it in ways unimaginable. Overuse it, however, and it explodes back at you, removing any tension from the scene, smothering it in a bond mist which completely wreck the other elements of the scene.

    Newman understands this, I feel. The theme is used at the right times, never overused, to great effect, and elevates the great scenes to even higher levels.

    Newman got the usage of the Bond theme right, can't fault him there. I just wished he'd given us some more of the title melody, something to hum other than the Bond theme.

    To be honest, nothing in the soundtrack stuck with me. Like you say, apart from the very brief use of the Adele song and sparse use of the Bond theme, there is no memorable theme to tie the film together. It did not distract like Serra in GE, but it was not IMO a great help in terms of suspense, characterisation or drama. Frankly a bit forgettable and flat. I think it's a shame as Arnold had really begun to hit his stride with CR and QoS. Arnold is never going to match Barry, but on balance his recent work is better than Newman's effort on SF. I do think a more flamboyant score would have lifted parts of the film that in my mind seemed strangely muted.
  • Orbis_Non_SufficitOrbis_Non_Sufficit
    Posts: 20
    Whew, this is the first time I've posted on the forums in a long while!
    I've seen the film twice and I believe this is probably its biggest opportunity. I was disappointed to hear Arnold would be sitting this one out as I've only seen his work improve since Tomorrow Never Dies. I originally heard the brief snippets of Newman's work before it was released and was less than enthused; having even considered waiting until seeing the film itself before buying the score... but, it's Bond. I had to! Overall, though, I'm really (and sadly) disappointed. There are some very memorable pieces, like Komodo Dragon (the first half of it is stunning -- if the score had been approached like this, I would have been floored), Severine, The Chimaera, Tennyson and the two tracks for the pre-titles. Other than that, besides a few moments in some of the tracks, I feel as if the rest of the score belongs in some other movie. Generic pieces. Some of it sounded like I was watching The Dark Knight. In my first viewing, I was taken out of the movie and thought, "What is this??" The one moment that comes to mind is in Shanghai where Bond clings to the elevator and rides it up and we're treated with Zimmer. And, it saddens me to say that and feel that way as we wait years between movies, waiting to immerse ourselves fully in the next one, only to find (in my case) a let down. That M death scene, I felt, could have packed a serious punch, but the score didn't gel there to me.

    It could be that it felt like the movie at times didn't gel to me either, but that's another story.
  • bondbat007bondbat007
    Posts: 1,407
    @Orbis_Non_Sufficit

    I thought the exact same thing when Bond grabbed the elevator in Shangahi about how it sounded like Zimmer. Now I have been liking the score more and more(still kind of forgettable though) but I do really wonder what Arnold could of done in some of these scenes
  • boldfingerboldfinger
    Posts: 5,767
    bondbat007 wrote:
    @Orbis_Non_Sufficit

    I thought the exact same thing when Bond grabbed the elevator in Shangahi about how it sounded like Zimmer. Now I have been liking the score more and more(still kind of forgettable though) but I do really wonder what Arnold could of done in some of these scenes
    I guess Newman could have done completely other things too, judging by his portfolio. From what I understand from the recently released interview with Newman, the producers went for this kind of Powell-Zimmer-heavy approach, obviously because Nolan´s films generate endless supplies of cash. So it stands to reason that they would have "asked" Arnold for something similar, regardless of what he did before.

  • TPM007TPM007
    edited November 2012 Posts: 183
    Orbis_Non_Sufficit wrote:
    Whew, this is the first time I've posted on the forums in a long while!
    I've seen the film twice and I believe this is probably its biggest opportunity. I was disappointed to hear Arnold would be sitting this one out as I've only seen his work improve since Tomorrow Never Dies. I originally heard the brief snippets of Newman's work before it was released and was less than enthused; having even considered waiting until seeing the film itself before buying the score... but, it's Bond. I had to! Overall, though, I'm really (and sadly) disappointed. There are some very memorable pieces, like Komodo Dragon (the first half of it is stunning -- if the score had been approached like this, I would have been floored), Severine, The Chimaera, Tennyson and the two tracks for the pre-titles. Other than that, besides a few moments in some of the tracks, I feel as if the rest of the score belongs in some other movie. Generic pieces.

    Couldn't agree with you more @Orbis_Non_Sufficit! I felt it was incredibly bland, and yes Tennyson is brilliant and the beginning of Komodo Dragon is great, but other than that nothing stood out. I disagree it sounds like Zimmer and disagree even more that it sounds like Powell as mentioned by @boldfinger

    My problem is the lack of any clear themes, and the ones that do exist, are just really boring, and uninteresting. I loved the idea of getting a new composer to have a rest from Arnold, like we got with George Martin or Marvin Hamlisch, but I was really let down, and I'd rather they kept Arnold on. Maybe the score will grow on me, but overall - dissapointed.
  • bondbat007bondbat007
    edited November 2012 Posts: 1,407
    One theme I enjoy is the start of "Voluntary Retirement" and how that's played again when M dies as the scene fades out. I thought that was a nice touch
  • MalloryMallory
    Posts: 2,171
    Empire Magazine has interviewed Newman about the score, and he has given a commentary on some of the tracks within the score.

    http://www.empireonline.com/interviews/interview.asp?IID=1578

    A very interesting read. Explains what "Old Dog, New Tricks" is.
  • petergreenhill5petergreenhill5
    Posts: 824
    Skyfall is the biggest selling Bond soundtrack since 1985

    https://apps.facebook.com/metrouk/article/music/918156-skyfall-soundtrack-without-adele-breaks-james-bond-franchise-record
  • MalloryMallory
    Posts: 2,171
    PeterGreenhill wrote:
    Skyfall is the biggest selling Bond soundtrack since 1985

    https://apps.facebook.com/metrouk/article/music/918156-skyfall-soundtrack-without-adele-breaks-james-bond-franchise-record

    Quality sells. Who knew? ;)
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,356
    Great news, really. In today's market too. It's wonderful this 50th anniversary film is breaking records for all sorts of media.
  • ZekidkZekidk
    edited November 2012 Posts: 3,278
    Orbis_Non_Sufficit wrote:
    That M death scene, I felt, could have packed a serious punch, but the score didn't gel there to me.
    Only the first part of "Mother" was used here, before they cut to the rooftop. The second part is much better (when the strings kick in), IMO.
  • JWESTBROOKJWESTBROOK
    Posts: 5,745
    Having watched the film, I have to say the score was really good. It fit the scenes well. I noticed my self enjoying it.

    It's just not that good to listen to on its own for me.
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    edited November 2012 Posts: 12,837
    JWESTBROOK wrote:
    It's just not that good to listen to on its own for me.

    That's what I think too. It fit in well but it was a bit forgettable and it didn't send me running home to look up the tracks online, I don't think I'm going to bother listening to it at all outside of the film.

    I am hoping for Arnold to come back.
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