A place for disappointed skyfall viewers

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  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,361
    @BondBug just a little advice, if you want to add more to your last post, just use the edit button. Mods kinda frown at Double and Triple postings. just letting you know. :)
  • Posts: 158
    @Getafix, you took the words right out of my mouth, I commend you for writing such a beautifully crafted post . Skyfalls story was so poorly put together its hard to fathom how Sam Mendes could release such thrash.

    I think, actually I know that Barbara Brocolli and Michael Wilson are way too controlling and overprotective , and do not let the directors have much input into the films, which is why they wouldn't let Quentin Tarantino make a Bond film.

    It amazes me how Barbara and Michael felt comfortable enough to release garbage such as DAD and SKYFAIL, yet they wouldn't let Tarantino do a bond. quite amazing really when u think about it.

    The more I think about how sloppy and lazy the writing in skyfail was, the more dumbfounded I get.



    Skyfall is set to become the highest grossing UK movie ever. It is going to make a billion dollars around the world, It has been almost universally embraced by critics. It has some serious Oscar nomination buzz.

    I find it odd that you would come onto a forum for James Bond fans and call the latest Bond movie that has achieved so much "garbage."



  • edited November 2012 Posts: 284
    BondBug wrote:
    @Getafix, you took the words right out of my mouth, I commend you for writing such a beautifully crafted post . Skyfalls story was so poorly put together its hard to fathom how Sam Mendes could release such thrash.

    I think, actually I know that Barbara Brocolli and Michael Wilson are way too controlling and overprotective , and do not let the directors have much input into the films, which is why they wouldn't let Quentin Tarantino make a Bond film.

    It amazes me how Barbara and Michael felt comfortable enough to release garbage such as DAD and SKYFAIL, yet they wouldn't let Tarantino do a bond. quite amazing really when u think about it.

    The more I think about how sloppy and lazy the writing in skyfail was, the more dumbfounded I get.



    Skyfall is set to become the highest grossing UK movie ever. It is going to make a billion dollars around the world, It has been almost universally embraced by critics. It has some serious Oscar nomination buzz.

    I find it odd that you would come onto a forum for James Bond fans and call the latest Bond movie that has achieved so much "garbag

    some things make the mind boggle and i do not mean DTK's comment
  • edited November 2012 Posts: 11,425
    Am I the only one who felt the ending battle at Bonds house was just way too long, boring and just did not feel like a bond movie? Too me it was just like any other generic action finale. Nothing about the ending finale felt original or of any quality.

    Totally agree. It had no dramatic tension. Just people lobbing stuff through the window and lots of explosions. No real sense of danger.

    Also completely agree with you about Severine's death. It was very strangely edited. To begin with I wasn't entirely sure what happened to her when they arrived on the island. Since she'd been going on about how scary Silva was I'd assumed that she had invited Bond on board the boat in the confidence that this was something Silva would not object to - ie. it would have made a lot more sense if Severine was drawing Bond into a trap. However, when they got to the island she is carted off in handcuffs. The next time we see her she is shot by Silva. However, this change in her fortunes is not explained adequately visually or through the script. After she builds Silva up to be such a monster I expected her actions to relate in some way to what she says in the casino, but she behaves like a carefree teenager, inviting Bond back to her place and shagging him while her boyfriends not looking. It just doesn't make sense in terms of character development or motivation. Are we really to believe that she is prepared to sacrifice her own life so that Bond can meet Silva (she knows he can't kill him because he's surrounded by henchmen). What actually motivates her to behave the way she does? It's just ridiculous.

    Like you I wasn't immediately sure whether she was dead or not. I actually thought Silva had shot wide and that she'd fainted.

    The film does basically fall to pieces after the island. The plot is all over the place and becomes increasingly tedious as they become more and more reliant on computer hacking - always a sure sign that the scriptwriters can't be bothered to think up an intelligent plot device. It felt like a throw back to those naff 1980s teen hacking movies. The hilarious scene where Bond 'decodes' Silva's matrix was so bad it was (almost) good.

    I'm reserving comment on Moneypenny's casting. I think Naomi H is a good looking actress. If anything I'd say she is perhaps too attractive to be Moneypenny. I'm not entirely convinced she is well cast here, although I don't have a problem with the fact she is black. As someone else said, it would be odd today if MI6 did not represent Britian's ethnic diversity. MI6 made a big push for British Asians to join after 9/11 and the London tube bombings. Perhaps she should have been of Indian or Pakistani origin?! ;)
  • edited November 2012 Posts: 22
    Well it was inevitable. The movie couldnt live up to the hype! I just came back from seeing it at an advanced screening in Australia. FINALLY I can come on here and read what everyone has been saying. To tell you the truth I was bored until it got to the island and Silva was introduced. I was sitting there thinking... where is this going? It had its good moments like giving us a bit of background on bond's roots and had a more human element to the story but I dont know, it just wasn't very Bond like to me. It could have been any other action movie with a different title. Silva was great as a villain, he kept me interested. The moments that give reference to past Bond movies I also loved. I thought the 2nd act was 100x better than the first. I didn't really like Quantum for its horrible editing and poor story. I like Skyfall for giving us something new we havent seen before but the plot was lined with holes. It could have been great but to me it was only good. Casino Royale is still the best one Craig has done in my books.
  • SandySandy Somewhere in Europe
    Posts: 4,012
    Incisor wrote:
    Well it was inevitable. The movie couldnt live up to the hype! I just came back from seeing it at an advanced screening in Australia. FINALLY I can come on here and read what everyone has been saying. To tell you the truth I was bored until it got to the island and Sylvia was introduced. I was sitting there thinking... where is this going? It had its good moments like giving us a bit of background on bond's roots and had a more human element to the story but I dont know, it just wasn't very Bond like to me. It could have been any other action movie with a different title. Sylvia was great as a villain, he kept me interested. The moments that give reference to past Bond movies I also loved. I thought the 2nd act was 100x better than the first. I didn't really like Quantum for its horrible editing and poor story. I like Skyfall for giving us something new we havent seen before but the plot was lined with holes. It could have been great but to me it was only good. Casino Royale is still the best one Craig has done in my books.

    Did you pay any attention to the film? There is no Sylvia!
  • edited November 2012 Posts: 22
    Haha I meant to write Sylva but I see its spelt Silva. My bad. If you want to be technical I meant Tiago Rodriguez

  • edited November 2012 Posts: 11,189
    Like you I wasn't immediately sure whether she was dead or not. I actually thought Silva had shot wide and that she'd fainted.

    :-?

    I thought it was pretty clear from the off he'd shot and killed her.

    The expressions of Bond and Servine really sell the scene. I remember flinching when Bond fired the shot that missed. Great editing.

    Servine was attracted to Bond from the moment she saw him looking at her through the window in Shanghai.

    It wasn't a case of her luring Bond into a trap. Bond ASKED her to take him to Silva. She wanted to play with Bond a bit first though and make him work for her.

    "OK you want me to take you to my boss. I will...if you can fight off my guards. As a bonus you can have me too"

    From Silva's angle he obviously didn't see any further use for Servine so didn't think twice about getting rid of her.
  • edited November 2012 Posts: 22
    I was pretty sure she was dead too. You could tell he was going to kill her anyhow. He was just having a bit of fun with Bond and hoping he'd 'miss' and do it instead.
  • It's a little discouraging that some folks needed it explained to them that Silva killed her.
  • Also forget all the other plotholes. How did bond survive getting shot on top of the train, let alone the giant fall?
  • Incisor wrote:
    Also forget all the other plotholes. How did bond survive getting shot on top of the train, let alone the giant fall?
    Where'd he get shot? That'd have a lot to do with it. Surviving the fall actually became more likely since the shock of being shot made him go limp.

  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    Posts: 1,243
    The plot holes in SF is not what I was looking for. The overall story is about M and the fall of a once powerful woman. Silva being ex MI6 would have known through his training how to infiltrate an organisation. He was a valued 00 agent. He had men everywhere and the film is about corruption too as well as scapegoating.

    The film to me was very brave and showed huge ambition in terms of making a film.

    The main thing I enjoyed about the film is the character of Bond throughout. Craig plays him with a conviction and as damaged goods.
  • edited November 2012 Posts: 3,278
    Nothing about the ending finale felt original
    For me - Bond backstabbing Silva was very anticlimatic. Usually we see Bond confronting the villans and henchmen head on. They could have come up with something more orginal for a final showdown, IMO.
  • edited November 2012 Posts: 27
    Zekidk wrote:
    Nothing about the ending finale felt original
    For me - Bond backstabbing Silva was very anticlimatic. Usually we see Bond confronting the villans and henchmen head on. They could have come up with something more orginal for a final showdown, IMO.

    It's a "50th celebration" quote from FYEO, the death of Kristatos, very similar situation. It's not original on purpose.
  • DRESSED_TO_KILLDRESSED_TO_KILL Suspended
    Posts: 260
    seroxx wrote:
    Zekidk wrote:
    Nothing about the ending finale felt original
    For me - Bond backstabbing Silva was very anticlimatic. Usually we see Bond confronting the villans and henchmen head on. They could have come up with something more orginal for a final showdown, IMO.

    It's a "50th celebration" quote from FYEO, the death of Kristatos, very similar situation. It's not original on purpose.


    see this is what I am talking about that upsets me ! instead of constantly referring or paying homage to past bond films in skyfail, the writers should have had fresh ideas and stayed completely clear of any past homage. The Everything or Nothing documentary should have been the tribute for the anniversary, not the actual Bond film. And @getafix I am glad you find my opinion on Severines death both odd and out of place. I felt like her death was completely rushed and done poorly in terms of writing and directing.
  • I felt like her death was completely rushed and done poorly in terms of writing and directing.
    I thought it was refreshing to have a character like hers simply done away with without a ton of fanfare. Quick and brutal carries more force sometimes than endless exposition.

  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    edited November 2012 Posts: 1,243
    Silva was about to get M to shoot them both. Bond had no choice but to use the knife.

    And the scene was so sad that a prolonged duel with the villain would have interfererd with the emotion of the piece. This was adult cinema Bond and not DAD ending style Bond.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    edited November 2012 Posts: 28,694
    acoppola wrote:
    Silva was about to get M to shoot them both. Bond had no choice but to use the knife.

    And the scene was so sad that a prolonged duel with the villain would have interfererd with the emotion of the piece.

    I can see your point. Bond and Silva fight for two minutes, while M waits as she bleeds out just to get in a few last lines with Bond. Unlikely in her state.
  • acoppola wrote:
    Silva was about to get M to shoot them both. Bond had no choice but to use the knife.

    And the scene was so sad that a prolonged duel with the villain would have interfererd with the emotion of the piece. This was adult cinema Bond and not DAD ending style Bond.

    I thought that scene was pitch perfect, too. But take that with a grain of salt; I thought the whole movie was pitch perfect.

  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    Posts: 1,243
    acoppola wrote:
    Silva was about to get M to shoot them both. Bond had no choice but to use the knife.

    And the scene was so sad that a prolonged duel with the villain would have interfererd with the emotion of the piece.

    I can see your point. Bond and Silva fight for two minutes, while M waits as she bleeds out just to get in a few last lines with Bond. Unlikely in her state.

    Indeed. In fact I think it is one of the saddest endings in a Bond since OHMSS. I actually felt something and felt bad for her considering it was a less than dignified way to die.

  • acoppola wrote:
    Indeed. In fact I think it is one of the saddest endings in a Bond since OHMSS. I actually felt something and felt bad for her considering it was a less than dignified way to die.
    How did you see her death as not being "dignified"?

  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    Posts: 1,243
    acoppola wrote:
    Silva was about to get M to shoot them both. Bond had no choice but to use the knife.

    And the scene was so sad that a prolonged duel with the villain would have interfererd with the emotion of the piece. This was adult cinema Bond and not DAD ending style Bond.

    I thought that scene was pitch perfect, too. But take that with a grain of salt; I thought the whole movie was pitch perfect.

    It was a beautifully sad dramatic end. And Craig made the scene even tougher as in when you see a tough Bond show real emotion. And this will hopefully carry on in his portrayal of the character in future.



  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    acoppola wrote:
    acoppola wrote:
    Silva was about to get M to shoot them both. Bond had no choice but to use the knife.

    And the scene was so sad that a prolonged duel with the villain would have interfererd with the emotion of the piece.

    I can see your point. Bond and Silva fight for two minutes, while M waits as she bleeds out just to get in a few last lines with Bond. Unlikely in her state.

    Indeed. In fact I think it is one of the saddest endings in a Bond since OHMSS. I actually felt something and felt bad for her considering it was a less than dignified way to die.

    She went out swinging and for a good cause though. I like the comment someone made earlier regarding the future legacy of Judi's M, saying that it would be nice to see her portrait in Mallory's office (strangely another last name beginning with an M) as they did with the portrait of the legendary Bernard Lee's M. I would love it if Bond came up to it in 24 or 25 and just laid his hand on it and smiled. That would tear me up for sure.
  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    Posts: 1,243
    acoppola wrote:
    Indeed. In fact I think it is one of the saddest endings in a Bond since OHMSS. I actually felt something and felt bad for her considering it was a less than dignified way to die.
    How did you see her death as not being "dignified"?

    Because she was away from home and not dying on her own terms. She was like a hunted animal being chased by the villain and his men relentlessly. She was powerless and ironic for a woman who commanded MI6.

    I think it was unthinkable to her how things went so wrong and the severe punishment of the past came down like a tonne of bricks. Her career or loss of it was the last thing she was worried about in the last act.

  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    Posts: 1,243
    acoppola wrote:
    acoppola wrote:
    Silva was about to get M to shoot them both. Bond had no choice but to use the knife.

    And the scene was so sad that a prolonged duel with the villain would have interfererd with the emotion of the piece.

    I can see your point. Bond and Silva fight for two minutes, while M waits as she bleeds out just to get in a few last lines with Bond. Unlikely in her state.

    Indeed. In fact I think it is one of the saddest endings in a Bond since OHMSS. I actually felt something and felt bad for her considering it was a less than dignified way to die.

    She went out swinging and for a good cause though. I like the comment someone made earlier regarding the future legacy of Judi's M, saying that it would be nice to see her portrait in Mallory's office (strangely another last name beginning with an M) as they did with the portrait of the legendary Bernard Lee's M. I would love it if Bond came up to it in 24 or 25 and just laid his hand on it and smiled. That would tear me up for sure.

    Before I saw the film I knew what will happen to M. Nothing prepared me for how well the scene was played out and she made it so real that I think she deserves accolades.

    I hope they honour her M in the next movie. That would be a nice touch for sure and an interesting aspect to the story. Maybe the film starts off at M's funeral.

  • acoppola wrote:
    Because she was away from home and not dying on her own terms. She was like a hunted animal being chased by the villain and his men relentlessly. She was powerless and ironic for a woman who commanded MI6.

    I think it was unthinkable to her how things went so wrong and the severe punishment of the past came down like a tonne of bricks. Her career or loss of it was the last thing she was worried about in the last act.
    Well, when push came to shove, she made a stand. There's a lot less dignified ways to go than that.
  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    edited November 2012 Posts: 1,243
    acoppola wrote:
    Because she was away from home and not dying on her own terms. She was like a hunted animal being chased by the villain and his men relentlessly. She was powerless and ironic for a woman who commanded MI6.

    I think it was unthinkable to her how things went so wrong and the severe punishment of the past came down like a tonne of bricks. Her career or loss of it was the last thing she was worried about in the last act.
    Well, when push came to shove, she made a stand. There's a lot less dignified ways to go than that.

    True, but I doubt she expected it to go as far. She assumed earlier on that Bond would get Silva before things went out of control. And I assume she knew had she not made the stand, then Silva knew where she lived and how to find her. He knew how to hack into MI6 after all when he shows Bond's medical report.

    She shows true leadership in the sense of putting herself on the frontline and in harms way. What politician would do that?

  • acoppola wrote:
    True, but I doubt she expected it to go as far. She assumed earlier on that Bond would get Silva before things went out of control. And I assume she knew had she not made the stand, then Silva knew where she lived and how to find her. He knew how to hack into MI6 after all when he shows Bond's medical report.

    She shows true leadership in the sense of putting herself on the frontline and in harms way. What politician would do that?
    Most people really don't seem to believe their decisions of the moment will come back to haunt them later, I find. What separates Dench's M from others is when repercussions of her earlier decisions did confront her, she stood up and faced them.

    Like all great ladies, she still had her secret ways.

  • acoppolaacoppola London Ealing not far from where Bob Simmons lived
    edited November 2012 Posts: 1,243
    acoppola wrote:
    True, but I doubt she expected it to go as far. She assumed earlier on that Bond would get Silva before things went out of control. And I assume she knew had she not made the stand, then Silva knew where she lived and how to find her. He knew how to hack into MI6 after all when he shows Bond's medical report.

    She shows true leadership in the sense of putting herself on the frontline and in harms way. What politician would do that?
    Most people really don't seem to believe their decisions of the moment will come back to haunt them later, I find. What separates Dench's M from others is when repercussions of her earlier decisions did confront her, she stood up and faced them.

    Like all great ladies, she still had her secret ways.

    True. I still thought it was scary for her and to fight her last battle in a place of the least technology was an interesting idea. It also nicely showed how much she trusted Bond with her life out of all the men she could have summoned to protect her in MI6.



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