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Comments
He's not going to allow himself to get anywhere close to being "Vespered". Given Severine's involvement with the sex trade, "damaged goods" or not I think any sort of sexual involvement with Bond was a reciprocated and welcome relief for her as, Bond didn't force himself on her. I think she was conveyed to be of enough sound mind to have a sexual encounter with Bond.
Not that I'm too familiar with such back alley transactions but there are millions of prostitutes and women all over the world involved in the sex trade who, are obviously considered abused but many are still of sound mind to make personal decisions regarding their sexual activities outside of their profession. This is indeed a very sensitive issue and people have different viewpoints regarding the sex scene in the movie and I think there are valid points on both sides. I just happen to be on the side that thinks there's nothing wrong with it.
I agree with your point that there is nothing wrong with prostitution as long as it is the womans choice. How is it more demeaning than getting down on your knees and cleaning a toilet bowl? Especially when one can pay £500 an hour and the other £5 an hour.
However this is a moot point in Severines case as it is stated she was forced into the sex trade at an early age so she is not one of these empowered women we see prortrayed in Secret Diary of a Call Girl.
That said she could have easily screamed when Bond came in (or shot him with her Beretta) and the team of goons on the boat would have come to her aid so she was clearly up for it. For all those saying its practically rape - she had options not to shag Bond if she wanted. The scene where she sits waiting for him with the champagne and seems disappointed hes not coming also seems to back this up.
However another completely different interpretation would be that she wants Bond to kill Silva and she uses her body to seal the deal and gets no more pleasure out of shagging Bond than she does any of her other clients.
My own take is that she fancies Bond (hes Bond so obviously hes irresistible to all women - however damaged and abused) and he fancies her. She wants him to kill Silva and is willing to pay whatever he wants so is happy to offer herself. She enjoys the act more than she does normally with some fat Chinese businessman because she fancies him but at the end of the day it just a fleeting moment where its mutually beneficial for them to come together and enjoy each others bodies and then move on.
This is pretty much Fleming Bonds ethos towards women and explains Bonds rather throwaway line when she gets shot. Also he has now closed himsefl off after Vesper so sees women as disposable pleasures (which I'm pretty sure is a quote from Fleming).
I thought the same too, that she was a prostitute prior to the events of SF but I wasn't too sure after reading comments from posters who were writing as if she was still entrenched in the sex trade. SF comes out here tomorrow , so I'll pick up the blu ray and pay close attention.
@TheWizardOfice yes, I agree with your points, especially the part about Severine having options. The Beretta she supposedly has strapped to her thigh indicates that she has some sort of power and control at the very least and isn't going to allow herself to be dominated by just any Tom, Dick or Harry.
One of the complaints about SF (from a couple of posters here) was that it was too subtle - things were shown through action but not explained through dialogue, or the dialogue was only one single line. There's no right or wrong; it's just a matter of opinion.
I think that Bond's line to Severine about Silva - "He was your way out" is an example of this. If he was her way out, and she's involved with him now, then obviously (at least to some) she's out of the sex trade. Simple. But some people would prefer that it be more clearly explained through dialogue - "You were in the sex trade but your boss got you out; the fact that he rescued you from that life made you so grateful to him that you were willing to be involved in terrorism and assassinations like you are now". More clear, but to me far more clumsy.
I think that Severine automatically uses her sexuality to get what she wants, as that's what she was trained to do from a young age - in fact, she probably (subconsciously) knows that her sexuality is all that she's got. So she's moving from one man (Silva) to another (Bond) simply because of who can help her at any given moment.
A salient quote:
“Sometimes victims of sexual abuse are so deeply in need of help and have such a strong wish for rescue that they get into situations where they are being abused and don’t even realize it,” she says. “Sometimes it’s simply because the dynamic is familiar to them. This can be why they are so vulnerable to being re-traumatized, and it is alarming for society to see such a thing without a clear understanding.”
This is why I feel Bond comes over as being unnecessarily ruthless.
You're absolutely right mate. That's why I think it's odd. He's a character that should and has evolved. The key word here is 'unnecessarily'. It would be equally at odds if Bond viewed the Wright 'Leiter' in the way he does most of the black characters in the novels. I don't like using Fleming as a crutch in something that is essentially a moral discussion.
And also why there has been an undertone of slight confusion at certain points from fans - is this the Bond of the last 2 rebooted films, or is this the Bond of a bygone era.
Yeah they clearly tried to do this, I'm not sure this scene is an example of that though.
Hahaha! I wonder if that was an intended wink.
That's really funny but I'm sure it was just a coincidence. My thoughts are if Mendes didn't mention it in his commentary, it's not a deliberate nod. But nice catch
I can't wait to listen to the commentary. I will be doing that next weekend when I am back again from campus, and anticipate it with great relish.
Upon my rewatch I've just discovered something else I dislike about Skyfall... I don't actually like ANY of the new characters. In CR and QoS I did, but in Skyfall... I find Q too proud and snobby, Eve annoying, Silva tacky and fundamentally dislikable, Mallory uninteresting and Kincade... well, you know. Not exactly riveting.
Severine, I do like. But she dies so fast it barely matters lol
Some of the art in the movie is nice I'll admit, and I like the parts that echo QoS. Erm, it has a nice polish to it. I think the somewhat weak and melancholy atmosphere of it (primarily Bond being weaker and things being - as I said before - on a downer) just isn't my style. I do understand though that it's supposed to reflect a later stage of the character's career, and I understand the need to keep the series fresh.
Who knows, maybe it will lead to good things later o.O
I'm sure there were no questionable motivations there ;)
I know, and it really is about time. It was pretty obvious that Silva would die via knife when Kincade makes a nod to the 'old ways' and sets the knife down on the table.
Now, you know what I would enjoy seeing next? The villain dying by Craig's gunshot(s). We haven't had too many of these, when you think about it. They just get into a vicious gunfight/fistfight, and the villain gets riddled with rounds at the end. That would be even better.
I have been hanging my head in shame for not remembering that! An obvious weakness in my Bond knolwedge that I have already addressed by watching Thunderball again!
Completely agree with this and others who commented on the Casino scene in particular.
When Bond says to her "I want to meet your employer", her reaction, the look on her face and the way she blew the smoke out her mouth literally sent a shiver through me on one of my viewings! Such lines as "you know nothing about it" were also delivered so well, I thought she really proved herself as a top actress in this scene alone.
Absolutely - the trembling of her fingers. It was delivered perfectly.
It's a surpringly long dialogue scene in the casino and it really took me by surprise quite how good Berenice was. It makes it all the more powerful when Silva abruptly takes her out of the story. I love Daniel's line: "I can help you", I think Bond really meant it, I think he sees a lot of Vesper in her.
He should die ala Stromberg. Multiple shots to the balls :P
lol, I'm rewatching the whole film :)
But she's an attractive woman yes!
With a great musical background, a theme played by a guitar.
Ah well, I mean it's proof that you really can't please everyone. Ever. And that's not a bad thing, it just proves that we're all different. How boring would the world be if we all just nodded along like drones or agreed with the pack without hesitation or question!
So yeah :)
Seriously, SF is a beautifully made motion picture, maybe the best ever in the franchise... but I like the raw kick-in-the-guts feel from QOS much more.
For me, SF is the equal of CR.