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http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/7625/applause-at-the-silicon-valley-destruction-plot-in-a-view-to-a-kill-1985-in-cinema-theatres#Item_6
It may be of interest to those reading and contributing to this thread.
Despite what I write in the above thread, I am a big AVTAK fan and I would like to provide a link here to Dr Andrew McNess's book on AVTAK which I'm in the process of reading again and which is a brilliant accompaniment to the film:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/James-Bond-Our-Sights-Close/dp/1465382380/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1377090801&sr=1-1
Sure. I appreciate all the Bond films (hence why I'm here):
But surely this forum exists for more interesting discussion than just strings of posts featuring pure untempered praise? Always more interested in discussion looking at the pros and cons for each film.
I think that's my point. Moore is acting as young (or younger, as you say) in AVTAK than he was in FYEO or OP. The film simply ignores the fact that he's 58 years old and has him acting like a 30 year old.
I don't think the the problem. It's not really a question of weakness or physical strength. It's just as much about Bond's attitude in the film... in FYEO Bond displays a maturity befitting his years. In the Dalton films, SF and even the Brosnan films, Bond displays a cynicism or weariness that speaks of a man who's been living this life for a long time. I don't really perceive that in AVTAK (apart from Rog dozing in his chair!) - the script, direction and performance all conspire to pretend Bond is ageless.
Still, don't want to dwell on the negatives too much as the OP has slapped my wrist - just an observation.
Yes, I think this is correct, though I think that Andrew McNess deals with some of the issues that you raise if you have a look at his book on AVTAK.
I suppose you could argue that It's not impossible for a man of advancing years to be able to bed all those women?
It seems to have such a bad rep but I remember watching it at a party in the early 00's and everyone seem to remember it well and commented on it being one of their favrouites.
What I'm wondering is has the bad rep built up over time or was it an immediate thing?
Great post for such a new member, sir. I'm in total agreement and I too am an '80s child who defends Sir Roger Moore!
Welcome to MI6 Community!
My pleasure. I'm glad to say times have changed and Roger Moore is much more accepted nowadays, just as OHMSS became popular again. These things are cyclical, it would seem.
Love it! Best piece from the film!
Indeed. The villains of AVTAK really are a different breed. One of the highlights of this film, for sure.
Before watching the old films, for me Brosnan WAS Bond. I loved his character. How he could be somewhat serious, yet still be a gentleman. When Craig first showed up, I didn't really like him. CR felt like an average action movie than a Bond film to me. Then I watched QoS and left the cinema with a bad aftertaste. I even thought that might have been the last Bond film I would watch, but I gave it a try again with Skyfall and I quite liked it - Craig was far less cold and serious, and seemed slightly closer to the Bond I had experienced with Brosnan. That being said, I'm still not a big fan of Craig.
However, after watching the old movies I have a very different idea of the character and the series as whole. Anyhow, skipping my whole experience I've got to say I loved Moore's Bond. Certainly, it feels considerably different from the rest, especially from the more serious Dalton and Craig, but considering the time Moore's films were being done, I have no complaints. Having watched plenty of old movies, I don't get the impression people back then were as obsessed with realism as people nowadays do. So, I enjoyed Moore's somewhat humouristic, charming and casanova-like Bond. I really liked his interactions with M better than Brosnan's and Craig's, and I think Moore's Bond probably had the worst relationship with Q - followed by Connery's - which I always found funny.
Anyhow, regarding AVTK, I was surprised it had really poor ratings when I thought the movie was really solid. I don't know if the ratings come from modern critics (though, by reading this thread I've learnt older critics seemed to hate Moore's guts), who rate the old movies by today's standards, which are perhaps more focused on realism. Buy in my opinion, I thought AVTK was an improvement over OP (which I did like), and even less crazy like other films like MR. I thought Zorin was a great villain, in the sense that he was just a psycho. He reminded me a lot of Goldfinger, due to their business. However, GF was all about his business, whereas Zorin could be doing business, but it was clear he truly loved killing. Christopher Walken played Zorin's role amazing well.
As for Moore's performance, I though he was much more dynamic in AVTK than in OP, which was somewhat lacking in the action department. So, despite his age, I think he did an amazing job in his final movie.
Regarding whether he should have been more serious or acted older, I don't think Moore's acting in AVTK was very different from his behaviour in other movies. He was as candid as he had always been, with that touch of sarcasm he always had. Dalton and Brosnan playing the part of a more "weary" Bond isn't Moore's fault. Dalton wanted to play his Bond closer to the one Flemming had written, and Brosnan simply did it that way. So, I can't fault Moore's behaviour on what the newer actors decided to do with the role.
Despite Roger's age I see no real issues and I'm glad he done it as the film was suited to his Bond in my opinion. Supporting cast including Walken, who some say deserved to portray a Bond villain in a better film, was excellent for me. May Day is a bit of a strange one but again, fits the film. The scenes between Bond and Tibbett are typical Roger, being a fan of his this shines through for me. Also like the character of Sir Godfrey Tibbett and would rather not have been killed off.
Locations are prime, Zorin's estate is beautiful and Dr Carl Mortner convenient little lab is very Bond. Silicon Valley and San Francisco in general look great. Plot may not be considered one of the best and I agree on that but I still watch it time and time again so something must be good about it. I'd say that the horse implants aspect, and the involvement of horses in general is what pulls me back in being a big horse racing fan.
To conclude my poorly written little piece I'd say that AVTAK is all round a solid Bond film which fills in the three main aspects for me. Cast, location and plot. Better to worse in that order. It certainly isn't too highly regarded amongst the majority of fans but I for one like it, however can't seem to explain why.
Well written and you've done a fairly good job overall in explaining the good things about AVTAK. Don't run yourself down, @JrW_008.
It's a film not without its faults (see Keystone Cops, "Mahhhhh Carrrr" and the overuse of Sir Rog's "owowhohhhhhh" moment to name but a few), but I can overlook them and see the charm
Christopher Walken hams it up beautifully as the deranged and psychotic villain and Grace Jones, although not to everyone's tastes, adds a mystique and dangerous dimension to the story. The sight of Zorin gunning down the miners alongside Scarpine with that smirking grin on his face is a fantastic scene and really shows how crazy this guy is.
Rog's age? Ok, he's probably too old to be bedding Stacey and running around like he's 25, but Roger somehow pulls it off. He's still believable as Bond in it - no need for that walker just yet!
The creeping around the stud farm, the goon fight at Stacey's house, the Golden Gate Bridge finale, the PTS, the Eiffel Tower jump are all quality and memorable moments in the franchise. Hey, we even learn that Bond can make a mean quiche.
AVTAK needs some loving and I'm happy to give it some!
http://www.amazon.co.uk/James-Bond-Our-Sights-Close/dp/1465382380/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1377090801&sr=1-1
I've berated it to death and castigated it heavily, but for all it's faults, there is some fun to be had. Christopher Walken always seems wasted in this, the Zorin character seemed a bit over the top sometimes, but he did an OK job of things, or was he really one of the best, of a poor lot ?
I realize this is an appreciation thread for it, so no sense in giving out any more condemnations. Maybe Tanya Roberts Sutton isn't as bad as we've always believed, and Moore despite the advancing years, did what he could and provides some serious moments, even if you do see more of his stunt double than the actor himself
Decided to watch AVTAK tonight. My thoughts based on my third or fourth watch - or whatever it is:
I think Moore, despite his obvious age issue - although I don't feel it is an issue personally, acts the role well again. You quickly forget that he's 58, and it's arguable that he looked younger in AVTAK than in Octopussy. Walken is excellent as Zorin, and you really see how ruthless and psychotic he is (the scene where he massacres hundreds of his workers is a good example). Unlike some of the villains, he also had a good, well-developed backstory. May Day is a fairly decent henchwoman, I think - certainly more imposing than some in the series. Macnee as Godfrey Tibbett is good as well - he has a rapport with Moore that works well. Someone else mentioned it in this thread, but I would have liked to see him become a more permanent fixture. The majority of the other characters may be a bit two-dimensional but there's nothing extreme, in my opinion.
The locations are very good as well - the scenes in Paris and San Francisco are, in the main, well done. Can't really complain on that front.
The plot's reasonably straightforward - could have done with a bit more development admittedly but it's decent enough.
It also has one of my favourite Bond theme songs, and John Barry's score is superb - probably his best since OHMSS imo.
I'd probably give it a 7/10 - a very decent entry to the series that has value in repeat viewings. It's not quite up there with the best in the series but I think it's been seriously underrated by some, who perhaps haven't given it a chance based on Moore's age, which I think is unfair given that I think TMWTGG was a worse Moore film.
Look, I love Sir Rog but I blame Cubby for not moving on when it was more than obvious that we needed a new actor in the role. AVTAK was my first cinematic Bond experience and it will always hold a special place in my heart. It's like a relationship that has reached the end but both parties aren't quite ready to admit that it's over yet. Cubby, you should have known better. Sorry, Sir Rog.
I would probably agree with you there, although I think his score for MR is also excellent.
1. Roger Moore's age
2. The ridiculous goofy humor
Other than than, it had a lot going for it. The plot is a fun over the top concept, Christopher Walken was basically born to be a Bond villain, Grace Jones was memorable enough henchwoman, and the score is pretty great. If it had starred Dalton, I really think it could have been one of the better Bond films.
You, sir, are spot on. The only part of the movie I disliked was Grace Jones. What were they thinking when they hired her?
If you have ever heard Roger interviewed about "Bond", he has often said that his goal was to entertain moviegoers.... to transport them to Heaven where they could leave their troubles behind for a couple of hours and just enjoy themselves. Yes, one left the movie theater, after AVTAK, with a smile. The only real sad thing about AVTAK is that it was Rog's swan song.....the end of an era....the end of the "good time" Bond.
I managed to find this clip of behind the scenes of AVTAK, but there is no Grace Jones...