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I'm just so passionate about Bond music. I love it dearly. I own every Bond film soundtrack and I listen to them almost daily. Bond music is what I listen to the most. I want Bond music to be memorable and hummable. I want more use of the Bond theme too. It's Bond's theme! Without it...it's not a Bond movie anymore. This "Oh he has to earn it so it's used sparingly" bull crap ain't going to cut it anymore. He earned it in Casino Royale. Let if fly!
No, great modern movie scores don't need to be hummable, but great Bond movie scores IMO need to be rich and emotional. Heck my heart goes intense from many scenes in AVTAK which, if you watch without the soundtrack, is pretty crap. The golden gate fight visually is not as intense as say, Bond vs Trevelyan or B vs Fisher but Christ that music ups the tension!
Murdoch made some excellent points. Music is an integral part of the experience. To the casual fan, they wouldn't give a toss. But imagine Star Wars without the Imperial March or the main theme? Indiana Jones without the theme? Bond without the main theme?
Having just watched the Tennyson scene, the music is highly emotional throughout and gives me the shivers but it sounds more like it could belong in any action blockbuster (Batman comes to mind). I think Murdoch's quote "Music in a Bond movie is a character" best sums it up. In any other movie I'm not as invested in the individual elements integrating seamlessly together but for Bond I want the whole audiovisual experience.
Even in CR, despite a lot of the soundtrack sounding like filler music, the moment Bond arrives in Nassau and Montenegro is so powerful, especially the former when Bond walks towards the camera with his sunnies and white suit...this is why James Bond is so cool
Yeah,sure. Given the choice each and every composer would prefer creating melodies,that stick to people's memories. Problem is guys like Newman don't have it in them,so they sell it as "new approach " and some naive souls buy these excuses. Actually quite clever. Not very gifted,but clever.
I love it indeed. It's suave, big, but it also has a slightly 1960's swing-feeling to it, no ;)? In any case, I love it.
i think there is a time and place very different kind of scores - i don't think it's about the measure of a composer's talent... look at the difference between the style of scores between Alien and Chinatown - both scores done by Jerry Goldsmith.. Alien is very atmospheric and sound scape.. Chinatown is very film noir-esque...
compare Newman's Skyfall soundtrack to some of other work, like this..
so go on about how Newman is incapable of writing melody?
i think there is a time and place very different kind of scores - i don't think it's about the measure of a composer's talent... look at the difference between the style of scores between Alien and Chinatown - both scores done by Jerry Goldsmith.. Alien is very atmospheric and sound scape.. Chinatown is very film noir-esque...
compare Newman's Skyfall soundtrack to some of other work, like this..
so go on about how Newman is incapable of writing melody?
I only could play Cinderella Man but it only confirmed my suspicion,that Newman has no coherent and memorisable melody arc in him.
It's perfectly hummable. But I also agree with @PanchitoPistoles that if music is not hummable, it isn't necessarily bad. I love the track from "The Social Network".
Moreover, don't forget that music should also create suspense in a Bond film. In a way I like to compare Newman's soundtrack for SF with Barry's soundtrack for FRWL: Both are not really full of ingenious melodies, and are focussed more on Hitchcok-ian suspense really.
Hence why Newman got some inspiration for his score for SF from actual heartbeats. It's a central theme during the entire movie score. I liked it. And around that theme he really composed everything.
Now with SPECTRE Newman might have some new inspiration :-).
I'm not too much worried about it this time around.
What teaser?
Heartbeats? You must be fu...ing kidding me!
Yet,somehow I believe you.
About that "Hitchcock - Ian touch - imagine Janet Leigh under a shower, the shadow of an enormous knife striking her again and again,seeing her break down,her blood rinsing in the sewer. Do you hear those high spikes of music tearing through the silence and your brain,making this a thing out of a nightmare, grabbing you completely. That's Hitchcock!
My word, that is an outstanding piece of music! It's not really Bondian, but it's very well done. That proves Newman can create melody. We know he can create suspenseful music too. It just has to be integrated.
To those who talk about 'hummability', yes, I agree. Bond music pre-Arnold was known for melody and hummability. Even Martin did this beautifully in LALD. I don't agree with throwing Arnold in with Barry and conflating the two however. There is absolutely no comparison to my ears and it's an insult to Barry. Arnold isn't even close (particularly in action sequences where his work is quite 'pedestrian' and lacking in finesse - certainly not hummable). He is much better in the lower key moments, and I'll admit he improved a lot during the Craig tenure. I think QoS is by far his best work. Having said that, I feel strongly that he's just not good enough for Bond. 2nd rate. B class. The fact that he was the composer during some of the worst title tracks the series has seen IMO (Another Way to Die, TWINE, DAD) reinforces this perception for me, although I realize he did not compose that music necessarily. He's had more than enough chances. Bond has moved on, and it's improving by leaps and bounds in other areas. It's time the score improves too, & goes back to being as good as it was during the 60's to 80's high.
Now, about Newman: As I've said before, I'm not advocating for him necessarily. I'm just not as dismissive of him as others & I think he needs another chance to grow into this. I heard potential in SF. Yes, it did feel unfinished & it did feel in some areas like 'filler'. However it did not seem unfinessed to me, ever..... Arnold has been guilty of that to my ears many times during his 11 year run & for me and that's unforgiveable. Bond is all about finesse & class.
So let's see what Newman can come up with this time around. If he screws it up, then by all means, throw him out, but get somebody new in to 'lift' the series back to where it must be in terms of music quality, and where it has been lacking for many decades.
As I've said, if they really want to move this back to where it should be, hire Howard Shore.
PS: regarding integrating the title track into the score: issues include copyright (i.e. different labels), not getting the title track done on time, and not having the composer actually compose the tune (Barry almost always composed the title tracks during his run). Timing is also a factor, although I realize Newman had ample time for SF from what I've heard. It has to be integrated into the score for SP. No ifs, buts or two ways about it. Babs better get on it.
Won't happen with Newman that's for sure.
I mean the video that was played to reveal the SPECTRE title and Logo during the photocall. I think it used Arnold's rendition of the Bond theme in "Bond, James Bond" with a slightly different mix.
Totally agree. Have to remain upbeat. Things can only get better IMO after SF. Having said that I won't be going in expecting much from the soundtrack. Just hoping it's slightly more energised than what we got for SF.
I certainly don't think SF score is up there with the greats. The fact that some of the tosh that Connery & Moore were in were afforded such scoring gold by John Barry. Yet Craig gives so much to the role and despite peoples opinion has put Bond in a position that we haven't seen in decades gets Arnold mixed bag and Newman's effective but not particularly memorable effort does have a tendency to annoy.
Although we can't expect the level of scoring that Barry bought to the series, he was one of the key elements to why those films have endured, some might say Connery, Young etc but imagine those films without Barry's touch and just some generic effort. Barry leaves a mark on everything he worked on, even huge flops like Raise The Titanic, King Kong etc are given something, they don't deserve but Barry could excite as well as produce music that swelled with emotion.
I'm hoping that Newman really takes the bull by the horns this time and realises he's scoring a Bond film with Spectre and not anything he's done before including SF and tries not to so much leave his own stamp but evoke the best of Bond scoring as well as accompanying appropriately what we are hoping is going to one of the finest of the series.
From what some of us have heard this is crying out for something like Barry's OHMSS. By that I mean not that level of quality, it's not going to happen (we are talking about one of the finest scores in film history). I mean Newman needs to make it exciting and use the Bond theme at the right time, variations like Barry so brilliantly did and also let it blare when it needs to. Though also like OHMSS it needs to be emotional, he hit on some great moments with the SF score, his cue for the row of coffins sequence which was essentially like M's theme was an example. I know some of us complained about Arnold's lack of subtlety during the Brosnan era but I think Newman needs to step on the pedal more this time round and maybe not be so delicate, I don't want the JB theme every 10 minute but I do want to hear it more this time round.
Also if Adele is back maybe she needs to not be on the opening credits and like OHMSS use an instrumental and then like that film weave a love theme by Adele into the film. I know it's not likely but I can hope can't I?
The thing that worries me about Adele doing the theme is Spectre is a sinister title and can she really pull off a song to match that title? I guess we'll see.
Yes he has a nice voice I guess but the title Spectre as I said spells sinister some wimpy sounding ballad isn't going to cut it, in an ideal world it would be Depeche Mode, Radiohead or even better with that title Portishead. I liked the Bowie idea although that came from someone on this forum people distrust so I'd take it with a pinch of salt.
EON will be looking to make a big splash after SF and Adele so I won't be surprise if they've got her back or it is Sam Smith given his profile. I know one thing they are unlikely to be looking at my taste as a gauge hence why my choices above would only be providing the theme in my dreams. I've come to conclusion that the commercial music arena is becoming more and more alien to me and the big names out there now I probably don't even know as I don't listen to the radio, read gossip mags or go on their websites.
I've no illusions and that any theme from now on isn't going to appeal to my tastes and that is why when people mention McCartney or Tom Jones I have to laugh apart from the fact those 2 are far past their best, any theme from now on will be looking for a wider market than a bunch of hardcore fans, so get ready to be horrified with future choices I'm all set not to like whoever gets the job this time as for the future it can only get worse.
I think people tend to forget that Adele's status NOW is very comparable to, let's say, Tom Jones and Nancy Sinatra's status back in the 1960's. Yes, McCartney, Sinatra, Jones, they all have a cult status now, but they simply used to be "pop stars".
What counts for me by the way, is the actual song, not the commercial status of a singer. "Skyfall" for me completely "did it". Loved it. And will always love it. KD Lang or David McAlmont could have sung such a similar song as well. But it's the song.
And so far we don't know a thing about the "SPECTRE"-song. Until then I find it too early to criticise the movie in terms of "commercial music arena".
I'm not necessarily criticising SPECTRE I'm just saying at my age I'm more than likely not to be a fan of whoever does the theme from now on. QOS is likely to be the last time I'm a fan of the artist doing the theme.
I knew Cornell through being a Soundgarden fan but Adele I've never been into her music despite not minding some of her songs, SF theme is fine accompanied by the titles but as an independent song it's nowhere the standard of YOLT or DAF, easily some of the best themes of the series despite the quality of the films themselves.
Look I'm 43 this year and despite once having an open mind about new music, I did work in music retail for 15 + years and was exposed to a wide range of tastes. Now I find new stuff leaves me bewildered but I'm not the market they are going after, the likelihood is that whoever does it in the future is likely not to be someone I would approve of but that is factor of the series that I'm going to have to come to terms with.
I also thought Severine's theme was better than Vesper's personally. That was very Barry'esque as well to my ears.
Not too late for Beth Orton.
I thought there were two:
1. The aerials of Shanghai
2. Approaching the island on the Chimera
Both were scored with booming music that packs a wallop.