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No, I belive Spectre won't be great simply because the screenplay isn't that good.
The opening chase is decent and the helicopter fight is going to be a lot of fun, but setting the PTS in another exotic locale just like Skyfall feels a little unoriginal.
C / Denbigh feels like a replacement for Mallory in Skyfall. A bureaucrat who doesn't trust Bond. I like Andrew Scott a lot, but casting him makes his villain turn super predictable.
"Bond. James Bond" is placed perfectly, and most of the dialogue in the script is really funny and clever.
Hinx is getting some good action scenes, but I wish he had something that made him stand out a little more. Bautista deserves a role just as good as Drax in GOTG. Him not speaking annoyed me until the joke Bond makes when he kills him. That made up for it.
The scene between Bond and Mr. White is really, really good. Can't wait to see Jesper Christensen act that out.
Q and Moneypenny get a ton of stuff to do! That makes me really happy.
I like Swann. Her scenes with Bond in Morocco and on the train are really good. She's still no Vesper though.
I really hate Oberhauser as a villain, or the final 30 or so pages at all. Oberhauser is given a proper introduction way too late, and his whole speech / reveal thing ruined a lot of the script for me honestly. They should give him a longer introduction or a real confrontation with Bond in Rome, and completely rewrite or erase everything that happens in his villain lair.
The London action setpiece at the end didn't really have any of the oomph or excitement compared to the previous ones. Building collapsing has been done to death in other movies, and the helicopter stuff was done in Mexico in the beginning.
Having read the October script I can say that I really like the mix between serious brutal Bond and comedy relief/witty dialogue in this one.
@timmer I'm not so sure about Swann being killed at the beginning of Bond 25, and the We Have All The Time in the World line is definitely not pointing towards that, since that line was already in the October draft, and in that draft Bond kills Blofeld at the end.
The way I see it is that they envisioned the Bond-Madeleine relationship having a happy ending, unlike the Bond-Tracy relationship. I could be wrong though...
Fans have been wanting to see the Shatterhand story on screen for a long time..castle of death etc, proper follow-up to OHMSS, in the Fleming YOLT vein.
This could be it, Bond fans!!!
This completely. In the script, C mentions to Bond before his death that there is no escaping him and he has multiple hideouts besides the one Bond destroyed. In fact, the line is;
"You think by destroying one of his bases you've achieved anything? He has them all over the world. The man's a genius. He's in control. Face it, Bond, you don't matter any more."
If a Castle of Death is one of these so-called bases and its next, I swear I would kiss Babs and Mike both square on the lips.
Edit; now that I think about it, they could also incorporate the squid/killing ground plot element from the Dr. No novel, as well. Would love that!
1. Because it would've been a huge let down considering how much an effect the "original Irma" had on people.
2. She just seemed like a throwaway henchwoman.
3. Her death was boring (Falling to her death inside the destroyed MI6)
As for the bullet whole in the title logo/teaser poster. I have two throughts.
A its just a general thing that hardens back to the old films/last proper spectre film.
B its a direct clue to Swann's death either in this film or in a Bond 25. Is it possible that they will kill her off in this film and have not put it in any draft so far?
Questions in the shooting outline Bond refers to him as it says ESB does Bond say this on the bridge in the Dec 1st draft?
Also in the Oct draft what's the last bit with Hinx? I thought it was his fingers twitching? In the Dec draft is he pulled from the train with chains round his neck?
Also where does the Bond, James Bond come in the drafts?
If memory serves from yesterday, I believe it's while he's seducing Lucia right before a make-out scene.
Oh I assumed everyone ment Blofeld using it in the scene in Rome.
This is my suggestion for BB and Mendes:
1. Pick up a mirror
2. Look in the mirror.
3. Say, "A-ha, there's the culprit!"
Both BB and Mendes wanted to pursue other projects. A writer (Logan) was hired who, likewise, was pursuing other projects. Everyone concerned wanted a three-year gap so they could pursue their other projects.
When everyone involved finally got around to working on a Bond movie, they were behind the 8 ball and had to scramble.
The other thing we must take into account is that, especially with most blockbuster films these days, pre-production is usually a pretty hectic, trying time with everyone trying to get their sh*t together; execs want something one way, writers want it another, producers have their say and everyone is trying to be heard the loudest. Then you have the actors wanting a piece, then you have stuff hitting the floor due to time constraints or budget constraints or other activities and obligations they have in motion in their careers, ect ect. I understand your fears but you should understand that this is what happens with every movie. Literally. Just listen to any podcast or documentary about the process, they all have complaints and if they say it was a piece of cake, they are lying through their teeth to save face unless they have a set crew they work with day in and day out who knows how they like to get things done. The only reason this seems such a pressing issue is because of the leaks, because we got to see the ugly truth under the veil. I'm sure the times between LTK/GE and DAD/CR were just as bad, if not worse, and look how those turned out.
However, it seems that Logan was granted a clean slate and given the all-clear to basically write whatever the hell he wanted and then after they just cherry picked what they wanted to keep, change and throw out entirely. That is also not especially surprising given Skyfall's success and the producers maybe wanting to see out of curiosity what Logan would come up with which also is not that uncommon in Hollywood after a majorly successful film.
That said, the script is fantastic considering all the hell they seemingly went through and I have no doubt in my mind this will be a top notch flick. It has all the right beats, all the right winks and nods for fans, great action set-pieces, the established Bond characteristics for Craig's 007 are in tact and progress forward as well as bringing in classy shades of Connery and Moore. The henchman and women are strong, the MI6 crew become more fully fleshed out characters due to their increased roles and the re-booted Bond mythos becomes thicker now with the added element of Blofeld and Spectre.
Where-as I thought the Bond/Blofeld teen element would feel cheesy, the way it's pulled off in the December draft as Blofeld having an even more traumatizing past than Bond works to greater effect and the whole 'jealousy' aspect is completely downplayed to the point I hardly even noticed it while reading through in utter delight. Blofeld just comes off as a man with ideals who has a point to prove, a grudge with the world, and he wants his plan to involve taking down and alienating everyone, most of all Bond.
Bare in mind, I went into reading the script completely expecting to tear it to shreds. It's been well documented that I loathed the ending and the idea of a retiring Bond, but the way I picked it up, it screams that this Blofeld story is nearing its completion, sure, but the show is not over yet and the curtain has yet to fall as we witness Bond driving off with Swann.
And no, writers rewriting a whole act of the script just weeks before the start of principal photography does not happen with every movie, and it certainly shouldn't. By the way, in the case of Spectre we aren't talking about a script the producers, Mendes and the executives had disagreements about. Quite the contrary, a few months before the start of filming they all agreed that the script was still a mess.
There was absolutely nothing wrong with them letting Logan start to write the script on his own. What's wrong is that they didn't do anything until the last minute, even though Logan made no improvement on his version of the script for months. As for the script being fantastic, I couldn't disagree with you more on that. It's not a disaster, but it's much worse than the screenplay of Skyfall (and a lot of people were already complaining about that one).
I am someone who loves the idea of Bond retiring, all the personal stuff and drama, and I still didn't love the script. It's complete pastiche. We are back where we were in 1995. After DAD, this screenplay would be a great improvement, but after CR and SF it really feels like 2 steps back.
To each his own but you couldn't be more wrong about the script. Everyone was agreed with loving the script....until the third act. The rest everyone was relatively completely fine with, and that is what went through the major changes after summer. Since then, it's just been minor tweaks here and there. Hardly last minute. Scripts go under the knife and changes are made well into shooting on most productions if need be. Hardly anything to sweat about.
And also, I'm quite baffled by your comment about it being two steps back. This draft has gave me so many feels of Casino Royale and Skyfall that I could hardly contain myself. Perhaps it would flow better on screen for you than on the page, or perhaps the Craig series has just moved on and left you behind. Either way, I feel sorry that the next year or 2 for you as a fan is going to be hell because I'm quite positive this film, and the film beyond it, will be an extension of this due to its no doubt oncoming success.
As for pastiche, I honestly don't know what you were expecting; you knew the score, you saw M and the double doors and the old office; Bond is Bond again, that was the whole driving force of the Bond Begins storyline. We have come full circle in the new timeline and are now caught up. You didn't think it would last forever, did you?
Them agreeing on loving the first two acts happened in October, a mere two months before the start of filming. During the summer the script was still a mess. M was still a traitor back in July, so it's pretty clear that the whole screenplay was very different back then. (Not to mention the fact that Blofeld was a woman in the March draft, and a black African guy before that... it's obvious they had no idea what to do with that character.)
Hardly anything to sweat about? Yeah I guess that's why
- Barbara Broccoli was furious with Mendes and Logan back in May
- Mendes tried to quit and move release date back in June
- Mendes was still really worried back in July
- they were stuck at the end of August
- the whole 3rd act was still very messy in October
- they closed the deal with Waltz only during the last week of October (even though they were already in serious talks with him back in July) becasuse he had some issues with his character
I'm not worried about Spectre, I've read the script and know what to expect. It won't be a disaster. Two things make me angry:
1. The way they handled the development of the screenplay.
2. That you and some other forum members are claiming there is nothing wrong with the fact that they were still rewriting a large portion of the script in November and that they had no problems during pre-production, even though it's there in the e-mails black and white that they had some serious problems.