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Bond and Mr White
One of my favourite scenes in Spectre was the one between Bond and Mr. White... But, despite the fact I enjoyed the scene, there's just something about it that doesn't sit well with me. Let me explain what I mean.
This is a man who Bond would gladly have killed back in Casino Royale if he hadn't of needed him. Yet here, it seems that all is forgiven between them?.. That just doesn't seem right to me.. From the clip we saw of this scene in the trailers I expected Bond to coldly dispatch White once he'd finished talking with him, but he doesn't. And, to a certain extent, I'm okay with that, as it shows that Bond is no longer just a killing machine. But, what I'm not okay with is Bond giving White a loaded gun. I mean, what the hell! I know this was done in order to gain White's trust but it still seems rather stupid of Bond. Not only that, but then once White is dead he gently closes his eyes.. I must admit that there is something rather beautiful about this moment, but it does seem rather strange for Bond to be so, so forgiving. And then for Bond to defend White to his daughter later on?.. It just all seems rather strange and forced.
What did you make of this scene?
This is a man who Bond would gladly have killed back in Casino Royale if he hadn't of needed him. Yet here, it seems that all is forgiven between them?.. That just doesn't seem right to me.. From the clip we saw of this scene in the trailers I expected Bond to coldly dispatch White once he'd finished talking with him, but he doesn't. And, to a certain extent, I'm okay with that, as it shows that Bond is no longer just a killing machine. But, what I'm not okay with is Bond giving White a loaded gun. I mean, what the hell! I know this was done in order to gain White's trust but it still seems rather stupid of Bond. Not only that, but then once White is dead he gently closes his eyes.. I must admit that there is something rather beautiful about this moment, but it does seem rather strange for Bond to be so, so forgiving. And then for Bond to defend White to his daughter later on?.. It just all seems rather strange and forced.
What did you make of this scene?
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Comments
White wants Bond to take care of his daughter, so it wouldn't make sense to kill him. White is also dying and wants to end it quickly, so Bond offers this option.
Bond needs the information White has, so it doesn't make sense to kill him -- best to let him do it himself once he's spilled the beans.
By the way, I would edit the title of this thread to warn against spoilers.
But I agree, Bond's overall treatment of Mr. White did seem a bit out of character.
Also, I'm surprised Bond didn't knock over the white king on the chess board before leaving. That was the perfect chance for some obvious symbolism.
I agree with this. Plus White knew he was dying and Bond promised to protect Madeleine--and did, for once!--so that tipped the scale in Bond's favor.
The *best* decision the screenwriters made this time around was to bring back White--to look at what really worked in QoS--and to invent his daughter.
They are not ones to leave loose ends. They would want to eliminate anyone they think would potential threaten their existence. It was one of the reasons they were after Lucia, after her husband died, she was no longer a "protected" person. She knew too much despite not being personally afflicted with the group, it would be easier for them to kill her then strike a deal.
The same applies for Madeline. She was clearly aware of this and took the job in the Hoffler Klinik as it was seemingly out of Spectre's grasp. However after Bond turned up and saw Mr. White (who disclosed the existence of L'Americain) they knew Bond would travel to her and uncover their organisation. The way they found Madeline was through Hinx discovering the camera in White's chalet recording the entire meeting. Essentially Bond led Spectre to Madeline. A rather shoddy piece of detective work as he had already noted the camera earlier.
On the other hand, the fact that Oberhauser is watching everything would suggest that he could have watched White's suicide in real time.
The truth is once you unpick the storyline you could drive a bus through it's plot-holes.
That is probably one of the best points one can make. I would add that at this stage, considering Mr. White's condition, I doubt Bond would reap much satisfaction in killing him.
Or something like that. Memory not great.
White is one great character across the films. And expertly acted. Although he turns Scottish when he says "he's eating dinner with your family"
At least that's how I justify it....still the scene wasn't needed...I swear I could have written parts of the movie better...
Have Bond kill White out of mercy so he can finally die in peace instead of struggling for 2 more weeks.......so when Oberhauser shows the video to Swann it makes sense why Bond is begging her to close her eyes...
Also mods put SPOILER in the name of the thread
Good points.
And although a short lived one, White became one of the most interesting allies of Bond in the last few decades.
One of the things that Mendes constantly mentions in SP is the life and choices of an 'assassin'. I think Bond sees a lot of himself in White, they are both opposites of the same coin; they kill people. It's likely one of the reasons why Bond decides to retire at the end (ironically with Mr White's daughter), he doesn't want to end up like his nemesis; alone, forgotten and dead. The life of an assassin is lonely and full of secrets and lies.
Mr. White is probably the most important character thematically in the film. Bond senses a certain kinship with the now feeble Pale King.
Anyway, I've tried to sketch out the life of Mr. White. I want people to interject with their own theories about what this guy got up to before his demise
_____________________________________________________________
- We know little about his early life aside from the fact that he's a criminal and a 'assassin'.
- It's likely he got married in his 30's and had Madeline in his mid 30's. I presume by this point he was already in Spectre. His rank in Spectre is never explicitly mentioned, but considering his role in CR and QOS we can presume it's fairly high-up (maybe the deputy?). I'd imagine he headed up the Quantum division and was close with Blofeld who claims to have visited the White family home.
-Him and his wife were clearly very much in love at one point and visited the L'Americain hotel every year following their honeymoon. When Madeline was born they took her along too.
-Assassins try and break into his family home and kill him but a young Madeline saves him. We also see lots of pictures of him and Madeline suggesting he was once close to his daughter.
-His wife leaves him. It's suggested that she is still alive. After their divorce he still continues to use the L'Americain hotel room, only now as a base for his operations and a hideout.
-Him and Madeline grow estranged. I can't remember the exact dialogue from the film but she turns her back on him. When we meet her she hasn't seen or heard from him in 7 years.
-During this time White travels to Uganda to meet Steven Obanno and put him in contact witha Spectre contractor, Le Chiffre. He later interrogates British Treasury official, Vesper Lynd, into working for Spectre. Vesper strikes a deal with Spectre to spare Bond's life in exchange for the money. Bond is able to arrest White.
-White is interrogated in an MI6 safehouse in Italy where he insists that his organisation has global reach and are currently operating unbeknownst to the world's intelligence communities. White is able to escape capture.
-Several years later White begins to disagree with the methods being used by Blofeld. He believes Blofeld has changed and is too willing to kill women and children for power. Essentially, White suddenly has a change of heart and redeems himself. We also learn he operates under the code name 'The Pale King'.
-Having upset Blofeld, White goes into hiding. He also discovers that thalium has been placed inside his mobile, thus poisoning him severely. He hides out in a chalet in Austria where no one can find him waiting to die (Spectre have also sent their best assassin to kill him). Bond discovers him, by this point he is noticeably frail and delusional. After striking a deal with Bond, White shoots himself in the head knowing that 007 will protect his daughter and kill Blofeld.
-The last we see of White his body has been decomposing for a day or two and crows are picking at his face.
The only thing I can see to add is that he personally executed Le Chiffre for his failure.
Kind of. But Dexter doesn't commit suicide....he is stung by a scorpian fish and drowned by an octopus whilst swimming. He never takes Bond up on his 'subtle' offer.
http://i1.wp.com/www.commander007.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Spectre_619.5.jpg
Or is Friedrich König just an alias? Wouldn't his surname be Swann? I like how White's codename 'The Pale King' and his daughter's surname are evocative of his (supposed) name.
I assume that that was before the producers decided to give Mr White a new background to tie him into the Madeleine Swann character? Or, diplomatically, one could say that that was merely an alias? Who knows?
Ah, it's actually very clever then?
Yes I'd say so.
The screen appears to show search results for anything using the words PALE, KING or any translation thereof. Hence the item on the right is a taxi receipt in the name of Pale, which is probably unrelated to him but has just popped up in the search.
Fantastic attention to detail - love it!