The Next American President Thread (2016)

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  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    edited November 2016 Posts: 9,020
    .
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited November 2016 Posts: 23,883
    There's no doubt that Republicans obstructed Obama. What's amusing is that some think Clinton won't be more obstructed. She is more hated than filth by rank and file Republicans, and the way she's run her campaign, the Tea Party coalition in the House (read Trumpers) will eviscerate her if she's elected. The energy to destroy her will be like nothing you've ever seen before.

    The game has been exposed. There's no putting the genie back in the box now. Trump is/was the last chance to let steam out of the system as an outsider, even if symbolically. He is a brash talker, salesman and a businessman but has more democratic instincts than anyone else on the right. A New York Republican (so essentially a democrat). A man who can thread the needle if given a chance as he has no ideological underpinnings except for economic and security concerns.

    If he loses, then everyone has reason to worry about fascists and what not next time out, mark my words.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    edited November 2016 Posts: 9,020
    An impeachable offense is whatever a majority of the House of Representatives considers it to be at a given moment in history.

    The email affair has shown that H. is unfit for the Presidency.
  • Posts: 315
    Hey, Trump...guess who's warming up? The irony just drips on this one.

  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    The alternative with a Republican in office, with even more republican seats and a supreme court justice of Trump's choosing would mean a possible demolishing of the gay rights law and abortion law for women, all in the name of bloody religion. I don't care to go there, and I'm sick of Republicans dictating the happiness and bodily rights of other people in the name of an invisible man in the sky. With a Dem we'll at least have people treated far more equally like human beings for being gay, transgender, etc. and it helps that they also don't think global warming is a myth, too. It's not mounting moving stuff, but I'm satisfied with that for now. It says a lot about the lack of compassion or empathy even these days when people actually want to unite to undo landmark human rights reforms.

    As for the debate about people voting or not voting, I think it's a waste to throw it away. I used to be cynical about this, and thought nothing I could do would matter anyway, but over time that's changed. If everyone in the country thought like me and decided not to vote because they didn't think it would count, then all that would pile up to a big lack in votes, so I do it to offset those who don't see the point in it like I once did. That, and barely 50 years ago black americans were being beaten at the polls when they tried to vote, and in a world with so many more totalitarian minded governments, the right to vote is one that we take for granted. That we actually have choices, however slim or bad, is amazing, no matter how used to it we are now. Not voting is an insult to those who weren't or aren't able to do it either because of where in the world they are, or in their gender, the color of their skin or anything else.
  • Posts: 12,521
    I've done my civic duty and voted. You all know who for. And no, I don't like either candidate.
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    Why is it people seem to believe "impeach" means "remove"? Bill Clinton and Richard Nixon were both impeached and neither was removed. Clinton served out his term and Nixon resigned.
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    edited November 2016 Posts: 4,589
    jobo wrote: »
    The majority of the American public have every reason to celebrate if Clinton is elected. She is the one who will maintain a progressive policy with focus on strengthening the wellfare of the working class, limiting social divisions, taking the step towards a more environmentaly stable future.

    The problem is that a Republican-controlled Congress will keep anything from happening. We will look at four more years of deep partisanship. It will be worse than with Obama, because it's likely that Clinton will not win more than 50% of the popular vote. Thus, Republicans will feel justified to obstruct even more.

    The ACA will continue to be a problem. It's fixable, but the Republicans will not fix it; they will let people suffer needlessly just to be spiteful. It's the worst kind of childishness.

    The SCOTUS seat may remain vacant indefinitely. And who knows: there might be another vacancy coming. The fight over this could turn very ugly.

    Investigations will continue. I predict that articles of impeachment will be introduced by the House within six months of her inauguration. There are not enough votes in the Senate to impeach her, but the Republicans will do it for the political theater.

    That said, it appears that Clinton will not win North Carolina. As if Republicans can't get any more disgraceful, there's this item out already: https://thinkprogress.org/north-carolina-gop-happy-suppression-worked-a4b3c06d1996#.13gbdlgx4

  • Posts: 1,631
    As for the debate about people voting or not voting, I think it's a waste to throw it away. I used to be cynical about this, and thought nothing I could do would matter anyway, but over time that's changed. If everyone in the country thought like me and decided not to vote because they didn't think it would count, then all that would pile up to a big lack in votes, so I do it to offset those who don't see the point in it like I once did. That, and barely 50 years ago black americans were being beaten at the polls when they tried to vote, and in a world with so many more totalitarian minded governments, the right to vote is one that we take for granted. That we actually have choices, however slim or bad, is amazing, no matter how used to it we are now. Not voting is an insult to those who weren't or aren't able to do it either because of where in the world they are, or in their gender, the color of their skin or anything else.

    I'll throw my opinion in on this as one of those that is abstaining from voting today. For me, and I don't doubt that this isn't the case for a good number of people, the decision to abstain is not an easy one. I've been following this election since Ted Cruz announced his candidacy last year. I tend to find these kinds of things interesting, watching the debates and coverage of the election, and would generally rather watch that kind of stuff as opposed to whatever stupid sitcom the networks are running in the primetime hours. So, I feel like I have a decent understanding about what's going on out there, even if some of the more nuanced policy debate (not that there's been any this cycle) can go over my head from time to time.

    That said, abstaining this time around, for me, is the only way to go (short of taking the time to drive to the poll and literally throw my vote away on a write-in for Mitt Romney). I've examined each of the candidates and I can't vote for any of them. The two major party candidates are both just awful choices and, the real sad part about all of this, the two third-party candidates have proven to be even worse. I would have gladly lined up for a third party candidate this time, but Gary Johnson has proven himself unfit for the office and when your own running mate endorses a competitor, that's not a sign that your a solid choice to lead the nation. The less said about Jill Stein's campaign, the better. She's run on a promise that is essentially a lie, as she doesn't have the power to cancel student debt. Seems millennials have picked up on that, since they would greatly benefit from such a plan yet Stein only polls at around 2-3%.

    If there were a candidate fit for the office on the ballot, I'd vote for them. But, sadly, at least for me, there isn't. We're in trouble either way. I managed to bite the proverbial bullet back in 2004 and voted for John Kerry (although I regret that vote now), and I've voted for a small handful of Democrats at the Congressional and state/local level in years past, so it's not necessarily a partisan thing. I just can't get behind any of these candidates, so none of them will get my vote.
  • But what about the down-ballot candidates? "Senators, congressmen, please heed the call"? (Ooops, sorry, I'm trying to kick the Dylan addiction, but it's not easy.) There must be some local races, some state-wide propositions (here in California we've got 17 of 'em) -- something you feel called to take a stand for or against.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    @dalton, I get that, and I respect that you've actually thought this through for a long while and debated the options to make your conclusions. I know many out there don't care to be informed about any issues or candidates, and abstain even still (though this year it's hard not to know the candidates, they're on TV so much). Hopefully your fears aren't realized, however this goes.
  • Germanlady wrote: »

    Sometimes, I don't know, what to answer to you, because your replies normally are only in small terms related to what I wanted to say or wrote.

    Then my work here is done. You're urging us to question our assumptions, but you never question your own.
    Germanlady wrote: »
    Did you listen to that vid of John Allen.

    And there's one of them. I saw John Allen's appearance at Democratic Convention when it was originally broadcast. Thank you for telling me what I already knew.
  • Posts: 1,631
    But what about the down-ballot candidates? "Senators, congressmen, please heed the call"? (Ooops, sorry, I'm trying to kick the Dylan addiction, but it's not easy.) There must be some local races, some state-wide propositions (here in California we've got 17 of 'em) -- something you feel called to take a stand for or against.

    Not really. The Democrat has zero chance of winning my district in the House race. I did my part back in the primary to try to defeat him, but it looks like we're stuck with him now.
  • edited November 2016 Posts: 6,601
    Germanlady wrote: »

    Sometimes, I don't know, what to answer to you, because your replies normally are only in small terms related to what I wanted to say or wrote.

    Then my work here is done. You're urging us to question our assumptions, but you never question your own.
    Germanlady wrote: »
    Did you listen to that vid of John Allen.

    And there's one of them. I saw John Allen's appearance at Democratic Convention when it was originally broadcast. Thank you for telling me what I already knew.

    Here we go again. I said, you often answer with apples, when I was talking meat or whatever. Has nothing to do with questioning your assumptions. It has to do with - IF you care to answer to me, reply to my post and not with some topic, that goes into another direction and hence, has no impact.

    So you did see THIS vid and it doesn't frighten you? WOW - if so, you didn't get the meaning.
  • No, I just didn't get the same meaning you did. Your viewpoint is not the only legitimate viewpoint in the whole wide world. I like apples, I like meat. I am vast, I contain multitudes.
  • Posts: 6,601
    Ok. You have me. I give up on you. No discussion possible.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited November 2016 Posts: 23,883
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    Thanks for the link @bondjames
    I like playing devil's advocate and have been doing it a lot concerning Trump.
    In the US I would be called a racist, stupid and sexist just for the fact not being totally against him.
    That would probably trigger a counter reaction in form of actually voting for him.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    @BondJasonBond006, you do play devil's advocate well, indeed, and are often a contrarian in many big ways.

    I don't think you'd fit in well in the states, however. We're largely prudes that gawk at any mentions of sex and smut (love violence though), whereas you pride yourself on being an open book in that regard, you fiend, you. ;)
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,829
    Well, I was gonna write Bernie in, but HE TOLD ME to vote for Hillary, so that's what I ended up doing. I'm just a mindless Bernite, I guess...
  • edited November 2016 Posts: 572
    TripAces wrote: »
    jobo wrote: »
    The majority of the American public have every reason to celebrate if Clinton is elected. She is the one who will maintain a progressive policy with focus on strengthening the wellfare of the working class, limiting social divisions, taking the step towards a more environmentaly stable future.

    The problem is that a Republican-controlled Congress will keep anything from happening.
    No, the problem is that neither party will work together on things. There's two sides to the coin and Obama has done nothing but aggravate the republican base to score political points.

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,829
    JamesStock wrote: »
    Obama has done nothing but aggravate the republican based to score political points.

    ENNNNH. Wrong guess Hans.
    :))
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    edited November 2016 Posts: 9,020
    JamesStock wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    jobo wrote: »
    The majority of the American public have every reason to celebrate if Clinton is elected. She is the one who will maintain a progressive policy with focus on strengthening the wellfare of the working class, limiting social divisions, taking the step towards a more environmentaly stable future.

    The problem is that a Republican-controlled Congress will keep anything from happening.
    No, the problem is that neither party will work together on things. There's two sides to the coin and Obama has done nothing but aggravate the republican based to score political points.

    you mean by being black?
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    Obama has tried to work across party lines, they refuse.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    edited November 2016 Posts: 9,020
    The Tea Party fanatics are holding the Republican Party hostage since 8 years.
  • edited November 2016 Posts: 572
    Obama has tried to work across party lines, they refuse.
    You're going to have to show me examples for me to change my mind...
    JamesStock wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    jobo wrote: »
    The majority of the American public have every reason to celebrate if Clinton is elected. She is the one who will maintain a progressive policy with focus on strengthening the wellfare of the working class, limiting social divisions, taking the step towards a more environmentaly stable future.

    The problem is that a Republican-controlled Congress will keep anything from happening.
    No, the problem is that neither party will work together on things. There's two sides to the coin and Obama has done nothing but aggravate the republican based to score political points.

    you mean by being black?
    No, absolutely not. I'm talking about the policies he chose to pursue and the tactics he used to get them (or tried to get them) through.

  • edited November 2016 Posts: 572
    How do you delete accidental second posts?
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,829
    JamesStock wrote: »
    Obama has tried to work across party lines, they refuse.
    You're going to have to show me examples for me to change my mind...
    Nah, your mind is made up regardless of facts- I can tell. The examples are numerous & out there for all to see. Water is wet.

  • Posts: 11,425
    JamesStock wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    jobo wrote: »
    The majority of the American public have every reason to celebrate if Clinton is elected. She is the one who will maintain a progressive policy with focus on strengthening the wellfare of the working class, limiting social divisions, taking the step towards a more environmentaly stable future.

    The problem is that a Republican-controlled Congress will keep anything from happening.
    No, the problem is that neither party will work together on things. There's two sides to the coin and Obama has done nothing but aggravate the republican based to score political points.

    you mean by being black?

    I did think that was pretty provocative to be fair. I mean, you have to realise that some people just weren't ready for a black president. It would have been polite to wait. May be 250 years or so? That would have been a lot less provocative.
  • edited November 2016 Posts: 572
    chrisisall wrote: »
    JamesStock wrote: »
    Obama has tried to work across party lines, they refuse.
    You're going to have to show me examples for me to change my mind...
    Nah, your mind is made up regardless of facts- I can tell. The examples are numerous & out there for all to see. Water is wet.
    Okay, well since you know me so well, you know that I wanted to vote for Bernie. I don't agree with him on a fair amount of stuff, but he is a far better personality and I believe would have been a uniter.

    I don't associate with the republican party for a reason. There are plenty of things about the party not to like, let's get that straight. But you making it personal by making judgement of me as an individual says more about you than I. If there is material out there that suggests that Obama successfully reached across the aisle, please show me. There just isn't any bipartisan bills of any major magnitude that Obama himself can claim credit for. Both parties are to blame for the divisiveness. Claiming one side is the problem, is the problem. Obamacare was shoved through and now the democrats are getting the obstructionism from republicans. There was a PBS? special about how divisive things have gotten and I think they hit the nail on the head. The explosion began from the hanging chad debacle and grew exponentially this cycle. Unfortunately, I believe the power struggle will just continue...
This discussion has been closed.