Anthony Horowitz's James Bond novel - Trigger Mortis

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Comments

  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    They are still feeding the thirst and excitement of the fans, whether on different standards or not. I'm not saying I approve of all the new novels released subsequently after the original ones, but they are official since the original publishers are taking care of it, and not some third party company, like the Holmes stories, now, if you catch my drift. I still respect their ranks as well as the authors, like I respect many films that didn't come to my liking, I still class them as part of the family tree.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    Perdogg wrote: »
    I think this is the first time I like the US cover better than the UK cover. I am hoping the skull motif is on both cloth boards.

    I think I missed the covers???
  • Posts: 14
    Really pumped for this! Have read all the Alex Rider books and enjoyed them thoroughly. If you guys have not read them i suggest you give it a go because they aren't near as childish as you think and very bond in their influences.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Vic_Makey wrote: »
    Really pumped for this! Have read all the Alex Rider books and enjoyed them thoroughly. If you guys have not read them i suggest you give it a go because they aren't near as childish as you think and very bond in their influences.
    What this chap said! :D
  • Posts: 15,124
    They are still feeding the thirst and excitement of the fans, whether on different standards or not. I'm not saying I approve of all the new novels released subsequently after the original ones, but they are official since the original publishers are taking care of it, and not some third party company, like the Holmes stories, now, if you catch my drift. I still respect their ranks as well as the authors, like I respect many films that didn't come to my liking, I still class them as part of the family tree.

    They are not official, i.e. they are not canon. What is Ian Fleming is canon. You may say I'm a purist, but there are worse things to be called.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Errr... I'm more than just a little lost here, how can I clarify that, sir? Are we supposed to be say that the Daniel Craig era of the Bond films are not official because they don't follow the original canon but they recreate the entire arc with new origins rather than repeating the old ones?
  • Posts: 15,124
    Errr... I'm more than just a little lost here, how can I clarify that, sir? Are we supposed to be say that the Daniel Craig era of the Bond films are not official because they don't follow the original canon but they recreate the entire arc with new origins rather than repeating the old ones?

    You are building a strawman and making a false analogy. The films are a different medium and adaptation from the novels as source material. Or extensions of the source material, when not directly adapted from the novels. The continuation novels are an extension of the original Fleming work in the same medium. And thus at best superfluous to the literary Bond.

    This review by fellow Montrealer Kevin Burton Smith is about a different continuation from a different universe, but it sums up pretty well what I find wrong about continuators and their work in general: http://www.thrillingdetective.com/non_fiction/r040.html
  • edited May 2015 Posts: 2,483
    I like the title--cheeky and clever--and in Horowitz, we at last have an author who truly appreciates Fleming, and hopefully won't traduce the character as so many continuation authors have. This is one I may actually purchase.
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Errr... I'm more than just a little lost here, how can I clarify that, sir? Are we supposed to be say that the Daniel Craig era of the Bond films are not official because they don't follow the original canon but they recreate the entire arc with new origins rather than repeating the old ones?

    You are building a strawman and making a false analogy. The films are a different medium and adaptation from the novels as source material. Or extensions of the source material, when not directly adapted from the novels. The continuation novels are an extension of the original Fleming work in the same medium. And thus at best superfluous to the literary Bond.

    So, an adaptation that can possibly bastardize everything the original story stood for is accepted because it's in a different medium; but continuations in the same medium, despite their quality, are to be ignored simply because they're continuations?
  • Posts: 15,124
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Errr... I'm more than just a little lost here, how can I clarify that, sir? Are we supposed to be say that the Daniel Craig era of the Bond films are not official because they don't follow the original canon but they recreate the entire arc with new origins rather than repeating the old ones?

    You are building a strawman and making a false analogy. The films are a different medium and adaptation from the novels as source material. Or extensions of the source material, when not directly adapted from the novels. The continuation novels are an extension of the original Fleming work in the same medium. And thus at best superfluous to the literary Bond.

    So, an adaptation that can possibly bastardize everything the original story stood for is accepted because it's in a different medium; but continuations in the same medium, despite their quality, are to be ignored simply because they're continuations?

    It is the nature of movies or any kind of adaptations to potentially bastardize the source material. Like Hemingway said about author's involvements in adaptations of their work, "take the money and run". That does not mean they are all bastardized versions. Just that they stand on a class of their own. Regarding Bond movies, I consider them from different fruits from the same tree. I may add that the best ones are the ones closer to the source material.

    And if a continuation novel can be of good quality, then fine. I am skeptical however about the quality of continuations to begin with. Ian Fleming wrote James Bond. Forgive me if I am naive enough to think he understood his character and universe better than anybody else. Maybe understood is not the right word. His instinct was better on the subject than anybody else? I like Horowitz's title so far and some of his ideas are at least interesting. And I have no doubt he genuinely loves Bond. So this one I might actually purchase.
  • Agent007391Agent007391 Up, Up, Down, Down, Left, Right, Left, Right, B, A, Start
    Posts: 7,854
    Ludovico wrote: »
    It is the nature of movies or any kind of adaptations to potentially bastardize the source material. Like Hemingway said about author's involvements in adaptations of their work, "take the money and run". That does not mean they are all bastardized versions. Just that they stand on a class of their own. Regarding Bond movies, I consider them from different fruits from the same tree. I may add that the best ones are the ones closer to the source material.

    And if a continuation novel can be of good quality, then fine. I am skeptical however about the quality of continuations to begin with. Ian Fleming wrote James Bond. Forgive me if I am naive enough to think he understood his character and universe better than anybody else. Maybe understood is not the right word. His instinct was better on the subject than anybody else? I like Horowitz's title so far and some of his ideas are at least interesting. And I have no doubt he genuinely loves Bond. So this one I might actually purchase.

    It's not really the nature of an adaptation to bastardize the source material. The nature of the adaptation is to present the source material in a different medium, or pay homage to the source material.

    And no one's calling you naive for feeling that Fleming understood his character more than anyone, but you are at least implying that no one else can even understand the character enough to write a good story, and are writing off the continuations solely on the fact that they are continuations, as opposed to judging them on their own merits.
  • Posts: 15,124
    That's what I said potentially. There is always a risk of adapting from a source material into another medium.

    And don't worry, I will judge any book on its merit. I even praise on these forums Christopher Wood on his novelization of TSWLM for having a prose that was somewhat Flemingesque and for injecting some Fleming tone and sensibilities to a story that was so foreign to the source material.

    But I will say that in general (NOT ALWAYS) continuations are poor copies of the original material. I also find more commendable a writer who inspired himself from Fleming using his own original creations.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    I still and wish these were modern day adventures ..even Fleming updated his timeline.
  • Posts: 4,622
    mcdonbb wrote: »
    I still and wish these were modern day adventures ..even Fleming updated his timeline.

    I would prefer Bond in the present context too, Deaver not withstanding.
  • edited May 2015 Posts: 15,124
    timmer wrote: »
    mcdonbb wrote: »
    I still and wish these were modern day adventures ..even Fleming updated his timeline.

    I would prefer Bond in the present context too, Deaver not withstanding.

    There is a problem with either approach: Ian Fleming conceived James Bond as a contemporary character, that said if one wants to be close and as faithful as possible to Fleming's Bond he would need to have him live in the time when his original adventures were written... a time Fleming knew well and found his inspiration from. In the meantime, we are not Fleming's contemporaries and neither are the authors of continuations. There is a dimension of temporal exoticism that is added if one decides to write a Bond story as a period piece. Something of course foreign to the original novels, which are contemporary to their author.

    And, on a side note, people advocating for Bond novels to be adapted as period pieces (in the series or as TV films) often forget this: because we are not from the time, we have an extra distance between the source material and us. Bond would not only be spy fiction but also pseudo-historical fiction.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    Agreed ...very well stated ...and ditto on Deaver.

    I never finished reading Carte Blanche.


  • Posts: 686
    Here is the description of the novel and my thoughts:

    The world's most famous spy, James Bond b]Bond is not a spy- K. Amis[/b, has just returned victorious from his showdown with Auric Goldfinger in Fort Knox. By his side is the glamorous and streetwise Pussy Galore, who played no small part in his success. As they settle down in London b]This sounds like what Tiffany Case did after DAF[/b, the odds of Galore taming the debonair bachelor seem slim—but she herself is a creature not so easily caught.

    Meanwhile, the struggle for superiority between the Soviet Union and the West is escalating. In an attempt to demonstrate Soviet strength, SMERSH plans to sabotage an international Grand Prix in the hot zone of West Germany. At the Nürburgring Racing Circuit, Bond must play a high-speed game of cat and mouse to stop them, but when he observes a secretive meeting between SMERSH's driver and a notorious Korean millionaire [ Hugo Drax or did he become a millionaire like ESB?]it becomes clear that this is just the infamous organization's opening move.

    An orphan of the Korean War, he has a personal reason for wanting to bring America to its knees. [this takes place in 1958, how old is this kid 17, 13?] He's helping SMERSH decisively end the white-hot space race—but how? With the help of an American female agent b]Why? To assuage guilt and to please the PC gods?] [/b], Bond uncovers a plan that leads first to Florida and then to New York City, where a heart-stopping face-off will determine the fate of the West. [[b]Thunderball?[/b

    This thriller has all the hallmarks of an original Ian Fleming adventure and features welcome familiar faces, including M and Miss Moneypenny. Horowitz delivers a smooth and seductive narrative of fast cars and beautiful women [Do we get the sex like we got in Col Sun and gambling and does Bond smoke ?], ruthless villains and breathtaking plot that will leave readers hanging until the very end.

    It sounds dicey but it may work. Fingers are crossed.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    From the description it sounds much better than DMC, CB and Solo, to me.

    I can't wait!
  • Posts: 15,124
    Sounds very much like heavily recycled Hugo Drax and Goldfinger for the villain.
  • edited May 2015 Posts: 4,622
    I'd be happy with more Bond in the present time novels.
    I did like theGardner novels. Bensons novels could get a little too homagy, but they were still readable Bond modern adventures.
    Deavers 2011 book was bad because he had such a dickish approach to the character.
    What Horowitz is doing is not new. We've seen this before with both Pearson and Weinberg, who both inserted fresh Bond into the Fleming timeline and I think did a decent job, so the idea can work with good writers.
    However there is only so much room to work with, squeezing inbetween the Fleming stories.
    I'd like to see another good writer like Gardner pick up Bond in the now, and away we go.

    ==I do like the description for the new book.
    It does hold promise. Still curious as to how AH plans to deal with the no small matter of Pussy avoiding incarceration.
    Bond could vouch for her maybe, and get some sort of deal for her.
    That's quite possible, although it does seem that Fleming had her on her way to a stay in the klink.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    Walecs wrote: »
    From the description it sounds much better than DMC, CB and Solo, to me.

    I can't wait!

    That isn't saying much, though. I'm not a fan of Goldfinger, so i'm not overjoyed with the connections. But I will be adding Trigger Mortis to my collection, however it turns out.
  • edited May 2015 Posts: 15,124
    timmer wrote: »
    I'd be happy with more Bond in the present time novels.
    I did like theGardner novels. Bensons novels could get a little too homagy, but they were still readable Bond modern adventures.
    Deavers 2011 book was bad because he had such a dickish approach to the character.
    What Horowitz is doing is not new. We've seen this before with both Pearson and Weinberg, who both inserted fresh Bond into the Fleming timeline and I think did a decent job, so the idea can work with good writers.
    However there is only so much room to work with, squeezing inbetween the Fleming stories.
    I'd like to see another good writer like Gardner pick up Bond in the now, and away we go.

    ==I do like the description for the new book.
    It does hold promise. Still curious as to how AH plans to deal with the no small matter of Pussy avoiding incarceration.
    Bond could vouch for her maybe, and get some sort of deal for her.
    That's quite possible, although it does seem that Fleming had her on her way to a stay in the klink.

    There is a good period of time between CR and LALD that is unaccounted for: in LALD Bond says he's been through many adventures with Felix Leiter. There has to be some mission we don't know about inbetween both novels.
  • Posts: 4,622
    I guess with creative license and study of the timeline there is room to squeeze in all sorts of stuff, but my preference is a set of new books in the now.
    I did enjoy the 14 volume set of fresh Gardner adventures.

  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    edited May 2015 Posts: 4,399
    trigger-mortis-covers-450x324_zpsjsxwp7ee.jpg

    not sure how i feel about both covers.. with the exception of the UK cover for Devil May Care, i feel like all the covers for the recent Bond novels since have been fairly mediocre or terrible (both US and UK versions) - and Trigger Mortis is no exception... but if i had to choose between the two, I would probably take the UK version over the US.. the US cover looks like someone raided a stock photo website and just crammed it all together into a messy generic collage - hence, if you removed the title of the book, there is nothing there that would tell you anything of what the story is about - it's just generic Bondian looking images thrown together in something i would best describe as looking very "fan art"... you could interchange that cover with any other previous Bond novel and it wouldn't matter...... while the UK cover is kind of bland as well, it still uses images of rockets, or schematics of rockets, which harkens to the book's plot about the US and Soviet space race..

    all things considered though, both covers are still better than the US covers for Carte Blanche and Solo..... *shudders* eww, both were hideous.
  • edited May 2015 Posts: 4,622
    I like the blue cover better.
    Sure it's clichéd, but I don't mind.
    Girls, martinis etc I find more appealing than rocket schematics.
    Can't go wrong with girls and guns IMO, or maybe for this book, girls posing about on rockets and race cars.
    Maybe for the paperback.
    That's the only reason I would buy the pb later...if I liked the cover.
  • Posts: 15,124
    timmer wrote: »
    I guess with creative license and study of the timeline there is room to squeeze in all sorts of stuff, but my preference is a set of new books in the now.
    I did enjoy the 14 volume set of fresh Gardner adventures.

    In that case though it's a clear gap.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Personally I found Benson's books superior to any successor Fleming had.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    I liked the first couple of Benson novels, but then ( only my opinion)
    The quality dropped quickly, The same with J Gardner's books fine
    Up until No Deals ..... , then got a bit rubbish.
    Didn't mind DMC or Carte Blanche but I hated Solo. Although my hopes
    Are high for Trigger Mortis, Horowitz is a good solid writer.
  • edited June 2015 Posts: 4,622
    Ludovico wrote: »
    timmer wrote: »
    I guess with creative license and study of the timeline there is room to squeeze in all sorts of stuff, but my preference is a set of new books in the now.
    I did enjoy the 14 volume set of fresh Gardner adventures.

    In that case though it's a clear gap.
    Of course it is, so is everything else but for Pearson and Weinberg and now Horowitz.
    The first Gardner book, like Amis, Pearson, Higgins,Weinberg, Faulks, and Boyd, did start off with Bond in real time ie Fleming timeline circa 1981, with Bond still in his '50s hence first book title License Renewed, but as he went along, realizing he had a series, he gave up on the real-timeline idea very quick ( by book 2 I think) and Bond quietly morphed back to 00 agent of indeterminate age.
    In fact it seems he got younger, and settled back to proper 00 age. :)

    Good set of books. I am planning on ploughing through them again soon, followed by the 6 Bensons.

    Most of what's come out since, has been meh.
    Gardner and Benson at least got a flow going with the character doing his thing, in the now context.
    DMC and Solo, I found readable at least
    Adequate efforts, even if Faulks effort seemed a little lazy.
    Deaver's book though was an abomination.


    No one will ever write Bond like Fleming, because they'd have to bring all his quirky and provocative attitudes along too, and most writers would be too chickenshit (eg. deaver=the anti-fleming)

    Fleming was unique. Great writer! Entertaining as hell.

    But Gardner and Benson did do decent enough Bond adventures I thought.

    Maybe Horowitz can end the dry spell.

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