Who should/could be a Bond actor?

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  • Posts: 939
    Maybe a working class background makes you more humble. I don't know if that matters in acting. My best idea is to see where we are in a year or so.
  • sandbagger1sandbagger1 Sussex
    Posts: 942
    According to Wikipedia, Turner (Callum that is), grew up in Chelsea…?
    A council estate in Chelsea.

  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    Aidan Turner was born in a working class area of Dublin as well, and worked as an electrician into his twenties.
  • Posts: 939
    Aidan Turner was born in a working class area of Dublin as well, and worked as an electrician into his twenties.

    And he has that mysterious look that no one else seems to have.
  • edited July 2020 Posts: 17,756
    Why is the class background of the actor important? Or said another way: Does Bond have to be portrayed by somebody with a working class background?

    Leaving aside the Sheen quote and whether or not working class lads should get more opportunities (they should), how does this pertain to Bond? I never read him as a working class guy. Quite the opposite. He went to Eton and Fettes and grew up around continental Europe learning languages and skiing. He has quite expensive tastes and is at home in high stakes gambling.

    Now I agree that I wouldn't want him to be portrayed as an upperclass twit, but where does the working class thing come from?

    I don't think anyone mentioned the class background of an actor as important. It was just a discussion leading from @FatherValentine's "Cubby approach" comment.
    mtm wrote: »

    Background shouldn't matter really, but I think it's interesting that a character like Bond has been played mainly (?) by working class actors.

    Yes that is quite interesting, I've never really considered that. I think it's more a reflection of the acting profession at the time rather than a requirement of the role, but it shows there's no need to get a genuine posh lad playing him.
    Fleming wanted Cary Grant, didn't he? And we all know he was born to factory workers in Bristol.

    Although as I say, I don't know a huge amount about Dalton or Craig. Dalton was half American wasn't he?

    It's quite funny how four of the Bonds all ended up as Americans! And we technically have our first American James Bond right now.

    Yes, it might be several factors at play, and probably a few coincidences too. But it's acting though, you can play anything or anyone, as long as you do it convincingly.

    I think Dalton's mother was American?

    Never though about the fact that four of the actors are now living outside the UK. Might be more practical to live in the US (for the high-paid Hollywood roles etc.) than in the UK?
    According to Wikipedia, Turner (Callum that is), grew up in Chelsea…?
    A council estate in Chelsea.

    Ah, OK. I've always associated Chelsea as a place for the wealthy.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited July 2020 Posts: 5,131

    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Moore was working class? Didn't he go to grammar school?

    Roger Moore was from a working class background, but had the persona of a posh boy throughout his career.

    He’s hardly tough or rough anyhow. He played the toff in real life.

    The character of Bond is supposed to be from money, privilege and public school. Not some Council house resident who ‘dragged himself up’.

    Who said it was supposed to be someone from a council house? The idea is, taken from the original casting decision to use Connery, that it is easier and more convincing for someone playing Bond to be masculine and rough around the edges and to make them appear more privileged, than it is to take a fey upper class boy and to make them appear hard.

    But just because one is from a rough or poor background. Why does this make them tougher/ more ruthless in a military sense.

    A good actor is a good actor. Especially in modern cinema. Personal life outside of acting is irrelevant (as long as it’s not not illegal or immoral). Unless the actor is unconvincing in general.





    I was referring only to Cubby and Harry's reasoning for casting Connery. Nobody mentioned poor people or those from a rough background. It was the idea of a rough diamond type. Like Connery. Like Craig. Like Lazenby. Hardy and Fassbender would fall into this type (not saying that they are viable candidates any more).

    Back to Hiddleston. I think he's a dreadful choice for this reason.


    Each to their own.

    I think Hiddleston is a great choice because he is a posh public school toff. This is because this fits the mould of Fleming’s character who isn’t a rough diamond.

    I don't see Bond as a toff at all: if you read the books he's an outsider. He got chucked out of Eton, he wasn't part of the toff set.
    Personally I'd get a good actor who's able to play vaguely gentlemanly and tough, rather than get one who is posh and can only play posh and who can't be convincingly tough.
    I have no idea of Craig or Dalton's backgrounds but they both seem able to play smooth and classy because they're good actors.

    At least the other suggestions (the Turners, Cavill etc.) I could see winning a fight.

    The character is from privilege. Perhaps ‘toff’ is an exaggeration on my part.

    Hiddleston was convincingly tough in The Night Manager.

    I don't think so at all, no. I could believe he worked in a hotel, he was fine at that. He's believable at fey prissiness.

    As approximately none of the actors to play Bond up until now have been public school toffs or from privileged backgrounds -and many of them have been quite popular- I don't see how it's much of a benefit to be one to play him. Just get an actor to pretend.

    You don’t think he’s suitable. Fine.

    But the press hyped him up as a Bond candidate based on The Night Manager. His character background in that was ex military.

    The ‘fey prissiness’ isn’t something the press or critics mentioned. Many saw a Bond candidate. You don’t...... It’s all opinion.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited July 2020 Posts: 16,383
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Moore was working class? Didn't he go to grammar school?

    Roger Moore was from a working class background, but had the persona of a posh boy throughout his career.

    He’s hardly tough or rough anyhow. He played the toff in real life.

    The character of Bond is supposed to be from money, privilege and public school. Not some Council house resident who ‘dragged himself up’.

    Who said it was supposed to be someone from a council house? The idea is, taken from the original casting decision to use Connery, that it is easier and more convincing for someone playing Bond to be masculine and rough around the edges and to make them appear more privileged, than it is to take a fey upper class boy and to make them appear hard.

    But just because one is from a rough or poor background. Why does this make them tougher/ more ruthless in a military sense.

    A good actor is a good actor. Especially in modern cinema. Personal life outside of acting is irrelevant (as long as it’s not not illegal or immoral). Unless the actor is unconvincing in general.





    I was referring only to Cubby and Harry's reasoning for casting Connery. Nobody mentioned poor people or those from a rough background. It was the idea of a rough diamond type. Like Connery. Like Craig. Like Lazenby. Hardy and Fassbender would fall into this type (not saying that they are viable candidates any more).

    Back to Hiddleston. I think he's a dreadful choice for this reason.


    Each to their own.

    I think Hiddleston is a great choice because he is a posh public school toff. This is because this fits the mould of Fleming’s character who isn’t a rough diamond.

    I don't see Bond as a toff at all: if you read the books he's an outsider. He got chucked out of Eton, he wasn't part of the toff set.
    Personally I'd get a good actor who's able to play vaguely gentlemanly and tough, rather than get one who is posh and can only play posh and who can't be convincingly tough.
    I have no idea of Craig or Dalton's backgrounds but they both seem able to play smooth and classy because they're good actors.

    At least the other suggestions (the Turners, Cavill etc.) I could see winning a fight.

    The character is from privilege. Perhaps ‘toff’ is an exaggeration on my part.

    Hiddleston was convincingly tough in The Night Manager.

    I don't think so at all, no. I could believe he worked in a hotel, he was fine at that. He's believable at fey prissiness.

    As approximately none of the actors to play Bond up until now have been public school toffs or from privileged backgrounds -and many of them have been quite popular- I don't see how it's much of a benefit to be one to play him. Just get an actor to pretend.

    You don’t think he’s suitable. Fine.

    But the press hyped him up as a Bond candidate based on The Night Manager. His character background in that was ex military.

    The ‘fey prissiness’ isn’t something the press or critics mentioned. Many saw a Bond candidate. You don’t...... It’s all opinion.

    I know it's an opinion, that's why I phrased it as an opinion ("I don't think so at all, no"), whereas you phrased your opinions as fact ("Hiddleston was convincingly tough"). But trying to say that 'many' saw it is an attempt to devalue my opinion, and that of those who have agreed on this thread, as that of the minority, which is rather tiresome. You'd probably call it trolling.

    Also, your reporting skills are in doubt after thinking Roger Moore saying he didn't say something meant the opposite! :D

    A couple of lazy journos might have seen a TV show which had the same plot as Licence To Kill and decided to fill a couple of hundred words with more 'this guy should be Bond' rubbish without really thinking about it- what does that prove? They do that with every guy they see in a dinner suit. See James Norton. That's if you even read the articles right- they probably said he wasn't suitable! :D
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited July 2020 Posts: 5,131
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Moore was working class? Didn't he go to grammar school?

    Roger Moore was from a working class background, but had the persona of a posh boy throughout his career.

    He’s hardly tough or rough anyhow. He played the toff in real life.

    The character of Bond is supposed to be from money, privilege and public school. Not some Council house resident who ‘dragged himself up’.

    Who said it was supposed to be someone from a council house? The idea is, taken from the original casting decision to use Connery, that it is easier and more convincing for someone playing Bond to be masculine and rough around the edges and to make them appear more privileged, than it is to take a fey upper class boy and to make them appear hard.

    But just because one is from a rough or poor background. Why does this make them tougher/ more ruthless in a military sense.

    A good actor is a good actor. Especially in modern cinema. Personal life outside of acting is irrelevant (as long as it’s not not illegal or immoral). Unless the actor is unconvincing in general.





    I was referring only to Cubby and Harry's reasoning for casting Connery. Nobody mentioned poor people or those from a rough background. It was the idea of a rough diamond type. Like Connery. Like Craig. Like Lazenby. Hardy and Fassbender would fall into this type (not saying that they are viable candidates any more).

    Back to Hiddleston. I think he's a dreadful choice for this reason.


    Each to their own.

    I think Hiddleston is a great choice because he is a posh public school toff. This is because this fits the mould of Fleming’s character who isn’t a rough diamond.

    I don't see Bond as a toff at all: if you read the books he's an outsider. He got chucked out of Eton, he wasn't part of the toff set.
    Personally I'd get a good actor who's able to play vaguely gentlemanly and tough, rather than get one who is posh and can only play posh and who can't be convincingly tough.
    I have no idea of Craig or Dalton's backgrounds but they both seem able to play smooth and classy because they're good actors.

    At least the other suggestions (the Turners, Cavill etc.) I could see winning a fight.

    The character is from privilege. Perhaps ‘toff’ is an exaggeration on my part.

    Hiddleston was convincingly tough in The Night Manager.

    I don't think so at all, no. I could believe he worked in a hotel, he was fine at that. He's believable at fey prissiness.

    As approximately none of the actors to play Bond up until now have been public school toffs or from privileged backgrounds -and many of them have been quite popular- I don't see how it's much of a benefit to be one to play him. Just get an actor to pretend.

    You don’t think he’s suitable. Fine.

    But the press hyped him up as a Bond candidate based on The Night Manager. His character background in that was ex military.

    The ‘fey prissiness’ isn’t something the press or critics mentioned. Many saw a Bond candidate. You don’t...... It’s all opinion.

    I know it's an opinion, that's why I phrased it as an opinion ("I don't think so at all, no"), whereas you phrased your opinions as fact ("Hiddleston was convincingly tough"). But trying to say that 'many' saw it is an attempt to devalue my opinion, and that of those who have agreed on this thread, as that of the minority, which is rather tiresome. You'd probably call it trolling.

    Also, your reporting skills are in doubt after thinking Roger Moore saying he didn't say something meant the opposite! :D

    A couple of lazy journos might have seen a TV show which had the same plot as Licence To Kill and decided to fill a couple of hundred words with more 'this guy should be Bond' rubbish without really thinking about it- what does that prove? They do that with every guy they see in a dinner suit. See James Norton. That's if you even read the articles right- they probably said he wasn't suitable! :D

    You said; “He’s believable at fey prissiness”. Sounds like a statement to me. 🤣

    Anyway, I’m hoping for another season of ‘The Night Manager’ which is apparently in production.

    Agreed, it does have a similar plot to LTK....probably why I liked it so much.
  • edited July 2020 Posts: 16,163
    I'm still not 100% sold on anyone to replace Craig. I'd have to force myself to have an open mind to visualize Hiddleston in the role. He might be okay, but, not so sure.
    Same with Cavill, Tom Hardy, James Norton, etc.

    I'd almost rather Eon not recast Bond and just do a LEGO Bond adaptation next time over some of the potential Bonds mentioned.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    According to Wikipedia, Turner (Callum that is), grew up in Chelsea…?
    A council estate in Chelsea.

    If his parents did ‘right to buy’ in the 70’s/ 80’s they’ll have resold for a fortune now!!

    I must say....I’m not convinced by him as a Bond. But he plays ‘upper class’ very well!!
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Aidan Turner was born in a working class area of Dublin as well, and worked as an electrician into his twenties.

    Shocking.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Aidan Turner was born in a working class area of Dublin as well, and worked as an electrician into his twenties.

    Shocking.

    He’s rich now though. If he lands Bond he can retire afterwards.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    Posts: 5,970
    suavejmf wrote: »
    According to Wikipedia, Turner (Callum that is), grew up in Chelsea…?
    A council estate in Chelsea.
    I must say....I’m not convinced by him as a Bond. But he plays ‘upper class’ very well!!
    I just think an actor with his duality is perfect for a role like this :)

    1-1582749829.jpg?resize=768:*

  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited July 2020 Posts: 16,383
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Moore was working class? Didn't he go to grammar school?

    Roger Moore was from a working class background, but had the persona of a posh boy throughout his career.

    He’s hardly tough or rough anyhow. He played the toff in real life.

    The character of Bond is supposed to be from money, privilege and public school. Not some Council house resident who ‘dragged himself up’.

    Who said it was supposed to be someone from a council house? The idea is, taken from the original casting decision to use Connery, that it is easier and more convincing for someone playing Bond to be masculine and rough around the edges and to make them appear more privileged, than it is to take a fey upper class boy and to make them appear hard.

    But just because one is from a rough or poor background. Why does this make them tougher/ more ruthless in a military sense.

    A good actor is a good actor. Especially in modern cinema. Personal life outside of acting is irrelevant (as long as it’s not not illegal or immoral). Unless the actor is unconvincing in general.





    I was referring only to Cubby and Harry's reasoning for casting Connery. Nobody mentioned poor people or those from a rough background. It was the idea of a rough diamond type. Like Connery. Like Craig. Like Lazenby. Hardy and Fassbender would fall into this type (not saying that they are viable candidates any more).

    Back to Hiddleston. I think he's a dreadful choice for this reason.


    Each to their own.

    I think Hiddleston is a great choice because he is a posh public school toff. This is because this fits the mould of Fleming’s character who isn’t a rough diamond.

    I don't see Bond as a toff at all: if you read the books he's an outsider. He got chucked out of Eton, he wasn't part of the toff set.
    Personally I'd get a good actor who's able to play vaguely gentlemanly and tough, rather than get one who is posh and can only play posh and who can't be convincingly tough.
    I have no idea of Craig or Dalton's backgrounds but they both seem able to play smooth and classy because they're good actors.

    At least the other suggestions (the Turners, Cavill etc.) I could see winning a fight.

    The character is from privilege. Perhaps ‘toff’ is an exaggeration on my part.

    Hiddleston was convincingly tough in The Night Manager.

    I don't think so at all, no. I could believe he worked in a hotel, he was fine at that. He's believable at fey prissiness.

    As approximately none of the actors to play Bond up until now have been public school toffs or from privileged backgrounds -and many of them have been quite popular- I don't see how it's much of a benefit to be one to play him. Just get an actor to pretend.

    You don’t think he’s suitable. Fine.

    But the press hyped him up as a Bond candidate based on The Night Manager. His character background in that was ex military.

    The ‘fey prissiness’ isn’t something the press or critics mentioned. Many saw a Bond candidate. You don’t...... It’s all opinion.

    I know it's an opinion, that's why I phrased it as an opinion ("I don't think so at all, no"), whereas you phrased your opinions as fact ("Hiddleston was convincingly tough"). But trying to say that 'many' saw it is an attempt to devalue my opinion, and that of those who have agreed on this thread, as that of the minority, which is rather tiresome. You'd probably call it trolling.

    Also, your reporting skills are in doubt after thinking Roger Moore saying he didn't say something meant the opposite! :D

    A couple of lazy journos might have seen a TV show which had the same plot as Licence To Kill and decided to fill a couple of hundred words with more 'this guy should be Bond' rubbish without really thinking about it- what does that prove? They do that with every guy they see in a dinner suit. See James Norton. That's if you even read the articles right- they probably said he wasn't suitable! :D

    You said; “He’s believable at fey prissiness”. Sounds like a statement to me. 🤣

    It probably does when taken out of context from the sentence it followed on from, which began with 'I could believe'. You're not very good at this.
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Anyway, I’m hoping for another season of ‘The Night Manager’ which is apparently in production.

    I think 'Little Drummer Girl' was the follow up, I wouldn't expect a direct sequel.

    The only person from Night Manager I think we're likely to see in a Bond film is Olivia Coleman.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    Aidan Turner was born in a working class area of Dublin as well, and worked as an electrician into his twenties.

    Shocking.

    I can't speak to his skills as an electrician, so I don't know if it was.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,383
    Ha! :D
  • edited July 2020 Posts: 2,917
    mtm wrote: »
    Fleming wanted Cary Grant, didn't he? And we all know he was born to factory workers in Bristol.

    That is true. And Fleming's first recorded choice for Bond was Richard Burton, the son of a coal miner and barmaid.

    Fleming's Bond comes from a well-off background but not an aristocratic or very wealthy one, and the character has little to do with conventional upper class English social life. On a rare visit to Blades we're told "Bond knew that there was something alien and un-English about himself. He knew that he was a difficult man to cover up. Particularly in England."

    Casting actors from working class backgrounds to play Bond is a way of acknowledging that Bond doesn't quite fit in a stereotypical upper-class world. He moves through such worlds, but he also stands somewhat apart from the class system, in the way a working-class actor who successfully plays upper-class parts does.

    Additionally, Fleming wanted his English/British gentleman hero to have the toughness of a Hammett/Chandler hero. Casting an actor from working class backgrounds is a way of helping Bond retain an element of toughness--a down-to-earth quality--and avoid coming across as too effete or privileged.

    Lastly, it has often been the case that working class actors who became stars--like Cary Grant, Sean Connery and Roger Moore--ended up portraying a version of upper-classness that seemed more suave and classy than the real thing.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited July 2020 Posts: 5,131
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Moore was working class? Didn't he go to grammar school?

    Roger Moore was from a working class background, but had the persona of a posh boy throughout his career.

    He’s hardly tough or rough anyhow. He played the toff in real life.

    The character of Bond is supposed to be from money, privilege and public school. Not some Council house resident who ‘dragged himself up’.

    Who said it was supposed to be someone from a council house? The idea is, taken from the original casting decision to use Connery, that it is easier and more convincing for someone playing Bond to be masculine and rough around the edges and to make them appear more privileged, than it is to take a fey upper class boy and to make them appear hard.

    But just because one is from a rough or poor background. Why does this make them tougher/ more ruthless in a military sense.

    A good actor is a good actor. Especially in modern cinema. Personal life outside of acting is irrelevant (as long as it’s not not illegal or immoral). Unless the actor is unconvincing in general.





    I was referring only to Cubby and Harry's reasoning for casting Connery. Nobody mentioned poor people or those from a rough background. It was the idea of a rough diamond type. Like Connery. Like Craig. Like Lazenby. Hardy and Fassbender would fall into this type (not saying that they are viable candidates any more).

    Back to Hiddleston. I think he's a dreadful choice for this reason.


    Each to their own.

    I think Hiddleston is a great choice because he is a posh public school toff. This is because this fits the mould of Fleming’s character who isn’t a rough diamond.

    I don't see Bond as a toff at all: if you read the books he's an outsider. He got chucked out of Eton, he wasn't part of the toff set.
    Personally I'd get a good actor who's able to play vaguely gentlemanly and tough, rather than get one who is posh and can only play posh and who can't be convincingly tough.
    I have no idea of Craig or Dalton's backgrounds but they both seem able to play smooth and classy because they're good actors.

    At least the other suggestions (the Turners, Cavill etc.) I could see winning a fight.

    The character is from privilege. Perhaps ‘toff’ is an exaggeration on my part.

    Hiddleston was convincingly tough in The Night Manager.

    I don't think so at all, no. I could believe he worked in a hotel, he was fine at that. He's believable at fey prissiness.

    As approximately none of the actors to play Bond up until now have been public school toffs or from privileged backgrounds -and many of them have been quite popular- I don't see how it's much of a benefit to be one to play him. Just get an actor to pretend.

    You don’t think he’s suitable. Fine.

    But the press hyped him up as a Bond candidate based on The Night Manager. His character background in that was ex military.

    The ‘fey prissiness’ isn’t something the press or critics mentioned. Many saw a Bond candidate. You don’t...... It’s all opinion.

    I know it's an opinion, that's why I phrased it as an opinion ("I don't think so at all, no"), whereas you phrased your opinions as fact ("Hiddleston was convincingly tough"). But trying to say that 'many' saw it is an attempt to devalue my opinion, and that of those who have agreed on this thread, as that of the minority, which is rather tiresome. You'd probably call it trolling.

    Also, your reporting skills are in doubt after thinking Roger Moore saying he didn't say something meant the opposite! :D

    A couple of lazy journos might have seen a TV show which had the same plot as Licence To Kill and decided to fill a couple of hundred words with more 'this guy should be Bond' rubbish without really thinking about it- what does that prove? They do that with every guy they see in a dinner suit. See James Norton. That's if you even read the articles right- they probably said he wasn't suitable! :D

    You said; “He’s believable at fey prissiness”. Sounds like a statement to me. 🤣

    It probably does when taken out of context from the sentence it followed on from, which began with 'I could believe'. You're not very good at this.
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Anyway, I’m hoping for another season of ‘The Night Manager’ which is apparently in production.

    I think 'Little Drummer Girl' was the follow up, I wouldn't expect a direct sequel.

    The only person from Night Manager I think we're likely to see in a Bond film is Olivia Coleman.

    Yeah sure...now it’s out of context to suit the current rant. 🤔🤣😂

    I must say, the punctuation and grammar in your posts is vastly improving though....well done mate. 👍👏

    Anyhow....Hiddleston for Bond.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Denbigh wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    According to Wikipedia, Turner (Callum that is), grew up in Chelsea…?
    A council estate in Chelsea.
    I must say....I’m not convinced by him as a Bond. But he plays ‘upper class’ very well!!
    I just think an actor with his duality is perfect for a role like this :)

    1-1582749829.jpg?resize=768:*

    I haven’t seen him in enough to comment either way TBH, with regards to Bond. I’ll watch out for him though.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    edited July 2020 Posts: 4,247
    Word Back in 2006 was, Craig watched Connery's Bond and read the Books to prepare for the role. But surely Craig must have watched DAD intensely....obviously not for direct inspiration, but to see the different route he wanted to take the franchise. We also hope Bond 7 finds good inspiration too.

    I think Connery, Lazenby, Moore and Dalton were the bonds who didn't take inspiration from each other, as they were so different. We can find a bit of Connery and Moore in Brosnan's Bond and we can also find Connery and especially Dalton in Craig's Bond....Maybe a bit of the 'Everyday Man' Lazenby too. I guess we'll see how Bond 7 goes about his own inspiration.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited July 2020 Posts: 16,383
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Moore was working class? Didn't he go to grammar school?

    Roger Moore was from a working class background, but had the persona of a posh boy throughout his career.

    He’s hardly tough or rough anyhow. He played the toff in real life.

    The character of Bond is supposed to be from money, privilege and public school. Not some Council house resident who ‘dragged himself up’.

    Who said it was supposed to be someone from a council house? The idea is, taken from the original casting decision to use Connery, that it is easier and more convincing for someone playing Bond to be masculine and rough around the edges and to make them appear more privileged, than it is to take a fey upper class boy and to make them appear hard.

    But just because one is from a rough or poor background. Why does this make them tougher/ more ruthless in a military sense.

    A good actor is a good actor. Especially in modern cinema. Personal life outside of acting is irrelevant (as long as it’s not not illegal or immoral). Unless the actor is unconvincing in general.





    I was referring only to Cubby and Harry's reasoning for casting Connery. Nobody mentioned poor people or those from a rough background. It was the idea of a rough diamond type. Like Connery. Like Craig. Like Lazenby. Hardy and Fassbender would fall into this type (not saying that they are viable candidates any more).

    Back to Hiddleston. I think he's a dreadful choice for this reason.


    Each to their own.

    I think Hiddleston is a great choice because he is a posh public school toff. This is because this fits the mould of Fleming’s character who isn’t a rough diamond.

    I don't see Bond as a toff at all: if you read the books he's an outsider. He got chucked out of Eton, he wasn't part of the toff set.
    Personally I'd get a good actor who's able to play vaguely gentlemanly and tough, rather than get one who is posh and can only play posh and who can't be convincingly tough.
    I have no idea of Craig or Dalton's backgrounds but they both seem able to play smooth and classy because they're good actors.

    At least the other suggestions (the Turners, Cavill etc.) I could see winning a fight.

    The character is from privilege. Perhaps ‘toff’ is an exaggeration on my part.

    Hiddleston was convincingly tough in The Night Manager.

    I don't think so at all, no. I could believe he worked in a hotel, he was fine at that. He's believable at fey prissiness.

    As approximately none of the actors to play Bond up until now have been public school toffs or from privileged backgrounds -and many of them have been quite popular- I don't see how it's much of a benefit to be one to play him. Just get an actor to pretend.

    You don’t think he’s suitable. Fine.

    But the press hyped him up as a Bond candidate based on The Night Manager. His character background in that was ex military.

    The ‘fey prissiness’ isn’t something the press or critics mentioned. Many saw a Bond candidate. You don’t...... It’s all opinion.

    I know it's an opinion, that's why I phrased it as an opinion ("I don't think so at all, no"), whereas you phrased your opinions as fact ("Hiddleston was convincingly tough"). But trying to say that 'many' saw it is an attempt to devalue my opinion, and that of those who have agreed on this thread, as that of the minority, which is rather tiresome. You'd probably call it trolling.

    Also, your reporting skills are in doubt after thinking Roger Moore saying he didn't say something meant the opposite! :D

    A couple of lazy journos might have seen a TV show which had the same plot as Licence To Kill and decided to fill a couple of hundred words with more 'this guy should be Bond' rubbish without really thinking about it- what does that prove? They do that with every guy they see in a dinner suit. See James Norton. That's if you even read the articles right- they probably said he wasn't suitable! :D

    You said; “He’s believable at fey prissiness”. Sounds like a statement to me. 🤣

    It probably does when taken out of context from the sentence it followed on from, which began with 'I could believe'. You're not very good at this.
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Anyway, I’m hoping for another season of ‘The Night Manager’ which is apparently in production.

    I think 'Little Drummer Girl' was the follow up, I wouldn't expect a direct sequel.

    The only person from Night Manager I think we're likely to see in a Bond film is Olivia Coleman.

    Yeah sure...now it’s out of context to suit the current rant. 🤔🤣😂

    It's just simple reading and comprehension. 'Out of context' means you take things away from their surroundings and in doing so make them no longer fully understandable e.g. 'Roger Moore was reported to have said a racist comment but explained his quote had been taken out of context'. You'll get there with practice, I'm sure.
    But the main point is to not dismiss others' words as 'opinion' when you keep stating yours as nothing but fact.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited July 2020 Posts: 16,383
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Word Back in 2006 was, Craig watched Connery's Bond and read the Books to prepare for the role. But surely Craig must have watched DAD intensely....obviously not for direct inspiration, but to see the different route he wanted to take the franchise. We also hope Bond 7 finds good inspiration too.

    I think Connery, Lazenby, Moore and Dalton were the bonds who didn't take inspiration from each other, as they were so different. We can find a bit of Connery and Moore in Brosnan's Bond and we can also find Connery and especially Dalton in Craig's Bond....Maybe a bit of the 'Everyday Man' Lazenby too. I guess we'll see how Bond 7 goes about his own inspiration.

    Yeah I think Brosnan has always maintained that he's never watched Dalton's films (or Living Daylights at least) because losing the role wasn't a good experience for him. He did say in that GoldenEye watchalong that he was sort of consciously going for a Connery/Moore middle ground, which I thought was quite an interesting admission.

    You'd imagine the others would have all caught each others' work at some point, if out of curiosity than anything else. I think Lazenby would have certainly taken inspiration from Connery because he wasn't an experienced actor and there wasn't really any other known way to play Bond at that time.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited July 2020 Posts: 16,383
    Revelator wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    Fleming wanted Cary Grant, didn't he? And we all know he was born to factory workers in Bristol.

    That is true. And Fleming's first recorded choice for Bond was Richard Burton, the son of a coal miner and barmaid.

    Fleming's Bond comes from a well-off background but not an aristocratic or very wealthy one, and the character has little to do with conventional upper class English social life. On a rare visit to Blades we're told "Bond knew that there was something alien and un-English about himself. He knew that he was a difficult man to cover up. Particularly in England."

    Casting actors from working class backgrounds to play Bond is a way of acknowledging that Bond doesn't quite fit in a stereotypical upper-class world. He moves through such worlds, but he also stands somewhat apart from the class system, in the way a working-class actor who successfully plays upper-class parts does.

    Additionally, Fleming wanted his English/British gentleman hero to have the toughness of a Hammett/Chandler hero. Casting an actor from working class backgrounds is a way of helping Bond retain an element of toughness--a down-to-earth quality--and avoid coming across as too effete or privileged.

    Lastly, it has often been the case that working class actors who became stars--like Cary Grant, Sean Connery and Roger Moore--ended up portraying a version of upper-classness that seemed more suave and classy than the real thing.

    Interesting post. It kind of matches up to how the screen version of Bond is actually shown to be a bit more cultured and elegant than Fleming's was. The movie one is famous for always being in the most elegant fashions and never wearing the same thing twice, but the book Bond tended to wear the same outfit much of the time and only owned about two (possibly three) suits, one of which was even described as being a little beaten up. I think he even wears jeans at one point.
    Reminds me of reading Christopher Wood's TSWLM novel, and there's a weird bit where Bond looks out of a window and thinks about how he's saving 'the England he loves', and it struck me as being really out of whack with Fleming's Bond. He always feels, as you say, an outsider, and mostly seems to be doing his job because he loves the thrills and hates his enemies over any particular patriotic motivation. Anyone who thinks the 'Scottish peasant' is an aristocratic toff hasn't really got the thrust of the character from the novels, if you ask me.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    mtm wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Word Back in 2006 was, Craig watched Connery's Bond and read the Books to prepare for the role. But surely Craig must have watched DAD intensely....obviously not for direct inspiration, but to see the different route he wanted to take the franchise. We also hope Bond 7 finds good inspiration too.

    I think Connery, Lazenby, Moore and Dalton were the bonds who didn't take inspiration from each other, as they were so different. We can find a bit of Connery and Moore in Brosnan's Bond and we can also find Connery and especially Dalton in Craig's Bond....Maybe a bit of the 'Everyday Man' Lazenby too. I guess we'll see how Bond 7 goes about his own inspiration.

    Yeah I think Brosnan has always maintained that he's never watched Dalton's films (or Living Daylights at least) because losing the role wasn't a good experience for him. He did say in that GoldenEye watchalong that he was sort of consciously going for a Connery/Moore middle ground, which I thought was quite an interesting admission.

    You'd imagine the others would have all caught each others' work at some point, if out of curiosity than anything else. I think Lazenby would have certainly taken inspiration from Connery because he wasn't an experienced actor and there wasn't really any other known way to play Bond at that time.

    Yeah, fair assessment.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited July 2020 Posts: 5,131
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Moore was working class? Didn't he go to grammar school?

    Roger Moore was from a working class background, but had the persona of a posh boy throughout his career.

    He’s hardly tough or rough anyhow. He played the toff in real life.

    The character of Bond is supposed to be from money, privilege and public school. Not some Council house resident who ‘dragged himself up’.

    Who said it was supposed to be someone from a council house? The idea is, taken from the original casting decision to use Connery, that it is easier and more convincing for someone playing Bond to be masculine and rough around the edges and to make them appear more privileged, than it is to take a fey upper class boy and to make them appear hard.

    But just because one is from a rough or poor background. Why does this make them tougher/ more ruthless in a military sense.

    A good actor is a good actor. Especially in modern cinema. Personal life outside of acting is irrelevant (as long as it’s not not illegal or immoral). Unless the actor is unconvincing in general.





    I was referring only to Cubby and Harry's reasoning for casting Connery. Nobody mentioned poor people or those from a rough background. It was the idea of a rough diamond type. Like Connery. Like Craig. Like Lazenby. Hardy and Fassbender would fall into this type (not saying that they are viable candidates any more).

    Back to Hiddleston. I think he's a dreadful choice for this reason.


    Each to their own.

    I think Hiddleston is a great choice because he is a posh public school toff. This is because this fits the mould of Fleming’s character who isn’t a rough diamond.

    I don't see Bond as a toff at all: if you read the books he's an outsider. He got chucked out of Eton, he wasn't part of the toff set.
    Personally I'd get a good actor who's able to play vaguely gentlemanly and tough, rather than get one who is posh and can only play posh and who can't be convincingly tough.
    I have no idea of Craig or Dalton's backgrounds but they both seem able to play smooth and classy because they're good actors.

    At least the other suggestions (the Turners, Cavill etc.) I could see winning a fight.

    The character is from privilege. Perhaps ‘toff’ is an exaggeration on my part.

    Hiddleston was convincingly tough in The Night Manager.

    I don't think so at all, no. I could believe he worked in a hotel, he was fine at that. He's believable at fey prissiness.

    As approximately none of the actors to play Bond up until now have been public school toffs or from privileged backgrounds -and many of them have been quite popular- I don't see how it's much of a benefit to be one to play him. Just get an actor to pretend.

    You don’t think he’s suitable. Fine.

    But the press hyped him up as a Bond candidate based on The Night Manager. His character background in that was ex military.

    The ‘fey prissiness’ isn’t something the press or critics mentioned. Many saw a Bond candidate. You don’t...... It’s all opinion.

    I know it's an opinion, that's why I phrased it as an opinion ("I don't think so at all, no"), whereas you phrased your opinions as fact ("Hiddleston was convincingly tough"). But trying to say that 'many' saw it is an attempt to devalue my opinion, and that of those who have agreed on this thread, as that of the minority, which is rather tiresome. You'd probably call it trolling.

    Also, your reporting skills are in doubt after thinking Roger Moore saying he didn't say something meant the opposite! :D

    A couple of lazy journos might have seen a TV show which had the same plot as Licence To Kill and decided to fill a couple of hundred words with more 'this guy should be Bond' rubbish without really thinking about it- what does that prove? They do that with every guy they see in a dinner suit. See James Norton. That's if you even read the articles right- they probably said he wasn't suitable! :D

    You said; “He’s believable at fey prissiness”. Sounds like a statement to me. 🤣

    It probably does when taken out of context from the sentence it followed on from, which began with 'I could believe'. You're not very good at this.
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Anyway, I’m hoping for another season of ‘The Night Manager’ which is apparently in production.

    I think 'Little Drummer Girl' was the follow up, I wouldn't expect a direct sequel.

    The only person from Night Manager I think we're likely to see in a Bond film is Olivia Coleman.

    Yeah sure...now it’s out of context to suit the current rant. 🤔🤣😂

    It's just simple reading and comprehension. 'Out of context' means you take things away from their surroundings and in doing so make them no longer fully understandable e.g. 'Roger Moore was reported to have said a racist comment but explained his quote had been taken out of context'. You'll get there with practice, I'm sure.
    But the main point is to not dismiss others' words as 'opinion' when you keep stating yours as nothing but fact.

    Thanks for the support. Hopefully, with practice, I can get the hang of it going forward. 👍

    Just like you’ve improved your punctuation and grammar in your recent posts.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    mtm wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Word Back in 2006 was, Craig watched Connery's Bond and read the Books to prepare for the role. But surely Craig must have watched DAD intensely....obviously not for direct inspiration, but to see the different route he wanted to take the franchise. We also hope Bond 7 finds good inspiration too.

    I think Connery, Lazenby, Moore and Dalton were the bonds who didn't take inspiration from each other, as they were so different. We can find a bit of Connery and Moore in Brosnan's Bond and we can also find Connery and especially Dalton in Craig's Bond....Maybe a bit of the 'Everyday Man' Lazenby too. I guess we'll see how Bond 7 goes about his own inspiration.

    Yeah I think Brosnan has always maintained that he's never watched Dalton's films (or Living Daylights at least) because losing the role wasn't a good experience for him. He did say in that GoldenEye watchalong that he was sort of consciously going for a Connery/Moore middle ground, which I thought was quite an interesting admission.

    You'd imagine the others would have all caught each others' work at some point, if out of curiosity than anything else. I think Lazenby would have certainly taken inspiration from Connery because he wasn't an experienced actor and there wasn't really any other known way to play Bond at that time.


    +1.

    Brosnan would have benefited from being ‘his own man.’ He was never as suave/ tough as Connery or suave/ smooth as Moore. It’s probably why I felt he was a step down from Dalton who seemed to only gain inspiration from Fleming.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited July 2020 Posts: 16,383
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Moore was working class? Didn't he go to grammar school?

    Roger Moore was from a working class background, but had the persona of a posh boy throughout his career.

    He’s hardly tough or rough anyhow. He played the toff in real life.

    The character of Bond is supposed to be from money, privilege and public school. Not some Council house resident who ‘dragged himself up’.

    Who said it was supposed to be someone from a council house? The idea is, taken from the original casting decision to use Connery, that it is easier and more convincing for someone playing Bond to be masculine and rough around the edges and to make them appear more privileged, than it is to take a fey upper class boy and to make them appear hard.

    But just because one is from a rough or poor background. Why does this make them tougher/ more ruthless in a military sense.

    A good actor is a good actor. Especially in modern cinema. Personal life outside of acting is irrelevant (as long as it’s not not illegal or immoral). Unless the actor is unconvincing in general.





    I was referring only to Cubby and Harry's reasoning for casting Connery. Nobody mentioned poor people or those from a rough background. It was the idea of a rough diamond type. Like Connery. Like Craig. Like Lazenby. Hardy and Fassbender would fall into this type (not saying that they are viable candidates any more).

    Back to Hiddleston. I think he's a dreadful choice for this reason.


    Each to their own.

    I think Hiddleston is a great choice because he is a posh public school toff. This is because this fits the mould of Fleming’s character who isn’t a rough diamond.

    I don't see Bond as a toff at all: if you read the books he's an outsider. He got chucked out of Eton, he wasn't part of the toff set.
    Personally I'd get a good actor who's able to play vaguely gentlemanly and tough, rather than get one who is posh and can only play posh and who can't be convincingly tough.
    I have no idea of Craig or Dalton's backgrounds but they both seem able to play smooth and classy because they're good actors.

    At least the other suggestions (the Turners, Cavill etc.) I could see winning a fight.

    The character is from privilege. Perhaps ‘toff’ is an exaggeration on my part.

    Hiddleston was convincingly tough in The Night Manager.

    I don't think so at all, no. I could believe he worked in a hotel, he was fine at that. He's believable at fey prissiness.

    As approximately none of the actors to play Bond up until now have been public school toffs or from privileged backgrounds -and many of them have been quite popular- I don't see how it's much of a benefit to be one to play him. Just get an actor to pretend.

    You don’t think he’s suitable. Fine.

    But the press hyped him up as a Bond candidate based on The Night Manager. His character background in that was ex military.

    The ‘fey prissiness’ isn’t something the press or critics mentioned. Many saw a Bond candidate. You don’t...... It’s all opinion.

    I know it's an opinion, that's why I phrased it as an opinion ("I don't think so at all, no"), whereas you phrased your opinions as fact ("Hiddleston was convincingly tough"). But trying to say that 'many' saw it is an attempt to devalue my opinion, and that of those who have agreed on this thread, as that of the minority, which is rather tiresome. You'd probably call it trolling.

    Also, your reporting skills are in doubt after thinking Roger Moore saying he didn't say something meant the opposite! :D

    A couple of lazy journos might have seen a TV show which had the same plot as Licence To Kill and decided to fill a couple of hundred words with more 'this guy should be Bond' rubbish without really thinking about it- what does that prove? They do that with every guy they see in a dinner suit. See James Norton. That's if you even read the articles right- they probably said he wasn't suitable! :D

    You said; “He’s believable at fey prissiness”. Sounds like a statement to me. 🤣

    It probably does when taken out of context from the sentence it followed on from, which began with 'I could believe'. You're not very good at this.
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Anyway, I’m hoping for another season of ‘The Night Manager’ which is apparently in production.

    I think 'Little Drummer Girl' was the follow up, I wouldn't expect a direct sequel.

    The only person from Night Manager I think we're likely to see in a Bond film is Olivia Coleman.

    Yeah sure...now it’s out of context to suit the current rant. 🤔🤣😂

    It's just simple reading and comprehension. 'Out of context' means you take things away from their surroundings and in doing so make them no longer fully understandable e.g. 'Roger Moore was reported to have said a racist comment but explained his quote had been taken out of context'. You'll get there with practice, I'm sure.
    But the main point is to not dismiss others' words as 'opinion' when you keep stating yours as nothing but fact.

    Thanks for the support. Hopefully, with practice, I can get the hang of it going forward. 👍

    Just like you’ve improved your punctuation and grammar in your recent posts.

    I'm sure you think you're hitting a nerve with that but I honestly haven't a clue why you're saying it. There's rarely anything wrong with my ability to write, and when there is it's because this is a web forum that I'm dashing off replies quickly on: it's not exactly a carefully proofread dissertation. Hence why most people with manners don't mention if anyone else makes a spelling error on places like these. If you have to resort to trying to pick me up on mistyping a word occasionally (especially when I haven't) then you really are having to scrape the bottom of the trolling barrel.
    Rest assured I'll now be watching out for you doing it of course. For example: there should never be a space after a slash, so "He was never as suave/ tough as Connery" is bad punctuation. Try harder. 'Going forward' is a superfluous nonsense phrase etc.

    Or maybe you could stop trying to turn this into an irritating pissing contest and just talk normally.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    I still think 43 year Michael Fassbender could be a great Bond.

    Fassbender has managed to balance dramatic roles in smaller films with huge blockbusters, much like Craig.

    While Bond doesn’t necessarily need an actor with as much range and talent as Fassbender, I think he’d bring an interesting emotional dynamic to the character.

    Also, Craig has already ‘raised the stakes’ with regards to acting quality within the role.
  • ImpertinentGoonImpertinentGoon Everybody needs a hobby.
    Posts: 1,351
    What do you guys think about an actor doing a "one off" movie?

    I guess artistically, it could be interesting, it might open the door for very high level actors who might not want to sign long term (Bale, Hardy, Fassbender), and for actors who are a bit older.

    On the other hand, it goes against the way the franchise has worked until now. And it is probably not something Eon would want to do, as long as they don't have a problem getting an actor they like. And the trend in movies is long franchises and connected series of movies.
  • DenbighDenbigh UK
    edited July 2020 Posts: 5,970
    What do you guys think about an actor doing a "one off" movie?

    I guess artistically, it could be interesting, it might open the door for very high level actors who might not want to sign long term (Bale, Hardy, Fassbender), and for actors who are a bit older.

    On the other hand, it goes against the way the franchise has worked until now. And it is probably not something Eon would want to do, as long as they don't have a problem getting an actor they like. And the trend in movies is long franchises and connected series of movies.
    The issue with it (for me anyway) is the role will no longer belong to an actor, meaning they don't get to play around with the role and sink their teeth in as much as they may like - considering how long it can take for actors to get comfortable in the role.

    It also means that success would constantly fluctuate, and not to mention that if people really like one actor, it doesn't really matter cause they're probably gonna recast anyway.

    And I understand you could argue that occasionally someone plays him for one film... but then to me that's just wasting time and money until someone properly commits to it.
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