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Rumour: Great Wall of China motorcycle chase to feature in Bond 23

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  • NicNacNicNac Administrator, Moderator
    Posts: 7,582
    @actonsteve =D>
    Of course locations can be used for brief scenes. The African location in CR used for Le Chiffre's entrance. It isn't necessarilly about Bond Globehopping.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited June 2011 Posts: 15,718
    Puts on aestheticici hat. The QoS locations were the jewell in the crown. Siena looked gorgeous. Those terracotta roofs, the banners, the Palio. Haiti (or Panama) looked grimy and exotic. Real Graham Greene territory. The floating opear house in Bregenz was intrigueing and who can forget the gorgeous sweep of landscape of Lake Como as the speedboats zooms along.
    What are you on about ? The locations in QOS were abysmal, catastrophic. Bond stayed 7 minutes in Siena, 5 minutes in Talamone. Talamone consists of a single set, in Bregenz the action doesn't leave the opera house...

    It was truly pathetic in QOS. It is the shortest film in the franchise, and on top of that, it is the film with the most locations in the franchise ! So of course the locations were going to be underused. QOS is a travesty of Bond globetrotting. It's a blatant rip-off of Bourne... and Bourne does it better.

    I don't want more than 2 major locations in B23. Anymore than that, and the film will be a huge turd.

    6 location changes in 50 minutes... that is an average of 8 minutes per country... Factually that is pathetic. Maybe the locations look good, but that much change in such a short amount of time is factually totally un-Bond like. I hope it never happens again. The globe-trotting in QOS is factually much closer to Bourne than traditional Bond... I do not want a 2nd Bourne film in the franchise.
  • Mach2InfinityMach2Infinity Wales
    edited June 2011 Posts: 74
    It will be Daniel Craig's third outing as 007. Shooting is expected to commence in November 2011 for release in the UK on October 26th, 2011.
    *Time drive switch enabled* *beep* *instrument panel enabled and time destination entered* *Bond revs the car and releases the break, the car shoots off at speed*

    Bond: "Q! The time instrument panel's gone on the blink again!"

    Q: "Hit the panel 007!"

    *Bond hits the panel, the display re-appears and Bond inputs the correct time co-ordinates*

    Bond: "Let's see what this baby does at 88 M.P.H!"

    I guess we know Bond will be driving a heavily modified DeLorean then.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------

    DaltonCraig007, you should be waterboarded for such heresy. No, if you didn't like the locations then fine. Though I thought they made good use of the locations. I was thoroughly impressed with the Bregenz floating opera stage. Surely, one of the best scenes from Craig's two films? The way he micturates over Quantum's machiavellian meeting never fails to entertain me.
  • dragonskydragonsky
    Posts: 2,491
    it will be great i hope this rumour will be true
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited June 2011 Posts: 15,718
    DaltonCraig007, you should be waterboarded for such heresy. No, if you didn't like the locations then fine. Though I thought they made good use of the locations. I was thoroughly impressed with the Bregenz floating opera stage. Surely, one of the best scenes from Craig's two films? The way he micturates over Quantum's machiavellian meeting never fails to entertain me.
    I am not saying the locations themselves look bad. But an average of 8 minutes per location is just wrong, whichever way you look at it. I expect the film to stay atleast 1 hour in each major locations... Not 8 minutes in 5 different locations !! I hate this Bournified globe-trotting... Back to making Bond films please, EON !!
  • Mach2InfinityMach2Infinity Wales
    edited June 2011 Posts: 74
    I think you're overstating things here. "QoS" is its own animal, just like the other films. I liked the change of pace in the second film. As it provides a nice counter-point to its predecessor. I think the pace of the second film necessitated a more expedited sojourn for Bond. He knows who he's after and he's not going to stop until he gets him; bear in mind he's seething with revenge. The beauty of the Bond films is that each one is different, I don't want the exact same viewing experience as I prefer a film-maker to put their own stamp on things whilst of course respecting the character. I think the third film will be more evenly-paced, certainly not languid but I think we're going to see more espionage and stealthy going-ons with Bond. It won't have things blowing up left, right and centre but of course we're going to get a good deal of action at some point. As long as they don't do what they did in "Casino Royale", a car chase which lasted 20 seconds? He may as well left the car with the valet. Another thing to remember and this is hugely important. We finally have the complete article in 007. He matured and learned all he needed to by the end of the second film and this is a major thread in the character's arc. Now, we have the 007 of old. Hopefully, we will see things such as the "shaken, not stirred" back in and more than that, the savoir-faire or sang froid that we know Daniel Craig can pull off. I think that's the one thing we haven't really seen much of Craig in the films. His suaveness and debonair manner when dealing with the ladies. While we do not want a walking Durex advert, we do want to see someone using their charm and sophistication in getting what they want. Rather than always clubbing them over the head and chucking them in the river.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    This great wall bike chase sounds a bit bogus to me and tbh, I dont want to see another bike chase from Bond. I want to see a proper car chase (actually SEE what's going on this time) and perhaps a ski chase.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited June 2011 Posts: 15,718
    Well I'm sorry @Mach2Infinity, but I don't watch Bond films to feel like a tourist who barely leaves the airport. I watch Bond films to feel at home in locations I'll most likely never visit in my life. And it's not in 8 minutes that you can use a location in it's full capacity. I do not want another Bourne rip-off of the constant globe-trotting. I want Bondian globe-trotting.
  • NicNacNicNac Administrator, Moderator
    Posts: 7,582
    Ok DC calm down, seriously. Start to accept other people have a point of view as well.
    The only person obsessed with Bourne seems to be you. Constantly demanding that 'I want this...I want that' isn't constructive and has become tiresome. QOS was what it was, B23 will be different no doubt.
  • JBFan626JBFan626
    Posts: 1,497
    Too much talk about action scenes: filming in Mumbai for an action scene, filming on the Great Wall for an action scene...Didn't EON learn anything from QOS? How about location hunting for something that would add something interesting to the plot?? I'm getting really tired of these flimsy, undeveloped, unpolished stories, stuffed with useless action filler. Action scenes should only be used as a means to move along the plot. It should not be the other way around: where the plot is merely a way to set up one action scene after the other...*cough, cough...Quantum of Solace*

  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,718
    The only person obsessed with Bourne seems to be you.
    Not my fault QOS has many elements that ressemble closely the Bourne films.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    edited June 2011 Posts: 13,355
    Too much talk about action scenes: filming in Mumbai for an action scene, filming on the Great Wall for an action scene...Didn't EON learn anything from QOS?
    For all we know these could be the only major action sequences in the film. We have to learn about something in the way of news first! In this case it's been the action. So I wouldn't jump to the classic "didn't EON learn anything" yet.
  • SirHenryLeeChaChingSirHenryLeeChaChing
    Posts: 3,494
    But China India south Africa and obviously London not bad.. Not Bad at all.
    :-? Those locations would turn B23 into a total disaster... I hope to god they don't go to all 3 (China, India, South Africa) in the same film. I am tired of constant globe trotting a-la Jason Bourne. I want to feel at home in these locations, not feel like a tourist who barely leaves the airport. .
    You mean like MR where Bond visited California, Venice, Rio, the Amazonian rainforest and outer space?

    :-)) NicNac, that was the absolutely perfect answer! I couldn't stop laughing because that was the first thing I thought too. Really, we have a single source for this info and only one film location (India) with any reasonable confirmation. Let's see what happens first. I really do not understand how people like DC get so hot and judgmental before knowing some facts and seeing a finished product. I'd love to see Bond deep undercover in China (and maybe a Chinese girl while he's at it), and the Great Wall would be a breathtaking location to use.

    Hey Dimi, are you listening? I rest my case :-j
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited June 2011 Posts: 15,718
    You mean like MR where Bond visited California, Venice, Rio, the Amazonian rainforest and outer space?
    :-)) NicNac, that was the absolutely perfect answer!
    Well NicNac's answer was a non-argument, as it is completly contradictory. It actually served my point.

    How can you compare MR's locations with QOS's ? It's totally pointless and meaningless to do so, as they are complete oposits. MR's locations serve the epic, grand scale adventure, while QOS' locations make the film turn towards Jason Bourne territory.
  • lecherolechero
    Posts: 161
    Personally I have a hard time making any Bourne comparisons, because the films were so incredibly boring and dull. To each his own, I guess.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited June 2011 Posts: 15,718
    The constant globe-trotting in QOS (6 country change in 50 minutes) was evidently a copy of Bourne. Both Bourne and QOS constantly change locations and countries. Bond travels more in QOS than in DN, FRWL, GF and TB combined. Bond used to use the locals to their full potential... It isn't with an average of 8 minutes per country that you will see even an ounce of the epic scope that Bond adventures used to be. That is why QOS is totally lacklustre if you look at the amount of locals in it. Yes MR went to a lot of places... but that helped the epic scale of the film. Why did QOS underuse its locations so much and looked mundane and dull, I have no idea. With a 250 million dollar budget, it could have toned down the locals and used only 2 or 3 of them... And it would have been one, if not THE biggest Bond adventure in the franchise. We missed the occasion of having an epic adventure... I hope B23 will grab that chance better and deliver.
  • SirHenryLeeChaChingSirHenryLeeChaChing
    edited June 2011 Posts: 3,494
    You mean like MR where Bond visited California, Venice, Rio, the Amazonian rainforest and outer space?
    :-)) NicNac, that was the absolutely perfect answer!
    Well NicNac's answer was a non-argument, as it is completely contradictory. It actually served my point.

    How can you compare MR's locations with QOS's ? It's totally pointless and meaningless to do so, as they are complete oposits. MR's locations serve the epic, grand scale adventure, while QOS' locations make the film turn towards Jason Bourne territory.
    Actually it served to get you going, which makes it hilarious all by itself :-))

    I could accept your point regarding the length of time spent in the various locations though, it is a good one. I'll be fair, I'd also like to see them spend a little more time in the various locales. The problem with your arguments most of the time is that your good points get overshadowed by all the conclusions you jump to with very little thought as to the responses you may get. You don't know where they will be filming or how much will be filmed there, so why take the low road? I thought QOS had some great locations too. My friend, sometimes less is more- and that applies to music as well. Try and look at things with a little more of a positive view and maybe others will be more inclined to see things your way rather than making you the butt of jokes.



  • shadowonthesunshadowonthesun Banned
    Posts: 1,894
    Well, that's what they wrote, linking it to the Mi6 news. I sent the news and all I can tell is that if "this" source isn't trustworthy then no one is. Yet, we're six months away from shooting so anything is possible and, yes, plans can be changed during that period of time.
    Except that MI6 News *isn't* the source at all - they're only reproducing what someone else has published.
  • danslittlefingerdanslittlefinger
    edited July 2011 Posts: 886
    I can't believe I'm reading this. I mentioned this idea (as well as a few other people) last year sometime...thought it would be a great opening...bl**dy hell..talk about gobsmacked.
    :O

    Sam Mendes - check
    Rachel Weisz - check (well she married Bond, close enough)
    Now to have Duran Duran do another theme tune would fulfill my main wishes for B23.
  • actonsteveactonsteve
    edited July 2011 Posts: 1,492


    What are you on about ? The locations in QOS were abysmal, catastrophic. Bond stayed 7 minutes in Siena, 5 minutes in Talamone. Talamone consists of a single set, in Bregenz the action doesn't leave the opera house...

    It was truly pathetic in QOS. It is the shortest film in the franchise, and on top of that, it is the film with the most locations in the franchise ! So of course the locations were going to be underused. QOS is a travesty of Bond globetrotting. It's a blatant rip-off of Bourne... and Bourne does it better.

    "pathetic?", "catastrophic?" Those are strong words and obviously you dont seem to have much of a sense of aesthetic There were may reasons for the switch of locale. Firstly the budget allowed it, secondly the audience expected it, and thirdly they were keeping a sense of momentum with Bond chasing after those responsible for the death of Vesper. The fast pace signified Bonds own momentum.

    You seem to paraphrasse every argument with the squeak "I dont want another Bourne!" "Bourne does it better" as if this is a trump card argument and "You dont want it like this!" "You dont want it like that!" as if you are stamping your feet. Can you see another point of view? You seem to base your argument on the amount of time Bond spends in each locale. Maybe you shoud try the way the locale was used within those minutes ie the excellent Palio or the floating opera house.

    Lastly, the Moonraker argument is a valid one. The locations, score and SFX are the saving grace of Moonraker and the reason most of us enjoy it. But it does move from one location to another very quickly. I have always thought that Venice or California could be cut out but they are excellent cinematic locations. Live and Let Die whizzed from one location to another as did Bond speeding around South East Asia in TMWTGG.

    Bond films have a long tradition of multiple locations.


  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    edited July 2011 Posts: 4,399
    @DaltonCraig007

    I agree and disagree with you on this one...

    i do too find it annoying that the recent Bond films feature a lot more globetrotting than the previous Bond films - not enough time is spent in these locations to really give of sense of "being there", if that makes sense?.. the older Bond films presented locations as full course meals, where recently - it seems like they are treated like appetizers - a small sampling before moving on.... QOS bothered me in this respect because it seemed they just threw in locations just to have them... did they really need to fly out of Haiti, to Bregenz, and then back to Bolivia?... probably not... it's like an effort had to be made to keep track of where Bond was at at all times - but, that might have been due to length of the film itself, not the number of locations.....

    so with that being said.......

    You are wrong when you say that Quantum Of Solace had the most locations in any Bond film.....

    Quantum Of Solace had 5...
    Siena, Italy
    Haiti
    Bregenz
    Bolivia
    Kazan, Russia

    Casino Royale had 8...
    Prague
    Africa
    Madagascar
    Nassau
    Miami
    Montenegro
    Lake Como, Italy
    Venice, Italy

    so you are off by quite a bit on this one.... so really - your argument about number of locations is moot and pointless... maybe it's how the locations are used?? - just a thought..

    with that said.... I don't think the number of locations in a film necessarily spells doom and gloom for a film - forgive me, because i know we'll disagree on this also (like other stuff lol)... but there is much that goes into the success or failure of a movie, than just how many locations they use.... it depends on how they are used, and to what extent... while i do agree that QOS jumped around a lot - it did not have the most locations in any Bond film - as obviously CR had more.... hell, even Moonraker had more locations than QOS.... it only seemed that way, probably because of what they were trying to cram into so short of a Bond film.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited July 2011 Posts: 15,718
    @haserot, I counted the country changes in QOS... 6 changed in 50 minutes (Italy, London, Haiti, Bregenz, Italy, Bolivia within the 50 minutes mark). That is an average of 8 minutes per location.

    Yes, CR had more... but it seems with the long run time the movie stayed longer in locations than QOS.

    I think with the short run-time of QOS, a minimal amount of locations should have been used.
    .Bond films have a long tradition of multiple locations.
    That is a non-argument... Are you even aware of the enormity of that argument ? I guess you haven't watched any Bond film from 1962 to about 1974.
  • thelordflasheartthelordflasheart
    Posts: 1,370


    But if it happens to go to all 3, I won't need to see the film to know it will be a total and utter failure.
    A little late to this discussion, but surely the above is hyperbole? DC007, did you "know" that MR would be a disaster because of the number of locations when it started filming?

    Like anything else in a film, it's *how* they do it, not the *what* that they are doing which is important (IMHO, of course). There were a great number of locations in CR and they all looked amazing and were presented extremely well. QoS was a different type of film and the locations were shot in a different way but they were still presented well - Haiti was not as glamourous as the Bahamas in CR but it wasn't meant to be. As someone said there was a real Graham Greene feel about some of the locations in QoS.

    My instinct is to have fewer locations in a Bond film but if they are used well - not necessarily in a glamorous way, but well - then I won't complain.

  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited July 2011 Posts: 15,718
    @thelordflasheart I hope this film is about 2 hours and 10 minute long... A 5 minutes PTS, Opening Titles, MI6 sequence (M briefing, Q scene, Moneypenny scene) about 10 minutes... Then say 45/50 minutes in India and 1 hour (remaining of film) in China... That would be great !! As China is a first-timer location, I hope it's used to it's full potential, not another petty 15 minutes sequence including a 6 minutes chase scene... So yes my ideal B23 would have 2 long sequences in India and China !!

    If South Africa is also a location ? Put India in PTS, and give S.Africa the 50 minutes sequence and end with the 1 hour sequence of China. Such a film would enter my top 10 easily !! And if M stays in London, and there is Q/Moneypenny scene... top 5 material !!

    So... S.Africa, China and India... Enough locations for B23. Don't want a 4th one.
  • JBFan626JBFan626
    Posts: 1,497
    My wish is that the next Bond would have a return to gorgeous and cinematic locations. Examples: Jamaica beaches in Dr. No, the Bahamas in Thunderball, the castles and hillsides of Japan in You Only Live Twice, The Alps (again) and Piz Gloria in OHMSS. China, India and South Africa all have the potential to do exactly that.

    Marc Forster stated: "since travelling the world had become less exotic since the series' advent, it made sense to focus more on Bond as a character." No. No. No. Mr. Forster! You miss the entire point of the series. Times weren't any better in the early 60's. Bond was an escape from all the turmoil at home since during and after the War at that time. Current socio-economic times are still not that great, and certainly a lot worse in the past few years with the economic crisis. We don't need more dire scenes like the ones we saw in QOS: the impoverished streets of Haiti or the barren deserts of Bolivia. A Bond film should take us away. Having something grand and exotic like the Great Wall of China or India or South Africa and having our hero interact in such an environment is what we need right about now.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited July 2011 Posts: 15,718
    Yes @JBFan626 !! QOS, in that aspect, was totally contradictory with what Bond movies should be. I don't watch Bond films to have a cold, broody, realistic view on the world... Au contraire, Bond is about exotism, glamour, epic scale, grand scale adventures !! Forster got it all wrong for QOS. Even if I hate CR, I admit it was quite glamourous and exotic... Something QOS totally failed at doing so. Maybe they don't want to do another MR or YOLT... but please don't take all the fun, glamour and exotism away from Bond like in QOS !! Forster is a hack Bond director... He didn't understand Bond one bit. Yes, you can have a more character-driven film (OHMSS), but please don't take the Bond style away.

    There are several scenes in QOS that simply aren't recognizable from other action movies. Take the Palio chase, the boat chase and the plane chase. What is Bondian about those ? There's no Bond theme, no gadgets, Bond doesn't throw a one-liner at the end, and there are no 'lighthearted/funny' moments in them. What differenciates the chase scene in Sienna from Bourne film or a Statham film, for instance ?

    I am, for one, very tired of seeing the franchise become unrecognizable from other action films. This is factually true for certain action scenes in QOS. I do agree that Bond needed to tone down the OTT after Brosnan. But you cannot just strip away all the Bond traditions. QOS is simply not a Bond film, IMO. For B23, bring back the one-liners, the Bond theme full blast BEFORE the end credits, the gadgets (even if they are realistic and down-to-earth) and the lighthearted/funny moments. Don't go all Brosnan on us again and have a cliche-ticking-list for B23... But bring the traditions back so I can understand I am watching a Bond film.

    If EON continues to make other QOS films... Stop the franchise on the spot. Why bother continuing making further outings, if they are only Bond by name, and aren't actual Bond films ?

    People say Craig is similar to Dalton... Not true. Atleast Dalton's films had the traditional elements... Even LTK. Dalton had the Bond theme during action scenes, had blatant humourous moments, had the gadgets, had Moneypenny, had Q, had the gun-barrel at the start...

    When you are making an action scene that stricly has no traditional elements in it... You are not making a Bond film, atleast not during that particular scene.
  • actonsteveactonsteve
    edited July 2011 Posts: 1,492

    If EON continues to make other QOS films... Stop the franchise on the spot. Why bother continuing making further outings, if they are only Bond by name, and aren't actual Bond films ?

    .
    If they are not making Bond films the way you want then perhaps it is time to say goodbye to them. When the Star Wars films went down the toilet after coming back I gave up on them and kicked them to the kerb.

    If Brosnan had done as many as Moore he'd have lost me after DAD.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,718
    I have survived the last 6 horrible outings... I will voice my disaprovement until they make a proper Bond film again.
  • Risico007Risico007
    edited July 2011 Posts: 9,847
    I suppose now would be a bad time to suggest Bond Play hold em poker in bond 23...


    Dalton Have faith I always like to wait and see before i suggest what is good or bad. I mean for all we know The Great wall motor cycle sequences is the pre title sequence (tracking down one of the people at the opera house in Quantum of Solace i can't remember his name He was the one who owned most of the mines in Siberia I think You all know who I'm talking about) then after he is killed mission proper starts after the pre title sequence we get London (for briefing) then South Africa and India.


    As for M staying In London I would love that however Q and Moneypeny should only be in the script if they work. For me the tracer in arm sequence in the Bahamas and the money laundering sequence were Q scenes I'd even bring that guy in the tweed jacket back from quantum of Solace and call him Q (brownie points if you can give me the actors name) as for Moneypenny she needs to be redesigned a bit i think for the 21st century She just seemed the weakest most forced and annoying parts of the Brosnan era so perhaps her as an Internet Junkie working in Q branch giving bond background on a character that could work but if they are going the forced Brosnan era route then please leave her out of the film.

    Oh and hold em as Craig Bond's game of choice if fleming were alive he would of changed bond's game at some point probably much earlier then the producers did.

    My thoughts like them or hate them.
  • myworldisenoughmyworldisenough
    Posts: 1,143
    Is James Bond going to try to emulate Steve McQueen 'The Great Escape style' ? But obviously escaping!!
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