SPECTRE Leaks Discussion (allowed on ONLY this thread) MAJOR PLOTLINE SPOILERS!

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  • Posts: 940
    There's a nice long stretch of road there too for it to be the scene where the two cars make it through before the security gates close.
  • aaron819aaron819 Switzerland
    Posts: 1,208
    slyfox wrote: »
    There's a nice long stretch of road there too for it to be the scene where the two cars make it through before the security gates close.

    I can't wait to see how they make that scene and how it comes out in the movie and the whole movie.

  • To answer an earlier poster’s question about the “hook” that Mendes and Logan came up with, my assumption is that the hook was quite simple: Bond goes up against Blofeld and SPECTRE. Clearly Logan took it in a different direction than Mendes and EON wanted, but I think the hook was probably as basic as that.
  • Do people think Logan's place in future Bond films will depend on Spectre's success? I couldn't be happier in saying that I think Spectre will do great, especially following Skyfall. I think the success of Skyfall will definitely lend a hand with Spectre, but I just wondered hypothetically would Logan be "held responsible" and lose any shot of writing a future Bond film?
  • Do we really know John Logan took the story in a different direction than Mendes and Eon wanted? Logan said he was working closely with all involved. Could someone else -- a studio executive perhaps -- objected?
  • Well, it depends how much freedom they gave to Logan.
  • Well, it depends how much freedom they gave to Logan.

    Yes. But if you're really "working closely" (Logan's words in interviews), then it shouldn't really be a surprise when the draft is turned in. There's this narrative that's taking hold that Logan messed up. But did he? Or was everyone on board at least while it was still being written?

  • ThomasCrown76ThomasCrown76 Augusta, ks
    Posts: 757
    Making m a bad guy was a really bad move, especially when you go to the trouble of getting fiennes to take over from dench
  • edited February 2015 Posts: 591
    I suppose we'll never know the answer :(

    I also wonder if all the controversy with the script and Sony will add to Spectre's success?
  • edited February 2015 Posts: 2,115
    Strictly hypothetical:

    MENDES: I thought I'd check in and see how things were going.

    LOGAN: Great. I'm in the middle of writing the scene where Tanner is revealed as a traitor and he commits suicide as Bond watches.

    MENDES: Super! Can't wait to read it.

    Or?

    LOGAN: Well, what did you think?

    MENDES: I don't recall you mentioning anything about Tanner being a traitor and committing suicide as Bond watches.

    LOGAN: Just a little notion I had. Are you sure I didn't mention it?

    MENDES: Quite sure.

    That over-simplifies things, but there's a big difference between the first scenario and the second.
  • A very good point, and well stated, AlexanderWaverly. I wonder whether we'll ever know.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    What we do know is, whatever Logan wrote, many involved thought it was absolute rubbish and when you beg for Purvis and Wade to return and fix things, it must have been a catastrophe.
  • We also know they announced a release date *without even having a draft script.* Announcement of the release date was in July 2013 and Logan didn't turn in his first draft until March 2014 or so.

    You'd think somebody would have made some "John, how's it going? How much do you have written so far?" phone calls. Or, "Can you send me what you've written so far?" And maybe they did.
  • Put another way, Logan certainly bears responsibility. I can't help but wonder whether others do as well.
  • DrShatterhandDrShatterhand Garden of Death, near Belfast
    Posts: 805
    I'm not sure the screen-writers these days worry about story as such but concentrate more on the themes.

    In this, it's clear the main theme of Spectre is a riff on the Edward Snowdon revelations concerning surveillance by the NSA and the rest of the intelligence community. Similar to how SF riffed off the Wikileaks thing with the list of under-cover agents (which then got quickly forgotten among the other theme: Bond Rises).

    So, if that was the brief to Logan or indeed what was discussed with Mendes, it shouldn't have been too much of a surprise that he turned in a draft where someone inside MI6 was working 'in the shadows' to help along the Nine Eyes programme for SPECTRE. I wouldn't at all be surprised that Fiennes refusal to play the bad guy was what ultimately led to the major rewrites.
  • ThomasCrown76ThomasCrown76 Augusta, ks
    Posts: 757
    Fiennes must've blown a gasket when he heard that development
  • edited February 2015 Posts: 669
    Logan has said in a couple interviews I’ve seen that he always focuses on theme more than anything else. That might explain why his themes are always interesting but EVERYTHING else in his scripts, from plot to pacing to dialogue, are utter rubbish.
  • Ah, themes, rather than story. Just like how Forster wanted to concentrate on earth, wind, fire, water and not worry about details, like what year the movie was supposedly taking place.
  • Ah, themes, rather than story. Just like how Forster wanted to concentrate on earth, wind, fire, water and not worry about details, like what year the movie was supposedly taking place.

    He certainly didn't care about little details such as "What's happening during any given moment during an action scene."
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    Lest we don't forget Logan said he didn't want anymore to do with big productions... he was replaced etc... tabs were maybe not taken as should have been and we got the Brother theme after the SF mother theme... whatever but everyone was scrabbling to rewrite. Logan was never a good choice...
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    Dialogue utter rubbish? criticise Skyfall for many things like the plot holes but the dialogue being rubbish that is a stretch.

    I think the dialogue was probably the strongest of the Craig era, all the Craig films bar a few miss steps is better than any of that with in the Pierce era.
  • Shardlake, sorry - I actually wasn't referring to SF at all. That movie is so brilliant that I often forget Logan had anything to do with it! No, I'm referring to his other scripts like Star Trek: Nemesis and Gladiator.
  • edited February 2015 Posts: 2,015
    To answer an earlier poster’s question about the “hook” that Mendes and Logan came up with, my assumption is that the hook was quite simple: Bond goes up against Blofeld and SPECTRE. Clearly Logan took it in a different direction than Mendes and EON wanted, but I think the hook was probably as basic as that.

    Well in the leaks, the producers discussing the script write about the "hook" on at least two separate instances. And it is :

    - Warning "mega spoiler" -
    Bond's last mission

    But IMPORTANT : these are discussions from the end of 2013/beginning of 2014. Already more than one year ago. And we know that in the last screenplay available, Ernst survives, while he died in the old ones. So they might have had a change of mind about all this.
  • leas_moleleas_mole love is the promise of suffering
    Posts: 574
    I am really surprised that they would even consider that hook.
  • edited February 2015 Posts: 2,015
    He somehow has done this already once or twice in the movies, it seems spies
    can exit and come back in MI6 very easily
    . I don't know the UK system, but here in France it's an awful lot of papers to do such things even if you're not a spy :) But IMO, it's obsolete now.
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    If they make this
    Bond's last mission with the intention of rebooting again
    I think this a very bad idea to reboot again so soon and this would be the only option to go if this happened, I really hope we aren't getting Craig's last and he'll get at least one more before he bows out.
    Introducing Spectre and possibly Blofeld to spank it on one film is just a waste, from what I've read the rewrites are keeping Oberhauser alive with the inevitable likelihood he'll be revealed as ESB, this seems like an origin story for him and Spectre and the end with Bond going off with Swann does not spell the end, more likely a new beginning of Bond going up against Spectre.

    Let Craig do 1or 2 more then continue with a new actor with the same MI6 team as nothing has changed, just like they used to. To reboot like all these other franchises does seem to do is just not a good idea. Unless the Idris Elba thing is on the cards and then you are talking reboot, no other option but I seriously hope that doesn't happen.
  • Posts: 3,274
    They changed the colour:
    B9hHVfSIUAEunak.jpg
  • edited February 2015 Posts: 4,622
    Ah, themes, rather than story. Just like how Forster wanted to concentrate on earth, wind, fire, water and not worry about details, like what year the movie was supposedly taking place.

    Good one. The film was so obviously circa 2008, not actually right off the back of the events of CR, unless everyone went forward two years in time.
    Earth wind and rubbish. yawn. Olga looked real good though! There is that.

    ==fear of another re-boot IMO btw is a red herring. I cannot envision any scenario where an acutal reboot is needed.
    First of all, I think its a virtual lock that Craig is back for at least one more film, if he wants it, maybe even two. I'm happy to have him, if they can keep the personal drama under control, and that seems to be whats coming in SP. ie Bond has his mojo for the whole film.
    Although I prefer a younger Bond, in fact demand it when time to re-cast, I am not averse to an established Bond fully milking the role, BUT when it does come to recasting, go young again ie age 30.
    Lets get some prime years out of these guys, like we did with Sean and George, the two originals.
    New Bond can continue with the Craig history. Magic of cinema, and don't forget even though Craig was introduced rather aged in CR as new 007, it was in fact an orgins story.
    New Bond can compress the Craig era as his origins. We can just overlook how old the actors appeared to be, and appeared is the operative word, as age was never established in any of the Craig films. Even old-dog was just experienced. Ok he was old too, but we can pretend. The whole old-dog thing was swept under the rug by end of SF anyway and apparently not a trace left in SP, which is a good thing.
    Anyway Bond will continue in cinema long after we are all long dead. Magic of cinema requires that he be continually re-launched, not re-booted as Flemings perpetually dashing 30-something agent.
  • Posts: 725
    timmer wrote: »
    Ah, themes, rather than story. Just like how Forster wanted to concentrate on earth, wind, fire, water and not worry about details, like what year the movie was supposedly taking place.

    Good one. The film was so obviously circa 2008, not actually right off the back of the events of CR, unless everyone went forward two years in time.
    Earth wind and rubbish. yawn. Olga looked real good though! There is that.

    ==fear of another re-boot IMO btw is a red herring. I cannot envision any scenario where an acutal reboot is needed.
    First of all, I think its a virtual lock that Craig is back for at least one more film, if he wants it, maybe even two. I'm happy to have him, if they can keep the personal drama under control, and that seems to be whats coming in SP. ie Bond has his mojo for the whole film.
    Although I prefer a younger Bond, in fact demand it when time to re-cast, I am not averse to an established Bond fully milking the role, BUT when it does come to recasting, go young again ie age 30.
    Lets get some prime years out of these guys, like we did with Sean and George, the two originals.
    New Bond can continue with the Craig history. Magic of cinema, and don't forget even though Craig was introduced rather aged in CR as new 007, it was in fact an orgins story.
    New Bond can compress the Craig era as his origins. We can just overlook how old the actors appeared to be, and appeared is the operative word, as age was never established in any of the Craig films. Even old-dog was just experienced. Ok he was old too, but we can pretend. The whole old-dog thing was swept under the rug by end of SF anyway and apparently not a trace left in SP, which is a good thing.
    Anyway Bond will continue in cinema long after we are all long dead. Magic of cinema requires that he be continually re-launched, not re-booted as Flemings perpetually dashing 30-something agent.

    Totally agree on all points. They should indeed go young for the next Bond so we get at least 4-5 films out of him. It's also why Elba doesn't have a prayer of being the next Bond. He'll be 15 years too old once Craig leaves if they go for a young Bond. It's not his race that is the problem, it's his age.

  • aaron819aaron819 Switzerland
    Posts: 1,208
    Does anyone know if the crew have filmed the interior train scenes to Morocco. I know that they filmed the exterior shots of the desert in Morocco back in 2014. I wonder if the train interior will be at Pinewood, because the interior of the train doesn't look very nice.

    I think that the post by James 007 Facebook Page a couple of weeks ago, the post From Solden to Q stage. I think that they're filming the ICE Q Restaurant. There's no way they shot a 6 page script interior of the ICE Q restaurant in 4 days and the exterior and Bond fighting the henchmen outside of the clinic...

    Give your thoughts..
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