No Time To Die: Production Diary

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  • edited October 2017 Posts: 11,119
    Bounine wrote: »
    TripAces wrote: »
    I am beginning to think that with SP, the old adage is true: if you try to please everyone, you end up pleasing no one.

    Want lighter? They tried to make it lighter.
    Want more humor (as Cleese whined): They tried to include humor.
    Want "classic" Bond tropes? They offered classic Bond tropes, like the opening gun barrel and a train fight.
    Want a henchman? They gave you a henchman.
    Want the grittiness of previous Bonds? They put in some of the grittiness.
    Want the big production? Boy, did they ever give you a big production.

    And on and on.

    Problem is, in trying to include a bit of everything for all tastes, they had a mess on their hands.

    SP was a disappointing film -- the trailers (especially the teaser) set us up for that failure. But it was NOT a lousy film. Not at all.

    This is something I've been saying since the Brosnan era - inconsistency doesn't work. Unless a Bond film with Craig, returns to the gritty, darker tone of CR, QOS and SF, then Bond 25 will just be very average for me, as is Spectre. Craig can't pull off the lighthearted humour like Connery and Moore, anyway.

    I think currently the Bond fan community is divided into two camps it seems.

    A] There's the camp that is now desperate for a more larger-than-life, fun, "DAD"-like approach for Bond #25. And....
    B] There's the camp who foremost wants Daniel Craig to return, making this camp realize that the tone and style of his previous films will probably continue.

    I think I'm in between those two camps. I'm quite desperate for Craig's return. And he will return. But I would not like to see a pure "Logan"-esque, dramatic, dark send-off. I would like to see Bond #25 to be a further development of the character Bond and all its formulaic elements; the character we eventually all started to love. A bit like Connery's portrayal in "Goldfinger". This development already started a bit with "SPECTRE" -more humour, finally a 007 who's updating properly to 'M' in London-, and I would like to see that happen more.

    Yet I am also realistic enough that with Denis Villeneuve we would probably get a mixture in style and tone of "Sicario"/"Logan" and "Goldfinger"....if that does make sense??

    Regarding the two Bond camps: Let's be diplomatic...and find common ground hehe ;-).
  • Major_BoothroydMajor_Boothroyd Republic of Isthmus
    edited October 2017 Posts: 2,722
    I think Villeneuve is a good choice because he has a clarity of vision. The question is does he envision Bond the same way as others? Unlike the patchy Spotsiwoode and Tamahori led Brosnan era - I think Campbell, Foster and Mendes are all fine directors - so it comes down to the script which CR had nailed. With Villeneuve's past films plus the seeming narrative necessity of including both Blofeld/Swann I'm expecting the darker, personal stuff to return for a fifth straight film.

    But with Waltz, Sedouyx, Craig, Harris, Fiennes and Wishaw returning plus the possibility of a returning Hinx (?) then there isn't much to get excited about on the new cast announcement front. The exception being if they cast Irma Bunt - this could be an opportunity to reinvent the character and create a Fiona Volpe/ Xenia Onatopp style female nemesis for Craig's Bond (especially if she's the one responsible for Swann's death). Which ever direction they go I'm sure Villeneuve will have a clear end goal in mind and he seems to be able to communicate that with his cast and crew because they are quite striking films.

    Post-Craig era I'm looking forward to a return to more fantastical, less personal storylines. Along the lines of GF and TB. Mission Impossible 4 and 5 does this pretty well - where they have fantastical elements and outrageous stunts without getting too heavy into personal motivations driving everything.
  • Posts: 19,339
    Happy World James Bond Day all...

    Now regarding a special announcement or news,yes !!

    We have .....oh......er.....naff all....
  • Posts: 11,119
    barryt007 wrote: »
    Happy World James Bond Day all...

    Now regarding a special announcement or news,yes !!

    We have .....oh......er.....naff all....

    tHANKS @barryt007 :-D
  • Posts: 5,767
    Roadphill wrote: »
    Either George S Clinton or Michael Giacchino would clearly be good candidates for Bond 25 if they bring these sorts of sounds.
    Any composer can come up with a few minutes of Barry-esque sound. Making an hour or more of high quality soundtrack is an entirely different matter.

  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Which both of them could do easily.
  • Posts: 5,767
    I´m not too familiar with Clinton, but Giacchino´s only consistently good soundtrack is The Incredibles.

    Wait, that´s pure vintage Bond sound. Ok, let him have a go at it.
  • Posts: 4,619
    The only problem for me is EON can't depend on the talent of Campbell to introduce a new Bond actor forever.
    They won't need to.
  • Posts: 5,767
    Oh come on...
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    The only problem for me is EON can't depend on the talent of Campbell to introduce a new Bond actor forever.
    They won't need to.

    Nope.
  • Posts: 4,619
    peter wrote: »
    That sounds to me like either he is going to direct Bond 25, or he is still in the running at the very least. It seems the rumors about Demange being a done deal were false.

    @Murdock: Now I know that from now on I can dismiss any of your cinema related opinions. How can Nolan haters expect others to take them seriously when they are against one of the most talented directors (who also happens to be a huge Bond fan, and has proven time and time again that his style would fit the franchise like a glove) directing a Bond film? Being against Nolan directing a Bond film is simply not rational.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited October 2017 Posts: 15,717
    @Murdock: Now I know that from now on I can dismiss any of your cinema related opinions. How can Nolan haters expect others to take them seriously when they are against one of the most talented directors (who also happens to be a huge Bond fan, and has proven time and time again that his style would fit the franchise like a glove) directing a Bond film? Being against Nolan directing a Bond film is simply not rational.

    If that's how you are going to respect other member's opinions, you can get the hell off this forums and please don't come back. By talking like that to @Murdock, you are disqualified as a Bond fan.
  • edited October 2017 Posts: 2,599
    "I think currently the Bond fan community is divided into two camps it seems.

    A] There's the camp that is now desperate for a more larger-than-life, fun, "DAD"-like approach for Bond #25. And....
    B] There's the camp who foremost wants Daniel Craig to return, making this camp realize that the tone and style of his previous films will probably continue.

    I think I'm in between those two camps. I'm quite desperate for Craig's return. And he will return. But I would not like to see a pure "Logan"-esque, dramatic, dark send-off. I would like to see Bond #25 to be a further development of the character Bond and all its formulaic elements; the character we eventually all started to love. A bit like Connery's portrayal in "Goldfinger". This development already started a bit with "SPECTRE" -more humour, finally a 007 who's updating properly to 'M' in London-, and I would like to see that happen more.

    Yet I am also realistic enough that with Denis Villeneuve we would probably get a mixture in style and tone of "Sicario"/"Logan" and "Goldfinger"....if that does make sense??

    Regarding the two Bond camps: Let's be diplomatic...and find common ground hehe ;-).[/quote]"


    Personally, a Goldfingersque film is not something I want...at least definitely not with Craig as it just doesn't suit his style, although I won't be surprised at all if this is what we get.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    @Murdock: Now I know that from now on I can dismiss any of your cinema related opinions. How can Nolan haters expect others to take them seriously when they are against one of the most talented directors (who also happens to be a huge Bond fan, and has proven time and time again that his style would fit the franchise like a glove) directing a Bond film? Being against Nolan directing a Bond film is simply not rational.

    @PanchitoPistoles , Back at you buddy. how can anyone take someone who wants a Bond movie with no Bond theme seriously? Wanting a Bond film without good music is simply not rational. :)
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Murdock wrote: »
    @Murdock: Now I know that from now on I can dismiss any of your cinema related opinions. How can Nolan haters expect others to take them seriously when they are against one of the most talented directors (who also happens to be a huge Bond fan, and has proven time and time again that his style would fit the franchise like a glove) directing a Bond film? Being against Nolan directing a Bond film is simply not rational.

    @PanchitoPistoles , Back at you buddy. how can anyone take someone who wants a Bond movie with no Bond theme seriously? Wanting a Bond film without good music is simply not rational. :)

    Are you seriously insinuating that in a Bond movie, any music other than the Bond theme is automatically bad? Wanting a Bond film without good music really is not rational. Guess what? I want a Bond film with good music.

    As for you, @DaltonCraig007, my answer is that I have never respected opinions I deemed dumb, and I'm not going to start now.

    Oh of course not, There are lots of Non Bond theme related cues that are simply amazing. But given how poor the last two scores have been. A nice full use of the Bond theme (outside of the ending credits) would have been a wonderful treat for the ears instead of the vanilla and crackers Newman gave us. :)
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Thank you @DaltonCraig007, I respect that you want Nolan to direct a Bond film even though he's not my cup of tea. :-bd
  • Posts: 2,599
    Happy James Bond Day!
  • Posts: 11,119
    Bounine wrote: »

    Personally, a Goldfingersque film is not something I want...at least definitely not with Craig as it just doesn't suit his style, although I won't be surprised at all if this is what we get.

    That's why I said:
    Yet I am also realistic enough that with Denis Villeneuve we would probably get a mixture in style and tone of "Sicario"/"Logan" and "Goldfinger"....if that does make sense??

    ;-)

  • Post-Craig era I'm looking forward to a return to more fantastical, less personal storylines. Along the lines of GF and TB. Mission Impossible 4 and 5 does this pretty well - where they have fantastical elements and outrageous stunts without getting too heavy into personal motivations driving everything.


    Very much agree - I think the shift in tone is inevitable for at least a few reasons:

    -we're already seeing a bit of a lightening of the tone in the blockbuster space, after the success of things like Deadpool, Kingsman, and Guardians of the Galaxy; maybe the 'dark and gritty' thing is winding down.

    -whoever takes over from Craig would suffer badly from comparison to him if they tried to copy his "strong, silent type" approach to the character. You can't go much further down that road, I'm afraid.

    -Depending on who they cast, there may be no option. Hiddleston, for instance, would be absolutely perfect at playing Bond as the cheeky rake, but ill-suited to doing the hulking 'blunt instrument.'

    -a new actor and any sort of soft/hard reboot or reshuffle would also open up new story lines that could reward a different kind of approach. As has been said, the tone would clash too heavily during the Craig era, but perhaps from B26 they have a chance to do something more like an escapist adventure.

    I suppose we'll see.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Post-Craig era I'm looking forward to a return to more fantastical, less personal storylines. Along the lines of GF and TB. Mission Impossible 4 and 5 does this pretty well - where they have fantastical elements and outrageous stunts without getting too heavy into personal motivations driving everything.
    I agree, including with your examples. The two MI entries do that very well and they have the right star to pull off that tone.
    Bounine wrote: »
    Craig can't pull off the lighthearted humour like Connery and Moore, anyway.
    No, in my view he most definitely cannot, and shouldn't try.
    boldfinger wrote: »
    I´m not too familiar with Clinton, but Giacchino´s only consistently good soundtrack is The Incredibles.

    Wait, that´s pure vintage Bond sound. Ok, let him have a go at it.
    The Incredibles score is a masterpiece. What I like the most is the infusion of jazz with the orchestra. Very 60s and yet contemporary.
    peter wrote: »
    That sounds to me like either he is going to direct Bond 25, or he is still in the running at the very least. It seems the rumors about Demange being a done deal were false.
    I never saw Demange as an option with Craig. It never met the 'smell' test, especially post-Mendes. Villeneuve is definitely in the running and wants it. As he's said, it all comes down to scheduling.
  • Posts: 1,162
    boldfinger wrote: »
    Roadphill wrote: »
    Either George S Clinton or Michael Giacchino would clearly be good candidates for Bond 25 if they bring these sorts of sounds.
    Any composer can come up with a few minutes of Barry-esque sound. Making an hour or more of high quality soundtrack is an entirely different matter.

    Any composer? I bet you dollars to donuts that Newman couldn't even if his life depended on it.
  • Posts: 1,970
    Happy Bond day!

    Let’s hope we get some news today
  • Posts: 1,031
    Apparently Martin 'Robinson' isn't interested in Bond 25, they could at least get his name right!

    http://www.express.co.uk/entertainment/films/862464/Bond-25-director-return-if-Daniel-Craig-NOT-involved-Denis-Villeneuve-Martin-Campbell
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,575
    Great to see that Campbell Robinson (CR) is still interested in doing a future Bond film, but CR (Casino Royale) will certainly be a tough act to follow.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,591
    fjdinardo wrote: »
    Happy Bond day!

    Let’s hope we get some news today
    Don't think we'll be getting anything today.
  • 007Blofeld007Blofeld In the freedom of the West.
    Posts: 3,126
    Happy Global James Bond Day everyone!
  • Posts: 11,119
    Just posted a news article about the fact that it's now basically a three-horse fight between "Cleopatra" (Sony Pictures), "Dune" (Legendary/Universal) and "Bond 25" (MGM/EON) for winning director Denis Villeneuve first:
    https://www.jamesbond.nl/getouwtrek-om-canadese-filmregisseur-denis-villeneuve/
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited October 2017 Posts: 23,883
    Just posted a news article about the fact that it's now basically a three-horse fight between "Cleopatra" (Sony Pictures), "Dune" (Legendary/Universal) and "Bond 25" (MGM/EON) for winning director Denis Villeneuve first:
    https://www.jamesbond.nl/getouwtrek-om-canadese-filmregisseur-denis-villeneuve/
    I'm afraid I can't understand that, but from what I can glean from his comments elsewhere, Villeneuve doesn't want to lose Dune. It seems like that's the one he's most passionate about. He is a fan of Bond and wants to do it, but only if it won't mean losing Dune. That's my read on it. I'm not sure how he feels about Cleopatra.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    edited October 2017 Posts: 40,969
    Cleopatra only recently cropped up, and it seems that he really wants some time to ruminate on Dune, so I could easily see him diving into B25 before transitioning to that one, followed by Cleopatra if he still wished.
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