Where does Bond go after Craig?

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  • Posts: 4,603
    Little Nellie's daughter?

  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,579
    Jordo007 wrote: »
    Yeah good thinking on the product placement mate, that hasn't occurred to me.
    I personally wouldn't want a 60's era Bond again because that will always been Sean Connery

    I must admit I am nervous with the future of the series, because the world has changed so much in the last few years, I can see the producers changing fundamental parts of the character to appease modern sensibilities. I hope they hold their nerve, like they did brilliantly with keeping NTTD in cinemas. Time will tell

    Product placement can still work and be ultra cool at the same time.

    I am 100% behind a reboot to the Cold War (1955-1960ish).

    And looking at how Venom out-performed NTTD in the U.S., it's apparent to me that EON/Amazon needs to attract younger audiences because their target audience is dying out. A younger Bond (such as Ansel Elgort, as an example), in that 50s/60s era, with the right Bond girls being cast (such as Anya Taylor-Joy): that's a win, in my book.
  • SeveSeve The island of Lemoy
    Posts: 394
    Pre credit sequence. Wint and Kidd are "extractors"; they perform espionage using experimental military technology to infiltrate their targets' subconscious and extract information through a shared dream world. Their previous employer, Seraffimo Spang, wanted them to implant an idea in a certain person's subconscious. Spang wanted Wint & Kidd to convince James Bond, the top MI6 secret agent and assassin, that he was dead, which they did successfully in NTTD. Now MI6 have hired them to bring him back...
  • DoctorKaufmannDoctorKaufmann Can shoot you from Stuttgart and still make it look like suicide.
    Posts: 1,261
    Some people forget, that the Bond movies are not just made for us, the Bond fans, even if people would like to have it that way. They are made for the average group of moviegoers. The fans would not give the producers nenough cash to continue the series. Because they want make money with these films. Their least concern is to make all Bond fans happy. Which would be an impossible task, seeing the large variety of tastes represeneted in this forum. And yet again, Bond is a fictional character. He does not belong to the fans, and the producers are not obliged to please the fanbase. And Ian Fleming died in 1964, and probably would have gone mad about MR sending Bond into space.
  • StarkStark France
    edited October 2021 Posts: 177
    Before Spectre we know that the producers wanted to shoot 2 films in a row but Craig refused, maybe we will have Bond 26 and 27 shot back to back.
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,579
    Stark wrote: »
    Before Spectre we know that the producers wanted to shoot 2 films in a row but Craig refused, maybe we will have Bond 26 and 27 shot back to back.

    I have not heard this, but the SP shoot was long enough and grueling enough to become two films if they had wanted.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    I don't know where to put this.
    For those who are speculating about Boyle re NTTD and also hope to see Boyle still direct a Bond film in the future ...
  • BennyBenny Shaken not stirredAdministrator, Moderator
    Posts: 15,127
    I think whoever is cast as the next James Bond, the producers and director need to capitalize on Bond being English, a gentleman, a lover of fine foods and the finer things in life. Throw in some well known brands, that are top tier. Whilst the Craig films have next excluded Bond being a bit of a snob, they haven't ran with it either.

    'Vodka Martini'
    'Shaken or stirred Sir?'
    'Do I look like I give a damn!'


    And yes, this worked well for Craig's Bond and fit the scene well. However, going forward the film makers might want to steer clear of the Craig type tropes, and give their new actor a chance to establish his own persona. Similar to how Roger Moore in LALD, didn't do anything audiences would associate with Sean Connery.
    If you really want to mix it up, they could make Moneypenny a male character, and Q a female!
    Shocking. Positively shocking!
    Tell a story in a more simple, yet still exciting way. Make it grounded and thrilling. I know it's often cited as the template for many Bond films, but go back to FRWL. It's a thriller all the way. But also very simple in its execution. A real espionage caper, with a decent love interest and strong villains. I'm not saying remake FRWL, but use it as the basis of Bond 26. Another film of this ilk would be TLD. Throw in plenty of issues of trust and deceit, Bond in constant danger, using his wits to overcome a villainous plot, rather than some gadget. You can also cut back on the locales in a story like this, and thus keep the budget a lot tighter.
    Just a thought.

  • Posts: 526
    This will never happen, I know that...but indulge me: can you imagine if the ending of NTTD was all a setup for Craig to come back for one more? Some villain kills Mathilde and Swann, “somehow” Bond survived etc, and he comes back for revenge. I think it would be the highest grossing Bond ever. I know it’s not going to happen, but let me dream ... :D
  • quantumspectrequantumspectre argentina
    edited October 2021 Posts: 61
    after craig, the new 007 could have a aston dbs(instead of the db5), the 2008 quantum car but used again as the new 007 car, and no q or monneypenny , basically, all his missions with all his knowledge and his car. and he can sleep with some girls he met between missions, but no marriage.
  • MSL49MSL49 Finland
    Posts: 395
    Lighter back to Brosnan.
  • LeonardPineLeonardPine The Bar on the Beach
    Posts: 3,989
    One thing I'm sure about is that whoever gets the gig, they won't get the same courtesies extended to Craig. No producer credit or allowed to get bigger than the character. Not unless they have a SF type hit.
  • Posts: 12,526
    Whoever takes on the mantle? They need to keep it real still. But have humour too.
  • MSL49MSL49 Finland
    Posts: 395
    Barbara has someone spesific in mind.
  • TripAcesTripAces Universal Exports
    Posts: 4,579
    I don't know where to put this.
    For those who are speculating about Boyle re NTTD and also hope to see Boyle still direct a Bond film in the future ...

    I'm not sure I understand...this mostly looks like concept art for CJF's film. Was Boyle basically going to direct the same film? I was always under the impression that Boyle's ideas were different, and after he left the project, EON went back to the original script.
  • TripAces wrote: »
    Was Boyle basically going to direct the same film? I was always under the impression that Boyle's ideas were different, and after he left the project, EON went back to the original script.
    It definitely was a different story. As far as we know, his story involved Bond having a child from a past relationship (who was not Madeleine), a 350-foot rocket, a Russian Gulag, a Russian male villain, a Russian female (likely be the villain's partner), and a Māori henchman.
  • Posts: 526
    TripAces wrote: »
    Was Boyle basically going to direct the same film? I was always under the impression that Boyle's ideas were different, and after he left the project, EON went back to the original script.
    It definitely was a different story. As far as we know, his story involved Bond having a child from a past relationship (who was not Madeleine), a 350-foot rocket, a Russian Gulag, a Russian male villain, a Russian female (likely be the villain's partner), and a Māori henchman.

    That would have been 10 x better to me. What a shame. I would have left the child out completely though.
  • MSL49MSL49 Finland
    Posts: 395
    Boyle to direct next movie.
  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    edited November 2021 Posts: 1,731
    I have said it previously - I am not convinced they have done all that can be done with the character.

    There is a universe in which we can have a serious actor (even classically trained such as TD) bring a moderate but fresh take on 007, part fantasy, part heightened reality.
    Somewhere between DC's intensity & Dalton's Fleming-esque interpretation, but with enough self-awareness to make it fun, such as with Connery's early pseudo-realistic plots.
    You'd need a v good physical actor who is willing to understand the character.

    I feel TLD almost got this balance right - and something along the lines of the down-to-earth but still 'fun' writing of TLD and perhaps even GE is the direction they should be looking to take the series to at this point.


    The writing is key - and can easily be more in line with the style of the M:I series, without copying it - hence creating a visually pleasing action adventure that gives it's lead and main characters enough time to breathe.
    More snooping around, building the plot - less pure action, less country-hopping.

    Good plot development should negate the need for DC-universe melodrama. It CAN be done, but do Babs and MichaelGW have the nouse to find the right kind of writer(s)...?
  • So they need to address NTTD in some way to show Bond carries on and continues. They don't do a Diamonds are Forever and completely ignore it. I think this needs to be done in the Pre-Credits. A reintroduction of the character.

    I think it should be done in the form of a hybrid GoldenEye/Octopussy (Novel, not film)

    Pre Credits
    In flashbacks, A Navy Commander (face never seen) is on a mission or training exercise of some sorts with Major Dexter Smyth. Smythe is summarising to a figure that is clearly M (the office is a giveaway) about this person's actions. His brilliance. His potential. The last words of the Pre Credits should be Smythe saying to M the recruits name "Bond....James Bond"

    Main Story
    A young Bond and new 007 (think Connery in Dr No as opposed to Craig in Casino Royale), is a protégé Smythe. The film follows the Octopussy novel plot about Smythe disappearing but ultimately being revealed to be the villain.

    I think the first film doesn't need to be a story arc or be a fresh faced rookie Bond like Craig in CR and QoS. But clearly a newly appointed 007 on his mission without Smythe, his influence and his biggest supporter, and then finding out it was Smythe all along could be good. Dark. But include the big Bond elements and fun.

    Might be terrible actually haha
  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    Posts: 1,731
    So they need to address NTTD in some way to show Bond carries on and continues. They don't do a Diamonds are Forever and completely ignore it. I think this needs to be done in the Pre-Credits. A reintroduction of the character.

    I think it should be done in the form of a hybrid GoldenEye/Octopussy (Novel, not film)

    Pre Credits
    In flashbacks, A Navy Commander (face never seen) is on a mission or training exercise of some sorts with Major Dexter Smyth. Smythe is summarising to a figure that is clearly M (the office is a giveaway) about this person's actions. His brilliance. His potential. The last words of the Pre Credits should be Smythe saying to M the recruits name "Bond....James Bond"

    Main Story
    A young Bond and new 007 (think Connery in Dr No as opposed to Craig in Casino Royale), is a protégé Smythe. The film follows the Octopussy novel plot about Smythe disappearing but ultimately being revealed to be the villain.

    I think the first film doesn't need to be a story arc or be a fresh faced rookie Bond like Craig in CR and QoS. But clearly a newly appointed 007 on his mission without Smythe, his influence and his biggest supporter, and then finding out it was Smythe all along could be good. Dark. But include the big Bond elements and fun.

    Might be terrible actually haha

    I like it. This sort of reboot but with a solid Fleming thread throughout the story.
  • AceHole wrote: »
    So they need to address NTTD in some way to show Bond carries on and continues. They don't do a Diamonds are Forever and completely ignore it. I think this needs to be done in the Pre-Credits. A reintroduction of the character.

    I think it should be done in the form of a hybrid GoldenEye/Octopussy (Novel, not film)

    Pre Credits
    In flashbacks, A Navy Commander (face never seen) is on a mission or training exercise of some sorts with Major Dexter Smyth. Smythe is summarising to a figure that is clearly M (the office is a giveaway) about this person's actions. His brilliance. His potential. The last words of the Pre Credits should be Smythe saying to M the recruits name "Bond....James Bond"

    Main Story
    A young Bond and new 007 (think Connery in Dr No as opposed to Craig in Casino Royale), is a protégé Smythe. The film follows the Octopussy novel plot about Smythe disappearing but ultimately being revealed to be the villain.

    I think the first film doesn't need to be a story arc or be a fresh faced rookie Bond like Craig in CR and QoS. But clearly a newly appointed 007 on his mission without Smythe, his influence and his biggest supporter, and then finding out it was Smythe all along could be good. Dark. But include the big Bond elements and fun.

    Might be terrible actually haha

    I like it. This sort of reboot but with a solid Fleming thread throughout the story.

    I think by recognising the existence of James Bond in pre Credits without him being seen (facially) or heard followed by a "10 years later" message flashing up after the title song is a great way to introduce the new Bond. You can then have a mini "Pre-Credits" after the song where you see the new Bond on a mission before launching into the full story.
  • The Smythe plot reminds me of Batman Begins and what GoldenEye could've been with Hopkins as Trevelyan.
  • Actually, to adapt my idea above, the pre-credits mission could be the plot of From A View To A Kill. Told in flashbacks. A helmeted Bond. Face never revealed.
  • edited November 2021 Posts: 624
    The pre-title sequence needs to show an established Bond enter Moneypenny's [not Naomie Harris] office. Moneypenny looks a bit surprised to see him and Bond says something like "Were you expecting someone else?" wink wink

    "No, you just startled me a bit. M [Ralph Fiennes] doesn't have any meetings today."

    "He cleared his schedule because I'm meeting him to conduct a bit of personal business at Blades. A fellow named [not Hugo Drax because don't reuse characters] is becoming a bit of a nuisance. Cheating at cards, M suspects."
    ....

    Followed by a faithful Moonraker novel movie.

    They can't call it Moonraker though so, maybe call it Spacex a chapter title from the book like Zero Minus or something.

    The "expecting someone else" line should be the only reference made to this being a new timeline. It may be a bit too on the nose, but I want all these annoying "replace James Bond with Mathilde or Nomi" or "Bond is a codename" people quashed and that would just be a little jab to them.

  • The pre-title sequence needs to show an established Bond enter Moneypenny's [not Naomie Harris] office. Moneypenny looks a bit surprised to see him and Bond says something like "Were you expecting someone else?" wink wink

    "No, you just startled me a bit. M [Ralph Fiennes] doesn't have any meetings today."

    "He cleared his schedule because I'm meeting him to conduct a bit of personal business at Blades. A fellow named [not Hugo Drax because don't reuse characters] is becoming a bit of a nuisance. Cheating at cards, M suspects."
    ....

    Followed by a faithful Moonraker novel movie.

    They can't call it Moonraker though so, maybe call it Spacex a chapter title from the book like Zero Minus or something.

    The "expecting someone else" line should be the only reference made to this being a new timeline. It may be a bit too on the nose, but I want all these annoying "replace James Bond with Mathilde or Nomi" or "Bond is a codename" people quashed and that would just be a little jab to them.

    This I could firmly get behind. I particularly like the flippant exchange you suggest to bury the Craig universe in the past and highlight that "we're back in business, in a new universe".
  • AceHoleAceHole Belgium, via Britain
    Posts: 1,731
    The pre-title sequence needs to show an established Bond enter Moneypenny's [not Naomie Harris] office. Moneypenny looks a bit surprised to see him and Bond says something like "Were you expecting someone else?" wink wink

    "No, you just startled me a bit. M [Ralph Fiennes] doesn't have any meetings today."

    "He cleared his schedule because I'm meeting him to conduct a bit of personal business at Blades. A fellow named [not Hugo Drax because don't reuse characters] is becoming a bit of a nuisance. Cheating at cards, M suspects."
    ....

    Followed by a faithful Moonraker novel movie.

    They can't call it Moonraker though so, maybe call it Spacex a chapter title from the book like Zero Minus or something.

    The "expecting someone else" line should be the only reference made to this being a new timeline. It may be a bit too on the nose, but I want all these annoying "replace James Bond with Mathilde or Nomi" or "Bond is a codename" people quashed and that would just be a little jab to them.

    Just the ticket.
    The only original thing left to 'do' in the cinematic Bond franchise is to go full out literary Bond. Blades, Bond's Appartment, Double crossing agents...,

    CR used Fleming's CR gambling plot to launch Craig as 007 - use Moonraker's Blades plot to launch out NEXT 007 !!
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,392
    I just know they have to focus on a cool standalone mission with a strong plot, good characters and good set pieces. The Craig films including B25 are just so desperate to garner some kind of emotional reaction out of you, and play on your heartstrings that the plot and everything else takes a back seat. The writing of the last few films is seriously messy with loose threads galore, they need to just focus on getting the basics right first, and writing a script that is funny, actionpacked and fresh. There is so much loose baggage in these movies now that the real story gets completely strangled to death. I really think Chrishtopher Nolan would be ideal as a next director, because he literally got criticised alot for the same thing, and his last 2 movies have been experiments in staying in the present moment, narratively speaking, and characters moving forward through a story with only the information at hand. He has been very open about exploring the idea of audiences connection to characters being based more on the visceral experience of spending time in their shoes rather than a complicated backstory or heavy exposition. A director that thinks like this is exactly what Bond is screaming out for right now IMO, because the few films don't feel like visceral experiences in the same way like Goldfinger and The Spy Who Loved Me were. When he describes Dunkirk as a "third act where we don't see the first two acts, we just jump in and go" That's exactly what Bond needs, that rollarcoaster ride feeling and genuine exhilaration. I have never gotten that with the Craig, especially the later films, because it always feels like the plot is only there to serve as a backdrop, and the real meat of story is what happens to be going on inside Bonds noggin. I also think that by getting out of Bond inner demons we can avoid a lot of the "should Bond really be" debates that seem to rage nowadays. Bond was never supposed to be a sympathetic character, despite Craig and Babs trying their hardest to turn him into one. We want him to succeed because his mission is important, but the character himself is at best morally dubious. By getting away from his personal side, we can be back on the outside looking in, and just observing, and still being invested because he has to save the world and he's the only one who can do it. Nolan explains in this cool video how audiences can be made to empathise, at least in the moment, with morally dubious characters by using the example of Psycho.

  • MSL49MSL49 Finland
    Posts: 395
    I agree mendes4lyfe.
  • With Marvel Studios known for mapping out arcs with a collective goal in mind that spans several franchises and yesterday's slate of their Disney + content, EoN going forward, need to decide definitively if they want the next tenure to tell a complete story over several films (handled better than the sloppily put together Craig era) or return to telling stand alone adventures. They've already had enough time to figure this out and whatever they decide they need to be intentional and committed.

    Personally, I feel Bond really needs to stand out from the crowd and diversify their creativity with each release, so I'm definitely hoping for a return to stand alone adventures now that we supposedly have the cleanest slate coming up since these movies began.
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