The Next American President Thread (2016)

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  • Posts: 315
    bondjames wrote: »
    what exactly do you mean? "You'll see"?

    This means that, come November, she will become the president, and in the course of the next four years we'll all be able see whether I was right or wrong.
    I'm checking out now. :)
    I agree completely @Superintendent, and said as much in mid June on this thread.

    Huh? That's a lie. I refer everyone to the 2nd post of this long thread where you said:

    My money is on Trump or Sanders.

    Possibly you should stay in the imaginary apt. or was it a condo and get your stories straight.
  • Posts: 2,341
    Trump asks Vladimir Putin to commit espionage against the very country he is attempting to become President...
    He called for the assassination of his opponent for that same office...
    DOJ ? Homeland Security ? Secret Service ?FBI ? Where are you?
    Republican Leadership not throwing him under the bus (speaker Ryan in particular)
    What is going on here?

    Police officers kill unarmed citizens over minor traffic infractions and violations and this rich man is able to commit serious offenses and nothing is done?

    America is an obligarchy...Period.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Lets not pretend that Hillary doesn t support murder.
  • Posts: 2,341
    Lets not pretend that Hillary doesn t support murder.

    Support murder? Her husband is in favor of capital punishment.

    Clinton voted for the Iraq War...
    She wants to keep the tradition of terrorizing the Middle East (a western practice that has gone on since the Crusades)

    But I trust her with our nuclear codes and appointing federal judges more than the Trumpster.


  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited August 2016 Posts: 12,480
    Feb piece on Trump's using conspiracy theories (he is quite comfortable with that it seems - and this has played out all along, I think)

  • Let's not pretend that murder and military action by US armed forces, when performed according to US law and duly authorized by Congress and the President are the same thing. They're not. Nor, for that matter, is capital punishment when someone is found guilty of a capital crime. And I'm speaking as someone who is opposed to capital punishment and who demonstrated against the War in Iraq.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    If someone does something stupid because of what he has said, would he get in trouble THEN-??
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited August 2016 Posts: 12,480
    A lighter moment for us ... not really political, just so ... American in a way:



    oh and here is the video bit that works (giant suction cups ..!)
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    A human fly in the ointment!
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    Yes, we needed another one. ;)
  • Posts: 15,125
    chrisisall wrote: »
    If someone does something stupid because of what he has said, would he get in trouble THEN-??

    Well, Trump is already losing the election. He might still win, but so far he's been digging his own political grave.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited August 2016 Posts: 12,480
    There is a lot here. Direct quotes from Trump, the past 100 days of his campaign (tweets, etc.) . Read it all or skip around, what you feel like doing: http://www.politico.com/story/2016/08/donald-trump-100-days-226850
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    There is a lot here. Direct quotes from Trump, the first 100 days since he became the official Republican nominee for president. Read it all or skip around, what you feel like doing: http://www.politico.com/story/2016/08/donald-trump-100-days-226850
    It's a verbal horror show.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    I like that because it mentions what was going on at the time, what he tweeted, what else was happening that he ignored. It is not a strongly biased write up. Just list things chronologically and I think it is helpful.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited August 2016 Posts: 23,883
    FLeiter wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    what exactly do you mean? "You'll see"?

    This means that, come November, she will become the president, and in the course of the next four years we'll all be able see whether I was right or wrong.
    I'm checking out now. :)
    I agree completely @Superintendent, and said as much in mid June on this thread.

    Huh? That's a lie. I refer everyone to the 2nd post of this long thread where you said:

    My money is on Trump or Sanders.

    Possibly you should stay in the imaginary apt. or was it a condo and get your stories straight.
    Interesting that you went back to the 2nd post, when we were still in the primary stages, to make your point. As far as I can see, Trump is the nominee, isn't he, or are you one of the Never Trumpites?

    Moreover, my quote above says 'if she wins': a point that has obviously been missed by you during your attempts to be disparaging.

    Insults here, selective posts to make your point, abusive photo posts there. Hmm.
  • edited August 2016 Posts: 11,119
    bondjames wrote: »
    Insults here, selective posts to make your point, abusive photo posts there. Hmm.

    Selective no more my dear @BondJames ;-). Like I said on page 94 the game is far from over. And these recent articles on Politico.com and TheNation.com basically enhance my worries. They give a fresh perspective on worries within the Democratic Party. So for every Hillary-supporter, please hold your breath:

    Top Democrats warn against writing off Trump:
    http://www.politico.com/story/2016/08/top-democrats-warn-against-writing-off-trump-226855

    Are Hillary Clinton’s Strong Poll Numbers Misleading?:
    https://www.thenation.com/article/are-hillary-clintons-strong-poll-numbers-misleading/

    From now on I will try to focus my posts about, in posting some very interesting 'Pro-Donald!' articles and 'Pro Hillary!' articles.




    PRO HILLARY!


    Clinton Has Nearly Caught Up To Trump In Media Coverage:

    The media coverage about Trump has been frequently discussed. On many occasions The Donald has complained that the media is biased and is nothing more than one big arm of Hillary's campaign. Well, is that true? On FiveThirtyEight.com (please bookmark it) there's this interesting article that looks into the media coverage for both candidates:
    http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/clinton-has-nearly-caught-up-to-trump-in-media-coverage/

    Regardless of being pro-Hillary or pro-Trump media coverage, Donald Trump is most certainly the winner when it comes down to media coverage. 'The Big Arm Of Hillary's Campaign' surely wasn't strong enough to let Hillary win the amount of media coverage. Is it because....Trump is a master (or a fool) in drawing all attention to his campaign for the right (or wrong) reasons?

    Clinton's Lies, Trump's Damned Lies:

    The comparison is as interesting as this one, that is focusing on the lies uttered by both the Trump campaign and the Clinton campaign. Electoral-Vote.com:
    http://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2016/Pres/Maps/Aug08.html#item-8
    The British politician Benjamin Disraeli once said: "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." In other words, there are varying degrees and types of dishonesty. Anyone who has been watching this year's election knows that both Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump have an honesty problem. But are they dishonest to the same degree? The New York Times' Nicholas Kristof has taken a look, and concluded that they most certainly are not. He puts it thusly: "The idea that they are even in the same league is preposterous. If deception were a sport, Trump would be the Olympic gold medalist; Clinton would be an honorable mention at her local Y."

    Kristof starts his case with some raw data, looking at the numbers from several fact-checking sites. The Washington Post Fact-Checker finds that Trump tells flat-out lies 4.5 times as often as Clinton; Politifact says it's nine times as often. Kristof also observes that with Clinton, the same handful of lies (email server, gunfire in Bosnia, TPP) are brought up over and over. With Trump, by contrast, there are bushels of brand-new lies every day. In fact, Politico estimated that Trump was guilty of a misstatement once every 5 minutes, while HuffPo once caught 71 distortions and inaccuracies in a single hour.

    With both parties, their approach to the truth reflects a clear strategic and philosophical choice: Clinton embraces your garden variety politician's blend of mostly truth mixed with a bit of fiction when the truth is uncomfortable, while for Trump lying and exaggeration are core tenets. Kristof recounts an anecdote from one of Trump's lawyers, in which he noticed that every newspaper story about Trump's penthouse apartment listed a different number of rooms. When he asked The Donald how many rooms were actually in the apartment, the reply was: "However many they will print." (Z)

    Now, I am seriously worried about this. Perhaps the reasons why people (especially non-educated, white, working-class men) swallow Trump's lies more easily than Clinton's, is the mere fact that Trump is an outsider, and Clinton is an insider. Trump is open and clear about his lies, whereas Hillary talks around it all the time. Yet, in both cases we still need to look at the core definition of a lie. And if we don't do that anymore, than our society does have a problem.......an worrysome ethical problem in which morale doesn't matter anymore. Except the person who's uttering the lie.


    PRO DONALD!


    New Hillary Clinton Emails Suggest Aides Intervened on Behalf of Donors:

    We still have to wait for a big 'October Surprise' presented by Raoul Silva.....ehh, sorry.....Julian Assange. But the conservative watchdog group Judicial Watch is delivering us the first course on a menu that's best served chilled. And this article from Time.com is indeed a worrysome. Like my previous post on page 94, this article gives you some insight in the Clinton Foundation and its SPECTRE-esque tentacles:
    http://time.com/4446418/hillary-clinton-emails-donors/

    An October Surprise For Hillary Clinton:

    In case you really believe in the Bond film 'Skyfall' turned into reality, then this could do it. An 'October Surprise' really is on its way. As we know already, WikiLeaks did some serious damage with regard to the Democratic National Committee (pro-Russian hacker Guccifer 2.0). Chairman Wasserman-Schultz had to step down. And ad-interim chair Donna Brazile is still busy cleaning the mess. Julian Assange already hinted that next in line of damaging leaks could be Hillary Clinton herself. From PoliticalWire.com:
    https://politicalwire.com/2016/08/09/an-october-surprise-for-hillary-clinton/.

    Make no mistake, @BondJames several times said that all these hacks and leaks are only sidetracks. But I think they could become damaging if new leaks give away some dirty information about one of the Clinton Foundation's 'bundlers' (people, and even foreign nations contributing $10.000,- or more). If one of these 'bundlers' have actively funded some efforts to get co-founder Hillary Clinton elected as US-Senator or...President, then that's damaging. Make no mistake, I hate men like Julian Assange, and I think for that reason he should hack Trump's tax returns. He might even imply that a former DNC-employee turned into a WikiLeaks informant and was killed for it. But fact is, the Democrats were hacked, and they should be serious about this.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    What they are really saying is don't underestimate the stupidity and ignorance of the voting public.
  • Posts: 11,119
    What they are really saying is don't underestimate the stupidity and ignorance of the voting public.

    You mean the articles I just posted @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 (sjee, what a nickname :-P )
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    Trump wants to win, but he doesn't want the JOB.
  • edited August 2016 Posts: 11,119
    Just saw that FiveThirtyEight.com has another great documentary online. It's about the Dukakis campaign for the 1988 US presidency.

    http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/film-how-to-destroy-a-presidential-candidate/

    How Vice President George H.W. Bush overtook Dukakis in the polls and won the election. And the fundamental question is: Do campaigns have defining moments?

    Having watched the above documentary, makes me think that the 2016 campaign is on some aspects quite similar to the 1988 campaign. Like 1988, when a Bush presidency felt like a 3rd Reagan term, this year could feel like a 3rd Obama term if Clinton gets elected.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    What they are really saying is don't underestimate the stupidity and ignorance of the voting public.

    You mean the articles I just posted @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 (sjee, what a nickname :-P )

    What I mean is, when people consistently say, "Hey, don't write off a Trump victory," I think they are really only saying, "Watch out for our nation's voters, some of these fools are imbecilic enough to vote Trump in!"
  • Posts: 11,119
    What they are really saying is don't underestimate the stupidity and ignorance of the voting public.

    You mean the articles I just posted @0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 (sjee, what a nickname :-P )

    What I mean is, when people consistently say, "Hey, don't write off a Trump victory," I think they are really only saying, "Watch out for our nation's voters, some of these fools are imbecilic enough to vote Trump in!"

    I prefer using the quote "Hey, don't write off a Trump victory" and stick to it. Realists go across partylines. You have Democratic realists, Republican realists, and most of these realists agree one one thing, again: "Hey, don't write off a Trump victory"

  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited August 2016 Posts: 23,883
    It will be a close election but I believe there will be a 'break' for one candidate after the first debate. I don't see any surprises changing the trajectory that will be established after that first, or perhaps after the 2nd debate, no matter what is thrown out there.

    Clinton has turned the general election campaign (since the Convention) into a referendum on Trump rather than a referendum on Obama. So far it's working, in no small part due to Trump's own missteps, and with media complicity. The debates give an opportunity for him to turn that around and establish himself as a credible alternative, or conversely Clinton cleans his clock and moves forward with a commanding lead and onto a win.

    What we're seeing now is an 'as expected' well funded campaign to solidify opinions about Trump at an early stage of the general election so that he can't grow his base. Clinton is massively outspending him on the air and in network advertising. So far it's working according to the polls, but this could still turn on a dime because Clinton has high negatives in a lot of the polling data, and those polled may not be being truthful to the pollsters either.

    He's raised a lot of money in the past few months but has spent very little of it. What he plans to do with the money and what kind of on-air campaign he intends to fight remains to be seen. I doubt it will be standard advertising fare. More likely something unusual that we should look for.

    It's interesting that the 1988 Bush/Dukakis campaign was mentioned. That is the only recent one where an effective third term was granted (in this case to Bush to carry on Reagan's legacy). That was a nasty campaign, and Dukakis as 'change candidate' was butchered early (as being weak and insensitive). That playbook is in effect again (this time portraying the 'change candidate' as dangerous and insensitive), but Trump is not Dukakis and his support is more entrenched, so I am not sure if it will work.

    I think this will either be a replay of 1979, where Reagan came from behind for a big surprise win after over performing against expectations in that first and only debate, or it will be a replay of 1988, where 'incumbent candidate' Bush took a lead in September and went on for the win because the alternative was seen as untenable - not because Bush was seen as great.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited August 2016 Posts: 12,480
    Just saying I have been pro Obama and still am. Many are not, I know. Referendum on Obama would not cut it, in my opinion.

    As I mentioned earlier, I think the choice is clear. If it is a close election, that says a lot of sad sorry things about our citizens. This is far from being a replay of any previous elections. Trump is overboard, far overboard.
  • Posts: 2,341
    I don't know how anyone can defend or vote for Trump. forget about making America great again, forget about his wife posing nude twenty years ago, forget about his calling on Russian espionage and gun crazies to take care of Clinton, : forget about Clinton and the goddamned emails, forget about being tired of business as usual in Washington and ask yourselves :

    "Do you trust him with our nuclear arsenal? the nuclear codes?"
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    edited August 2016 Posts: 8,400
    Hilary is far worse for the country in the long run than Trump. Saying some off colour remarks on a podium does not necessarily translate into a fascist dictator. The only people who believe that are those who WANT to believe it as a means of discrediting a candidate they don't agree with.

    There is no successor to Trump. If he messes things up, there will almost certainly be an opportunity to correct the mistakes down the road. Thats how a presidency should work. With Hillary, she is taking the reins of someone brought by banks and special interests, and she will continue that course towards a globalist future. We may as well have given Obama a third term, because its the same god damn thing if he's there or not there.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    It is interesting to read that someone would say Hilary is far worse for the country in the long run than Trump. Just .... interesting. That's all I'll say about your statement.
  • Posts: 1,631
    Both would make for terrible presidents. Hillary might end up being less bad than Trump, but that doesn't make her a good choice.

    I'll be casting my vote for Gary Johnson. If he can win just one state (he's surging in Utah, according to recent polls), and the rest of the map falls just right, the election could be thrown to the House of Representatives, at which point I'd love to see those fools have to make that difficult decision. Elect the idiot that is actually their party's nominee, swallow a rather bitter pill and go across the aisle and put Hillary in office, or do something bold and go with a former member of their party in Johnson who most likely has more in common with Republican ideology than Trump does.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,804
    It is interesting to read that someone would say Hilary is far worse for the country in the long run than Trump. Just .... interesting. That's all I'll say about your statement.

    I'll say more: Trump is mindless evil incarnate. :D
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Words inspire, both good and bad. Anyone who wants to be in elected office must be aware of all they are feeding the populace and their supporters while at the lecturn. People are so keen on being martyrs these days, it doesn't take much to light the flame of idiocy under their arses. Of course, I think most of the people Trump "inspires" would be the kinds of people the feds find out immediately and capture before they can do any damage to the rest of us. After all, these are the types that would buy all their bomb-making materials at the same store, order ammunition for guns in the tons at a local gun store and red flag themselves, or brag about their big plot to their cousin at the bar stool in earshot of everyone. We needn't fear, methinks.

    Nor do we need to fear a Trump presidency. I don't have much faith in people, but I haven't written humanity off that much to think such an event would come to pass. If I thought it was a foregone conclusion, I'd love all hope in people doing anything right. This is the easiest decision that can be made, and yet we have people still confused or conflicted about it. Hillary will be more of the same in the Obama vein, maybe with a bit more military carnage (America's favorite), but still very status quo to how we now know Washington to operate.

    With Trump, however-you know what, I'm not even going to entertain the idea. Just wait until the debates come, then see how much of a chance Trump has when he is forced to stop running his mouth about cooky ideas in order to deliver actual policy plans, which will in all likelihood be more cooky ideas. Unless his team can slip him a new brain and filter his big mouth, I'd say it's a done deal at this point in time. Of course his ego is too big to just give up now, especially to a woman of all people, so he'll ride out this failure to the very end.

    Use up all that money, Donald, go right ahead. And spread your silver spoon message to your "followers" with that big mouth of yours. After all, you know words. You've got the best words. But not grammar. Not the very best grammar.
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