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Miss Moneypenny 00?

stagstag In the thick of it!
in General Discussion Posts: 1,053
This thought occurred to my while watching the SF PTS (I like to watch them as stand alones on occasion). Given the fact that Miss Moneypenny was issued with weaponry, has obviously had training beyond her remit as M's secretary & crucially was ordered to open fire by M - hitting Bond by mistake - in the world of JBs MI6 surely this means she has a double 0 prefix?

Comments

  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    She was a field agent anyhow. It builds on what Lois Maxwell had in mind for killing Miss Money penny off on a field mission.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    stag wrote:
    This thought occurred to my while watching the SF PTS (I like to watch them as stand alones on occasion). Given the fact that Miss Moneypenny was issued with weaponry, has obviously had training beyond her remit as M's secretary & crucially was ordered to open fire by M - hitting Bond by mistake - in the world of JBs MI6 surely this means she has a double 0 prefix?

    'Surely'?

    Well for a start we have no idea if she has killed anyone before and even if she had we all know it takes...
    Two.

    In addition we have no idea of MI6 rules of engagement or the fine print of being a double 0.

    It could be that in extreme situations MI6 field agents are allowed to kill. And even here M ordering her to 'take the bloody shot' in a stressful, fluid situation is far removed from ordering a double O to go and assassinate Dryden in cold blood.

    The fact she merely fires a weapon in the line of duty is scant evidence from which to infer that 'surely' she has a double O prefix.

    This has about as much credibility as the codename theory of you ask me. Although send it to P&W by all means and no doubt they will include it in the next film.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited August 2016 Posts: 23,883
    Please don't give Mendes any more revisionist ideas! He may agree to come back and give us another mangling of a much loved character.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,183
    Agreed with @TheWizardOfIce. 00 status counts for more than just the ability to shoot someone. If not, any soldier who's killed at least two enemies could be made a 00 on the spot. What about all those other talents a 00 has to display?

    Naomi Harris could have been playing a 00 in SF, except they chose to make her MP and immediately the context changes. Now, she's the secretary with some field experience but without the cleverness and improvisational skills that Bond has. She's not the clever field operative whose unique knowledge of some office software made her the excellent candidate for a desk job.
  • daltondalton
    Posts: 1,631
    There's not really any evidence in Skyfall to suggest that Moneypenny is a Double-oh. She's a field agent, probably not unlike those that were on the NOC List that she and Bond were trying to retrieve. If she were a Double-oh, then that would stand to suggest that all of the other agents on that list were as well, which I think it's fair to say that they weren't.
  • stagstag In the thick of it!
    edited August 2016 Posts: 1,053
    For starters I was having a little dig about the direction in which the characters are being taken & I forgot about the requirement to have two kills. But Surely any field agent who is armed & therefore authorised to use deadly force has a licence to kill? License to kill being the official sanction by a government or government agency to a particular operative or employee to initiate the use of lethal force in the delivery of their objectives, it is well known as a literary device used in espionage fiction. Didn't Fleming write a 00 was awarded because you've had to kill a chap in cold blood in the course of some assignment. Moneypenny's attempted shooting is classic cold blood stuff - the target is not shooting at her & she is in no personal danger.

    The two can of course be distinguished as different entities but, going by recent films at least are we being led to believe that the licence to kill is being applied in a wider context?
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited August 2016 Posts: 23,883
    I had a discussion with a few members here a while back about Silva. Was he a 00? I thought so initially (he knew how to handle a gun, as evidenced by his cool killing of Severine). He even worked for and reported directly to M. I thought he was, but members convinced me I was mistaken.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,281
    bondjames wrote: »
    I had a discussion with a few members here a while back about Silva. Was he a 00? I thought so initially (he knew how to handle a gun, as evidenced by his cool killing of Severine). He even worked for and reported directly to M. I thought he was, but members convinced me I was mistaken.

    Yes, perhaps it's the Alec Trevelyan Effect? There are certain similarities between the two.
  • thelivingroyalethelivingroyale
    Posts: 12,837
    I think if we saw another 00 on screen, it'd be made clear. That alone rules out Moneypenny (who seemed way too inexperienced to be a 00) and Silva (he was stationed in Hong Kong while the 00's are based in London and travel the world) imo.

    The way I've always thought of it is that obviously, in a life or death situation, an MI6 agent may have to kill and general field agents carry weapons (like Bond did in the CR PTS, or am I remembering wrong? And moneypenny did) but 00 agents are authorised to kill as they see fit. The licence to kill means that if they're on a mission and decide that someone needs taking out, even if they're not a direct threat, they're authorised to do so. Whereas a normal field agent would have to be placed into a firefight or something to kill without permission.

    The two kills I think are assassination jobs. To become a 00 you have to complete two authorised kills, assassinations if you like. For example, Bond decides Drydren's contact needs to die, asks M for permission, she grants it. Whereas if now, when he's a 00, he decided someone needed eliminating over the course of a mission, he could do it without contacting MI6. Just has to include it in his report afterwards. I think if they kill someone in a firefight or some other unavoidable situation, that probably doesn't count. It has to be an assassination mission or at least an authorised kill.

    So basically I think normal field agents can kill if they have to, and maybe even assassinate if they get permission, but a 00 is a more experienced killer so they're trusted make the choice for themself. I doubt every agent with two kills gets promoted to 00 either. It's a requirement but that won't necesarily mean they're cut out for the job. I think M makes this clear when she says it was too early to promote Bond (regardless of his two kills).
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited August 2016 Posts: 9,117
    Apart from anything else is anyone seriously suggesting that Bond wouldnt absolutely batter MP in about 3 seconds flat if they went at it bare knuckled mano a womano?

    She's hardly Trevelyan is she. Surely to be a 00 its not enough to be able to shoot a target with a sniper rifle (and she cant even do that - she hits Bond)? Surely you have to be a bit handy in a rumble as well?

    This whole notion is ludicrous quite frankly.
  • stagstag In the thick of it!
    Posts: 1,053
    As ludicrous as the notion that Blofeld had his nose put out of joint by the arrival of the usurper boy Bond who went on to win the affection of young Franz Oberhauser's father. This had such a profound effect on Franz that instead of drawing glasses & a mustache on Bond's favourite poster in retaliation, his nose was put out of joint to such an extent that he felt the only appropriate course of action open to him was to found a global criminal empire from where he could direct operations & be the author of James Bond's pain.

    The Celluloid Miss Moneypenny hasn't been tested in hand to hand combat on screen (yet) but I'm guessing she would at least be as proficient as 'Our Stacey' in her Charlie's Angels guise or indeed perhaps even Purdey? Indeed Purdey has been trained by British intelligence so her 'skills' may be more akin to those of Moneypenny's?

    The two graphic & highly realistic fight scenes below demonstrate perfectly that - in certain circumstances - the female of the species can indeed be more deadly than the male.





  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    edited August 2016 Posts: 9,117
    stag wrote: »
    As ludicrous as the notion that Blofeld had his nose put out of joint by the arrival of the usurper boy Bond who went on to win the affection of young Franz Oberhauser's father. This had such a profound effect on Franz that instead of drawing glasses & a mustache on Bond's favourite poster in retaliation, his nose was put out of joint to such an extent that he felt the only appropriate course of action open to him was to found a global criminal empire from where he could direct operations & be the author of James Bond's pain.

    Yep - precisely that ludicrous.

    Dont give up hope of this happening though as I'm sure P&W would think it's genius.
    stag wrote: »
    The two graphic & highly realistic fight scenes below demonstrate perfectly that - in certain circumstances - the female of the species can indeed be more deadly than the male.





    'Graphic & highly realistic' O:-)

    Those are both appalling. James Brolin's OP screen test is better than that.

    Go and watch the CR PTS or stair well fight and then come back and tell us how long either of these 'deadly' females would last against Bond or Trevelyan.

    I'm starting to suspect this whole thread is a wind up.
  • BennyBenny Shaken not stirredAdministrator, Moderator
    Posts: 15,138
    I'm not seeing any notion or evidence to suggest that Moneypenny is a OO.
    Was Campbell a OO in OHMSS?
    Is Tibbett a OO in AVTAK?
    Two agents who have assisted Bond on a mission in the field after all. I always thought the OO section was a small group. Consisting of highly trained individuals recruited from all areas of the armed services.
    Moneypenny for me is M's secretary and making her a field agent, who becomes M's secretary is one of the reasons that I didn't think Skyfall was as good as others do.
    I certainly don't believe that Bond and Moneypenny would've gone on a mission together in Istanbul, yet only at the end of the film do they introduce themselves to one another formally. That just BS with a capital B for me.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited August 2016 Posts: 23,883
    stag wrote: »
    As ludicrous as the notion that Blofeld had his nose put out of joint by the arrival of the usurper boy Bond who went on to win the affection of young Franz Oberhauser's father. This had such a profound effect on Franz that instead of drawing glasses & a mustache on Bond's favourite poster in retaliation, his nose was put out of joint to such an extent that he felt the only appropriate course of action open to him was to found a global criminal empire from where he could direct operations & be the author of James Bond's pain.

    The Celluloid Miss Moneypenny hasn't been tested in hand to hand combat on screen (yet) but I'm guessing she would at least be as proficient as 'Our Stacey' in her Charlie's Angels guise or indeed perhaps even Purdey? Indeed Purdey has been trained by British intelligence so her 'skills' may be more akin to those of Moneypenny's?

    The two graphic & highly realistic fight scenes below demonstrate perfectly that - in certain circumstances - the female of the species can indeed be more deadly than the male.



    Is that Tanya Roberts in the Charlies Angels clip? I'm impressed. I prefer her as a redhead & they should have had her fight like that in AVTAK. She could have shown Rog a thing or two.

    I agree on Lumley's Purdey. It would be unwise to mess with her.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited August 2016 Posts: 15,718
    Does Moneypenny show any kind of 00-status skills in SP, however? Apart from yelling 'reverse!' to Tanner and making an angry pouty face at Denbigh, she doesn't strike as a former 00 to me. She also needed some super juiced up translator on her computer to understand a newpaper article in foreign language. Surely 00's would know be well versed in other languages.
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