SPECTRE: So who's going to play Ernst?

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  • Posts: 1,894
    Blofeld's got to be a menacing (megalo)maniac. A Spanish background simply romanticizes the guy, and Javier Bardem is too likeable to play the evil villain.
    You've obviously never seen NO COUNTRY FOR OLD MEN, then.

    Even then, why couldn't Bardem have his Henry Fonda moment? When Sergio Leone made ONCE UPON A TIME IN THE WEST, he deliberately cast Fonda in the role of the villain simply because Fonda was, at the time, in the stereotypical good-guy mold. Leono wanted to play with the audience's expectations, showing Fonda's character, Frank, doing something despicable before revealing that it was Henry Fonda.
  • Well I've gone through most of the replies, and I can't find any definite evidence that Blofeld will return for Bond XXIII, there's a lot of talk and rumors and what may or may not occur with regard to this character but unless I missed something no definite word on a Blofeld return, (going to look damn silly if Blofeld is actually included in it)

    For the last time, why bring back this character, he's a relic of the past, was seen to have been killed off after Diamonds, some debate about the FYEO opening, so who is this guy we're supposed to see next year, Blofeld's son or Blofeld II, it can't be the same one as before because he's offically dead (mental exhaustion)

    All said, and bottom line is, I genuinely hope they don't bring back this character this time around. It's totally unneccesary
  • edited November 2011 Posts: 11,119
    Well I've gone through most of the replies, and I can't find any definite evidence that Blofeld will return for Bond XXIII, there's a lot of talk and rumors and what may or may not occur with regard to this character but unless I missed something no definite word on a Blofeld return, (going to look damn silly if Blofeld is actually included in it)

    For the last time, why bring back this character, he's a relic of the past, was seen to have been killed off after Diamonds, some debate about the FYEO opening, so who is this guy we're supposed to see next year, Blofeld's son or Blofeld II, it can't be the same one as before because he's offically dead (mental exhaustion)

    All said, and bottom line is, I genuinely hope they don't bring back this character this time around. It's totally unneccesary
    With sincere respect. But is Blofeld not a fantastic creation by Fleming and McGlory. It resulted in perhaps three of Fleming's best novels. So why talking so rude about stuff that Fleming created. We also don't say: "Because two previous versions of Casino Royale, both being rather lacklustre, we should come up with a new name for Le Chiffre". The reboot of Batman also didn't flush 'The Joker' into the toilet no? On the contrary, they made the character a tour the force for every possible actor. And I always say: After 22 Bond films, you can't just stay completely original. Going back to Flemings work was perhaps the best idea when preproducing EON's version of CR. Furthermore, the best Bonds are those that use Flemings work -characters and plots- in the best possible way. So please no other newly created villain a la Greene.
  • Technically, the Bond universe has been rebooted with CR. Blofeld can't be dead because Bond hasn't even met him yet. So it's definitely a possibility his character could be re-introduced.
    Personally I'd like to see it, but I don't want to get my hopes up despite all the hype.
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    with this film not having any connection to QUANTUM or the previous 2 films, i highly doubt we will be introduced to a villain character that will live to appear in films beyond this one..

    people have taken one candid remark and have run wild with it - adding more fuel to the fire is that beyond those in attendance during the presser, a vast majority of the roles are still a mystery..... people assume that because Fiennes is on board, that he will be one of the villains, even a cameo as Blofeld - which who knows if it is a true... it's still in doubt if EON even has the rights to use the character.. all the searching I have done still leads back to the same place - which is as of right now, the rights still belong to the McClory estate, and no purchases have been made by anyone over the past 3 years.

    I would expect Fiennes as Major Boothroyd, before Blofeld at this point.
  • "Mr Bond, I can buy you a Delicatessen......In stainless steele!....Mr Bonnnnnnnnnnnnd"
  • If Ralph is not Blofeld then I hope he is the recasting of Truman Lodge.
  • Posts: 1,894
    with this film not having any connection to QUANTUM or the previous 2 films, i highly doubt we will be introduced to a villain character that will live to appear in films beyond this one..
    One of the big things that Craig and Mendes have been pushing is the desire to make the best Bond film that they possibly can. Some of Mendes' comments suggest that he will settle for nothing less than the best film in the entire franchise.

    With that in mind, why couldn't EON go in for one definitive interpretation of Blofeld in SKYFALL? Introduce him, explore him and kill him off so that his repuation cannot be tarnished in the future by films that dilute Fiennes' performance.
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    even that...Blofeld can be a someone who appears in the ending sequences, not a huge role. he doesnt have to be with quantum. Hell! Bond 24 could be a continuation from this film and reintroduce quantum.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    edited November 2011 Posts: 6,304
    "So who´s going to play Ernst?"

    I'm pulling for Jill St. John in a bald cap. Turns out it *was* hell getting those diamonds back.
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    with this film not having any connection to QUANTUM or the previous 2 films, i highly doubt we will be introduced to a villain character that will live to appear in films beyond this one..
    One of the big things that Craig and Mendes have been pushing is the desire to make the best Bond film that they possibly can. Some of Mendes' comments suggest that he will settle for nothing less than the best film in the entire franchise.

    With that in mind, why couldn't EON go in for one definitive interpretation of Blofeld in SKYFALL? Introduce him, explore him and kill him off so that his repuation cannot be tarnished in the future by films that dilute Fiennes' performance.
    Because Blofeld isn't a villain that you simply waste on one film - he's not throwaway like a Drax or Goldfinger... if Blofeld is indeed the archnemesis to Bond like we all know he is - simply wasting him on one film I believe is a creative missuse of the character..

    I don't know how it works in England, but court documents are public record here in the states.. any news of a rights buyout would've been discovered by now - it didn't take long for news to break about EON finally attaining the rights to CR.
  • Imagine a Scene with Ralph Fiennes as Blofeld batteling Bond in the Scottish Castle at the end of the movie. This scene can be found at the end of Iam Fleming's book "You Only Live Twice" Great battle Bond kills Blofeld in the book.
    As for Albert Finney I play my card he is going to be the next Q.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,355
    As for Albert Finney I play my card he is going to be the next Q.
    At 75 years old, I highly doubt that.
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    Why wouldnt he be Q? Q, was always old in the older Bond films. So why can he not be older for this film? Craig is only signed on for Bond 24. So he has a total of what? Four films. The last two introduce Q and Moneypenny then the new Bond film will likely be another reboot or something along those lines..
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    ENOUGH WITH THE REBOOTS!!

    Sorry - but I hear this all the time on IMDB and drives me nuts - like blofeld's cat in YOLT... why is there this consortium of people who think once Craig's tenure is up that they'll simply reboot and start over?.. they went 40 years and 5 actors before they rebooted with CR... it wont happen again anytime soon.
  • Posts: 289
    Ralph as MQ!
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    theres a difference though. every bond film back then fitted. these films today are designed and all arced for Daniel Craig. You cant randomly have a new actor and the same characters and shit. thats just messed up...Im not saying it will be a total reboot. but i believe after Craig they will have all knew actors and actresses.
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    Posts: 4,399
    The tone was different between Moore and Dalton yet they continued... every Bond film is geared towards that specific actor - its the way it's always been... once Dan is done, they aren't going to hit the reset button again - some actors/actresses might change - as they always have.. but they'll maintain current continuity.
  • HASEROT wrote:
    HASEROT wrote:
    If you read carefully, I didn't say anything basically. I just highlighted a quote from John Logan. So I do not understand why I am 'grasping at straws'. And to be honest, isn't it infectious to see a nerdy screenplay writer like John Logan working on 'Skyfall'? I actually like it. I can recall an interview with Michael G. Wilson from 1999, released shortly after TWINE. In that interview he admitted: "You actually have to be a fanatic, a nerd, to create the uttermost best Bond film."

    don't play dumb with me sir.....

    you were the one making a big deal about Blofeld returning.. and your little "AHA!" comment again gave you out that you were trying to prove that point - unless of course you had an 80s flashback which i highly doubt...

    Blofeld isn't returning - let me say that again, so it can sink in a little...

    Blofeld...

    Who's rights still belong to McClory's estate...

    ...which means they cannot be used without consent or purchase, upon threat of legal rammifcations..

    ...IS NOT COMING BACK!

    the end

    First of all: You are wrong about the rights EON have. According to my post in here, http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/comment/48009#Comment_48009 , EON officially possesses now rights to ALL Bond and Fleming related characters. I suggest you read this post carefully.

    Secondly, don't call me....sir. I am a normal bloke. And there is no reason to patronize me like that.

    No I am not wrong....

    Videogame rights, based off preexisting Bond material might be, and are totally different than film rights, licensed to new creative properties or content.... of course past Blofeld and SPECTRE material are usable - if they weren't, then he would have to stricken from the previous films - wiped clean if you will - unless a huge royalties payment was to be made...

    as I myself stated before, but you probably conveniently glossed over - using the likeness of a character, and playable option - strictly in a multiplayer shooter, is a lot different than using the character as the main enemy of the story (which is why the 2005 game FRWL had to use OCTOPUS instead of SPECTRE) - enough was changed with the story and content that it was quite possible it could've been looked at as new creative entity - not based 100% off the film, which would mean that EON and EA could not legally use those copyrighted names..

    the lawsuit wasn't filed - and the won by McClory, until after DAF... once he won the rights to the character, name, and to (essentially) the script of Thunderball - thats when he began in haste to work on what would eventually become NSNA... by winning that lawsuit, Blofeld and SPECTRE are no longer considered Fleming property, or related characters - they are in sole possession of McClory - and now his estate

    i've tried to look it up sir, and found nothing - i suggest you do the same........ the filming rights and properties to Blofeld and SPECTRE still reside with the McClory estate

    Easy easy mister. You almost sound....angry. I try to be careful as well. You are right. Blofeld and SPECTRE are no longer Fleming property. But how do YOU know Blofeld and SPECTRE have not become EON property over the past years?

    Your example about the videogame as being it a personal shooter or a story-based videogame is not sufficient, in that it does not say for which purpose the characters Blofeld and SPECTRE can be used without royalties to McGlory (estate) and for which purpose not. As far as I know, McGlory didn't want other people to use Blofeld and SPECTRE....AT ALL.

    There is still the legal statement I have mentioned before: "GoldenEye 007: Reloaded © 2011 Danjaq, LLC and United Artists Corporation. 007 and related James Bond trademarks © 1962-2011 Danjaq, LLC and United Artists Corporation. 007 TM and related James Bond trademarks are trademarks of Danjaq, LLC licensed by EON. All Rights Reserved. Game Code © 2011 Activision Publishing, Inc. Activision is a registered trademark of Activision Publishing, Inc."


    <b>Now, step by step some arguments based on the above</b>:

    <b>1)</b> Focus on the words 'related James Bond trademarks'. You, me, everyone in here do not know for certain IF EON <B>silently</B> bought the rights for the names 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' back from McGlory's children. Also, we do not know what Sony's role is (Remember, thanks to Sony acquiring Columbia, it was finally possible to produce a worthy version of 'Casino Royale').

    <b>2)</b> The lawsuit from the 1960's (Approved in favour of McGlory, in which his name should be credited and for which McGlory should be paid, IF EON starts using 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE') do not specify AT ALL that there should be made a difference between a 'good storyline/plot' or a 'personal shooter' game. For the very simple reason, that in those days videogames did not exist. So that argument is bullocks.

    <b>3)</b> Why the hell would EON risk using the names 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' in the new videogame 'GoldenEye 007: Reloaded', when in 'FRWL' they agreed on using 'Octopus' instead? Both Wilson and Babs Broccoli, together with son David, are involved in the videogame-franchise as well. They functioned as consultants for both ActiVision and EuroCom. If the producers of 'FYEO' were so keen in showing the audience that Bond does not need Blofeld and SPECTRE, why bring those two names back?

    <b>4)</b> Off course legal expert Michael G. Wilson knows he is in a good position to win future lawsuits, IF his goal is creating a legal precedent (We all know MGM/UA and EON won the August 30th 2001 lawsuit that McGlory filed against them). But everyone knows the mere risk of facing a lawsuit is always costly.

    <b>5)</b> Perhaps EON and the estate of Kevin McGlory settled on something, in that McGlory's name will be credited one more time in the new Bond film + a nice, but not too high amount of royalty for McGlory's kids. I actually think the kids would be very satisfied with that. A nice gesture IMO.

    <b>6)</b> And Kevin McGlory himself is dead, finished, period. He cannot produce a film with the names 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' anymore. This creates some new, easier and moreover <b>cheaper</b> possibilities as well to produce 'Skyfall' with 'SPECTRE' and 'Blofeld'.

    <b>7)</b> And then there still is John Logan's remark earlier this year that "Bond should always fight Blofeld". You cannot be for sure that Logan will use the bald-headed villain. But you can also not rule out the possibility.

    <b>8)</b> Maybe that's why during the press conference the producers and Mendes specifically mentioned that this new film is "not based on previous Fleming work", leaving the possibility that McGlory will silently be credited for 'Skyfall'.


    <b>My point</b>: You don't know for certain, I don't know for certain. Perhaps 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' will not return. But you also can't rule out that possibility. Let's just wait and see.
  • HASEROTHASEROT has returned like the tedious inevitability of an unloved season---
    edited November 2011 Posts: 4,399
    HASEROT wrote:
    HASEROT wrote:
    If you read carefully, I didn't say anything basically. I just highlighted a quote from John Logan. So I do not understand why I am 'grasping at straws'. And to be honest, isn't it infectious to see a nerdy screenplay writer like John Logan working on 'Skyfall'? I actually like it. I can recall an interview with Michael G. Wilson from 1999, released shortly after TWINE. In that interview he admitted: "You actually have to be a fanatic, a nerd, to create the uttermost best Bond film."

    don't play dumb with me sir.....

    you were the one making a big deal about Blofeld returning.. and your little "AHA!" comment again gave you out that you were trying to prove that point - unless of course you had an 80s flashback which i highly doubt...

    Blofeld isn't returning - let me say that again, so it can sink in a little...

    Blofeld...

    Who's rights still belong to McClory's estate...

    ...which means they cannot be used without consent or purchase, upon threat of legal rammifcations..

    ...IS NOT COMING BACK!

    the end

    First of all: You are wrong about the rights EON have. According to my post in here, http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/comment/48009#Comment_48009 , EON officially possesses now rights to ALL Bond and Fleming related characters. I suggest you read this post carefully.

    Secondly, don't call me....sir. I am a normal bloke. And there is no reason to patronize me like that.

    No I am not wrong....

    Videogame rights, based off preexisting Bond material might be, and are totally different than film rights, licensed to new creative properties or content.... of course past Blofeld and SPECTRE material are usable - if they weren't, then he would have to stricken from the previous films - wiped clean if you will - unless a huge royalties payment was to be made...

    as I myself stated before, but you probably conveniently glossed over - using the likeness of a character, and playable option - strictly in a multiplayer shooter, is a lot different than using the character as the main enemy of the story (which is why the 2005 game FRWL had to use OCTOPUS instead of SPECTRE) - enough was changed with the story and content that it was quite possible it could've been looked at as new creative entity - not based 100% off the film, which would mean that EON and EA could not legally use those copyrighted names..

    the lawsuit wasn't filed - and the won by McClory, until after DAF... once he won the rights to the character, name, and to (essentially) the script of Thunderball - thats when he began in haste to work on what would eventually become NSNA... by winning that lawsuit, Blofeld and SPECTRE are no longer considered Fleming property, or related characters - they are in sole possession of McClory - and now his estate

    i've tried to look it up sir, and found nothing - i suggest you do the same........ the filming rights and properties to Blofeld and SPECTRE still reside with the McClory estate

    Easy easy mister. You almost sound....angry. I try to be careful as well. You are right. Blofeld and SPECTRE are no longer Fleming property. But how do YOU know Blofeld and SPECTRE have not become EON property over the past years?

    Your example about the videogame as being it a personal shooter or a story-based videogame is not sufficient, in that it does not say for which purpose the characters Blofeld and SPECTRE can be used without royalties to McGlory (estate) and for which purpose not. As far as I know, McGlory didn't want other people to use Blofeld and SPECTRE....AT ALL.

    There is still the legal statement I have mentioned before: "GoldenEye 007: Reloaded © 2011 Danjaq, LLC and United Artists Corporation. 007 and related James Bond trademarks © 1962-2011 Danjaq, LLC and United Artists Corporation. 007 TM and related James Bond trademarks are trademarks of Danjaq, LLC licensed by EON. All Rights Reserved. Game Code © 2011 Activision Publishing, Inc. Activision is a registered trademark of Activision Publishing, Inc."


    <b>Now, step by step some arguments based on the above</b>:

    <b>1)</b> Focus on the words 'related James Bond trademarks'. You, me, everyone in here do not know for certain IF EON <B>silently</B> bought the rights for the names 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' back from McGlory's children. Also, we do not know what Sony's role is (Remember, thanks to Sony acquiring Columbia, it was finally possible to produce a worthy version of 'Casino Royale').

    <b>2)</b> The lawsuit from the 1960's (Approved in favour of McGlory, in which his name should be credited and for which McGlory should be paid, IF EON starts using 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE') do not specify AT ALL that there should be made a difference between a 'good storyline/plot' or a 'personal shooter' game. For the very simple reason, that in those days videogames did not exist. So that argument is bullocks.

    <b>3)</b> Why the hell would EON risk using the names 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' in the new videogame 'GoldenEye 007: Reloaded', when in 'FRWL' they agreed on using 'Octopus' instead? Both Wilson and Babs Broccoli, together with son David, are involved in the videogame-franchise as well. They functioned as consultants for both ActiVision and EuroCom. If the producers of 'FYEO' were so keen in showing the audience that Bond does not need Blofeld and SPECTRE, why bring those two names back?

    <b>4)</b> Off course legal expert Michael G. Wilson knows he is in a good position to win future lawsuits, IF his goal is creating a legal precedent (We all know MGM/UA and EON won the August 30th 2001 lawsuit that McGlory filed against them). But everyone knows the mere risk of facing a lawsuit is always costly.

    <b>5)</b> Perhaps EON and the estate of Kevin McGlory settled on something, in that McGlory's name will be credited one more time in the new Bond film + a nice, but not too high amount of royalty for McGlory's kids. I actually think the kids would be very satisfied with that. A nice gesture IMO.

    <b>6)</b> And Kevin McGlory himself is dead, finished, period. He cannot produce a film with the names 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' anymore. This creates some new, easier and moreover <b>cheaper</b> possibilities as well to produce 'Skyfall' with 'SPECTRE' and 'Blofeld'.

    <b>7)</b> And then there still is John Logan's remark earlier this year that "Bond should always fight Blofeld". You cannot be for sure that Logan will use the bald-headed villain. But you can also not rule out the possibility.

    <b>8)</b> Maybe that's why during the press conference the producers and Mendes specifically mentioned that this new film is "not based on previous Fleming work", leaving the possibility that McGlory will silently be credited for 'Skyfall'.


    <b>My point</b>: You don't know for certain, I don't know for certain. Perhaps 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' will not return. But you also can't rule out that possibility. Let's just wait and see.

    my point is, there is no secrecy when obtaining rights of property through the courts... court documents are all public record - and thus, if any rights were attained between the time of his death, and now - SOMEONE would've tipped the media, and we here at Mi6 would've been made aware of it.. thats how it works... who knows how Activision got the rights to use Blofeld in the game - they probably were able to via a legal loophole, that allows them to in a videogame.... but that being said - videogame rights, and filming rights are 2 completely different animals

    someone's death has little to do with getting the rights at an easier rate, or even at a bargain... look how long it took EON to finally get the rights to Casino Royale? - almost 40 years after Fleming died... and they had tried repeatedly - and when EON finally got their hands on it, it was big news all over Bond sites... don't you think the same would apply here? - as Mr White said "We have people everywhere." ... someone would've coughed up details by now... come on man, use common sense - that story would be huge.

    simply giving someone credit via a "thank you" or "all property is owned by so and so" in the credits of the film is not good enough, technically, in the eyes of the court that is still stealing - for property to be used in any manner, specific written and approved documentation needs to be used... McClory once operated on that handshake deal - look where it got him.. i doubt he'd ever do it again, or much less let his heirs do it...

    again, simply throwing a character owned by someone else into a film they didn't sign off on, cannot, and will not happen - if it did in this instance, no doubt McClory's estate would've put the kibosh to the production, and we'd be at another legal standstill, for violating copyright law.... if the copyrights were refused to EON, the only they'd be able to attain them is when the copyrights run out - which wouldn't happened for at least another 50 years...

    had rights been attained, there wouldn't be any need for QUANTUM would there? just call it SPECTRE... which is essentially what they are doing.... granted, I will give you that Fiennes could be playing a Blofeld-esque character.... but it legally cannot be Ernst Stavro Blofeld - or any variation of that name...

    if Fiennes does in fact turn out to be Blofeld - I will admit that I was wrong, and I will gladly eat crow for it.... but as it stands right now, based on all the information surrounding this subject that I have gathered, I feel confident in saying he is not coming back..... if EON and McClory's estate came to a deal, and managed to keep it under wraps for this long - kudos to them.... because nothing remains secret for very long anymore.
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    If McClory were alive today, he would want his character(s) in the film. J.s. Who would say no?
  • Posts: 1,894
    If McClory were alive today, he would want his character(s) in the film.
    No, he would probably want his characters in the film, with certain provisions attached - no doubt he would want some degree of creative control over the film. Which may be (and probably would be) more than EON would be willing to give him.
  • HASEROT wrote:
    HASEROT wrote:
    HASEROT wrote:
    If you read carefully, I didn't say anything basically. I just highlighted a quote from John Logan. So I do not understand why I am 'grasping at straws'. And to be honest, isn't it infectious to see a nerdy screenplay writer like John Logan working on 'Skyfall'? I actually like it. I can recall an interview with Michael G. Wilson from 1999, released shortly after TWINE. In that interview he admitted: "You actually have to be a fanatic, a nerd, to create the uttermost best Bond film."

    don't play dumb with me sir.....

    you were the one making a big deal about Blofeld returning.. and your little "AHA!" comment again gave you out that you were trying to prove that point - unless of course you had an 80s flashback which i highly doubt...

    Blofeld isn't returning - let me say that again, so it can sink in a little...

    Blofeld...

    Who's rights still belong to McClory's estate...

    ...which means they cannot be used without consent or purchase, upon threat of legal rammifcations..

    ...IS NOT COMING BACK!

    the end

    First of all: You are wrong about the rights EON have. According to my post in here, http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/comment/48009#Comment_48009 , EON officially possesses now rights to ALL Bond and Fleming related characters. I suggest you read this post carefully.

    Secondly, don't call me....sir. I am a normal bloke. And there is no reason to patronize me like that.

    No I am not wrong....

    Videogame rights, based off preexisting Bond material might be, and are totally different than film rights, licensed to new creative properties or content.... of course past Blofeld and SPECTRE material are usable - if they weren't, then he would have to stricken from the previous films - wiped clean if you will - unless a huge royalties payment was to be made...

    as I myself stated before, but you probably conveniently glossed over - using the likeness of a character, and playable option - strictly in a multiplayer shooter, is a lot different than using the character as the main enemy of the story (which is why the 2005 game FRWL had to use OCTOPUS instead of SPECTRE) - enough was changed with the story and content that it was quite possible it could've been looked at as new creative entity - not based 100% off the film, which would mean that EON and EA could not legally use those copyrighted names..

    the lawsuit wasn't filed - and the won by McClory, until after DAF... once he won the rights to the character, name, and to (essentially) the script of Thunderball - thats when he began in haste to work on what would eventually become NSNA... by winning that lawsuit, Blofeld and SPECTRE are no longer considered Fleming property, or related characters - they are in sole possession of McClory - and now his estate

    i've tried to look it up sir, and found nothing - i suggest you do the same........ the filming rights and properties to Blofeld and SPECTRE still reside with the McClory estate

    Easy easy mister. You almost sound....angry. I try to be careful as well. You are right. Blofeld and SPECTRE are no longer Fleming property. But how do YOU know Blofeld and SPECTRE have not become EON property over the past years?

    Your example about the videogame as being it a personal shooter or a story-based videogame is not sufficient, in that it does not say for which purpose the characters Blofeld and SPECTRE can be used without royalties to McGlory (estate) and for which purpose not. As far as I know, McGlory didn't want other people to use Blofeld and SPECTRE....AT ALL.

    There is still the legal statement I have mentioned before: "GoldenEye 007: Reloaded © 2011 Danjaq, LLC and United Artists Corporation. 007 and related James Bond trademarks © 1962-2011 Danjaq, LLC and United Artists Corporation. 007 TM and related James Bond trademarks are trademarks of Danjaq, LLC licensed by EON. All Rights Reserved. Game Code © 2011 Activision Publishing, Inc. Activision is a registered trademark of Activision Publishing, Inc."


    <b>Now, step by step some arguments based on the above</b>:

    <b>1)</b> Focus on the words 'related James Bond trademarks'. You, me, everyone in here do not know for certain IF EON <B>silently</B> bought the rights for the names 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' back from McGlory's children. Also, we do not know what Sony's role is (Remember, thanks to Sony acquiring Columbia, it was finally possible to produce a worthy version of 'Casino Royale').

    <b>2)</b> The lawsuit from the 1960's (Approved in favour of McGlory, in which his name should be credited and for which McGlory should be paid, IF EON starts using 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE') do not specify AT ALL that there should be made a difference between a 'good storyline/plot' or a 'personal shooter' game. For the very simple reason, that in those days videogames did not exist. So that argument is bullocks.

    <b>3)</b> Why the hell would EON risk using the names 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' in the new videogame 'GoldenEye 007: Reloaded', when in 'FRWL' they agreed on using 'Octopus' instead? Both Wilson and Babs Broccoli, together with son David, are involved in the videogame-franchise as well. They functioned as consultants for both ActiVision and EuroCom. If the producers of 'FYEO' were so keen in showing the audience that Bond does not need Blofeld and SPECTRE, why bring those two names back?

    <b>4)</b> Off course legal expert Michael G. Wilson knows he is in a good position to win future lawsuits, IF his goal is creating a legal precedent (We all know MGM/UA and EON won the August 30th 2001 lawsuit that McGlory filed against them). But everyone knows the mere risk of facing a lawsuit is always costly.

    <b>5)</b> Perhaps EON and the estate of Kevin McGlory settled on something, in that McGlory's name will be credited one more time in the new Bond film + a nice, but not too high amount of royalty for McGlory's kids. I actually think the kids would be very satisfied with that. A nice gesture IMO.

    <b>6)</b> And Kevin McGlory himself is dead, finished, period. He cannot produce a film with the names 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' anymore. This creates some new, easier and moreover <b>cheaper</b> possibilities as well to produce 'Skyfall' with 'SPECTRE' and 'Blofeld'.

    <b>7)</b> And then there still is John Logan's remark earlier this year that "Bond should always fight Blofeld". You cannot be for sure that Logan will use the bald-headed villain. But you can also not rule out the possibility.

    <b>8)</b> Maybe that's why during the press conference the producers and Mendes specifically mentioned that this new film is "not based on previous Fleming work", leaving the possibility that McGlory will silently be credited for 'Skyfall'.


    <b>My point</b>: You don't know for certain, I don't know for certain. Perhaps 'Blofeld' and 'SPECTRE' will not return. But you also can't rule out that possibility. Let's just wait and see.

    my point is, there is no secrecy when obtaining rights of property through the courts... court documents are all public record - and thus, if any rights were attained between the time of his death, and now - SOMEONE would've tipped the media, and we here at Mi6 would've been made aware of it.. thats how it works... who knows how Activision got the rights to use Blofeld in the game - they probably were able to via a legal loophole, that allows them to in a videogame.... but that being said - videogame rights, and filming rights are 2 completely different animals

    someone's death has little to do with getting the rights at an easier rate, or even at a bargain... look how long it took EON to finally get the rights to Casino Royale? - almost 40 years after Fleming died... and they had tried repeatedly - and when EON finally got their hands on it, it was big news all over Bond sites... don't you think the same would apply here? - as Mr White said "We have people everywhere." ... someone would've coughed up details by now... come on man, use common sense - that story would be huge.

    simply giving someone credit via a "thank you" or "all property is owned by so and so" in the credits of the film is not good enough, technically, in the eyes of the court that is still stealing - for property to be used in any manner, specific written and approved documentation needs to be used... McClory once operated on that handshake deal - look where it got him.. i doubt he'd ever do it again, or much less let his heirs do it...

    again, simply throwing a character owned by someone else into a film they didn't sign off on, cannot, and will not happen - if it did in this instance, no doubt McClory's estate would've put the kibosh to the production, and we'd be at another legal standstill, for violating copyright law.... if the copyrights were refused to EON, the only they'd be able to attain them is when the copyrights run out - which wouldn't happened for at least another 50 years...

    had rights been attained, there wouldn't be any need for QUANTUM would there? just call it SPECTRE... which is essentially what they are doing.... granted, I will give you that Fiennes could be playing a Blofeld-esque character.... but it legally cannot be Ernst Stavro Blofeld - or any variation of that name...

    if Fiennes does in fact turn out to be Blofeld - I will admit that I was wrong, and I will gladly eat crow for it.... but as it stands right now, based on all the information surrounding this subject that I have gathered, I feel confident in saying he is not coming back..... if EON and McClory's estate came to a deal, and managed to keep it under wraps for this long - kudos to them.... because nothing remains secret for very long anymore.

    To summarize everything -I am too lazy to react on this-: It is time that the MI6 starts doing some intensive research/investigation. Yesterday I have been searching the internet for two hours to find some public records about recent legal settlements in which EON Productions are involved (With 'GoldenEye 007: Reloaded' as an interesting legal precedent). But I don't know where to start.

    We can talk until we weigh an ounce, but we won't get a final confirmation about who is right at the moment. Until we know for sure what happened in the case of 'GoldenEye: Reloaded', I suggest we stop proving who is right.

    PS: The case of 'Casino Royale' was fairly simple. Ever since the 1960's, Columbia Pictures had the rights of Ian Fleming's first novel. So when Sony Pictures acquired Columbia Pictures, things became suddenly much easier for EON Productions, as EON was already teaming up with Sony.
  • Posts: 4,622
    As much as I would love to see Blofeld return, doesn't the latest info from the set suggest that Fiennes is playing a character with the initial "M", suggesting that he might be the new M? If so, whose supposed to be playing Blofeld then? And Fiennes has already said thathis character does not have a white cat. I took that as a cryptic affirmation, that his character is not Blofeld period, as opposed to maybe Blofeld,but minus the cat.
  • Posts: 1,894
    timmer wrote:
    If so, whose supposed to be playing Blofeld then?
    Nobody. It has not been confirmed that Blofeld is in the film - that is only speculation.
  • Posts: 5,745
    timmer wrote:
    As much as I would love to see Blofeld return, doesn't the latest info from the set suggest that Fiennes is playing a character with the initial "M", suggesting that he might be the new M? If so, whose supposed to be playing Blofeld then? And Fiennes has already said thathis character does not have a white cat. I took that as a cryptic affirmation, that his character is not Blofeld period, as opposed to maybe Blofeld,but minus the cat.

    Um, where is this 'info from the set' and I highly doubt Fiennes has signed on for more than one film.
  • edited November 2012 Posts: 2,189
    When you think about it, back in the 60’s when Blofeld was most prominent, a spy like Bond should have been fighting the Russians in the western-block or killing political leaders in Cuba and Vietnam. Back then, the east and the west were really conflicting through a war of espionage, so an individual criminal mastermind like Blofeld threatening the security of the world on his own is totally out-of-place for the time period. Today however, with the power of the individual measuring ten-fold following the events of 9/11, Blofeld begins to look like a plausible character in the modern world of globalization and international terrorism.

    For too long I’ve heard people rant about Blofeld being a relic who should never return to the series because he’s silly and old-fashioned and totally implausible. I could not agree with these people more. I wager to say that Blofeld is the only realistic villain left in today’s world for Bond to combat. In Skyfall in the scene where M is being questioned by the oversight committee, M stresses that espionage hasn’t gotten easier since the Cold War but gotten harder because now their enemies aren’t countries they’re individuals, and it’s much easier for people to hide in the shadows. Quantum has proven themselves to be quite effective at living in the shadows in QoS, and so will Blofeld as their leader in Bond 24. It is the next logical step and I couldn’t be more thrilled!
  • Posts: 12,526
    Plenty of Blofeld threads already on here, do we really need another one to have the same old conversations and debates again?! (:|
  • This is about why he should be in Bond 24 and beyond because he is more plausible in today’s world than he ever was in the 60’s. I would think that some people on this forum would contest this thought, and I’d like to have an opportunity to convince them that Blofeld is the best villain for a modern Bond film.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Why does it have to be Blofeld? Why can't it be a new and more original villain? Blofeld had his chance. Reboot or not, EoN's not going to remake or reuse old villains. It's a step down really. Blofeld was Connery's villain. Bald guys stroking cats is a thing of the past and besides Blofeld inspired Dr. Evil. Younger people won't get it and only think Bond was ripping off Austin Powers now. We don't need to rehash old villains. But that's not to say EoN can't create a Blofeldesque villain. and no offence but today's generation of movie goers would laugh at a name like Blofeld. He was a 60's villain and seeing as he was used in 007 Legends, It's most likely he won't be appearing in Bond movies again fortunately.
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