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  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    She only gives the introduction, and takes extra questions at the end.
  • She only gives the introduction, and takes extra questions at the end.

    She's only following orders.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    I mean SHS in general, as she's typically the lead during the press briefings.

    http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/392992-dhs-nielsen-hasnt-visited-child-detention-center-since-family
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    She only gives the introduction, and takes extra questions at the end.

    She's only following orders.

    Not sure what you mean. What does it have to do with anything at all?
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited June 2018 Posts: 17,798
    She only gives the introduction, and takes extra questions at the end.

    She's only following orders.

    Not sure what you mean. What does it have to do with anything at all?

    It means you are their target audience. People who will believe anything anyone in 'authority' tells them because you believe they 'know' things most ordinary people do not. You sir, are an elitist. You consider yourself and those around you to be inferior to the peeps at the top. "I will follow you... follow you wherever you may go...." ;)
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    If you got something, feel free to share.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    Well, this administration has been fact-checked and called out on lies continually, by numerous sources, for many months. The press briefings are basically a war at this point, with only pro Trump spin issuing forth. You can say all administrations spin, and they do, but what we are seeing is genuinely unprecedented lying on a daily basis.

    This family separation issue is finally ripping into the GOP's long dormant heart, as it should. It is up to the rest of our govt to actually use their checks and balances power to right this ship, to keep our democracy in any way a real democracy, and keep governing America on a path that does not lead to further racism, violence, suppression of human rights.

    This is a huge task. The Congress up till now are flailing and failing. Wheels are turning. The Mueller investigation is the one ongoing light we have and, thankfully, that is not going away.

    Trump is forcing the separation of children from parents in situations far beyond what it was intended and it is NOT in law the way he keeps spouting. All of Congress know that. It will take the American citizens, each of us, our collective responsibility to speak up and demand (not ask) our Congress and other govt officials to end this current action regarding immigration. That is happening now, and we shall see what is played out in the next week.

    I expect Trump to back down of course, reverse it and claim it all as a pure victory for him. We are gaslighted every single day by this administration. Our media is a very mixed bag, and it is up to every one of us (American citizens) to do our own research, contact our officials, and never give up. Not for one moment. Our country is at risk; a huge risk. This is a major turning point in our history.

    "He's not a politician, just give him a chance." "He tells it like it is." "He just says stuff; he doesn't mean it." White supremacy spouted, racism, inciting violence and tearing up relations with allies - these are all building, step by step, on a very ugly and unAmerican path.

    Biggest con our country has ever had. It is up to us to clean house - and we need action, laws, judicial support now. Every day. Not just words. Because it is a tinder box and more people will be harmed, jailed, lost, injured, and yes even killed before this is over. The laws of our land are shaken.

    So we need to make this finish as soon as possible. Our country's democracy and foundation has given us the means to deal with this without anarchy and rioting in the streets. We will march, we will make our voices heard. But this is clearly a dangerous time for our country in so many ways and the other people in our govt (all outside of Trump administration), with any power at all (large or small) - all need to act. We all must take a stand and act.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    In case it is not completely clear, let me state that this is way beyond "conservative" vs. "liberal".
  • j_w_pepperj_w_pepper Born on the bayou, but I now hear a new dog barkin'
    Posts: 9,032
    In case it is not completely clear, let me state that this is way beyond "conservative" vs. "liberal".

    I'm sure it is here, but I wish it also were in the States...
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited June 2018 Posts: 12,480
    It is in the U.S. - more so than usual, I think. Many conservatives have turned against the Trump administration, some certainly going against the GOP for the first ime.

    But yes, there is a stumbling block of GOP congress who are still letting Trump get away with everything because they want to undo what Obama did (for whatever reasons) and/or they want to push through as much of their own policies as quickly as possible.

    We must put our country first, over our usual alliances with whichever political party we adhere to, or we will lose our country.

    Here is the formation of the main march coming up, but there are smaller ones happening, too.:

    And one sooner, actually in Texas, if you can make it there:
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,798
    If you got something, feel free to share.

    Just read every word of 4Ever's post above, yo. ;)
  • She only gives the introduction, and takes extra questions at the end.

    She's only following orders.

    Not sure what you mean. What does it have to do with anything at all?

    "I vas only followink orders" was the excuse many Nazis gave in their trials at Nuremburg. The excuse was unsuccessful and the Nazis involved ended up doing time. Do you really not know that or are just trying to pretend ignorance when it suits you?
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    Virginia governor recalls the Virginia National Guard from the border ... I forget how many governors now have recalled their guard because of this inhumane situation that Trump has made (yes, it is on him); maybe 8 or more governors now? I have not checked. But it's snowballing ...

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,798
    My state of MA's governor has also.
  • edited June 2018 Posts: 628
    Trump is forcing the separation of children from parents in situations far beyond what it was intended and it is NOT in law the way he keeps spouting. All of Congress know that. It will take the American citizens, each of us, our collective responsibility to speak up and demand (not ask) our Congress and other govt officials to end this current action regarding immigration. That is happening now, and we shall see what is played out in the next week.

    Good -- hopefully this practice will be put to a stop.

    Once the issue of child/parent separation has been dealt with, I'd like to see a feasible plan of immigration reform offered by the Democrats (or both parties, if they can find some way to work together). The more radical and vocal leftists on social media are calling for open borders -- clearly insane and not a viable option, although they would never admit that. So what's it going to be then? Sooner or later those borders have to be secured, and the Dems (and their activists) can't keep deflecting from the problems of unchecked immigration.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,798
    Escalus5 wrote: »
    The more radical and vocal leftists on social media are calling for open borders --
    Excuse me? Can you provide a link to this? Not saying you can't- I'd just like to see this for myself.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    Sure, we can work on changing laws and policies together. We need a functioning Congress with a spine - on both sides - to do this properly. Getting back to a functioning, compassionate govt that respects our Constitution and Bill of Rights will be great and we can argue fine points to pass new laws, etc. I yearn for that. But at the moment we are in a more dangerous war and cannot let our focus leave the most important issues.

    For my political leanings, in general I am left of center but not far left. I consider myself independent. (far left and far right are pretty much the same, really)

    But there are conservatives who are not for Trump. More than my two examples below, of course.

    Anyway, here is a conservative American:


    AND another conservative (his article, in the attached, is well worth reading).
    Rick is a "never Trump" conservative.
  • edited June 2018 Posts: 7,507
    Ah, this is so hard! I really don't know guys.

    Who should I believe on this topic? A presidency that has been proven to lie repeatedly almost daily for 1 and a half years? Or should I believe all the other respected news chanels and journalists, both american and international? Are Trump and his gang simply dishonest? Or have all news people in the entire rest of the world conspired with Hillary to take him down?

    It's so hard! I am losing sleep over this!
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited June 2018 Posts: 12,480
    Yes, we need a sarcasm emoji. :) (so here is the insipid smiley face instead...)
  • edited June 2018 Posts: 628
    Getting back to a functioning, compassionate govt that respects our Constitution and Bill of Rights will be great and we can argue fine points to pass new laws, etc. I yearn for that. But at the moment we are in a more dangerous war and cannot let our focus leave the most important issues.

    One of the most important issues being a feasible plan for immigration reform!

    The problem is not that people can't focus on two things -- it's rather that they don't want to deal with the elephant in the room: If we're to be a country of immigration laws, illegal border crossers will have to be deported if they are not granted asylum. That's it.

    Again, I'll be interested to see what transpires once the current controversies are squared away.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    It is important. Very. But we have to stop the evil atrocities first. That is the priority I meant.
  • Posts: 628
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Escalus5 wrote: »
    The more radical and vocal leftists on social media are calling for open borders --
    Excuse me? Can you provide a link to this? Not saying you can't- I'd just like to see this for myself.

    Search "open borders" on Twitter.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    We have immigration laws and no, I have not researched them in depth. We can make them better, we can work it out. But we do not have open borders, we do have processes in place.

    My points here are simply we can deal with it, for improvement, and we will. But I am not focusing on discussing finer points of immigration issue just now. My concern is stopping the worst actions that Trump administration is pushing. This current immigration situation of ripping children from their families is vile and is my main point just now.

    But of course, alongside that focus (stopping the worst that is happening right before our eyes this moment), yes our Congress and states need to deal with immigration to improve our policies and care for people correctly.
  • Posts: 628
    Fair enough. I agree.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    Trump can stop this right now with the stroke of a pen. The fact that he continues to blame all of this on a "Democratic law," whatever the hell that means, proves he has no interest in doing so. If he truly, genuinely cared about those children, we would no longer be discussing the topic.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    Yes, Trump could end it immediately.

    Apparently, all in the White House are pretty blithely moving along ...

    and James Bond gets a quick mention in this tweet, so here you go (click into it for the other info on White House reaction to current crisis)
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    Posts: 12,480
    And yes, @Creasy47 - read the Rick Wilson article. He says that and more; it's quite well written and not just slamming Trump with exclamation points or memes.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited June 2018 Posts: 12,480
    Re above linked tweet - CoS is Gen. Kelly, Chief of Staff - who has given up.

    Not my main focus now, but here is some info on that ...
    From the Politico article that is being quoted quite a bit:

    ***
    But Kelly’s status in the White House has changed in recent months, and he and the president are now seen as barely tolerating one another. According to four people close to Kelly, the former Marine general has largely yielded his role as the enforcer in the West Wing as his relationship with Trump has soured. While Kelly himself once believed he stood between Trump and chaos, he has told at least one person close to him that he may as well let the president do what he wants, even if it leads to impeachment — at least this chapter of American history would come to a close.
    In recent months, his Secret Service detail has often been spotted standing outside the gym in the Eisenhower Executive Office Building in the middle of the day — and White House officials who pass it on the way to meetings view his late morning workouts as an indication of him having thrown in the towel on trying to have any control inside the West Wing.

    ***
    And it seems Kelly was not jesting when he made those remarks. Not a big deal to me at this point, just clarifying and then moving on.

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,798
    Escalus5 wrote: »
    chrisisall wrote: »
    Escalus5 wrote: »
    The more radical and vocal leftists on social media are calling for open borders --
    Excuse me? Can you provide a link to this? Not saying you can't- I'd just like to see this for myself.

    Search "open borders" on Twitter.

    Oh, okay, yeah. Some of those posts are, shall I say, a bit out there. Most of them mean well I guess, but we can't just let EVERYONE in all the time. But to not take in folks in dire peril in their home country is the other side of the coin. There must be balance.
  • 4EverBonded4EverBonded the Ballrooms of Mars
    edited June 2018 Posts: 12,480
    When you read comments on twitter (or any social media) there are ALL kinds of extremists chiming in.

    We do have laws and a process for immigration, and it can be improved but already in place we do NOT let just anybody in. Open borders will not ever be approved.

    Anyway, Gov. of New York is suing the Trump administration over Trump's immigration stance on separating families at the border. This is news:
This discussion has been closed.