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NTTD Gun Barrel Sequence OOO O O O

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  • ColonelSunColonelSun
    Posts: 1,490
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Thanks.

    This is disappointing and annoying if it’s true. I personally need the GB at the beginning, or it effects my enjoyment of the whole film.

    CR was forgivable, the others weren’t.

    I'm sure Cary has planned this, if true, to work very well. There may also be an added practical reason for such a move. It seems we are in for a very long pre-title, the longest we have ever had, over 20+ mins. On some commercial TV channels, especially in the US, that would mean an ad break at some point during the pre-title scenes, but if they have an opening sequence, Safin at the lake, then there could be an ad break directly after that sequence before they return with the GB and continue the opening pre-title action in Matera. Just a thought. We still don't know how the GB plays.

  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 16,148
    There was a major spoiler regarding the opening in the Wall Street Journal . I'm assuming someone must have posted it here on the forums somewhere. I regrettably read the spoiler. Not quite sure how this gunbarrel theory fits in, though.
  • GatecrasherGatecrasher Classified
    Posts: 265
    Pierce2Daniel wrote: »
    antovolk wrote: »
    gonna leave this here (grain of salt and possible spoiler alert



    So if this is true - the gunbarrel following the Norway/Safin attacks young Madeleine and her mother scene - this actually makes a ton of sense. 1. Clearly separate the flashback opening and the present day (right after the events of Spectre, but before the post-main titles 5 Years Later jump) 2. circle back to Casino Royale similarly having a cold open before the gunbarrel and 3. Still having a more traditional pre titles with Bond, that doesn't feel as long as it might (20 mins+) were it not broken up by the gunbarrel.

    Also explains why the cue released by Zimmer has the buildup like Spectre but shorter by half. Would only work in a SP like scenario over the studio logos if there was only one studio logo (MGM). Thi at the end of the Norway sequence would be more akin to leading to a familiar title sequence cue on a TV show.

    I think based on CJF's comments the current longstanding theory of how the film opens, NTTD will go a little like this.....

    MGM logo:

    GaseousBlueColt-size_restricted.gif

    Safin at the lake:

    67079f89b38eac356eeb47e1863490b0cf429fd3.gifv

    Cut to the Gunbarrel:

    77f4ed99c5cc5450beb638b9e005d27f.gif

    Then off to Matera for the PTS:

    tenor.gif?itemid=15722831

    Obviously, followed by the main titles:

    billie%20eilish%20no%20time%20to%20die.jpg

    I think we will see the young Madeleine in the water and then - after the Gunbarrel - cut to the older Madeleine in the water in Italy. This establishes the idea that Lea is playing the grown-up version of the same character we saw chased on the lake. However, I don't think the film will make it much may obvious than that.

    If they follow the above, I think the cold open is purely there to establish mood and atmosphere. Essentially to wrongfoot the audience before the Bond experience begins properly. It'll be an intense, creepy little sequence to frighten you. I imagine they hope audiences forget it once they see Bond. Then when the lake sequence eventually becomes integral to the plot, it will reveal its latent significance to us.

    I actually like the idea of opening with an intense short sequence then cutting to the Gunbarrel. It'll be very interesting and unique. Plus, it'll make sure the blood is properly pumping for the movie itself....I'm very intrigued by how they will play it.

    I always found the Gunbarrel a little staid and boring. I don't need it at the beginning of the film. Especially if there are more inventive ways to incorporate it.......Come at me.

    If this is indeed how NTTD plays out in the opening, I don't mind it at all. It seems like the gunbarrel has been revamped in a way that is integral and makes sense, thematically, to the plot. CJF know what he's doing, and I think this version of the gunbarrel will be a real treat.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,338
    I think it would be kind of weird in any other movie to have that sudden graphical element (to be followed of course by that happening again when the titles kick in) but I guess it should work in a Bond because everyone is so familiar with it.
  • battleshipgreygtbattleshipgreygt
    edited October 2020 Posts: 1,220
    Pierce2Daniel wrote: »
    antovolk wrote: »
    gonna leave this here (grain of salt and possible spoiler alert



    So if this is true - the gunbarrel following the Norway/Safin attacks young Madeleine and her mother scene - this actually makes a ton of sense. 1. Clearly separate the flashback opening and the present day (right after the events of Spectre, but before the post-main titles 5 Years Later jump) 2. circle back to Casino Royale similarly having a cold open before the gunbarrel and 3. Still having a more traditional pre titles with Bond, that doesn't feel as long as it might (20 mins+) were it not broken up by the gunbarrel.

    Also explains why the cue released by Zimmer has the buildup like Spectre but shorter by half. Would only work in a SP like scenario over the studio logos if there was only one studio logo (MGM). Thi at the end of the Norway sequence would be more akin to leading to a familiar title sequence cue on a TV show.

    I think based on CJF's comments the current longstanding theory of how the film opens, NTTD will go a little like this.....

    MGM logo:

    GaseousBlueColt-size_restricted.gif

    Safin at the lake:

    67079f89b38eac356eeb47e1863490b0cf429fd3.gifv

    Cut to the Gunbarrel:

    77f4ed99c5cc5450beb638b9e005d27f.gif

    Then off to Matera for the PTS:

    tenor.gif?itemid=15722831

    Obviously, followed by the main titles:

    billie%20eilish%20no%20time%20to%20die.jpg

    I think we will see the young Madeleine in the water and then - after the Gunbarrel - cut to the older Madeleine in the water in Italy. This establishes the idea that Lea is playing the grown-up version of the same character we saw chased on the lake. However, I don't think the film will make it much may obvious than that.

    If they follow the above, I think the cold open is purely there to establish mood and atmosphere. Essentially to wrongfoot the audience before the Bond experience begins properly. It'll be an intense, creepy little sequence to frighten you. I imagine they hope audiences forget it once they see Bond. Then when the lake sequence eventually becomes integral to the plot, it will reveal its latent significance to us.

    I actually like the idea of opening with an intense short sequence then cutting to the Gunbarrel. It'll be very interesting and unique. Plus, it'll make sure the blood is properly pumping for the movie itself....I'm very intrigued by how they will play it.

    I always found the Gunbarrel a little staid and boring. I don't need it at the beginning of the film. Especially if there are more inventive ways to incorporate it.......Come at me.

    I really hope this is the way it opens. Sure, it's not traditional but I think it'll make for a much more gripping and exhilarating viewing experience.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    Over the years I've come to realize that I no longer care where the gun barrel opens anymore. SF ranks 3rd on my list and the placement of the gun barrel holds no sway over it. So if the gun barrel plays half-way through the PTS, fair game. I'm not going to whine about it on the internet.
  • battleshipgreygtbattleshipgreygt
    Posts: 1,220
    I wonder if Zimmer’s gunbarrel track that we’ve heard actually plays out the same way during the film.
    The reused buildup bit from Spectre led me to believe that the track would begin over the studio logos, so I wonder exactly how cold of an open it is going to be. Is the order going to be Studio Logos —> Frozen Lake —> Gunbarrel—> Matera —> or will it be Frozen Lake —> Logos —> Gunbarrel—> Matera? I think I prefer the latter.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,179
    It may be the latter.
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 16,148
    Maybe it's:
    Studio logos-> gunbarrel ->Frozen Lake -> titles-> Matera?
  • ColonelSunColonelSun
    Posts: 1,490
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Maybe it's:
    Studio logos-> gunbarrel ->Frozen Lake -> titles-> Matera?

    From Cary's comments to the WSJ, I am beginning to suspect you are right.
    The first pre-title's not to feature Bond (even a double, FRWL, or a dummy of Bond, TMWTGG) since LALD. I'm cool with that.

  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 16,148
    ColonelSun wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Maybe it's:
    Studio logos-> gunbarrel ->Frozen Lake -> titles-> Matera?

    From Cary's comments to the WSJ, I am beginning to suspect you are right.
    The first pre-title's not to feature Bond (even a double, FRWL, or a dummy of Bond, TMWTGG) since LALD. I'm cool with that.

    Me, too. Could be atmospheric.
  • EiragornEiragorn Hessia
    Posts: 108
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Maybe it's:
    Studio logos-> gunbarrel ->Frozen Lake -> titles-> Matera?



    Highly unlikely. Billie Eilish got 20ish pages of screenplay containing everything up to the title sequence set to her song. And since the song does make reference to a Bond/Maddy betrayal, the Matera sequence is most definitely BEFORE the titles. The song then comes at the ~20 min mark because 1 page of screenplay is formatted for 1min screen time.

    In theory the gunbarrel could split the PTS as some suggested. But would that offer any advantages regarding the flow/edit of the narrative? A probably very suspenseful cold open leads into the highly stylized ornament that is the gb? In that case the gb cue would either be very ominous or even silent but never as muscular and traditional as the published Zimmer track.

    From the sheer duration of the PTS I could imagine another scenario: Couldn't there be a third sequence AFTER Matera – then prob divided with the gb? Normally the PTS ends on some kind of cliffhanger or hint that sets the main story in motion!
  • ColonelSunColonelSun
    Posts: 1,490
    Eiragorn wrote: »
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Maybe it's:
    Studio logos-> gunbarrel ->Frozen Lake -> titles-> Matera?



    Highly unlikely. Billie Eilish got 20ish pages of screenplay containing everything up to the title sequence set to her song. And since the song does make reference to a Bond/Maddy betrayal, the Matera sequence is most definitely BEFORE the titles. The song then comes at the ~20 min mark because 1 page of screenplay is formatted for 1min screen time.

    In theory the gunbarrel could split the PTS as some suggested. But would that offer any advantages regarding the flow/edit of the narrative? A probably very suspenseful cold open leads into the highly stylized ornament that is the gb? In that case the gb cue would either be very ominous or even silent but never as muscular and traditional as the published Zimmer track.

    From the sheer duration of the PTS I could imagine another scenario: Couldn't there be a third sequence AFTER Matera – then prob divided with the gb? Normally the PTS ends on some kind of cliffhanger or hint that sets the main story in motion!

    Your point regarding the song and its lyrics etc. is very valid.

  • Jordo007Jordo007 Merseyside
    Posts: 2,641
    It'll be interesting to see what they do with the pre title sequence in this film, I doubt they'd for a PTS without Bond after a 5 maybe 6 year gap, especially given how well the PTS of Spectre was received, I imagine they'd want plenty of action to smash down the door and say Bond is back rather than a mood setting PTS

    It would different if they went for the frozen lake segment (no dialogue or score just sound effects), gunbarrel, Matera, title sequence, then 5 year time jump with Bond in Jamaica.
    The only problem with that is there's no link to the frozen lake scene and Matera unless they establish it was Madeline having a flashback.
    I think if they go for a title sequence without Bond, they risk alienating the audience who haven't seen or can't remember Spectre and Madeline.
    The marketing should have made it more clear that Madeline is a key element to this adventure but left it vague on why she is important to the story
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    Maybe it's:
    Studio logos-> gunbarrel ->Frozen Lake -> titles-> Matera?

    Hopefully.
  • ToTheRightToTheRight
    Posts: 16,148
    I think a moody, atmospheric PTS without Bond could be refreshing...........providing the damn gunbarrel is at the start.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    ToTheRight wrote: »
    I think a moody, atmospheric PTS without Bond could be refreshing...........providing the damn gunbarrel is at the start.

    +1.
  • Pierce2DanielPierce2Daniel
    edited November 2020 Posts: 4,408
    Cary Fukunaga liked my comment on his latest IG post asking if he has seen the IO gunbarell for their new game. I mentioned that I hope NTTD's looks similar.

    Perhaps this is Fukunaga giving us a hint? Or perhaps, he just liked the tease. Time will tell.

    Nevertheless, one of the creative fans on the forum has already ingenuously placed Craig inside the design and it's glorious. I really like this design. I can only hope it makes it's way into NTTD. It's not too late to change it, surely!

    wuk245bse9061.png
    battleshipgreygt wrote: »
    I wonder if Zimmer’s gunbarrel track that we’ve heard actually plays out the same way during the film.
    The reused buildup bit from Spectre led me to believe that the track would begin over the studio logos, so I wonder exactly how cold of an open it is going to be. Is the order going to be Studio Logos —> Frozen Lake —> Gunbarrel—> Matera —> or will it be Frozen Lake —> Logos —> Gunbarrel—> Matera? I think I prefer the latter.

    This is very Marvel.

    I always found it so disconcerting how their films just *start* and then you have the logo. It's so jarring. Half the audience in the cinema haven't even noticed the film begin. Well, that's when we had cinemas.
  • RyanRyan Canada
    Posts: 692
    The design in the IO trailer is indeed wonderful. Perfect modern interpretation.
  • BonSimonLeBon_1BonSimonLeBon_1
    Posts: 2,436
    Pierce2Daniel wrote: »
    Cary Fukunaga liked my comment on his latest IG post asking if he has seen the IO gunbarell for their new game. I mentioned that I hope NTTD's looks similar.

    Perhaps this is Fukunaga giving us a hint? Or perhaps, he just liked the tease. Time will tell.

    Nevertheless, one of the creative fans on the forum has already ingenuously placed Craig inside the design and it's glorious. I really like this design. I can only hope it makes it's way into NTTD. It's not too late to change it, surely!

    wuk245bse9061.png
    battleshipgreygt wrote: »
    I wonder if Zimmer’s gunbarrel track that we’ve heard actually plays out the same way during the film.
    The reused buildup bit from Spectre led me to believe that the track would begin over the studio logos, so I wonder exactly how cold of an open it is going to be. Is the order going to be Studio Logos —> Frozen Lake —> Gunbarrel—> Matera —> or will it be Frozen Lake —> Logos —> Gunbarrel—> Matera? I think I prefer the latter.

    This is very Marvel.

    I always found it so disconcerting how their films just *start* and then you have the logo. It's so jarring. Half the audience in the cinema haven't even noticed the film begin. Well, that's when we had cinemas.

    If each individual rifling still had Binder's design to them it would be perfect.
  • SatoriousSatorious Brushing up on a little Danish
    Posts: 233
    The above gunbarrel is glorious. So much better than everything since - well - Goldeneye...
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    edited November 2020 Posts: 16,338
    It is nice, but I prefer the curves of the rifling in the more recent gunbarrels: they just produce nicer shapes. These are a bit straight and plain (and I'm not criticising it- it isn't trying to replace them :) ).

    Image1.jpg?fit=1229%2C524&ssl=1

    Take those curves and add the detailing of the P007 one and I'll be happy.
  • tqbtqb
    Posts: 1,022
    I hope the design is similar to IO's. It's a great modern update of the classic barrel.
  • Neverturnback007Neverturnback007 Worldwide
    edited November 2020 Posts: 9
    Chris Cornell You Know My Name - Gritty Redux



    Spectre Moderna



    No Time to Die should be another evolution IMO.
  • SatoriousSatorious Brushing up on a little Danish
    Posts: 233
    As long as it's back at the start and there isn't any pretentious wording nonsense ala Mendes - I'll be fairly happy. I wish Zimmer pushed the boat out a bit more with that almost carbon-copy opening rendition though.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    Yeah, I think the creative thing with Zimmer's Gunbarrel is, Bond's gait might be in sync with the electric guitar.
  • Neverturnback007Neverturnback007 Worldwide
    Posts: 9
    I liked the ending to Quantum of Solace and how they incorporated into the duality of the first two films,

  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,338
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Yeah, I think the creative thing with Zimmer's Gunbarrel is, Bond's gait might be in sync with the electric guitar.

    It's funny, it took me until the video game trailer to notice that NTTD doesn't have the xylophone that Spectre's does.
  • GadgetManGadgetMan Lagos, Nigeria
    Posts: 4,247
    mtm wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Yeah, I think the creative thing with Zimmer's Gunbarrel is, Bond's gait might be in sync with the electric guitar.

    It's funny, it took me until the video game trailer to notice that NTTD doesn't have the xylophone that Spectre's does.

    Yeah. And it just gets to cement what Marr said about the score bringing back guitars. I think DAD was the last time we had the electric guitar in the Gunbarrel Sequence and prominent use of it in a Bond film as well.
  • mtmmtm United Kingdom
    Posts: 16,338
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    mtm wrote: »
    GadgetMan wrote: »
    Yeah, I think the creative thing with Zimmer's Gunbarrel is, Bond's gait might be in sync with the electric guitar.

    It's funny, it took me until the video game trailer to notice that NTTD doesn't have the xylophone that Spectre's does.

    Yeah. And it just gets to cement what Marr said about the score bringing back guitars. I think DAD was the last time we had the electric guitar in the Gunbarrel Sequence and prominent use of it in a Bond film as well.

    Doesn't QoS use it in the gunbarrel?
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