Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,173
    Ludovico wrote:
    Here's a controversial opinion: I don't think Mary Goodnight was miscast, only badly written, a too comedic role in a too comedic movie. In fact I think TMWTGG has a perfect casting.

    I will challenge that statement, @Ludovico, if I may. ;-)

    Christopher Lee is a great actor. His work in multiple Hammer films has made me realise that he is perhaps the only one ever to come near or actually match the skills of Peter Cushing. Casting him as a Bond villain makes all the sense in the world. So naturally I praise the producers for not overlooking him the way they have shamefully overlooked Cushing. But... I think TMWTGG is simply too weak a film for Lee. In fact, I believe that TMWTGG owes him a great debt. Were it not for his presence, the film would have been even weaker. Lee deserved a plot and a script much more tailored to his talents.

    Ekland is a fine looking girl but also of a fairly limited acting range. A slightly more vigorous and fiery actress, like Jacqueline Bisset perhaps, or even Maud Adams, might have given the part the depth that wasn't on the page.

    Adams, however, is one of the few cast members I think was cast well in her part, even if her performance as Octopussy overshadows what she does here IMO. She made Andrea a tragic yet subtly amusing character and given everything else, I honestly doubt the script had those qualities fleshed out enough.

    Hervé Villechaize could have been an interesting asset but the film squeezed every midget cliché out of him. In that sense, he was miscast. I'm sure there's a hell of a lot more that they could have done with Hervé. The NicNac from the novel surely didn't play out like the one from the film so again, weird decision making is what shaped this film.

    Overall, I think TMWTGG is not perfectly cast. Lee is like the finest steak in the world that gets wasted on the brutal treatment of a BBQ. Ekland is the mustard that makes the hotdog edible but doesn't improve the taste. And Villechaize was the seasoning that they overused and put on the wrong parts of the dish.
  • Posts: 1,405
    Timothy Dalton is a better Bond than Roger Moore.

    Agreed, I would add this, although Sir Roger is a tremendous actor, and contributed hansomely to the role, yes, Tim is the better actor and the better Bond. No offense intented to Sir Roger.
  • edited June 2014 Posts: 1,405
    patrice wrote:
    I find it hard to watch You Only Live Twice now. It just doesnt keep me gripped or intrigued to see what happens next like the other Bond's. Does'nt feel like a thriller.

    You could add that YOLT is the Bond movie who aged the worst, the special effects are childish, and Connery, well, Connery was only in for the pay.
  • Posts: 1,405
    CrabKey wrote:
    Having been with the series from the beginning, there's more I like about the series than dislike, but those things I dislike I've always put down to laziness, smugness, or just plain lack of attention to detail on the parts of the filmmakers.

    1-Hated the rear screen projection Sunbeam/Funeral car chase in DN, but then the series has done this quite a bit, especially skiing sequences.

    2-Use of models and miniatures that look like models and miniatures: GF, YOLT.

    3-Bad continuity editing: Mustang in DAF, as well as wheel falling off moon buggy. Explosion debris on truck in FRWL, but gone seconds later. One could write a book on these gaffs.

    4-Consistently choosing really bad actresses to play so many Bond girls.

    5-Changing the whole tone of the series to fit RM's lack of acting ability.

    6-Speeding up film that makes whatever is on screen appear cartoonish. Tilly's car crash in GF, Disco Volante crashing into rocks TB.

    7-Sound of tires screeching on sand - OHMSS.

    8-Cartoon characters such as Jaws falling out of an airplane and surviving.

    9-Creating gadgets that anticipate a specific problem Bond will encounter. Too many to note--but the inflatable gondola is especially irritating.

    10-Penchant for choosing weak villains. QoS, TWINE, TND.

    Overall this series has been a gigantic money maker that deserved a lot more quality than it got. Sometimes it's succeeded well, other times not. The three DC films have been better, but the series has never felt as confident as it did with the first four Bond films and OHMSS.

    Your points 6, 8 and 9 I coudn't agree more.
  • edited June 2014 Posts: 654
    CrabKey wrote:
    Having been with the series from the beginning, there's more I like about the series than dislike, but those things I dislike I've always put down to laziness, smugness, or just plain lack of attention to detail on the parts of the filmmakers.

    1-Hated the rear screen projection Sunbeam/Funeral car chase in DN, but then the series has done this quite a bit, especially skiing sequences.

    2-Use of models and miniatures that look like models and miniatures: GF, YOLT.

    3-Bad continuity editing: Mustang in DAF, as well as wheel falling off moon buggy. Explosion debris on truck in FRWL, but gone seconds later. One could write a book on these gaffs.

    4-Consistently choosing really bad actresses to play so many Bond girls.

    5-Changing the whole tone of the series to fit RM's lack of acting ability.

    6-Speeding up film that makes whatever is on screen appear cartoonish. Tilly's car crash in GF, Disco Volante crashing into rocks TB.

    7-Sound of tires screeching on sand - OHMSS.

    8-Cartoon characters such as Jaws falling out of an airplane and surviving.

    9-Creating gadgets that anticipate a specific problem Bond will encounter. Too many to note--but the inflatable gondola is especially irritating.

    10-Penchant for choosing weak villains. QoS, TWINE, TND.

    Overall this series has been a gigantic money maker that deserved a lot more quality than it got. Sometimes it's succeeded well, other times not. The three DC films have been better, but the series has never felt as confident as it did with the first four Bond films and OHMSS.







    Okay, let´s pretend that you remove all these things. What would be left of the series? If they could have done it better, they would have. For God sake, if you have been watching them since 1962 you should know that they could´nt have done it any other way. ´Cause it was 1962!
  • Posts: 1,979
    Fromswedenwithlove said:
    Okay, let´s pretend that you remove all these things. What would be left of the series? If they could have done it better, they would have. For God sake, if you have been watching them since 1962 you should know that they could´nt have done it any other way. ´Cause it was 1962!

    My criticisms are directed at the series, not confined to 1962, which, incidentally, was not the dawn of film. Which means from the beginning, a lot of the sloppiness in the films could have been addressed.




  • Posts: 7,653
    CrabKey wrote:
    Fromswedenwithlove said:
    Okay, let´s pretend that you remove all these things. What would be left of the series? If they could have done it better, they would have. For God sake, if you have been watching them since 1962 you should know that they could´nt have done it any other way. ´Cause it was 1962!

    My criticisms are directed at the series, not confined to 1962, which, incidentally, was not the dawn of film. Which means from the beginning, a lot of the sloppiness in the films could have been addressed.

    That so-called sloppiness represents a successful formula, and criticism is easy but 50 years of franchise says that every flaw has only strengthened the show. So what do you know?
  • CrabKey wrote:
    Fromswedenwithlove said:
    Okay, let´s pretend that you remove all these things. What would be left of the series? If they could have done it better, they would have. For God sake, if you have been watching them since 1962 you should know that they could´nt have done it any other way. ´Cause it was 1962!

    My criticisms are directed at the series, not confined to 1962, which, incidentally, was not the dawn of film. Which means from the beginning, a lot of the sloppiness in the films could have been addressed.




    How come you are a fan of the films if you find most of them "slopy"?
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,288
    Controversial opinion: Roger Moore's Bond is the only one who seems like he grew up in the Skyfall ancestoral home.
    LeighBurne wrote:
    It's also one of the reasons why I think that Sean Connery could've ruined OHMSS if he'd returned.
    Agreed, I've always thought Lazenby, for his faults, is far better in OHMSS than Connery would have been.

    He's not the best Bond actor by a long shot, but Lazenby was the right actor for his story.
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    CrabKey wrote:
    5-Changing the whole tone of the series to fit RM's lack of acting ability.
    Oh please. The series was already headed in that direction before Moore came along. Things started to get silly as early as GF. DAF represented the biggest tonal change the series has ever seen. That was the direction they wanted to go in the 70's and it would have continued had Roger taken over or not.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    @CrabKey, umm, what? Roger Moore can't act? Well that's a first. If you honestly think this because of the Bond films (and I don't know why, perhaps you should broaden your moviegoing horizon.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Roger made the humor and camp work. Imagine Connery or Lazenby delivering some of his lines.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    Murdock wrote:
    Roger made the humour and camp work.

    I enjoy Roger's films immensely, but let's be real here. He wasn't a great Bond. He was a great Saint filling in. ;)
  • Posts: 1,970
    Max Zorin is a better villian than Silva
  • MayDayDiVicenzoMayDayDiVicenzo Here and there
    Posts: 5,080
    Max Zorin is the best villain in the franchise.

  • Max Zorin is the best villain in the franchise.

    I agree
  • edited June 2014 Posts: 7,507
    Max Zorin is the best villain in the franchise.

    What franchise? You mean Zorin Industries? :P
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    edited June 2014 Posts: 14,569
    jobo wrote:
    Max Zorin is the best villain in the franchise.
    What franchise? You mean Zorin Industries? :P
    @MayDay, please provide @jobo with a drink ;)
  • MayDayDiVicenzoMayDayDiVicenzo Here and there
    Posts: 5,080
    jobo wrote:
    Max Zorin is the best villain in the franchise.

    What franchise? You mean Zorin Industries? :P

    You amuse me, Mr Jobo.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited July 2014 Posts: 24,173
    Here's another opinion:
    I actually think QOS improves with multiple viewings.

    To be frank, it shouldn't be that I need to watch a film up to ten times before I'm finally beginning to see some structure in the chaos which the aggressive editing was kind enough to leave behind. Perhaps my initial responses to QOS were slightly more negative due to the fact that I felt like entire reels of film were left on the cutting room floor. But I'm beginning to grasp the filmmakers' intentions with this film. CR had left us multiple pauses and moments to absorb the surroundings. QOS, by contrast, plays like a film on steroids but rather than speeding things up like they used to do in the old days, the scissors just went in with fierce audacity. However, after multiple viewings, brief moments of diverted attention can be compensated from memory. Contemplating the story with other people has also proven useful in seeing the big picture so to speak. With SF being a far more relaxed Bond film, I have given QOS a place in the Bond legacy as this one-time-only Bond experience on Red Bull. Its uniqueness, albeit one I used to loath, has gradually become an amusing element. I know when not to watch QOS; I also know when the time is right. On those rare occasions when I feel like watching a film that clears out after 90 minutes, QOS is my go-to Bond film. Also, when it's late and I'm somewhat tired, I can use the lack of pauses to keep going without falling asleep. Though I still think of QOS as the adrenalized coda to CR, and a much weaker film at that, I have grown to appreciate this effort more and more. It now ranks a bit higher than it used to; I'd say somewhere in my top 10 or 12.
  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    Now that I've seen it enough, I love the frenetic, fast-paced editing and energy of QoS. It's a go-to Bond film for high-octane action. I'll admit, even though I left the theater after my first showing blown away and very satisfied, I still had questions that weren't answered by the editing, such as what happened when during the PTS or who got stabbed when during the Bond vs. Slate fight, but the more I watch it and the more I answer it myself, the better it got, even though I loved it upon my first viewing.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    edited July 2014 Posts: 17,789
    I fully agree @Creasy47 & @DarthDimi. I never want another Bond movie this fast paced, but as an anomaly I actually love it.
    Apart from the title song. :))
  • Posts: 1,979
    SaintMark said: So what do you know?

    You're right, I don't know anything.
  • Posts: 7,653
    CrabKey wrote:
    SaintMark said: So what do you know?

    You're right, I don't know anything.

    But you very passionate which is brilliant.

  • Posts: 1,146
    Quantum of Solace is a very underrated Bond film. Enjoy its tone and would rather watch this than the majority of the 70's and 80's bonds.
  • WalecsWalecs On Her Majesty's Secret Service
    Posts: 3,157
    Quantum of Solace is a very underrated Bond film. Enjoy its tone and would rather watch this than the majority of the 70's and 80's bonds.

    I agree with this. QoS is not my favourite Bond movie, but I like it more than most of Moore's movies.
  • Posts: 7,653
    Quantum of Solace is a very underrated Bond film. Enjoy its tone and would rather watch this than the majority of the 70's and 80's bonds.

    Too overrated by the younger fans.
  • Posts: 6,396
    SaintMark wrote:
    Quantum of Solace is a very underrated Bond film. Enjoy its tone and would rather watch this than the majority of the 70's and 80's bonds.

    Too overrated by the younger fans.

    No. It's just crap.
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    I like QoS and just about all of Moore's films.
  • Posts: 19,339
    In my case i like ALL the Bond films,just in varying degrees,which fluctuates all the time.
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