Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    Ugh, @bondjames -- agreed. He was awful-- and yes, the C-line really stinks. He should, as Bond had hinted, just left it at:

    "Now I know what C stands for..."... But, to tell the truth: I can't stand anything about the Nine Eyes scenes (I like the idea, can't stand the actor playing C, nor the scenes); in fact, when I watch SP now, I FF these scenes entirely, and it makes for a better viewing in my opinion!
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    Absolutely @peter. The film would be so much better (although still deeply flawed) just by eliminating all those horrid exchanges with C. Scott totally blew it as well.
  • Posts: 676
    bondjames wrote: »
    It's as if he doesn't want to be there.
    Wouldn't be shocked if that was the case.
  • BondAficionadoBondAficionado Former IMDBer
    Posts: 1,889
    I don't like Fiennes' delivery of "pleased to meet you", when he sees Madeleine at the safehouse. That's always bugged me a lot.
  • Posts: 15,117
    Never been a fan of Andrew Scott myself. He plays an ok slimy second class villain because that's what he can play.
  • Posts: 11,189
    I don't like Fiennes' delivery of "pleased to meet you", when he sees Madeleine at the safehouse. That's always bugged me a lot.

    Fiennes is one of those actors where criticising him just feels wrong.
  • Posts: 15,117
    Controversial opinion: Lea Seydoux can do no wrong. Not with that body.
  • Posts: 19,339
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Controversial opinion: Lea Seydoux can do no wrong. Not with that body.

    Cant argue with that....at all !!
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    Correction @Ludovico: she can do no wrong with that body.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    I don't like Fiennes' delivery of "pleased to meet you", when he sees Madeleine at the safehouse. That's always bugged me a lot.

    Fiennes is one of those actors where criticising him just feels wrong.
    I know. That's why I thought it would be controversial.
  • Posts: 11,189
    Ludovico wrote: »
    Controversial opinion: Lea Seydoux can do no wrong. Not with that body.

    I think I even prefer both her and Gemma Arterton to Eva Green.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 5,131
    Lupe Lamora is the best Bond girl purely based on looks and sex.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    edited May 2017 Posts: 15,423
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Lupe Lamora is the best Bond girl purely based on looks and sex.
    And she loves James....

    ....

    ....

    So much.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Lupe is one of the least sexy women in the series.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    RC7 wrote: »
    Lupe is one of the least sexy women in the series.
    Agreed. Talisa in real-life is quite sexy, but her character in LTK certainly isn't. That also applies to many other subsequent Bond girls.
  • edited May 2017 Posts: 2,165
    Milovy wrote: »
    bondjames wrote: »
    It's as if he doesn't want to be there.
    Wouldn't be shocked if that was the case.

    Given Fiennes took on the role of M on the promise he wouldnt be a baddie, only for Mendes to fuck him over and try to do that, would indicate he wasnt overly happy to be there.
  • bondjames wrote: »
    Controversial opinion here.

    One thing I noticed in my SP viewing yesterday is that Ralph Fiennes was bloody awful. Not only did he muck up every scene with Craig (and even the intro with Madeline - what the heck was that?) but he also botched the scenes with the unmemorable and oily 'C' (and yes, this chap's name doesn't stand for careless to me, but rather the more obvious c***). His delivery of the 'not to kill' speech is cringeworthy in the extreme.

    Craig had more enthusiasm when looking at a monitor of Dench spouting something about Sciarra than he had in any scene with Fiennes.

    Darn shame, because he was rather good in SF.

    I also was rather shocked by the "wish I were anywhere but here"-ness of Fiennes' performance, especially as he'd shown such promise in the role in SF. As Mallory mentioned, perhaps he wasn't thrilled by having to fight to save the honor and dignity of his character. That could not have been the best foot to start the project off on. I will say though, I think his "A license to kill is also a license not to kill" scene was the one part where I felt like he really came alive.

    I'm hoping he sticks around and shows us more of his former promise, because I really think he has potential to be a truly great and long lasting M.
  • RichardTheBruceRichardTheBruce I'm motivated by my Duty.
    Posts: 13,791
    Isn't Fiennes M's manner relevant to the film? Didn't seem like misstep at all to me.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Isn't Fiennes M's manner relevant to the film? Didn't seem like misstep at all to me.

    Yes, he seemed suitably pissed off to me for his circumstances. I also think he stood down Bond in a way that would've made Lee's M proud.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Isn't Fiennes M's manner relevant to the film? Didn't seem like misstep at all to me.

    Yes, he seemed suitably pissed off to me for his circumstances. I also think he stood down Bond in a way that would've made Lee's M proud.
    Definitely agreed. I like Fiennes' M very much, to be honest. More than Robert Brown's.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Isn't Fiennes M's manner relevant to the film? Didn't seem like misstep at all to me.

    Yes, he seemed suitably pissed off to me for his circumstances. I also think he stood down Bond in a way that would've made Lee's M proud.
    Definitely agreed. I like Fiennes' M very much, to be honest. More than Robert Brown's.

    Ditto. Brown's M is one of my most despised Bond characters, actually.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    Posts: 15,423
    Isn't Fiennes M's manner relevant to the film? Didn't seem like misstep at all to me.

    Yes, he seemed suitably pissed off to me for his circumstances. I also think he stood down Bond in a way that would've made Lee's M proud.
    Definitely agreed. I like Fiennes' M very much, to be honest. More than Robert Brown's.

    Ditto. Brown's M is one of my most despised Bond characters, actually.
    I don't despise Brown's M at all. I like him. But, he's my least favourite M in the official series.
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    controversial opinion: although I kinda like Hinx, I like bad guys built like real men, like Patrice and Mitchell, to be a DC foil... I find it more real and exciting.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    peter wrote: »
    controversial opinion: although I kinda like Hinx, I like bad guys built like real men, like Patrice and Mitchell, to be a DC foil... I find it more real and exciting.
    +1. Loved both of those characters and their fights with Bond (one highly stylized and the other extremely brutal and visceral).
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    edited May 2017 Posts: 28,694
    Isn't Fiennes M's manner relevant to the film? Didn't seem like misstep at all to me.

    Yes, he seemed suitably pissed off to me for his circumstances. I also think he stood down Bond in a way that would've made Lee's M proud.
    Definitely agreed. I like Fiennes' M very much, to be honest. More than Robert Brown's.

    Ditto. Brown's M is one of my most despised Bond characters, actually.
    I don't despise Brown's M at all. I like him. But, he's my least favourite M in the official series.

    Every time I watch TLD and LTK I just have to tell myself they wrote him to be a poor successor to Lee's M, as nothing else really makes sense to me. I just hate how he pushes the contract to kill Pushkin onto Bond even when Bond constantly tells him something is fishy about the whole idea, or his utter disregard for Bond's mental state following Della's murder/possible rape and Felix's critical condition.

    Lee's M would've heard Bond out on the Pushkin issue to avoid walking MI6 and Britain right into Koskov's obvious trap, and he certainly wouldn't have treated Sanchez's actions against the Leiters in such a cruel and callous manner.
    peter wrote: »
    controversial opinion: although I kinda like Hinx, I like bad guys built like real men, like Patrice and Mitchell, to be a DC foil... I find it more real and exciting.

    I thought Hinx was a riot. After three films of fighting pencils, Bond had to face off with the human equivalent of a brick house.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    My thoughts:

    Lee
    Brown
    Dench (knocked a few off for TWINE)

    Fiennes
  • peterpeter Toronto
    Posts: 9,509
    another controversial opinion, also from QoS: I think this film did the best on making everything seem untrustworthy: after the Mitchell reveal, Bond meets M back at Mitchell's flat. No one knows what the hell is going on, MI6 is in chaos, and I love it.
  • ClarkDevlinClarkDevlin Martinis, Girls and Guns
    edited May 2017 Posts: 15,423
    Isn't Fiennes M's manner relevant to the film? Didn't seem like misstep at all to me.

    Yes, he seemed suitably pissed off to me for his circumstances. I also think he stood down Bond in a way that would've made Lee's M proud.
    Definitely agreed. I like Fiennes' M very much, to be honest. More than Robert Brown's.

    Ditto. Brown's M is one of my most despised Bond characters, actually.
    I don't despise Brown's M at all. I like him. But, he's my least favourite M in the official series.

    Every time I watch TLD and LTK I just have to tell myself they wrote him to be a poor successor to Lee's M, as nothing else really makes sense to me. I just hate how he pushes the contract to kill Pushkin onto Bond even when Bond constantly tells him something is fishy about the whole idea, or his utter disregard for Bond's mental state following Della's murder/possible rape and Felix's critical condition.

    Lee's M would've heard Bond out on the Pushkin issue to avoid walking MI6 and Britain right into Koskov's obvious trap, and he certainly wouldn't have treated Sanchez's actions against the Leiters in such a cruel and callous manner.
    I think they were trying to force the original concept of the Sir Miles Messervy version of M from the novels (a very opinionated and almost every time an angry old man) to go back to the "roots" with Dalton's "dark" Bond.

    Even though the Bernard Lee M often did agree and listen to Bond, he also has some character inconsistencies during his tenure, like forcing 007 off the Operation Bedlam in OHMSS with a "no its, no buts" attitude, even going as far to shut him up with a "That's it!" Another time he was completely in a hating manner to his agent was in Golden Gun, most of the times wishing Bond gets a bullet and that he wouldn't be surprised if he ends up dead by the hands of a jealous husband to a woman he bedded.

    The analysis of it is that prior to the Craig era, they didn't put too much care into character development and consistencies, only concentrating on the adventure itself rather than the story details.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Isn't Fiennes M's manner relevant to the film? Didn't seem like misstep at all to me.

    Yes, he seemed suitably pissed off to me for his circumstances. I also think he stood down Bond in a way that would've made Lee's M proud.
    Definitely agreed. I like Fiennes' M very much, to be honest. More than Robert Brown's.

    Ditto. Brown's M is one of my most despised Bond characters, actually.
    I don't despise Brown's M at all. I like him. But, he's my least favourite M in the official series.

    Every time I watch TLD and LTK I just have to tell myself they wrote him to be a poor successor to Lee's M, as nothing else really makes sense to me. I just hate how he pushes the contract to kill Pushkin onto Bond even when Bond constantly tells him something is fishy about the whole idea, or his utter disregard for Bond's mental state following Della's murder/possible rape and Felix's critical condition.

    Lee's M would've heard Bond out on the Pushkin issue to avoid walking MI6 and Britain right into Koskov's obvious trap, and he certainly wouldn't have treated Sanchez's actions against the Leiters in such a cruel and callous manner.
    I think they were trying to force the original concept of the Sir Miles Messervy version of M from the novels (a very opinionated and almost every time an angry old man) to go back to the "roots" with Dalton's "dark" Bond.

    Even though the Bernard Lee M often did agree and listen to Bond, he also has some character inconsistencies during his tenure, like forcing 007 off the Operation Bedlam in OHMSS with a "no its, no buts" attitude, even going as far to shut him up with a "That's it!" Another time he was completely in a hating manner to his agent was in Golden Gun, most of the times wishing Bond gets a bullet and that he wouldn't be surprised if he ends up dead by the hands of a jealous husband to a woman he bedded.

    The analysis of it is that prior to the Craig era, they didn't put too much care into character development and consistencies, only concentrating on the adventure itself rather than the story details.

    I think they kept Lee's M quite consistent in the 60s, really. From DN to OHMSS, basically the films that matter most for his tenure as the character for me, he was a very Churchill-like leader that was responsive to Bond's thoughts on missions, but was also stern when he was given lip. But he was never a fool or a cruel bastard, and that's where Brown's M fails for me. He never feels like he should be the leader of anything, much less a group of trained killers with international missions that could change the course of geopolitics at any given moment. By far the most inept and out of his depth M for me, and the one I've never had respect for. Maybe that's why Bond is so eager to be given the boot from the job in TLD...
  • Posts: 15,117
    suavejmf wrote: »
    Lupe Lamora is the best Bond girl purely based on looks and sex.

    Maybe not the best but I agree she's among the best looking ones.

    New controversial opinion: while I'm against remaking old Bond movies I'd be ok for an OHMSS remake if and only if Cate Blanchett plays Tracy.
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