Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited October 2020 Posts: 5,131
    suavejmf wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    I like TND and everything about it a lot. The matchups of lady characters with Bond make sense and don't stick out like underage ice skaters. HOWEVER -- the slow motion...ugh. Regardless of what was "in" at the time -- I don't care for it, personally. I like that Bond and the lady lead wind up on the water at the end -- yes !

    Except that Bond and Elliot Carver have more sexual chemistry than Bond and Wai Lin.

    It's another love it or hate it bond film.
    The slow motion is average.

    First hour: Excellent.
    Second hour: Poor. Straight after the ‘halo jump.’

    Agreed, it really drops off. It is the same for GE and DAD for me.

    Good point, agreed.

    Even TWINE has a brilliant and very original pre title sequence, but the rest of the film is mediocre.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    suavejmf wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    I like TND and everything about it a lot. The matchups of lady characters with Bond make sense and don't stick out like underage ice skaters. HOWEVER -- the slow motion...ugh. Regardless of what was "in" at the time -- I don't care for it, personally. I like that Bond and the lady lead wind up on the water at the end -- yes !

    Except that Bond and Elliot Carver have more sexual chemistry than Bond and Wai Lin.

    It's another love it or hate it bond film.
    The slow motion is average.

    First hour: Excellent.
    Second hour: Poor. Straight after the ‘halo jump.’

    Agreed, it really drops off. It is the same for GE and DAD for me.

    Never got that criticism with GE. I think the final act is first rate - a good blend of personal and world saving stakes. Still one of the best, despite Alan Cumming.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    edited October 2020 Posts: 7,114
    suavejmf wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    I like TND and everything about it a lot. The matchups of lady characters with Bond make sense and don't stick out like underage ice skaters. HOWEVER -- the slow motion...ugh. Regardless of what was "in" at the time -- I don't care for it, personally. I like that Bond and the lady lead wind up on the water at the end -- yes !

    Except that Bond and Elliot Carver have more sexual chemistry than Bond and Wai Lin.

    It's another love it or hate it bond film.
    The slow motion is average.

    First hour: Excellent.
    Second hour: Poor. Straight after the ‘halo jump.’

    Agreed, it really drops off. It is the same for GE and DAD for me.

    Never got that criticism with GE. I think the final act is first rate - a good blend of personal and world saving stakes. Still one of the best, despite Alan Cumming.

    I quite like Alan Cumming hamming it up as Boris: "Slugheads" :))
  • Last_Rat_StandingLast_Rat_Standing Long Neck Ice Cold Beer Never Broke My Heart
    Posts: 4,583
    DAF is about to surpass FRWL as my favorite Connery film. I find myself watching DAF way more than most of the films and I always enjoy it. Its been one of my favorites since I got into Bond in the year 2000
  • FatherValentineFatherValentine England
    Posts: 737
    suavejmf wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    I like TND and everything about it a lot. The matchups of lady characters with Bond make sense and don't stick out like underage ice skaters. HOWEVER -- the slow motion...ugh. Regardless of what was "in" at the time -- I don't care for it, personally. I like that Bond and the lady lead wind up on the water at the end -- yes !

    Except that Bond and Elliot Carver have more sexual chemistry than Bond and Wai Lin.

    It's another love it or hate it bond film.
    The slow motion is average.

    First hour: Excellent.
    Second hour: Poor. Straight after the ‘halo jump.’

    Agreed, it really drops off. It is the same for GE and DAD for me.

    Never got that criticism with GE. I think the final act is first rate - a good blend of personal and world saving stakes. Still one of the best, despite Alan Cumming.

    I realise I am in the minority but I'd put GE right near the bottom of the all time list. I just really struggle with the childish material between Natalya and Boris. Anything after Russia is weak. I hate Trvelyan's phony accent. I hate the way he jibes Bond about 'always being better'. Why would Bond care - he's not that sensitive? Anyway - rant over.

    Oh... and another thing, the end credits song is a crime against music.

    Each to their own, though.
  • FatherValentineFatherValentine England
    Posts: 737
    suavejmf wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    I like TND and everything about it a lot. The matchups of lady characters with Bond make sense and don't stick out like underage ice skaters. HOWEVER -- the slow motion...ugh. Regardless of what was "in" at the time -- I don't care for it, personally. I like that Bond and the lady lead wind up on the water at the end -- yes !

    Except that Bond and Elliot Carver have more sexual chemistry than Bond and Wai Lin.

    It's another love it or hate it bond film.
    The slow motion is average.

    First hour: Excellent.
    Second hour: Poor. Straight after the ‘halo jump.’

    Agreed, it really drops off. It is the same for GE and DAD for me.

    Good point, agreed.

    Even TWINE has a brilliant and very original pre title sequence, but the rest of the film is mediocre.

    Yes, actually out of all the Brosnan films TWINE is the most consistent - it is quite mediocre throughout. As you say though, brilliant pre-title sequence! The bit where he jumps out of the office window is one of the best moments in the whole series.
  • silva13silva13 Australia
    Posts: 198
    I'm seeing a double feature of GE and TND at a retro screening this weekend so I will definitely report back. I'm so excited, I've never seen a Brosnan bond on the big screen!
  • Posts: 1,630
    TND - gotta love Carver asking Mr. Stamper -- a great henchman and they come along only once in a while -- to please go kill Mr. Bond !
    Reminiscent of Drax directing to "see that some harm comes to him" with reference to Bond. If I remember correctly, Drax's line comes right from Fleming.
  • Posts: 7,415
    suavejmf wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    I like TND and everything about it a lot. The matchups of lady characters with Bond make sense and don't stick out like underage ice skaters. HOWEVER -- the slow motion...ugh. Regardless of what was "in" at the time -- I don't care for it, personally. I like that Bond and the lady lead wind up on the water at the end -- yes !

    Except that Bond and Elliot Carver have more sexual chemistry than Bond and Wai Lin.

    It's another love it or hate it bond film.
    The slow motion is average.

    First hour: Excellent.
    Second hour: Poor. Straight after the ‘halo jump.’

    Agreed, it really drops off. It is the same for GE and DAD for me.

    Never got that criticism with GE. I think the final act is first rate - a good blend of personal and world saving stakes. Still one of the best, despite Alan Cumming.

    I realise I am in the minority but I'd put GE right near the bottom of the all time list. I just really struggle with the childish material between Natalya and Boris. Anything after Russia is weak. I hate Trvelyan's phony accent. I hate the way he jibes Bond about 'always being better'. Why would Bond care - he's not that sensitive? Anyway - rant over.

    Oh... and another thing, the end credits song is a crime against music.

    Each to their own, though.

    Agree with all of this. GE has one of the most annoying set of characters (and I include smug Brossa in that!) Trevelyan, Boris, Onatopp and the truly irritating Jack Wade! And that scene on the beach with Natalya...Ugh!!
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,182
    I don’t find any of the characters in GE annoying. Boris made good comic relief for me. And I liked Jack Wade.

    That said, his appearance in TND not only felt forced but he wasn’t even written as well as a character. Always making cracks “just like my first marriage, HEH HEH HEH!!” If this is what we would have kept getting, I’m glad he never made more appearances in later films.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    suavejmf wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    I like TND and everything about it a lot. The matchups of lady characters with Bond make sense and don't stick out like underage ice skaters. HOWEVER -- the slow motion...ugh. Regardless of what was "in" at the time -- I don't care for it, personally. I like that Bond and the lady lead wind up on the water at the end -- yes !

    Except that Bond and Elliot Carver have more sexual chemistry than Bond and Wai Lin.

    It's another love it or hate it bond film.
    The slow motion is average.

    First hour: Excellent.
    Second hour: Poor. Straight after the ‘halo jump.’

    Agreed, it really drops off. It is the same for GE and DAD for me.

    Never got that criticism with GE. I think the final act is first rate - a good blend of personal and world saving stakes. Still one of the best, despite Alan Cumming.

    I realise I am in the minority but I'd put GE right near the bottom of the all time list. I just really struggle with the childish material between Natalya and Boris. Anything after Russia is weak. I hate Trvelyan's phony accent. I hate the way he jibes Bond about 'always being better'. Why would Bond care - he's not that sensitive? Anyway - rant over.

    Oh... and another thing, the end credits song is a crime against music.

    Each to their own, though.

    Each to their own, indeed. I'm not that big of a fan of the song, myself! :)
  • Posts: 1,630
    The song and the freeze-frame at the end of GE both are AWFUL. It was as if they all just ran out of time and money and wrapped it up as quickly as possible. As I've noted elsewhere, it also was lousy to have Bond and Natalya interrupted by a host of Marines in a field, rather than -- as with DN, FRWL and other Pierce Brosnan Bond films -- give Bond and the lady lead some alone time, preferably on the beach or in/on the water...
  • Posts: 631
    DAF is about to surpass FRWL as my favorite Connery film. I find myself watching DAF way more than most of the films and I always enjoy it. Its been one of my favorites since I got into Bond in the year 2000

    I absolutely love DAF. It is easily the Bond film I have watched more than any other over the fifty years I’ve been on this planet.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,182
    Since62 wrote: »
    The song and the freeze-frame at the end of GE both are AWFUL. It was as if they all just ran out of time and money and wrapped it up as quickly as possible. As I've noted elsewhere, it also was lousy to have Bond and Natalya interrupted by a host of Marines in a field, rather than -- as with DN, FRWL and other Pierce Brosnan Bond films -- give Bond and the lady lead some alone time, preferably on the beach or in/on the water...

    Freeze frame?
  • Posts: 1,394
    Since62 wrote: »
    The song and the freeze-frame at the end of GE both are AWFUL. It was as if they all just ran out of time and money and wrapped it up as quickly as possible. As I've noted elsewhere, it also was lousy to have Bond and Natalya interrupted by a host of Marines in a field, rather than -- as with DN, FRWL and other Pierce Brosnan Bond films -- give Bond and the lady lead some alone time, preferably on the beach or in/on the water...

    Freeze frame?

    I was going to ask that too.What Freeze frame is he on about?
  • CommanderRossCommanderRoss The bottom of a pitch lake in Eastern Trinidad, place called La Brea
    Posts: 8,253
    Since62 wrote: »
    The song and the freeze-frame at the end of GE both are AWFUL. It was as if they all just ran out of time and money and wrapped it up as quickly as possible. As I've noted elsewhere, it also was lousy to have Bond and Natalya interrupted by a host of Marines in a field, rather than -- as with DN, FRWL and other Pierce Brosnan Bond films -- give Bond and the lady lead some alone time, preferably on the beach or in/on the water...

    Although I love GE, the final scene isn't very strong, I agreee on that. Those marines were quite out of place, and those choppers too. As if the Cubans wouldn't notice an air armada llike that.
  • Posts: 1,917
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    I like TND and everything about it a lot. The matchups of lady characters with Bond make sense and don't stick out like underage ice skaters. HOWEVER -- the slow motion...ugh. Regardless of what was "in" at the time -- I don't care for it, personally. I like that Bond and the lady lead wind up on the water at the end -- yes !

    Except that Bond and Elliot Carver have more sexual chemistry than Bond and Wai Lin.

    It's another love it or hate it bond film.
    The slow motion is average.

    First hour: Excellent.
    Second hour: Poor. Straight after the ‘halo jump.’

    Agreed, it really drops off. It is the same for GE and DAD for me.

    Never got that criticism with GE. I think the final act is first rate - a good blend of personal and world saving stakes. Still one of the best, despite Alan Cumming.

    I realise I am in the minority but I'd put GE right near the bottom of the all time list. I just really struggle with the childish material between Natalya and Boris. Anything after Russia is weak. I hate Trvelyan's phony accent. I hate the way he jibes Bond about 'always being better'. Why would Bond care - he's not that sensitive? Anyway - rant over.

    Oh... and another thing, the end credits song is a crime against music.

    Each to their own, though.

    Agree with all of this. GE has one of the most annoying set of characters (and I include smug Brossa in that!) Trevelyan, Boris, Onatopp and the truly irritating Jack Wade! And that scene on the beach with Natalya...Ugh!!

    I'd put the nag Natalya at the top with her annoying lines like "Boys with toys" and "Do you blow up every vehicle" and not giving the man who is constantly keeping her alive a little more respect. If this is what represented a Bond woman instead of Bond girl, as the irritating line from each director went back in the day, I'll take the girls.

    I'd add M and modern Moneypenny in there as well. Their modern views were annoying at the time and remain so 25 years later.

    Onatopp is basically a Fiona Volpe/Fatima Blush/May Day variant, but at least she's fun and lively. Don't mind Boris, either. He was just a preview of the annoying, know-it-all IT guys we'd have to deal with in coming years.
  • echoecho 007 in New York
    Posts: 6,290
    I like that the ending of GE is different.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,114
    I quite like that song.
  • suavejmfsuavejmf Harrogate, North Yorkshire, England
    edited October 2020 Posts: 5,131
    BT3366 wrote: »
    Mathis1 wrote: »
    suavejmf wrote: »
    echo wrote: »
    Since62 wrote: »
    I like TND and everything about it a lot. The matchups of lady characters with Bond make sense and don't stick out like underage ice skaters. HOWEVER -- the slow motion...ugh. Regardless of what was "in" at the time -- I don't care for it, personally. I like that Bond and the lady lead wind up on the water at the end -- yes !

    Except that Bond and Elliot Carver have more sexual chemistry than Bond and Wai Lin.

    It's another love it or hate it bond film.
    The slow motion is average.

    First hour: Excellent.
    Second hour: Poor. Straight after the ‘halo jump.’

    Agreed, it really drops off. It is the same for GE and DAD for me.

    Never got that criticism with GE. I think the final act is first rate - a good blend of personal and world saving stakes. Still one of the best, despite Alan Cumming.

    I realise I am in the minority but I'd put GE right near the bottom of the all time list. I just really struggle with the childish material between Natalya and Boris. Anything after Russia is weak. I hate Trvelyan's phony accent. I hate the way he jibes Bond about 'always being better'. Why would Bond care - he's not that sensitive? Anyway - rant over.

    Oh... and another thing, the end credits song is a crime against music.

    Each to their own, though.

    Agree with all of this. GE has one of the most annoying set of characters (and I include smug Brossa in that!) Trevelyan, Boris, Onatopp and the truly irritating Jack Wade! And that scene on the beach with Natalya...Ugh!!

    I'd put the nag Natalya at the top with her annoying lines like "Boys with toys" and "Do you blow up every vehicle" and not giving the man who is constantly keeping her alive a little more respect. If this is what represented a Bond woman instead of Bond girl, as the irritating line from each director went back in the day, I'll take the girls.

    I'd add M and modern Moneypenny in there as well. Their modern views were annoying at the time and remain so 25 years later.

    Onatopp is basically a Fiona Volpe/Fatima Blush/May Day variant, but at least she's fun and lively. Don't mind Boris, either. He was just a preview of the annoying, know-it-all IT guys we'd have to deal with in coming years.

    I’m not really into the female M either. It’s ok, but I accepted it rather than ever loved it.

    The score (bar the gunbarrel, pre title sequence, tank chase, romantic scenes and theme song) is dire.

    Serras ‘Experience of Love’ is dire.

    The characters and Brosnan’s performance are all great IMO. I see what you mean about Boris though....a tad pantomime.

    Campbell’s direction is also first class.
  • Posts: 16,154
    I like GoldenEye's ending. "What could possibly go wrong, eh?"

    Next time I do a ranking I think GE may end up quite a bit higher as I've been feeling nostalgic for the film and Pierce era overall.
  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,569
    I don't mind 'Experience of Love' on it's own, but it doesn't quite fit the tone of the film/ending, and the song sounds like it was made in 1989.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,182
    Serra’s work is the best score of the Mike/Babs era.
  • Posts: 16,154
    I really like Serra's gunbarrel music. I prefer it far more than Arnold's first two efforts, both of Newman's and now Zimmer's.
  • Posts: 1,630
    The freeze frame at the end of Goldeneye shows Bond with Natalya, Marines in the background, with Bond laughing/smiling. The image freezes as the film ends and the credits come up.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,182
    ...no it doesn’t.

  • WillyGalore_ReduxWillyGalore_Redux I like my beer cold, my TV loud and my homosexuals flaaaaaaming
    Posts: 294
    Since62 wrote: »
    The freeze frame at the end of Goldeneye shows Bond with Natalya, Marines in the background, with Bond laughing/smiling. The image freezes as the film ends and the credits come up.

    Think you're very much mistaken.
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,114
    Serra’s work is the best score of the Mike/Babs era.

    Wholeheartedly agree. I'd even go further and say it's the best of the non-Barry Bond scores.
  • MakeshiftPythonMakeshiftPython “Baja?!”
    Posts: 8,182
    GoldenGun wrote: »
    Serra’s work is the best score of the Mike/Babs era.

    Wholeheartedly agree. I'd even go further and say it's the best of the non-Barry Bond scores.

    That’s because it is. :D
  • Posts: 2,917
    Now you guys are getting super-controversial!
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