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Controversial opinions about Bond films

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  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Murdock wrote:
    Blofeld's death in FYEO was better than his non death in DAF.

    I see little controversial in that, @Murdock, although I suppose it was done for comic effect in the PTS of FYEO.

    I thought it was sillier in DAF but I love the sadistic enjoyment on Roger's face as he picks Blofeld up and drops him in the smoke stack.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    Risico007 wrote:
    Quantum of solace is brilliant

    and the Opera Sequence is by far one of the best scene in Bond history.

    the win in Casino Royale eclipses it ever so slightly.

    QoS is not brilliant and the Tosca sequence is nowhere near as impressive as people make out. People like to think it's something resembling an auteur at work when it's basically a standard action scene in slo-mo backed by an opera track. Don't get me wrong, it's cool, but ultimately it's bordering on pretentious. There are many Moore era sequences that kick it's ass.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,269
    Murdock wrote:
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Murdock wrote:
    Blofeld's death in FYEO was better than his non death in DAF.

    I see little controversial in that, @Murdock, although I suppose it was done for comic effect in the PTS of FYEO.

    I thought it was sillier in DAF but I love the sadistic enjoyment on Roger's face as he picks Blofeld up and drops him in the smoke stack.

    Yes, granted, I guess there's not a whole lot in it. I'm actually writing a piece on the ending of DAF the film and novel that you may find of interest...
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Murdock wrote:
    Dragonpol wrote:
    Murdock wrote:
    Blofeld's death in FYEO was better than his non death in DAF.

    I see little controversial in that, @Murdock, although I suppose it was done for comic effect in the PTS of FYEO.

    I thought it was sillier in DAF but I love the sadistic enjoyment on Roger's face as he picks Blofeld up and drops him in the smoke stack.

    Yes, granted, I guess there's not a whole lot in it. I'm actually writing a piece on the ending of DAF the film and novel that you may find of interest...

    Splendid. I look forward to reading it.
  • Perilagu_KhanPerilagu_Khan
    edited December 2013 Posts: 2,483
    RC7 wrote:
    Risico007 wrote:
    Quantum of solace is brilliant

    and the Opera Sequence is by far one of the best scene in Bond history.

    the win in Casino Royale eclipses it ever so slightly.

    QoS is not brilliant and the Tosca sequence is nowhere near as impressive as people make out. People like to think it's something resembling an auteur at work when it's basically a standard action scene in slo-mo backed by an opera track. Don't get me wrong, it's cool, but ultimately it's bordering on pretentious. There are many Moore era sequences that kick it's ass.

    I think you're giving Tosca short shrift here. The sequence is about much more than the slo-mo and the actual music of Tosca. It is about the glamour of the setting; Arnold's really quite terrific cue; Bond's method of obtaining a Quantum receiver and then contemptuously breaking the bathroom door handle; the brilliant audacity of Quantum's meeting in the middle of an opera; Bond's crashing of said meeting and his icy line, "I really think you need to find another place to meet."; and Mr. White's equally wonderful line, "Well, I guess Tosca's not for everybody."

    QOS hardly melts my butter, but the Tosca sequence never fails to thrill me.

  • Creasy47Creasy47 In Cuba with Natalya.Moderator
    Posts: 40,968
    What moment during the Tosca scene am I not recalling that was in slow-motion? I know the music cuts out and it flashes in between Bond fleeing and what's happening on the stage - which is brilliant - but I don't recall any slow-motion action going on.
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    For a much more impressive opera/actionscene and not so badly edited:


  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    Murdock wrote:
    Blofeld's death in FYEO was better than his non death in DAF.

    Agreed. And now that I understand the 'stainless steel' comment, and am convinced that he'd totally lost his mind, I really like his little bye-bye.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    chrisisall wrote:
    Murdock wrote:
    Blofeld's death in FYEO was better than his non death in DAF.

    Agreed. And now that I understand the 'stainless steel' comment, and am convinced that he'd totally lost his mind, I really like his little bye-bye.

    Hell If I had killed James Bond's wife and He's got me at his mercy, I'd probably say random stuff too.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    Murdock wrote:
    Hell If I had killed James Bond's wife and He's got me at his mercy, I'd probably say random stuff too.
    The years after his total FAIL in DAF combined with his severe lack of resources and the RE-injury of his neck (first injured in OHMSS) which left him without the use of his legs that time drove him truly mad. His attempt on Bond's life in the PTS of FYEO was absolutely pathetic (measured in 60's Blofeld super-villain terms), and in the end, he reverted to the sad little inner punk of his early teen mob-connected days...

    IMO.

  • Risico007Risico007
    Posts: 9,846
    RC7 wrote:
    Risico007 wrote:
    Quantum of solace is brilliant

    and the Opera Sequence is by far one of the best scene in Bond history.

    the win in Casino Royale eclipses it ever so slightly.

    QoS is not brilliant and the Tosca sequence is nowhere near as impressive as people make out. People like to think it's something resembling an auteur at work when it's basically a standard action scene in slo-mo backed by an opera track. Don't get me wrong, it's cool, but ultimately it's bordering on pretentious. There are many Moore era sequences that kick it's ass.

    I ma talking about the scene before that one where Bond observes the Quantum meeting

  • hildebrand_rarityhildebrand_rarity
    Posts: 316
    Risico007 wrote:
    Quantum of solace is brilliant

    and the Opera Sequence is by far one of the best scene in Bond history.

    the win in Casino Royale eclipses it ever so slightly.

    While I don't necessarily consider it brilliant (or even good), I don't think it's the antichrist that many people make it out to be. Same goes for another way to die.

  • QBranchQBranch Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
    Posts: 14,568
    Risico007 wrote:
    I ma talking about the scene before that one where Bond observes the Quantum meeting
    Agreed. When the Quantum members start standing up and Bond says "where do you think you're going?"

    On my first viewing, I remember that as being the most impressive moment in the film.
  • BennyBenny Shaken not stirredAdministrator, Moderator
    Posts: 15,133
    RC7 wrote:
    Risico007 wrote:
    Quantum of solace is brilliant

    and the Opera Sequence is by far one of the best scene in Bond history.

    the win in Casino Royale eclipses it ever so slightly.

    QoS is not brilliant and the Tosca sequence is nowhere near as impressive as people make out. People like to think it's something resembling an auteur at work when it's basically a standard action scene in slo-mo backed by an opera track. Don't get me wrong, it's cool, but ultimately it's bordering on pretentious. There are many Moore era sequences that kick it's ass.

    Yep, heartily agree @RC7. The Tosca scene is overrated drivel. I don't hate it, but it's not the most amazing thing in a Bond movie.
    Also, please learn to use the edit function @Dragonpol, you triple posted on the previous page within a few minutes of each other. Thanks.
  • LeighBurneLeighBurne
    Posts: 57
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    MR has lots of ridiculous moments but this is not one of them.
    I wasn't talking about the scientific realism of going into space. I was talking about Bond doing it with exactly zero astronaut training.
  • RC7RC7
    Posts: 10,512
    LeighBurne wrote:
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    MR has lots of ridiculous moments but this is not one of them.
    I wasn't talking about the scientific realism of going into space. I was talking about Bond doing it with exactly zero astronaut training.

    I refuse to believe anyone has ever watched MR and thought 'Bond hasn't had astronaut training, this is completely unrealistic'.
  • DragonpolDragonpol https://thebondologistblog.blogspot.com
    Posts: 18,269
    Benny wrote:
    RC7 wrote:
    Risico007 wrote:
    Quantum of solace is brilliant

    and the Opera Sequence is by far one of the best scene in Bond history.

    the win in Casino Royale eclipses it ever so slightly.

    QoS is not brilliant and the Tosca sequence is nowhere near as impressive as people make out. People like to think it's something resembling an auteur at work when it's basically a standard action scene in slo-mo backed by an opera track. Don't get me wrong, it's cool, but ultimately it's bordering on pretentious. There are many Moore era sequences that kick it's ass.

    Yep, heartily agree @RC7. The Tosca scene is overrated drivel. I don't hate it, but it's not the most amazing thing in a Bond movie.
    Also, please learn to use the edit function @Dragonpol, you triple posted on the previous page within a few minutes of each other. Thanks.

    Sorry about that. I've still not mastered that one, but I will try to!
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    RC7 wrote:
    LeighBurne wrote:
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    MR has lots of ridiculous moments but this is not one of them.
    I wasn't talking about the scientific realism of going into space. I was talking about Bond doing it with exactly zero astronaut training.

    I refuse to believe anyone has ever watched MR and thought 'Bond hasn't had astronaut training, this is completely unrealistic'.

    What training? He just sits there. Once they light up a spacecraft there's nothing you can do to affect it - you're a passenger for the duration.

    Even Holly does very little as they are on a pre assigned flight path.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    RC7 wrote:
    LeighBurne wrote:
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    MR has lots of ridiculous moments but this is not one of them.
    I wasn't talking about the scientific realism of going into space. I was talking about Bond doing it with exactly zero astronaut training.

    I refuse to believe anyone has ever watched MR and thought 'Bond hasn't had astronaut training, this is completely unrealistic'.

    Correct. I thought, People's hair hanging down in zero G, this is completely unrealistic.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    chrisisall wrote:
    RC7 wrote:
    LeighBurne wrote:
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    MR has lots of ridiculous moments but this is not one of them.
    I wasn't talking about the scientific realism of going into space. I was talking about Bond doing it with exactly zero astronaut training.

    I refuse to believe anyone has ever watched MR and thought 'Bond hasn't had astronaut training, this is completely unrealistic'.

    Correct. I thought, People's hair hanging down in zero G, this is completely unrealistic.
    Considering the film features a villainous plot to wipe out the earth's population to begin anew with carefully chosen "specimens," I think some scientific liberties can be taken.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    edited December 2013 Posts: 6,396
    I was always more concerned with how Colonel Scott is able to pick up Jaws & Dolly on his way back to Earth. Considering we last see them within the docking station spinning uncontrollably through space, how exactly did they get from there to the shuttle?

    And why isn't Bond more concerned? "Don't worry, they'll make it. Only 100 miles to Earth". How are they going to make it? Is it equipped with a heat shield so they don't burn up upon entering the atmosphere? Or what about a parachute to prevent them being slammed into the concrete at over 1000 miles an hour?

    Or perhaps I'm reading way too much into it, after all this is a film in which Bond drives a gondola through St Mark's Square! ;-)
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    WillyGalore wrote:
    I was always more concerned with how Colonel Scott is able to pick up Jaws & Dolly on his way back to Earth. Considering we last see them within the docking station spinning uncontrollably through space, how exactly did they get from there to the shuttle?

    And why isn't Bond more concerned? "Don't worry, they'll make it. Only 100 miles to Earth". How are they going to make it? Is it equipped with a heat shield so they don't burn up upon entering the atmosphere? Or what about a parachute to prevent them being slammed into the concrete at over 1000 miles an hour?

    Or perhaps I'm reading way too much into it, after all this is a film in which Bond drives a gondola through St Mark's Square! ;-)

    Indeed MR is a classic Bond movie, its special effects stand up as brilliant even compared to the poor CGI of both DAD & QoB.

    If I remember correctly the remark about Jaws surviving is based upon 007's experience of Jaws'survival instincts, if a white shark cannot kill him. I believe in Woods novelisation the remark is meant that way.

    I love the gondola on St. Marks place, and of course I would. Great name and a great place to visit(albeit a tad expensive). ;)

  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    WillyGalore wrote:
    And why isn't Bond more concerned? "Don't worry, they'll make it. Only 100 miles to Earth". How are they going to make it? Is it equipped with a heat shield so they don't burn up upon entering the atmosphere? Or what about a parachute to prevent them being slammed into the concrete at over 1000 miles an hour?
    We're all reading too much into it if we are to give a serious analysis of Moonraker but I always took it as Bond just saying that to comfort her and not really caring what happened to them. Jaws did try to kill him multiple times after all.
  • Perilagu_KhanPerilagu_Khan
    Posts: 2,483
    RC7 wrote:
    LeighBurne wrote:
    TheWizardOfIce wrote:
    MR has lots of ridiculous moments but this is not one of them.
    I wasn't talking about the scientific realism of going into space. I was talking about Bond doing it with exactly zero astronaut training.

    I refuse to believe anyone has ever watched MR and thought 'Bond hasn't had astronaut training, this is completely unrealistic'.

    Quite. The things people find to carp about...

  • LeighBurneLeighBurne
    edited December 2013 Posts: 57
    WillyGalore wrote:
    I was always more concerned with how Colonel Scott is able to pick up Jaws & Dolly on his way back to Earth. Considering we last see them within the docking station spinning uncontrollably through space, how exactly did they get from there to the shuttle?

    And why isn't Bond more concerned? "Don't worry, they'll make it. Only 100 miles to Earth". How are they going to make it? Is it equipped with a heat shield so they don't burn up upon entering the atmosphere? Or what about a parachute to prevent them being slammed into the concrete at over 1000 miles an hour?
    I figured the fact the bit of the station they flee on clearly separates in a controlled manner, it must be some sort of escape pod. Therefore it must have some means of getting them safely back to Earth, otherwise what use is it?
    Perilagu_Khan wrote:
    Quite. The things people find to carp about...
    I phrased it badly. It's the whole concept of Bond going into space, rather than the fact going into space is technically possible, that is ridiculous.
  • Perilagu_KhanPerilagu_Khan
    Posts: 2,483
    Stephen Jay Rubin also has problems with that concept, and I suppose I can see the point, but frankly, it's never bothered me.
  • WillyGaloreWillyGalore
    Posts: 6,396
    LeighBurne wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    I was always more concerned with how Colonel Scott is able to pick up Jaws & Dolly on his way back to Earth. Considering we last see them within the docking station spinning uncontrollably through space, how exactly did they get from there to the shuttle?

    And why isn't Bond more concerned? "Don't worry, they'll make it. Only 100 miles to Earth". How are they going to make it? Is it equipped with a heat shield so they don't burn up upon entering the atmosphere? Or what about a parachute to prevent them being slammed into the concrete at over 1000 miles an hour?
    I figured the fact the bit of the station they flee on clearly separates in a controlled manner, it must be some sort of escape pod. Therefore it must have some means of getting them safely back to Earth, otherwise what use is it?

    That still doesn't explain how they've been picked up by Colonel Scott though.
  • SaintMarkSaintMark
    Posts: 7,653
    WillyGalore wrote:
    LeighBurne wrote:
    WillyGalore wrote:
    I was always more concerned with how Colonel Scott is able to pick up Jaws & Dolly on his way back to Earth. Considering we last see them within the docking station spinning uncontrollably through space, how exactly did they get from there to the shuttle?

    And why isn't Bond more concerned? "Don't worry, they'll make it. Only 100 miles to Earth". How are they going to make it? Is it equipped with a heat shield so they don't burn up upon entering the atmosphere? Or what about a parachute to prevent them being slammed into the concrete at over 1000 miles an hour?
    I figured the fact the bit of the station they flee on clearly separates in a controlled manner, it must be some sort of escape pod. Therefore it must have some means of getting them safely back to Earth, otherwise what use is it?

    That still doesn't explain how they've been picked up by Colonel Scott though.

    Perhaps they never were, since Jaws never came back for an encore.

  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,789
    The cello gag in TLD was marvellous!
  • Perilagu_KhanPerilagu_Khan
    Posts: 2,483
    I agree. And that's the end of that.

    Next controversy!
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