Would Goldeneye have been a success with Dalton?

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  • Posts: 16,153
    Getafix wrote: »
    Titanic and Avatar were dire

    Avatar is without hesitation my least favorite film to have seen in the cinema. Pretentious overrated crap, and I've seen a ton of awful films on the big screen.
  • Posts: 3,333
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    It's actually an American remake of the 1991 French film La Totale!
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103103/
    Yeah, I was aware of that when I went to see the advance screening of True Lies back in 94. Never seen this French movie. I'd be curious to know whether anyone else has seen it. I'm guessing it borrows only the husband and wife skit from La Totale and the rest bares little or no resemblance whatsoever. So probably not much of a remake at all.
  • Posts: 11,189
    I've not seen it either but according to Wikipedia the whole Simon stuff is in the original film.
  • edited May 2018 Posts: 3,333
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    I've not seen it either but according to Wikipedia the whole Simon stuff is in the original film.
    How long does the Simon stuff last in True Lies? Refresh my memory. I mean, does it have a terrorist group known as the "Crimson Jihad" in the French version?
  • Posts: 11,189
    The Simon stuff probably takes up about a quarter of the Cameron film amd La Totale features a terrorist group who plan to blow up a Paris football stadium.
  • Posts: 3,333
    I see. I just had a quick glance at some of the reviews for La Totale and they complain that it looks rather cheap and is nowhere near in the same league as True Lies. Maybe @Mathis1 watched the wrong movie and saw the French version instead?
  • edited May 2018 Posts: 15,114
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    It's actually an American remake of the 1991 French film La Totale!
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103103/

    Which is far better.
    bondsum wrote: »
    I see. I just had a quick glance at some of the reviews for La Totale and they complain that it looks rather cheap and is nowhere near in the same league as True Lies. Maybe @Mathis1 watched the wrong movie and saw the French version instead?

    If by "cheaper" you mean "unpretentious" then yes. The original is an actual comedy that knows it's a comedy, a parody that knows it's a parody. It does not try to be an action movie because it's not.
  • Posts: 7,653
    Ludovico wrote: »
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    It's actually an American remake of the 1991 French film La Totale!
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103103/

    Which is far better.

    No it isn't. Just you being annoying.
  • Posts: 15,114
    SaintMark wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    It's actually an American remake of the 1991 French film La Totale!
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103103/

    Which is far better.

    No it isn't. Just you being annoying.

    Yes it is. It's an unpretentious comedy. Hollywood never understood French comedies, that is why their remakes fail miserably.
  • Posts: 7,653
    Ludovico wrote: »
    SaintMark wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    It's actually an American remake of the 1991 French film La Totale!
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103103/

    Which is far better.

    No it isn't. Just you being annoying.

    Yes it is. It's an unpretentious comedy. Hollywood never understood French comedies, that is why their remakes fail miserably.

    True French comedy I can enjoy while a movie like "trois hommes et un coffin"was betetr brought in its American version.

    The French have their own style of movies and they are bloody great I rarely compare them to the US. The US tends to take the more European liberal style out of remakes from European or Asian productions and make it too moralistic for my tastes.

    I fell in love with French cinema due to its beautiful and more natural actresses Catherine Deneuve to name one.
  • edited May 2018 Posts: 11,425
    sadly Catherine D looks anything but natural these days...

    speaking of French cinema Luc Besson would have been an obvious choice for Bond in the 90s
  • Posts: 15,114
    Getafix wrote: »
    sadly Catherine D looks anything but natural these days...

    speaking of French cinema Luc Besson would have been an obvious choice for Bond in the 90s

    Luc Besson is another director I'd keep away from Bond by all means necessary.
  • Posts: 11,189
    He already has an indirect link to Bond anyway.

    He directed LEON, which was scored by Eric Serra.
  • Posts: 7,415
    bondsum wrote: »
    I see. I just had a quick glance at some of the reviews for La Totale and they complain that it looks rather cheap and is nowhere near in the same league as True Lies. Maybe @Mathis1 watched the wrong movie and saw the French version instead?

    No it's Cameron's movie I think is crap.
    I was aware it was a remake and I have only seen clips of the French film. I stand by what I say...True Lies looks cheap. It obviously spent the budget on set pieces and Arnies salary and the whole Bill Paxton section drags even if it is only a quarter of the film.
  • edited May 2018 Posts: 11,189
    Maybe I’m a bit nostalgic towards True Lies because - like GoldenEye and Terminator 2 - it was a film I watched A LOT as a teenager on video.

    But I can’t agree that it looks cheap. To me it looks and feels like a fairly big budget movie.

    Miami for example is filmed in a far better manner than it was in LTK.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    Maybe I’m a bit nostalgic towards True Lies because - like GoldenEye and Terminator 2 - it was a film I watched A LOT as a teenager on video.

    But I can’t agree that it looks cheap. To me it looks and feels like a fairly big budget movie.

    Miami for example is filmed in a far better manner than it was in LTK.
    I can't see any cheapness in True Lies either. It still looks great as far as I'm concerned. I last viewed it about a year ago and am due another watch soon.
  • Posts: 15,114
    Problem I have with Cameron movies and among them True Lies is that they are often so pretentious and bloated. Even the good ones! True Lies is the remake of a low key French comedy which parodies spy thrillers. Instead of an everyman Thierry Lhermitte you have muscleman Arnie as a superspy... trying to pass as an everyman.
  • Posts: 11,189
    Arnie was so good as the everyman in Total Recall that he played one again in True Lies.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,395
    Should Brosnan have gotten his chance at CR?
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2018 Posts: 23,883
    Should Brosnan have gotten his chance at CR?
    Perhaps, but they would have had to make it differently. It could have worked with the ending like the book, but not with the way it was done in 2006. Brozz would have overacted and blown it imho.
  • Posts: 3,333
    I recall Empire and Premiere magazine at the time having various interviews with Cameron and him stating for the record that he only made True Lies to fill in the vacuum vacated by not having a Bond movie out that summer, as he really missed not seeing a 007 movie.

    As @BAIN123 pointed out, the whole Simon angle was taken from the French movie, and it does feel typically French and very unlike Bond. I also recall I felt the movie perhaps a tad jingoistic, but then again, Cameron was only aping Bond and his allegiance to the crown so maybe I was being unfair in my criticism. I liked True Lies, but I'm glad Harry Tasker never replaced 007 in people's affections. Cameron was planning a True Lies 2, but that was scuppered soon after 9/11 as Cameron felt to make a movie about Arab terrorists after such a tragedy would be in poor taste. Basically, Cameron took far too long to hatch his sequel. In saying that, it would've been interesting to see Harry Tasker go toe-to-toe against Brosnan's Bond, as it might've made Eon up their game a bit more with GE and TND.
  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,395
    bondjames wrote: »
    Should Brosnan have gotten his chance at CR?
    Perhaps, but they would have had to make it differently. It could have worked with the ending like the book, but not with the way it was done in 2006. Brozz would have overacted and blown it imho.

    Perhaps you're right. It just seems to me a stupendous lack of judgement on the part of M to put the young gun, renegade, doesn't follow the rules agent and hand over millions to play in a card game. Who cares if he's good at cards, he's completely green, no experience in the ways of the secret service. Such a risky venture would seemingly suit a more mature agent better. Not to mention the idea of Bond quitting the force would have more reverence if he was nearing the end of his career, not on his first assignment. The Bond of the novel was not described as on his first assignment, if almost as if they weren't paying very much attention when they were putting the script together.
  • edited May 2018 Posts: 11,189
    I’ve heard on here I think that GE had its budget increased following the release of True Lies.

    I’ve tended to view the archive shootout/tank chase sequence in GE as Eon’s response to TL.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2018 Posts: 23,883
    bondjames wrote: »
    Should Brosnan have gotten his chance at CR?
    Perhaps, but they would have had to make it differently. It could have worked with the ending like the book, but not with the way it was done in 2006. Brozz would have overacted and blown it imho.

    Perhaps you're right. It just seems to me a stupendous lack of judgement on the part of M to put the young gun, renegade, doesn't follow the rules agent and hand over millions to play in a card game. Who cares if he's good at cards, he's completely green, no experience in the ways of the secret service. Such a risky venture would seemingly suit a more mature agent better. Not to mention the idea of Bond quitting the force would have more reverence if he was nearing the end of his career, not on his first assignment. The Bond of the novel was not described as on his first assignment, if almost as if they weren't paying very much attention when they were putting the script together.
    They had evidently run out of ideas with DAD, and humiliated themselves in the process. The timing was right for a new approach, and so recasting just made sense, and while doing it, why not jump on the reboot bandwagon as well? That's all it came down to really.

    Let's see if someone over there has the common sense to realize they are at another fork in the road again, at least imho. If not, perhaps the studio at least.
  • Posts: 3,333
    Should Brosnan have gotten his chance at CR?
    No, for the same reason Craig shouldn't get a shot at B26... he's getting too old for the part.
  • edited May 2018 Posts: 11,189
    Good ol' Bazza compares GE to TL at 5.05.

  • Mendes4LyfeMendes4Lyfe The long road ahead
    Posts: 8,395
    bondsum wrote: »
    Should Brosnan have gotten his chance at CR?
    No, for the same reason Craig shouldn't get a shot at B26... he's getting too old for the part.

    Craig is older now than Brosnan was in DaD. :)
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited May 2018 Posts: 23,883
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    I’ve heard on here I think that GE had its budget increased following the release of True Lies.

    I’ve tended to view the archive shootout/tank chase sequence in GE as Eon’s response to TL.
    GE was all about bringing back Bond classic film swagger. I didn't know they increased the budget for GE though. It was made on a relative pittance of $50m, and it shows imho. True Lies was a much bigger budget affair, but I think EON (and Campbell) showed with GE that they could deliver serious quality on a lower budget. Pity they didn't continue that approach with TND, where they blew their wad and gave us an inferior effort, at least imho. Sure, there's more money on the screen, but the casting and script couldn't hold a candle to GE, again imho.

    EDIT:
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    Good ol' Bazza compares GE to TL at 5.05.

    I miss ole Barry. He was one of a kind.
  • Posts: 11,189
    bondjames wrote: »
    BAIN123 wrote: »
    I’ve heard on here I think that GE had its budget increased following the release of True Lies.

    I’ve tended to view the archive shootout/tank chase sequence in GE as Eon’s response to TL.
    GE was all about bringing back Bond classic film swagger. I didn't know they increased the budget for GE though. It was made on a relative pittance of $50m, and it shows imho. True Lies was a much bigger budget affair, but I think EON (and Campbell) showed with GE that they could deliver serious quality on a lower budget. Pity they didn't continue that approach with TND, where they blew they wad and gave us an inferior effort, at least imho. Sure, there's more money on the screen, but the casting and script couldn't hold a candle to GE, again imho.

    I don't know 100% if this is true but I seem to remember reading it somewhere on here. I can understand why if they did.
  • Posts: 3,333
    Yes, @BAIN123. I was at that advance screening of GE. The mutterings around me were that it was "too cheesy" but I guess those people weren't included in the voxpop. You only have to see the big money razzamatazz that was spent on promoting GE compared to Dalton's 2 movies, to see how TD was at a disadvantage—Something that Norman's Film 95 shows unabashedly. I do remember this particular Barry Norman segment, especially as I'd already seen the movie a good 3 weeks prior to the BBC broadcast. As I pointed out, True Lies was at the forefront of everybody's minds back in 95 when GE was first released, even Norman's. Interesting to see some of the voxpoppers claiming Brosnan looked far too weedy to be convincing, which Norman even picks up on.
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