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Roger Moore...in Diamonds are Forever or The Living Daylights?

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  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    Quoting Lazenby.: I'd say it was more a case of them tiring a little bit of Bond in GENERAL, as
    other big franchises started to take over. Bond had a brief and understandable
    curiosity-fuelled upsurge with the casting of a new actor with TLD, but it went
    back downhill again just one film later, partially because the public weren't
    that bothered with the new Bond.
    Interesting point Lazenby. In the 80's it did seem that the Bond machine was somewhat like a sausage factory churning films out with metronomic regularity every 2 years and I think Daltons Bond was a victim of this malaise.

    To the general public who are not hardcore Bond fans and will only go and see the film once at the cinema the films all started to seem the same and with Rog having been in situ for 12 years the law of diminishing returns was seriously starting to kick in following OP with only the temporary shot in the arm of a new actor in TLD arresting the downward box office trajectory from AVTAK to LTK.

    Although it didnt seem like it at the time IMO the 89-95 hiatus worked in the series favour - although it did ultimately spawn a decade of greatest hits packages with Brozza, but thats a separate debate. After the underwhelming performance of LTK another film with the unpopular (in joe publics eyes) Dalton, especially when up against the Lethal Weapon, Die Hard and Batman franchises at their peak, might well have killed off the series.

    What would have been a better result for everyone concerned would have been for the 6 year legal wrangling to have hit in 83, post OP, thereby forcing Rogs retirement on a high and letting Dalton refresh things with TLD in 89 and continuing through the 90s. We would lose AVTAK as made but thats a small price to pay for say four or five Dalton films between 89 and 97 leaving Brosnan with a 3 film tenure from 99 to 03, or ditch Broz completely and let Dalton push on until about 02 and then bring in Craig in 04ish -although would there have been such a radical reboot seeing as surely DAD would never have been the abortion it was with Dalton in the role. Not that I'm laying the blame at Pierces feet; he was probably the best thing about DAD. Lets just say his interpretation was more susceptible to some of the excesses that somehow got the green light than Daltons was.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    Posts: 24,173
    Poll attached!
  • LudsLuds MIA
    Posts: 1,986
    I went with Yes for DAF, no for TLD.

    DAF is very much a Moore Bond flick. It's humorous, silly, and clearly more of a game than a serious Connery-esque spy adventure. Connery looked older in DAF than Moore did up to OP, he could have done a good job in DAF as well. As for TLD, well considering how old he looked in AVTAK, TLD would have given him a heart attack.
  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    edited March 2011 Posts: 4,813
    Quoting Samuel001: look at how old Moore is in the 25th anniversary documentary.
    You know it's funny you mention that- I popped that in with the sole purpose of checking to see how Rog looked in 1987. I feel like he looked the same as he did in 1985. That's why I'm kind of on the fence.... since he DID stick around till AVTAK, maybe he should had done TLD just to end with a good movie, you know? Realistically, I'd have preferred him to end with Octopussy though

    Here's an image to get stuck in your head: I watched TLD recently and couldn't stop picturing Roger Moore on that roller coaster with the 'Ooooohhhhh!!!!' dub they liked using so much! lol
    :-D
  • KerimKerim Istanbul Not Constantinople
    Posts: 2,629
    Moore could have easily done DAF. In fact, I would have rather seen Moore do DAF than Connery.

    However, I don't feel the same about TLD. Dalton was simply a better fit for that film. Besides, we would have had another grampa scenario with him and Kara.
  • JBFan626JBFan626
    Posts: 1,497
    Moore could have done DAF and it would have been fine; much better than had he done TLD. But Connery was much better than Moore would have been in DAF, especially with the delivery of the lines.
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    While it wouldn't quite be the same without Connery (I can't see the cartoonishly violent tone making the transition), i'd rather see Rog start his Bond run 2 years younger (44), than go on 2 years older (60).
  • RogueThunderballRogueThunderball
    Posts: 306
    Quoting MajorDSmythe: While it wouldn't quite be the same without Connery (I can't see the cartoonishly violent tone making the transition), i'd rather see Rog start his Bond run 2 years younger (44), than go on 2 years older (60).
    My feelings exactly.
  • Samuel001Samuel001 Moderator
    Posts: 13,355
    Quoting Master_Dahark:

    Quoting Samuel001: look at how old Moore is in the 25th
    anniversary documentary.
    You know it's funny you
    mention that- I popped that in with the sole purpose of checking to see how Rog
    looked in 1987. I feel like he looked the same as he did in 1985. That's why I'm
    kind of on the fence.... since he DID stick around till AVTAK, maybe he should
    had done TLD just to end with a good movie, you know? Realistically, I'd have
    preferred him to end with Octopussy though

    I agree. I think six films for anyone is enough. It's kind of the unspoken rule. Stallone did six Rockys, Willis wants to stop at six Die Hards, Deep will likely only do six Pirates of the Caribbean films.

    Would anyone actually want another actor to do seven films as Bond again?

    I do feel Moore looked older, though perhaps that's me. Maybe other people on the boards feel that same as you @Master_Dahark. I get the feeling The Living Daylights would have been quite different had Moore been playing Bond.
  • The_ReaperThe_Reaper
    Posts: 1,092
    The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of Moore in DAF. It is fun the way it is but I keep picturing Moore running around having fun like Connery have been doing in the film. I think it would have improved the film a great deal and would have been a better first film than LALD was for Moore.
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    Posts: 3,262
    I voted for "He could have done DAF but not TLD". TLD was perfect for Dalton's approach and I'd want to keep it that way. A Moore DAF probably wouldn't have been all that different from TMWTGG since they contained much of the same behind-the-scenes staff and crew. But I'm quite happy that Connery's in it instead. Connery's performance and his playful chemistry with Jill St. John are among DAF's strengths. I don't know if Moore would've paired as well with her as Connery did.
  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    edited January 2013 Posts: 4,813
    We all pretty much agreed unanimously that this wouldn't have worked- but the poses were so identical that I just had to photoshop it! Besides, I was having fun with the fake 'what if' posters over on that Sean Connery thread I started (Sean Connery as James Bond 1962-1985) seen here: http://www.mi6community.com/index.php?p=/discussion/563/sean-connery-as-james-bond-1962-1985/p1



    Roger Moore in The Living Daylights:
    http://images1.snapfish.com/232323232fp:;2>nu=3246>9<3>:8:>WSNRCG=348849:2:6325nu0mrj
    I'll likely do a Diamonds Are Forever one as well when I have more time!

  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,112
    I really like Rog in his first three outings and FYEO but I like both DAF and TLD as we got them.
  • QuarterdeckQuarterdeck
    Posts: 136
    Roger and DAF is a great match I think! I can really 'see' it...
  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    Posts: 4,813
    Oooooh I like this one!

    Roger Moore in Diamonds Are Forever:
    http://images1.snapfish.com/232323232fp:<4>nu=3246>9<3>:8:>WSNRCG=34884:8684325nu0mrj
  • Jazz007Jazz007 Minnesota
    edited May 2011 Posts: 257
    I think Roger Moore would have been perfect for the tone DAF but TLD?.... Not so much; I believe that Moore would have been far too old a Bond by 1987 and the series needed the intensity and change in direction that Dalton brought.
  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    edited May 2011 Posts: 15,715
    AVTAK had very bad Box Office attendance. Without the impulse of a new actor (Dalton), I shudder at the thought of what the ticket sales would have been for an 8th Moore outing, which were going down since FYEO.
  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    Posts: 4,813
    I'm loving the idea of Moore in DAF! His run should have been DAF-OP
  • The_ReaperThe_Reaper
    Posts: 1,092
    Master_Dahark... how about editing Roger Moore into the entire movie? Can you swing that?
  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    Posts: 4,813
    lol that's a pretty tall order- you'll have to give me a minute
  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    edited May 2011 Posts: 3,262
    Quoting Master_Dahark:
    Roger Moore in The Living Daylights:
    http://images1.snapfish.com/232323232%7Ffp%3A%3B2%3Enu%3D3246%3E9%3C3%3E%3A8%3A%3EWSNRCG%3D348849%3A2%3A6325nu0mrj
    Quoting Master_Dahark: Roger Moore in Diamonds Are Forever:
    http://images1.snapfish.com/232323232%7Ffp%3A%3C4%3Enu%3D3246%3E9%3C3%3E%3A8%3A%3EWSNRCG%3D34884%3A8684325nu0mrj
    Good job on both of these also.
  • The_ReaperThe_Reaper
    Posts: 1,092
    I'm waiting, MD... [-(
  • KerimKerim Istanbul Not Constantinople
    Posts: 2,629
    Moore actually would have been a better fit in DAF than Connery. However, Moore wasn't remotely a good fit in TLD.
  • JBFan626JBFan626
    Posts: 1,497
    Quoting Kerim: Moore actually would have been a better fit in DAF than Connery
    Hmm...I thought so too. But I'm starting to change my mind now...

    ...had Moore taken over for 007 in DAF immediately following Lazenby's go at OHMSS--this would have been DISASTROUS for the series. Going from a generally disliked Lazenby to another lesser-known Moore in a camp film like DAF might have been the end of the series as we know it.

    Connery does well enough in DAF and actually balances out a lot of the absurdity. So in a way he sets the stage for a smooth transition for Moore to take over.
  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    edited May 2011 Posts: 4,813
    Hmm good point- that would have been a heck of a transition.

    Let's just stick with what everyone wants anyway: George Lazenby in DAF! :-D

    http://images1.snapfish.com/232323232fp;3:>nu=3246>9<3>:8:>WSNRCG=3488783867325nu0mrj
  • GoldenGunGoldenGun Per ora e per il momento che verrà
    Posts: 7,112
    Quoting JBFan626: Hmm...I thought so too. But I'm starting to change my mind now...



    ...had Moore taken over for 007 in DAF immediately following Lazenby's go at OHMSS--this would have been DISASTROUS for the series. Going from a generally disliked Lazenby to another lesser-known Moore in a camp film like DAF might have been the end of the series as we know it.



    Connery does well enough in DAF and actually balances out a lot of the absurdity. So in a way he sets the stage for a smooth transition for Moore to take over.
    Exactly my thoughts. Of course DAF with Lazenby and somewhat less campy would have been great but what we got was the next best thing and I really like it.
  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    edited May 2011 Posts: 4,813
    Here's an image to get stuck in your head: I watched TLD recently and couldn't stop picturing Roger Moore on that roller coaster with the 'Ooooohhhhh!!!!' dub they liked using so much! lol
    :-D




    LOL

    http://images1.snapfish.com/232323232fp;36>nu=3246>9<3>:8:>WSNRCG=348:79::49325nu0mrj

  • PrinceKamalKhanPrinceKamalKhan Monsoon Palace, Udaipur
    Posts: 3,262
    LOL

    http://images1.snapfish.com/232323232fp;36>nu=3246>9<3>:8:>WSNRCG=348:79::49325nu0mrj

    Good work, M_D. Provides more evidence that Dalton was the right lead casting for TLD.

  • DaltonCraig007DaltonCraig007 They say, "Evil prevails when good men fail to act." What they ought to say is, "Evil prevails."
    Posts: 15,715
    LOL

    http://images1.snapfish.com/232323232fp;36>nu=3246>9<3>:8:>WSNRCG=348:79::49325nu0mrj

    That's Moore from FYEO ! Now imagine him 6 years older for TLD !!

  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    edited May 2011 Posts: 4,813
    Alright, let's do some Bond fiction.

    Moore ending in TLD in 1987. Who'd be the new Bond in 1989? Given that Brosnan would have been done with Remington Steel, he'd have debuted in Bond 16.

    Problem - Legal problems halting the franchise until 1995 = Brosnan would be the new Lazenby, doing on 1 film. No way would EON and Brosnan waited until 1995 to make a 2nd outing.

    New Bond in 1995. Brosnan being done, who is going to be Bond now? Timothy Dalton? Liam Neeson? With a more serious, Fleming-esque actor, Bond #5 would have lasted longer than 2002. Let's pick Dalton... He'd have ended in 2007.
    A similar thought popped into my head today.

    It does sort of make Moore look bad, but the rewards are worth it I think.
    WHAT IF: Moore sticks around for TLD and while it IS better than AVTAK, the popular opinion is that Moore needs to go, and his 'style' has finally gotten old. Bringing in Dalton for LTK as his FIRST movie proves to be a much more welcome change- people are embracing this dark killer Bond. Dalton is so well received that despite the legal wranglings that held up the next film until 1995, Dalton STICKS AROUND! And it's because everyone MISSED him!

    Now we've got Timothy Dalton as James Bond in Licence to Kill, GoldenEye, Tomorrow Never Dies, The World is Not Enough, Die Another Day and perhaps more! Each of the movies would have fared better with Dalton IMO. Not hating on Brosnan, I just like Dalton more

    I feel it would be like what's happening today- we are all loving Craig- and when the next movie does come out, we'd all be disappointed to not have Craig again
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