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  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    Just as a sidenote - another person who should be quite annoyed is Steven Price. His music is quite good yet his score is pushed into the background in favour of several retro tunes.

    The main theme for the Squad is fairly prevalent on his album presentation yet it barely registers in the film except for the "unity" sequence before the finale.
  • fire_and_icefire_and_ice
    Posts: 6,432
    The over use of music tracks has been a common complaint I have noticed.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    @CraigMooreOHMSS, @doubleoego, anyone who's seen the movie, one question I have (without any spoilers) is how is Joker and Harley's relationship handled? Do they just make it seem normal and lovey dovey, or do they explore the trenches of it and the abuse Harley faces at his hands, and the obsession with him that keeps her coming back for more?
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    @CraigMooreOHMSS, @doubleoego, anyone who's seen the movie, one question I have (without any spoilers) is how is Joker and Harley's relationship handled? Do they just make it seem normal and lovey dovey, or do they explore the trenches of it and the abuse Harley faces at his hands, and the obsession with him that keeps her coming back for more?

    The abuse is implied, but it's only briefly there (one instance would be Joker using Harleys sexuality to get a reaction to a certain character in order to react to that reaction).
    Considering Harley is the one who has the most screen time (alongside Deadshot) that is one of the biggest disappointments. And I say that as someone who enjoyed it. Deadshot is the one who comes out of SS as being the most well handled. Smith handled the character very well.

    That's the thing. Those of us who know and understand the source material will see the implications in a couple of scenes but those who aren't that familiar are likely to see this Joker as romanticised / sanitised. I hope that makes sense.

    It's very apparent that this wasn't what Leto was going for with his Joker but the edit seems to have made it so.

    I didn't hate the film - I enjoyed it. But I am still quite conflicted by it.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    edited August 2016 Posts: 28,694
    I'm glad Leto is being so vocal about his criticisms, too. We deserve the full experience, and because Joker and Harley are such a complicated pairing, there's so much to play with on screen when it comes to their dynamic, especially when Batman is involved. Why it was decided to cut the most scenes from arguably the most interesting or popular character of the bunch is perplexing and infuriating for sure.

    If WB keep this up, people are going to just skip all theater releases of these films in their chopped up cuts and wait for the full experience when the disc releases arrive so they can see the film the way it was meant to be seen. Ayer can't be happy about how all this is panning out, but he knows his head is liable to get the axe if he so much as sighs in WB's direction. They should only wrestle away creative control from their directors when they prove they aren't up for the job (like Snyder), and not before.
  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    Posts: 4,813
    Wow I had plans on seeing it Sunday but it sounds like I might benefit by waiting for Bluray-- you know.... to see the whole thing?
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    They should call it Suicide Squad: Joker Edition with the tagline, He's actually in this one!
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    I'm glad Leto is being so vocal about his criticisms, too. We deserve the full experience, and because Joker and Harley are such a complicated pairing, there's so much to play with on screen when it comes to their dynamic, especially when Batman is involved. Why it was decided to cut the most scenes from arguably the most interesting or popular character of the bunch is perplexing and infuriating for sure.

    If WB keep this up, people are going to just skip all theater releases of these films in their chopped up cuts and wait for the full experience when the disc releases arrive so they can see the film the way it was meant to be seen. Ayer can't be happy about how all this is panning out, but he knows his head is liable to get the axe if he so much as sighs in WB's direction. They should only wrestle away creative control from their directors when they prove they aren't up for the job (like Snyder), and not before.

    I think that's why Ayer claimed ownership on this cut in order to ensure that he's asked back for the sequel. It's the only reason I can think of. A director like Ayer who is renowned for his gritty plots and mostly cynical characters effectively cutting out one of the biggest lunatics in comic book history and his lovingly abusive relationship with his former physciatrist? Just doesn't seem right.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    @CraigMooreOHMSS, quite. From all I've read, Ayer's version matched the very first trailer we saw for the movie, showcasing a more cynical and less "fun" world full of these characters with grit and intensity. I think that the negative BvS response WB got and comments from audiences about it being too dreary made them reshoot to inject more comedy and possible action into the film that soon overtook Ayer's darker vision. What resulted in this cut seems to make the film less of a Dark Knight and more a Guardians of the Galaxy.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    people moan about The Joker being used too much, and now they moan about him being used too little?

    One question: Why squad? Are they split up into four sub-teams?
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    I'm sick of Joker being used as the end-all-be-all villain in Batman's stuff. In other films, like this one where the villains have their own film I'm fine with him appearing, as it's unique and not done to death. Even if I wasn't okay with it, he's easily the best character of the bunch (they could've assassinated his character though) and should've therefore appeared as much as he originally did in the script and in what was shot on set with Leto.

    As for why the word "squad" is used, it's defined as a small group of people brought together for a common task. That, and it makes for an alliterative title when put after "suicide."
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    Squad is short for Squadron, which is always a group of four.

    I know because I served on a cannon boat that was part of an MTB squadron. Being named so, because there were four boats.
  • GerardGerard
    Posts: 5,993
    That maybe true in the Navy, but not in the Army :

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squad
    In military terminology, a squad is a sub-subunit led by a non-commissioned officer[1] that is subordinate to an infantry platoon. In countries following the British Army tradition (Australian Army, Canadian Army, and others), this organization is referred to as a section. In most armies, a squad consists of eight to fourteen soldiers,[2] and may be further subdivided into fireteams.
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    A squadron is the same as a batallion, but the litteral meaning is square.
  • Seven_Point_Six_FiveSeven_Point_Six_Five Southern California
    Posts: 1,257
    Are you seriously not familiar with the term "squad" as used to describe a small group or team? Or were you just looking for any chance to impress us with your knowledge of military terminology?
  • ThunderfingerThunderfinger Das Boot Hill
    Posts: 45,489
    I know the term from American cop shows. It is still wrong use of language, which is quite common.

    Damn, not sure if I want to see the movie now.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    I'm skipping it @Master_Dahark I have decided.

    I can't stand another BvS like disappointment at the cinema involving my beloved DC characters.

    Furthermore why pay now when I will pay anyway for the steelbook which will contain (probably) the theatrical cut and the director's cut or whatever they will call it.

    In BvS case I will probably re-watch the theatrical cut more than the ultimate cut even, that's a first for me. To actually prefer a "butchered" version over a longer version, but then BvS ultimate didn't show more of what I would have liked but more of the things that already were wrong in the first place (imo)
  • GerardGerard
    Posts: 5,993
    Thunderfinger wrote: »
    A squadron is the same as a batallion, but the litteral meaning is square.

    Ahem !

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battalion
    A battalion is a military unit. The use of the term "battalion" varies by nationality and branch of service. Typically a battalion consists of 300 to 800 soldiers and is divided into a number of companies. A battalion is typically commanded by a lieutenant colonel. In some countries the word "battalion" is associated with the infantry.
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    edited August 2016 Posts: 9,020
    Squadron is not like Squad. It's complicated and depends of which country we speak.

    A Squad is a sub-unit of 8 to 12 men usually. Depending on the country it is 8 and called Section made of two 4 men units.

    Squadron is mostly used in cavalry (at least in Switzerland) and isn't limited to small numbers of soldiers.

    So Suicide Squad certainly means a classical Squad made of 4 to 8 people and that seems to be right for the movie, although I haven't seen it.

    My Squad is 5 people by the way, I was a para-scout in the Swiss Military. The term suggest 4 people, but we were 5 so you see it's a flexible term depending how the army is organised.

    Edit: Squadron of course also are used in Air Forces and Navy Forces
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    Posts: 1,003
    Believe it or not in the original script joker tries to kill Harley and is really abusive actually slaps her pretty hard in the face knocking her down..

    In this version they changed it to where the joker will do anything for her and to break her out of prison.

    I honestly expected Joker just to pop up in the opening and ending but he was in the movie quite a bit...

    He could've had a few more scenes but still I don't see why people are complaining. This movies about the suicide squad not joker or batma
  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    CASINOROYALE wrote: »
    Believe it or not in the original script joker tries to kill Harley and is really abusive actually slaps her pretty hard in the face knocking her down..

    In this version they changed it to where the joker will do anything for her and to break her out of prison.

    I honestly expected Joker just to pop up in the opening and ending but he was in the movie quite a bit...

    He could've had a few more scenes but still I don't see why people are complaining. This movies about the suicide squad not joker or batma

    Maybe yes. But it was heavily marketed as a "Joker" movie. So if you do that you have to expect people wanting to see a lot of Joker in it.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    0BradyM0Bondfanatic7 wrote: »
    @CraigMooreOHMSS, @doubleoego, anyone who's seen the movie, one question I have (without any spoilers) is how is Joker and Harley's relationship handled? Do they just make it seem normal and lovey dovey, or do they explore the trenches of it and the abuse Harley faces at his hands, and the obsession with him that keeps her coming back for more?

    It's handled terribly. They turned Joker into a simp. Joker is just Harley's bf and even that is handled poorly. The relationship dynamic is completely bastardized.

  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    edited August 2016 Posts: 11,139
    And as expected, another case of a supremely front loaded movie. Early numbers for Saturday at BoxOfficeTheory is mid 30s. That would be absolutely horrendous! One of the worst drops ever which is practically unheard of. This is actually shocking. So much for that $150million opening. That's a 50% drop from one day to the next! This is like the equivalent of an 80% second week drop for a tentpole. Toxic word of mouth kicked in earlier than anyone could have anticipated.

    International drops are just as bad, from BOT:

    37% in South Korea, 45% in France, 30% in Brazil, 30ish% in Russia.

    All from opening day to second day. Just...wow.





  • BondJasonBond006BondJasonBond006 on fb and ajb
    Posts: 9,020
    while BvS at least didn't lose Warner any money and barely broke even, SS will undoubtably result in a financial disaster.

    I'm pretty sure no stone will be left unturned at DC/Warner after that.

    It will all depend on WW now but even there I have not much hope that it will make up for the BvS and SS mess. The image of the DCU has been damaged to an almost irreparable extend, that makes me sad and it seems Comics and the stunningly great DC Animated Universe will have to do in the next several years.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    What's really sad for WB/DC is, they wanted Marvel money immediately and thought going from 0 to 60 was the best course of action. This whole thing has been one screw up after another; worst yet they're compromising their best IPs in the process.

    In a world where Marvel are now churning out A-list heroes annually Batman and Superman no longer have that novelty and luxury of leaning on and utilising the legacy to win people over. The brand is fractured and audiences see it as problematic. Now, the hard work that WB/DC tried avoiding in the first place is something they'll have to do in order to earn back what they've carelessly lost.
  • CraigMooreOHMSSCraigMooreOHMSS Dublin, Ireland
    Posts: 8,216
    "Suicide Squad" breaks August opening weekend record with $132million opening despite projected 40% Friday-Saturday drop.

    http://screenrant.com/suicide-squad-box-office-august-record-opening/?utm_source=SR-FB-P&utm_medium=Social-Distribution&utm_campaign=SR-FB-P&view=list
  • CASINOROYALECASINOROYALE Somewhere hot
    edited August 2016 Posts: 1,003
    Also.. Little Joker spoiler alternate ending confirmed...
    The scene in the trailer shows Joker with a burned face saying "BYE BYE" was a scene during the enchatress fight. Joker pushed Harley out of the plane to kill her, crashes, comes back and tries to get her to leave the team. Harley says no she's with her friends now and has to protect them and he's not hurting her anymore..He throws a grenade and leaves. Honestly glad they chose a different ending
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    edited August 2016 Posts: 11,139
    CraigMooreOHMSS wrote: »
    "Suicide Squad" breaks August opening weekend record with $132million opening despite projected 40% Friday-Saturday drop.

    http://screenrant.com/suicide-squad-box-office-august-record-opening/?utm_source=SR-FB-P&utm_medium=Social-Distribution&utm_campaign=SR-FB-P&view=list

    Like I said, this movie like BvS before it is front loaded.

    This is terrible news for WB. With a Fri to Sat drop like that it signifies a more than likely situation of the movie having very weak legs. I predict week 2 will have somewhere between 67% and 75% drop.

    This is strike 3 for WB/DC. They really needed this movie to be a hit and rehabilitate their brand before Justice League.
  • Master_DaharkMaster_Dahark
    Posts: 4,813
    Jesus, according to Jared Leto, they shot enough footage of him to make a Joker movie if they wanted to! Yet he's in it for around 10 minutes I hear....

    I'd be PISSED if I was him.

    http://comicbook.com/dc/2016/08/07/jared-leto-says-he-shot-enough-footage-for-a-joker-movie-wishes-/

    I could imagine him seeing the movie for the first time in the theatre like 'Where the f*** is all the stuff I shot?!?'

    ODipdhL.gif?noredirect
  • GerardGerard
    Posts: 5,993
    Yes, pretty much how Sir Christopher Lee might have felt after Return of the King (theatrical version).
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