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Dalton as Bond: TLD vs. LTK

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  • SirHilaryBraySirHilaryBray Scotland
    Posts: 2,138
    TLD for me locations are excellent, love the desert idea and the gas pipe evac concept. LTK concept was good dont know whay it is just doesnt grip me ad much as TLD. LTK was a better Dalton performance though.
  • ThomasCrown76ThomasCrown76 Augusta, ks
    Posts: 757
    The living daylights is a classic James Bond movie. I wish they'd have waited to do something so drastic as license to kill as Dalton's second bond. We needed more time to get to know and care about him and any relationship with Felix leiter to make that movie work.
    It's still decent, but the living daylights is better
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    Dalton's movies gave us a traditional Bond & a rogue Bond; best of both worlds IMHO.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    Stiff and overacted in both.. less of a slob in TLD so I'll go with that one.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    mcdonbb wrote: »
    Stiff and overacted in both.. less of a slob in TLD so I'll go with that one.
    Silly silly Texan man...
    :))
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Licence to Kill is the better of the two. The Living Daylights is a good movie, but it has it's faults. Mainly it's poor villains and the "cello case sled" scene. Some of the jokes could have been cut too. I wish Kara was written better. She comes off like Goodnight at times. All in all. It's a solid flick but Licence to Kill is one of the Best Bond films out there. It's in my top 3 sitting at number 2.

    1. GoldenEye
    2. Licence to Kill
    3. Skyfall
  • pachazopachazo Make Your Choice
    Posts: 7,314
    Dalton seems more comfortable with himself in LTK and I think it's the better of his two performances. Not that he was bad in TLD. There are just some awkward moments here and there. He certainly seems more at home with the darker material he had to work with in LTK.
  • doubleohdaddoubleohdad
    Posts: 1,146
    thelivingroyale wrote: »
    SirHenryLeeChaChing wrote:
    thelivingroyale wrote:
    MajorDSmythe wrote:
    thelivingroyale wrote:
    He was brilliant in both. I think he basically played the character the same way in both anyway so I can't choose.

    I think LTK does feature a progression of the Bond seen in TLD. I love both films, they're my #'s 1 & 2. I just so happen to preffer the classic tone of TLD.

    I have LTK as no 1 and TLD as 2. I love both but LTKs villian and story put it ahead for me.

    I think Dalton was the same in both. He still had all the usual cinematic Bond stuff, he cracked the odd joke, he was suave, etc. But he had a much darker side than any of the others, a side of him that was brutal and hated his job.

    I just think LTK showed that darker side more than TLD did.

    Precisely why I appreciate Craig and appreciate them equally.

    All imo:

    I think Dalton did the darker Bond better. When Craig was being a darker Bond I didn't like the whole rookie angle and I didn't get the sense that he hated his job like Dalton did.

    I think Craigs best performance is SF and he's much more light hearted in that, he has more funny lines. He felt more like Connery than he did Dalton and to be honest I think he's better at that.

    Dalton was really good at doing a darker Bond (who did have some funny lines). Craig was alright in CR and QOS but I think he felt like Dalton, except he was a rookie and wasn't as good.

    With SF I think Craig has shown he's better as sort of an all rounder. Leave the darker Bond to Dalts.

    I don't think so. Craig can actually fight, and there's really no memorable fight scene in Dalt's films that come close to the Craig fights.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    I think the fight on the land rover at the start of TLD and the one on the cargo net at the end are still pretty memorable. They stand out more in a way than any of the Craig fights, which are essentially Bourne style combat mainly.
  • doubleohdaddoubleohdad
    Posts: 1,146
    That's a laugh. The opening of TLD is cool, but nothing like any of the Craig fights, which are brutal and believable. Craig is literally on top of a train on some of those shots at the beginning of skyfall.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    doubleohdad wrote: »
    That's a laugh. The opening of TLD is cool, but nothing like any of the Craig fights, which are brutal and believable. Craig is literally on top of a train on some of those shots at the beginning of skyfall.

    How many times in umpteen different movies have we seen a fight on top of a train (not least OP). It's fine as far as it goes but nothing very new or original. Most of Craig's fights are very competent but basically look like the very good fight choreography in Bourne. Perhaps the Kermodo Dragon scene stands out as a bit different.
  • doubleohdaddoubleohdad
    Posts: 1,146
    Very competent? Like the machete fight in CR? That was awesome.
  • doubleohdaddoubleohdad
    Posts: 1,146
    Yeah, the Bourne stuff just embarrassed EON into mimicking them.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    doubleohdad wrote: »
    Yeah, the Bourne stuff just embarrassed EON into mimicking them.

    Well exactly. Mimicry is not a bad thing necessarily but would be nice to see a bit more originality in Bond. I find the chase at the start of CR a bit OTT for my tastes but you have to acknowledge it is original. The train thing in SF was familiar from countless other movies.
  • doubleohdaddoubleohdad
    edited December 2014 Posts: 1,146
    The train fight on top of the car where Bond uses the tractor to move from one car to another while the train is in motion is more of the best moments in the franchise. UNless you think flipping Jaws out of the train car is cool.

    Or Kananga blowing up like an inflatable doll.

    Good grief.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Well I think Jaws in TSWLM was pretty cool yes, as do millions of others. Not sure the Craig era has given us a henchman to match Jaws yet.
  • doubleohdaddoubleohdad
    edited December 2014 Posts: 1,146
    Put Machete guy from CR and Jaws in a room and who do you think walks out?
    Is it the guy who drops huge bricks on his feet?
    Or jumps from tram to tram in a silly and un-believable way?

    The big henchman in OP would clean Jaw's clock as well.
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    'Machete guy'? Yeah - he was really memorable.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    Getafix wrote: »
    'Machete guy'? Yeah - he was really memorable.
    The action figure is going for almost nothing on eBay.

  • NicNacNicNac Administrator, Moderator
    Posts: 7,582
    mcdonbb wrote: »
    Stiff and overacted in both.. less of a slob in TLD so I'll go with that one.
    I sort of agree with that synopsis.

  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    LTK hardly featured any fight scenes ...gun play and brief conveyor and the OTT tanker chase ... we had a little camera/edit style a la Bourne in QoS but don't see how bond has been copying Bourne all three films?? CR is straight Bond fights.

    I'm usually hard on Dalton but I really do like him and think he deserved way better director and scripts he got. He was stiff and yup overacted ...always too obvious he is acting which great for stage but umm on screen we are right there ..doesn't have to be so pronounced.

    If he hadn't had a b movie director and a better director to guide him then yeah.

    And reversing my original answer... LTKwas written for Dalton and better serves him.

    He still looks like a slob in it.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    mcdonbb wrote: »
    He still looks like a slob in it.

    You mean like Dan does in SF?
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    edited January 2015 Posts: 13,978
    Getafix wrote: »
    Well I think Jaws in TSWLM was pretty cool yes, as do millions of others. Not sure the Craig era has given us a henchman to match Jaws yet.

    I can't remember any of the Craig era henchman. Come to think of it, my memory is a bit fuzzy on the main villains, too.
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited January 2015 Posts: 11,189
    @MajorDSmythe.

    There was the great Elvis of course :p

    Seriously, the man with the machete in CR was very sinister. He wasn't meant to be iconic ala Jaws though.

    I did like his line "Hold out your arm dear beauty, or I will take your head"
  • MajorDSmytheMajorDSmythe "I tolerate this century, but I don't enjoy it."Moderator
    Posts: 13,978
    Machette Man...?

    Jason_Voorhees_in_Jason_Goes_to_Hell.png
    "Armed... and very dangerous."
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    BAIN123 wrote: »

    There was the great Elvis of course :p
    I like the way his pants blew up.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited January 2015 Posts: 23,883
    I'm revisiting this thread after having watched TLD yesterday, and having watched LTK about a month and a half ago.

    Apart from obvious 80's cheese, and somewhat weak female characters (I'm not really a fan of Milovy, Bouvier, and certainly not Lupe - although there's nothing really wrong with them, just a personal opinion) I think both films are very good. I might even say brilliant.

    We are quite privileged to have had Dalton's portrayal as Bond for the time we did IMO. He really was an excellent Bond. Lethal charm and great physicality. I dare say he's just as good if not better than Craig IMO. He definitely more readily looks the part of Fleming's creation.

    I can't really decide among the two movies he made. They are both brilliant.

    TLD is let down by the final part in the Afghan base that just goes on and on....and by Brad Whittaker who was poorly thought out. However it has an absolutely outstanding first 2/3 and the last score by the great Barry. Furthermore, it has some incredible Bondian acting moments exhibited by Dalton - superb stuff in some places.

    LTK is let down by not having Barry (although I really do like Kamen's score, which fits the USA location), & by Soto's Lupe. However, it has the amazing Robert Davi (this guy is just so 'real' as a villian. Only Bean's Trevelyen, Mickelson's Le Chiffre & Almaric's Greene are anywhere as close to being so realistic in the series' history IMO) and of course, Benicio Del Toro.

    I think I'll give the edge slightly to LTK just because it was so daring for its time and looked to really be shaking up the Bond universe. Very brave move by EON. I also actually prefer watching it because it is more balanced quality-wise throughout, while TLD is really let down by Afghanistan. It's very close between them though because in those places where TLD is firing on all cylinders, it's absolutely outstanding.
  • chrisisallchrisisall Brosnan Defender Of The Realm
    Posts: 17,801
    bondjames wrote: »
    I think both films are very good. I might even say brilliant.
    Both are at the top of my list. Which one is ultimately #1 depends richly on which one I most recently viewed.
    ;)
  • GetafixGetafix
    Posts: 11,425
    Bring back Dalton!
  • BAIN123BAIN123
    edited January 2015 Posts: 11,189
    Getafix wrote: »
    Bring back Dalton!

    I saw him on TV last night being blasted in Dr Who.


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