SPECTRE Production Timeline

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Comments

  • Ludovico wrote: »
    HASEROT wrote: »
    my god, are we still complaining about the CGI Komodo Dragons??? Did it really bother and upset so many enough that it ruined the movie??... I could be wrong, but it's probably damn near impossible to train a real life Komodo Dragon.. they are very very very very dangerous and unpredictable animals - especially when the script calls for it to bite a man's leg, drag him off, and eat him.... good luck explaining to your film's insurance investors that you had to have a real one for those scenes - after they attack and kill a man for real...... using live Crocs in LALD was possible, because they weren't required to do anything except crawl around and then have Bond escape by running on their backs - they weren't required to bite a henchman, and then drag him off into the water kicking and screaming - and then kill him...

    And back then they were far less watchful when it came to security with animals or indeed animal cruelty. Stanley Kubrick's daughter kicked a fuss about the snakes in Raiders of the Lost Ark because she thought they were not treated properly, but that was the exception. The scene in LALD would not be done with real alligators anymore.

    Completely agree with @Haserot and @Ludovico here. Has anyone actually seen documentaries about komodo dragons? In any case I'm quite relaxed really. But some people don't relax about a film.....they don't get entertained anymore. Or at least I don't read the positivity and happiness in it anymore. I find that such a pity. But I'm still relaxed :-).
  • HASEROT wrote: »
    it's an impossible shot to pull off practically..

    If you can't do it for real then don't do it at all! Bond movies are not Star Wars or Lord of the Rings, they always should feel real.

    Yes!!! That's the right attitude, both thumps up followed by hefty applause!
  • Posts: 4,619
    But some people don't relax about a film.....they don't get entertained anymore.

    You can like a movie and criticize it at the same time...

  • But some people don't relax about a film.....they don't get entertained anymore.

    You can like a movie and criticize it at the same time...

    You can also over-criticise it and making it appear that you don't like the film anymore.

    But it's good to hear that remark ;-). Despite the flaws that really to a certain extent every Bond film has, I rewatching them at least once a year :-).
  • Murdock wrote: »
    Good thing I don't watch movies to nit pick and be depressed. I watch movies to be ENTERTAINED! Give me a good movie and I'm happy. I don't care if special effects are good or bad. If it's fun and entertaining to be, the +1 for the movie. People are overly critical over little tiny elements or things that lasted a millisecond.

    I don't see no CGI face.
    wJ0Vrnp.jpg

    .

    Well, in my cinema it was one of the very few laughters.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    I really hope Mendes steps up his game in a major way for Bond 24. I'm watching TDK again and as that movie supposedly inspired SF, it's clear as day how vastly superior Nolan's TDK is to Mendes' SF. The balanced use of both cg and practical stunts/effects, the plot, the social commentary and even the villain. It's annoying gearing how Silva is like the Joker because they're nothing alike other than having deformed faces and operating on the wrong side of the law. Ledger ' s joker was phenomenal and dead or alive he deserved that Oscar.
    I'm more than happy for the Bond series to take inspiration from other movies or whatever just so long as the execution of it all is marvellous.
    The use of cg needs to be used sparingly and applied only when absolutely necessary otherwise, like others have said do it for real or don't do it at all. The script needs to be tight, no glaring and riddling plot holes in the script, great score, satisfying utilisation of the Bond girl(s), excellent use of locations which includes studio sets great action and a real sinister, reprobating villain. I don't give a toss where the inspiration cones from just so long all things are aligned brilliantly and we get a fantastic movie.
  • Matt_Helm wrote: »
    Murdock wrote: »
    Good thing I don't watch movies to nit pick and be depressed. I watch movies to be ENTERTAINED! Give me a good movie and I'm happy. I don't care if special effects are good or bad. If it's fun and entertaining to be, the +1 for the movie. People are overly critical over little tiny elements or things that lasted a millisecond.

    I don't see no CGI face.
    wJ0Vrnp.jpg

    .

    Well, in my cinema it was one of the very few laughters.

    Oowh funny, in my cinema the laughter came from the couple saying "He's keen to get home". And the sequence where Bond uses the shovel on the train. And Kincade especially: "Welcome to Scotland" and "You jumped up little Shit". I kinda hope Kincade returns. And I wouldn't be surprised. Perhaps as Bond's housekeeper or concierge?
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    edited November 2014 Posts: 23,883
    I agree with the many above who've said CGI must be used judiciously, seamlessly and very sparingly in a Bond movie.

    Unlike other franchises, Bond has history, and it has a future (it will be around in another 50 yrs for sure). So there is a higher burden of quality on a franchise like this (remember all those bad effects in the early 80's that have really dated some movies from that decade?) because the movies will be rewatched forever. As an example, I just watched FYEO on blu, and was a little disappointed to see those closeups of Roger on the skis following the toboggon now, because the back screen projector is so much more apparent in Blu ray (if they could have forseen blu ray technology 34 yrs ago I'm sure they may have been more careful with the use of back screens then). To this day, I'm stilll amazed at TSWLM because I don't see much back screen stuff there (just amazing models and sets). Agree on Jurassic Park too...outstanding, to this day.

    Sure we're being nitpicky, but I don't think anyone here is suggesting that we don't enjoy these films. My word, we wouldn't be here if we didn't enjoy Bond. We love this series (even those few movies that have descended into near farce), that's why we're here. Our commentary here is ' tough love' for our beloved franchise. Healthy debate is good for all of us, so we get multiple viewpoints and learn from each other's valid opinions. As long as it's never personal.

    As I said, if they can make CGI as good as CR's crane sequence (still get goosebumps when I watch that scene - Campbell and co. shot that beautifully and in a very grand, traditional Bond manner with sweeping long range establishing shots....like a crane moving actually...., because they were confident they were filming the real thing), then I'm sold.
  • bondjames wrote: »
    Sure we're being nitpicky, but I don't think anyone here is suggesting that we don't enjoy these films. My word, we wouldn't be here if we didn't enjoy Bond. We love this series (even those few movies that have descended into near farce), that's why we're here. Our commentary here is ' tough love' for our beloved franchise. Healthy debate is good for all of us, so we get multiple viewpoints and learn from each other's valid opinions. As long as it's never personal.

    Agreed @bondjames :-). Perhaps I'm hoping a bit too much for some happy faces in here. And that comes from me, who said that tough discussions should be possible. I fully agree with you.
  • i think the problem with the close up shot of Bond on the bike on the rooftops in Istanbul is because it was obviously shot in front of a green screen (SF is a great film and I do think this shot is slightly odd). I think it would have been much better had the close up been shot on location with DC riding some sort of bike rig (afterall you don't see the whole bike in the shot). I am wondering if this shot was a last minute insert and as a result had to be shot using greenscreen.
  • doubleoegodoubleoego #LightWork
    Posts: 11,139
    They should have kept the camera pulled back for most of the bike scene on the rooftop.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy My Secret Lair
    Posts: 13,384
    True but you have to have your " Hero" shots.
  • Posts: 15,125
    I would not want a CGI fest like DAD anymore. That said, some CGI is ok. The back screen projector in the early ones, particularly DN, does not bother me at all, in fact it is part of its B movie charm.
  • bondjamesbondjames You were expecting someone else?
    Posts: 23,883
    I think it would have been much better had the close up been shot on location with DC riding some sort of bike rig (afterall you don't see the whole bike in the shot).

    Perfectly said. I'm in total agreement. Bike rigs work really well (remember Arnie in T2?)

    It was a little odd, and maybe there was some reason they had to do it this way (costs or weather or something else).
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,591
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I would not want a CGI fest like DAD anymore. That said, some CGI is ok. The back screen projector in the early ones, particularly DN, does not bother me at all, in fact it is part of its B movie charm.
    No offence, but we've already had this CGI discussion many times throughout this forum, so people who are very keen on discussing CGI can start a new thread devoted to that topic?

  • edited November 2014 Posts: 2,015
    And if I loose myself in positivism on many occasions, then surely @Suivez_ce_parachute looses himself in complete cynicism. I wonder if he really enjoyed watching the recent Bond films. For me it looks like he, and many others in here, left cinema very very disappointed when they saw either CR, QOS or SF for the first time.
    When your only way to respond to other people's opinions is to distort them (I'm far from the only one here to have that treatment), it's because your in a dead-end street. CR is the best recent Bond IMO, I've already wrote it numerous times, I have to go back to TLD to find a contender, I'd say. Let's say that I'm part of the large crowd that prefers CR to SF : just look at the IMDB ratings you keep on talking about - except for that point :)

    About the FYEO vs SF "void scene", your answer is about stunts being unnecessary to Bond. Well, let's choose another elevator scene then.



    Here someone is really above the outside elevator in this DAF scene (and the fact it's Connery is the cherry on the cake), it's not a Bond CG avatar under a lift in a CG building. IMO, once again, here we've got definitely the feeling that Bond is a daredevil, who is not nervous despite being where he is. Something the SF CG scene does not convey at all IMO.

    I can also testify there where laughs in the theater when there was the green screen effect for the motorbike chase. It felt actually so dated. I understand they couldn't mount a faking system on these roofs to have a shot of Craig there, like they did for Naomie Harris driving the car, but then again the result does not work IMO.

    In the same scene, the PTS of SF, we have a "practical" effect, with Harris not really driving the car, but no green screen, she's really there. And we have green screen with Craig not really driving the motorbike on these roofs, but he's not actually there at all. Do you really see no problem if we get more and more of the latter just because you feel it's nevertheless ok ? Here you can't use your tactics to say others are SF hater, because I'm taking two examples that are both in SF :)

    PS : Is there someone here who prefers the CG Patrice fall scene from the movie to the few images of the real stuntman fall from the trailer ? In CR, I think we had zero digital characters. In QOS we had digital characters in one scene (the parachute scene), in SF we had them at least in three scenes (end of PTS, lift scene, Patrice fall). I'm afraid people alas can be worried it's a trend in movies in general. But Bond is not Iron-Man, it's a bit more a problem to go that way IMO. And well, Craig's CG avatar modeling job is already being done, it's less expensive to use it again and again...
  • You've never said something nice to me @Suivez_ce_parachute . Now I'm not fishing for "nice remarks" from your side. But in all honesty....ever since I started a topic early 2012 about Bond 23 having the potential to reach 900 Million Dollar worldwide, you are here to put me in a corner like a stupid kid.

    Moreover, in topics that are more friendly, and where there's generally a nicer atmosphere and a good sense of respect, you're always absent. Perhaps you're right about everything. And then I let you have the truth. But in all honesty, I'm not really reading your remarks anymore.

    By the way......you really really don't understand me. Go ahead if you think that I want to portray others as SF-haters. But those are really YOUR words. Not mine. I at least try to respect others. And agree to disagree. But even agreeing to disagree with you is impossible.
  • edited November 2014 Posts: 2,015
    But in all honesty, I'm not really reading your remarks anymore.
    Then stop answering. I mean, you rarely never answer anyone here :), but stop hitting the "reply" button to distort what other thinks in order to make them sound unable to understand the multi-layered aspects of that stellar Bond movie that only cynical fans (= "those who disagree with me") don't get :)

    The current CGI problem can be summarized by the difference between the Patrice fall in the trailer and the Patrice fall in the movie. I really wonder if someone here is able to say the movie version is the better of the two...

    And then the problem is that, if I'm not wrong, the number of scenes with CG characters instead of actors or stuntmen is : CR + pre-CR : 0, QOS : 1, SF : 3... Once again, I don't mind if zombies in a movie are full CG, but here we're talking about the main characters.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,591
    In think it's safe to say we should stop the CGI discussion for about the 3rd time in this forum. ;)
  • jake24 wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I would not want a CGI fest like DAD anymore. That said, some CGI is ok. The back screen projector in the early ones, particularly DN, does not bother me at all, in fact it is part of its B movie charm.
    No offence, but we've already had this CGI discussion many times throughout this forum, so people who are very keen on discussing CGI can start a new thread devoted to that topic?

    good idea. Not sure if there is a thread just dedicated to the effects work throughout the Bond films or not. This topic along with hundreds of others always go off in different directions§

  • RC7 wrote: »
    This gentleman talks sense, always.

    You should have MP this, don't forget we're supposed to be unable to agree with anyone else, it could come as a shock :)

    About CGI and Bond 24, what we know from our resident Craig experts is that Craig is not really proficient with skiing. And yes, IMO it could be a worry if they plan to go once again with CG face replacment to deal with it. Hopefully it will be skidoos, where you can use more practical effects.
  • mcdonbbmcdonbb deep in the Heart of Texas
    Posts: 4,116
    Got excited ..saw lots of new commentsso assumed news ..right? Nope just rehash of that CGI aargument.
  • Posts: 15,125
    jake24 wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I would not want a CGI fest like DAD anymore. That said, some CGI is ok. The back screen projector in the early ones, particularly DN, does not bother me at all, in fact it is part of its B movie charm.
    No offence, but we've already had this CGI discussion many times throughout this forum, so people who are very keen on discussing CGI can start a new thread devoted to that topic?

    I am not keen on discussing CGI, on the contrary, I think there are more relevant things to discuss. I was just mentioning it as people seem to make such a big fuss about the Komodo dragons.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    Posts: 10,591
    Hopefully it will be skidoos, where you can use more practical effects.
    Or maybe GoPro?

  • But in all honesty, I'm not really reading your remarks anymore.
    Then stop answering. I mean, you rarely never answer anyone here :), but stop hitting the "reply" button to distort what other thinks in order to make them sound unable to understand the multi-layered aspects of that stellar Bond movie that only cynical fans (= "those who disagree with me") don't get :)

    Fuck sake. You remind me of Silva making M's life dire. You really have any nice....empathic....guts??
  • Ludovico wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I would not want a CGI fest like DAD anymore. That said, some CGI is ok. The back screen projector in the early ones, particularly DN, does not bother me at all, in fact it is part of its B movie charm.
    No offence, but we've already had this CGI discussion many times throughout this forum, so people who are very keen on discussing CGI can start a new thread devoted to that topic?

    I am not keen on discussing CGI, on the contrary, I think there are more relevant things to discuss. I was just mentioning it as people seem to make such a big fuss about the Komodo dragons.

    It might not be the proper thread, but for sure it's relevant. We are talking about an all important part of franchise's heritage here.
  • jake24jake24 Sitting at your desk, kissing your lover, eating supper with your familyModerator
    edited November 2014 Posts: 10,591
    Just as a side note, do you think we'll get anymore locations aside from the four countries already confirmed?
  • Posts: 15,125
    Matt_Helm wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    jake24 wrote: »
    Ludovico wrote: »
    I would not want a CGI fest like DAD anymore. That said, some CGI is ok. The back screen projector in the early ones, particularly DN, does not bother me at all, in fact it is part of its B movie charm.
    No offence, but we've already had this CGI discussion many times throughout this forum, so people who are very keen on discussing CGI can start a new thread devoted to that topic?

    I am not keen on discussing CGI, on the contrary, I think there are more relevant things to discuss. I was just mentioning it as people seem to make such a big fuss about the Komodo dragons.

    It might not be the proper thread, but for sure it's relevant. We are talking about an all important part of franchise's heritage here.

    Just like the back screen of old?

    I am joking of course, but my point is that CGI is a topic of relative importance.
  • JWPepperJWPepper You sit on it, but you can't take it with you.
    edited November 2014 Posts: 512
    And if I loose myself in positivism on many occasions, then surely @Suivez_ce_parachute looses himself in complete cynicism. I wonder if he really enjoyed watching the recent Bond films. For me it looks like he, and many others in here, left cinema very very disappointed when they saw either CR, QOS or SF for the first time.
    When your only way to respond to other people's opinions is to distort them (I'm far from the only one here to have that treatment), it's because your in a dead-end street. CR is the best recent Bond IMO, I've already wrote it numerous times, I have to go back to TLD to find a contender, I'd say. Let's say that I'm part of the large crowd that prefers CR to SF : just look at the IMDB ratings you keep on talking about - except for that point :)

    About the FYEO vs SF "void scene", your answer is about stunts being unnecessary to Bond. Well, let's choose another elevator scene then.



    Here someone is really above the outside elevator in this DAF scene (and the fact it's Connery is the cherry on the cake), it's not a Bond CG avatar under a lift in a CG building. IMO, once again, here we've got definitely the feeling that Bond is a daredevil, who is not nervous despite being where he is. Something the SF CG scene does not convey at all IMO.

    I can also testify there where laughs in the theater when there was the green screen effect for the motorbike chase. It felt actually so dated. I understand they couldn't mount a faking system on these roofs to have a shot of Craig there, like they did for Naomie Harris driving the car, but then again the result does not work IMO.

    In the same scene, the PTS of SF, we have a "practical" effect, with Harris not really driving the car, but no green screen, she's really there. And we have green screen with Craig not really driving the motorbike on these roofs, but he's not actually there at all. Do you really see no problem if we get more and more of the latter just because you feel it's nevertheless ok ? Here you can't use your tactics to say others are SF hater, because I'm taking two examples that are both in SF :)

    PS : Is there someone here who prefers the CG Patrice fall scene from the movie to the few images of the real stuntman fall from the trailer ? In CR, I think we had zero digital characters. In QOS we had digital characters in one scene (the parachute scene), in SF we had them at least in three scenes (end of PTS, lift scene, Patrice fall). I'm afraid people alas can be worried it's a trend in movies in general. But Bond is not Iron-Man, it's a bit more a problem to go that way IMO. And well, Craig's CG avatar modeling job is already being done, it's less expensive to use it again and again...

    The DAF elevator scene was a 'inspiration' for Skyfall i think ;-)

  • marketto007marketto007 Brazil
    edited November 2014 Posts: 3,277
    From @FreightexEurope. Looks like the Freightex company transported this boat to the BOND 24 set in Austria.

    nT8nYKb.jpg
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