Seriously now- which is worse, TWINE or DAD

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  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Richards did her job. She showed up, looked hot, played the damsel in distress part well and shagged Bond. Not a brilliant actress but not as terrible as some make out imo.

    Halle Berry is probably a better actress and she's hotter but her lines are really the worst dialouge in the series so Richards is better simply because of that imo.

    No, Richards is really that bad, as is Halle. How she gets a damn Oscar when accomplished and talented people like Gary Oldman have yet to get any recognition what so ever (only 1 nomination out of his whole career) I will never understand. The moment this hit theaters her award should have been taken away. Just astounding when you consider the calibre of Bond girl in both talent and looks (which some people think is all that matters) that the series can get, yet EON resorted to women like them for being the popular topic of the day and nothing of substance underneath.
  • Posts: 15,106
    DAD easily. TWINE is flawed, it has many problems, but it is far better in so many ways. At least it tries, something DAD never does. And Michael Apted is a much better director than Lee Tamahori.
  • edited January 2013 Posts: 12,837
    Richards wasn't playing Tracy or Vesper. She didn't need to be an Oscar winning actress.

    She was the typical "show up, look hot, get kidnapped, shag Bond" girl, and I don't think she was any worse than some girls that had come before. She was just there as eyecandy and she did fine with what she was given.

    Halle Berry has done some good films and some bad films, DAD was a bad film. I haven't seen the film she one an Oscar for but she can't have been awful if she got nominated.

    She's really hot and for the most part like Richards, she's just eye candy. But some of her lines are so terrible it makes her one of, if not the, worst Bond girl ever.
  • edited January 2013 Posts: 414
    TWINE's actually my favorite Brosnan Bond, and DAD is my least.

    TWINE had a compelling plot and interesting villains. Everything in DAD was just way too OTT.

    And at the tender age I saw it at, I was hanging on every word coming off Ms. Richards' lips. Convincing as a nuclear physicist or not.
  • Posts: 269
    I always watch TWINE with great delights, as THE classic bond film from the 1990s. It has his drawbacks (Denise, denise, denise... :( ) but for me, this Bond adventure achieves all I am expecting from a Bond film, and we have this only action sequence in the all franchise which takes place in London (well... that makes 2 of them now). It also has this great scenario, great bondian characters (zukosky, M, Q, even Electra to some extend). Perhaps not as good as in other movie, but good enough for me.

    As for DAD. I always have the feeling, when I'm watching it, that part of the movie is not made for us Bond Fan. Despite all the references to past Bond films, it looks too much of a regular action movie. Bond does not really stand up and looks bored by all these CGI. So I enjoy it as a minor Bond film until it goes to Iceland. I try to enjoy myself for the action on the ice and the gadget. But I always switch off my DVD player after Graves leaves on the Antonov and try to imagine better scenario, involving Jinx and James just staying together in the hot water while Graves plays with his toys with nobody giving a damn.
  • DAD without question. At least TWINE tries to be a good movie at times, even though it fails. DAD on the other hand is just way out of control.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    Richards wasn't playing Tracy or Vesper. She didn't need to be an Oscar winning actress.

    She was the typical "show up, look hot, get kidnapped, shag Bond" girl, and I don't think she was any worse than some girls that had come before. She was just there as eyecandy and she did fine with what she was given.

    Halle Berry has done some good films and some bad films, DAD was a bad film. I haven't seen the film she one an Oscar for but she can't have been awful if she got nominated.

    She's really hot and for the most part like Richards, she's just eye candy. But some of her lines are so terrible it makes her one of, if not the, worst Bond girl ever.

    But it's the Oscars, so yes it's possible. The Academy isn't that great when it comes down to awarding those who truly deserve it and award those who where the best of the lot that year. They can do that, but not before they check to see if they can give an actor or actress a freebie because they maybe talked about this being their last role and the Academy wants to make them feel accomplished or if they want to break a losing streak that an actor or actress has had. Then of course you have to counter that with the possibility of some behind the curtain intrigue meant to edge out one nominee over the other. The Oscars aren't a talent contest...
  • edited January 2013 Posts: 204

    But it's the Oscars, so yes it's possible. The Academy isn't that great when it comes down to awarding those who truly deserve it and award those who where the best of the lot that year.

    I'd second that. In all honesty I feel Oscars are completely overrated and not an actual indicator of anything. There are so many fantastic actors out there, see Bryan Cranston in Breaking Bad for example or even yes, Gary Oldman. Fact of the matter is the Academy is an Old Boy's Club and there are certain types of actors they like - like Philip Seymour Hoffman, Daniel Day Lewis for example, and certain directors, like Paul Thomas Anderson and Kathryn Bigelow who's films they always side towards. I know I'm not explaining myself very well here but basically there are certain types of movies and types of actors that they give Oscars to. Look at 'There Will Be Blood' , 'No Country For Old Men' , 'Before The Devil Knows You're Dead' , 'True Grit' - solid movies, but they all have the same kind of 'weight' and or pacing... It has very little to do with actually being a great or enjoyable movie, or particularly well acted.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    edited January 2013 Posts: 28,694
    In True Grit's defense, it's fantastic. It beats the original to a pulp.
  • Richards wasn't playing Tracy or Vesper. She didn't need to be an Oscar winning actress.

    She was the typical "show up, look hot, get kidnapped, shag Bond" girl, and I don't think she was any worse than some girls that had come before. She was just there as eyecandy and she did fine with what she was given.

    Halle Berry has done some good films and some bad films, DAD was a bad film. I haven't seen the film she one an Oscar for but she can't have been awful if she got nominated.

    She's really hot and for the most part like Richards, she's just eye candy. But some of her lines are so terrible it makes her one of, if not the, worst Bond girl ever.

    But it's the Oscars, so yes it's possible. The Academy isn't that great when it comes down to awarding those who truly deserve it and award those who where the best of the lot that year. They can do that, but not before they check to see if they can give an actor or actress a freebie because they maybe talked about this being their last role and the Academy wants to make them feel accomplished or if they want to break a losing streak that an actor or actress has had. Then of course you have to counter that with the possibility of some behind the curtain intrigue meant to edge out one nominee over the other. The Oscars aren't a talent contest...

    But they wouldn't dare nominate somebody who was terrible. She must've been good in it, even if she didn't deserve an award. I just looked it up and the film got lots of praise.
  • DrNoDrNo North Hollywood, California, USA
    edited January 2013 Posts: 81
    In True Grit's defense, it's fantastic. It beats the original to a pulp.

    WHOA PILGRIM! Not at ALL. The remake brought nothing particularly new to the table. I zoned out halfway through because it was just a total rehash of the original, AND some of my favorite lines ("I would not let a thief in my mouth to steal my brains") were excised. The Duke was a WAY better Rooster Cogburn than Bridges (who don't get me wrong, is a fine actor). True Grit v.2 is just True Grit EXTREME for a modern audience. I recall their being some weird comedic elements the Brothers introduced as well, but I honestly don't even remember. It was only a bit more like the novel in that (I think) it had the 'real' ending. The rest bored me.

    As to The World Is Not Enough and Die Another Day, I actually like them both. As dumb as DAD is, it's a nice looking movie and there are some cool moments, like the sword fight. It's a modern day Roger Moore outing.

    The World Is Not Enough is definitely the better of the two however.

    I kinda think Tomorrow Never Dies is the worst Brosnan outing because it's such a disappointment after GoldenEye, and near misses at every turn. It's got a great cast, but it focuses on the wrong characters, like the stupid blond henchman (instead of the wickedly cool Dr. Kaufman or even Robert Pryce), and Lois Lane instead of Michelle Yeoh.

    Doesn't somebody's head pop through the bottom of a jet fighter at one point? Yeah that one made me sad at the theater.
  • QsAssistantQsAssistant All those moments lost in time... like tears in rain
    Posts: 1,812
    I actually like both films but the worst one is DAD. I actually like the TWINE a lot.
  • Posts: 11,425
    they're both awful
  • MrBondMrBond Station S
    Posts: 2,044
    I do seriously consider to watch TWINE tonight just to see if i change my opinion. It must have been more then a half year since i watched it last time. And as i said earlier, then it didn't impress me.
  • 0BradyM0Bondfanatic70BradyM0Bondfanatic7 Quantum Floral Arrangements: "We Have Petals Everywhere"
    Posts: 28,694
    DrNo wrote:
    In True Grit's defense, it's fantastic. It beats the original to a pulp.

    WHOA PILGRIM! Not at ALL. The remake brought nothing particularly new to the table. I zoned out halfway through because it was just a total rehash of the original, AND some of my favorite lines ("I would not let a thief in my mouth to steal my brains") were excised. The Duke was a WAY better Rooster Cogburn than Bridges (who don't get me wrong, is a fine actor). True Grit v.2 is just True Grit EXTREME for a modern audience. I recall their being some weird comedic elements the Brothers introduced as well, but I honestly don't even remember. It was only a bit more like the novel in that (I think) it had the 'real' ending. The rest bored me.

    As to The World Is Not Enough and Die Another Day, I actually like them both. As dumb as DAD is, it's a nice looking movie and there are some cool moments, like the sword fight. It's a modern day Roger Moore outing.

    The World Is Not Enough is definitely the better of the two however.

    I kinda think Tomorrow Never Dies is the worst Brosnan outing because it's such a disappointment after GoldenEye, and near misses at every turn. It's got a great cast, but it focuses on the wrong characters, like the stupid blond henchman (instead of the wickedly cool Dr. Kaufman or even Robert Pryce), and Lois Lane instead of Michelle Yeoh.

    Doesn't somebody's head pop through the bottom of a jet fighter at one point? Yeah that one made me sad at the theater.

    Have you read Charles Portis's brilliant novel?
  • I really don't get all the hate for TWINE.
    It's a perfectly entertaining Bond movie, great stunts, a nice twist on the villain, a wonderful theme tune, all in all it's a really fun ride.
    I think that TWINE is an unfortunate victim of the revisionist hate towards the Brosnan era in the wake of Casino Royale.
    DAD on the otherhand is a very bad movie but TWINE is great in my opinion.
  • DAD is BAD!
  • Posts: 4,762
    I am actually a little bit surprised that some people view DAD better than TWINE. Granted, I used to think TWINE was the worst of the Brosnan Four, but now that I look at it differently three years later, I see that TWINE truly is superior! If by nothing else, the plot should be enough!
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    With the exception of G.E all of Brosnan's films are junk and his defenders will go to great lengths to support but giving Richards a break is one of the best. She's always been a terrible actress and EON should have known better. Shag piece or not she certainly is not as good as what came before and could quite possibly be the worst actor in a Bond film ever.

    That being said DAD is still narrowly is still the absolutly worst we've had from the series, I'd watch QOS over this any day.
  • edited January 2013 Posts: 11,189
    Halle Berry is pretty dreadful in DAD. I was watching it with my friend the other day and he too said she was bad. Her character is just dire...about 95% of what she said is a wise-crack or a one liner and she tries really hard to upstage Brosnan in their scenes together.

    At least Denise Richards is sort of funny because she is so bad...and her character isn't as obnoxious (despite her cheesey name).

    I say this as a Brosnan defender.
  • AliAli
    Posts: 319
    My problem with DAD is the first half is such a great Bond film and the second half is such a terrible Bond film.

    Same with Tomorrow Never Dies. A great Bond film ruined by an incredibly dull finale.
  • AliAli
    Posts: 319
    Shardlake wrote:
    giving Richards a break is one of the best. She's always been a terrible actress

    She's an actress?!!! I was just staring at her butt for the most part. Much the same as Pierce, not very subtly, when she climbed up a ladder in the missile silo....
  • ShardlakeShardlake Leeds, West Yorkshire, England
    Posts: 4,043
    Ali wrote:
    My problem with DAD is the first half is such a great Bond film and the second half is such a terrible Bond film.

    Same with Tomorrow Never Dies. A great Bond film ruined by an incredibly dull finale.

    I must of missed the half you saw, I thought it was pretty bloody awful but yes the second half is utterly atrocious and in comparison might make the first half not seem so bad but it's all utter rubbish.
  • edited January 2013 Posts: 11,189
    I don't think TND is "a great Bond film" by any means - its littered with cheesey dialogue all the way through - but I agree the first half is considerably better than the second. Its not unwatchable...its just....forgettable.
  • AliAli
    Posts: 319
    BAIN123 wrote:
    its littered with cheesey dialogue all the way through

    THat can't be a criticism aimed at Bond films or we'd never watch them! It's part of the charm, especially Rog and Pierce.
  • Posts: 11,189
    Hmm...true but it seems especially the case in TND. I always wince at the line:"Because when it comes to a choice between you and Elliot I've made my bed...you don't sleep in it anymore"Maybe its Hatcher's delivery but the line sounds really corny.
  • Posts: 3,327
    TWINE is pretty dire, but it just about watchable, whereas DAD is nothing more than an abysmal joke which is utterly unwatchable.

    I flicked over to the Sky Movies 007 channel and caught the scenes at the ice palace towards the end of the movie, and had to switch it off after the now legendary parasurfing scene.

    The fight in the flying lazers scene is nothing short of embarassing, topped off with Jinx's `James, I'll be half the girl I used to be!' during the Star Wars battle. The baddie even has electrical shocks flying out of his hands like the Emperor.

    But when we reach the parasurfing moment, this is when the franchise reaches its all-time low, the gutter, the pits, the bottom of the barrel.

    The CGI looks like it has been rendered on a ZX Spectrum. Anyone who thinks DAD is a great Bond film needs to be tortured for several months like Brozza was at the start of this appalling mess of a movie.
  • TheWizardOfIceTheWizardOfIce 'One of the Internet's more toxic individuals'
    Posts: 9,117
    BAIN123 wrote:
    Hmm...true but it seems especially the case in TND. I always wince at the line:"Because when it comes to a choice between you and Elliot I've made my bed...you don't sleep in it anymore"Maybe its Hatcher's delivery but the line sounds really corny.

    If we're talking shit actresses then Hatcher has to be up there with Richards and Berry. Her delivery is worse than Downing from wide areas. I think they must have spent half the budget on CGI to erase the script thats was in her hands during every shot as the only excuse for such flat intonation is that she was reading them for the very first time during the take and they were on such a rushed schedule they just went with that first effort.
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