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Seriously now- which is worse, TWINE or DAD
We've all heard peoples opinion (could it actually be 50/50?) Let's really break down our reasons though- which is REALLY the worst Bond film, The World is Not Enough, or Die Another Day, and WHY
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As I said before, TWINE may have been melodramatic in places but at least it tried to take itself more seriously and DIDN'T HAVE BOND SURFING ON A GLACIER WITHOUT GETTING HIS HAIR WET.
DAD started off very strongly IMO but fell apart once Bond got to Iceland.
DADDADDADDADDADDADDADDADDADDDADDADDADDA
Pro-TWINE:
- Pre-title Sequence
- Desmond Llewelyn
- Sophie Marceau
- Robbie Coltrane
- Locations
- Ski Chase
- Caviar factory Sequence
- Maiden's Tower Sequence
Pro-DAD:
- Pre-title Sequence
- Sword fight Sequence (Minus Madonna)
- Rosamund Pike
- Cuba Sequence (Until Halle Berry arrives)
- Emilio Echevarría as Raoul
- Ice Palace Production Design
TWINE is the better of the two with much more to offer and much less sub-par material. Although, with TWINE, much of the material doesn't make it much higher than par, either...
*vote for TWINE*
*leaves for indefinitely future*
The PTS to TWINE on its own is better than some Bond films.
The World is Not Enough
Pros:
* Sophie as Electra is gorgeous
* BMW Z8 is a cool car- and potentially within my reach to own one in real life (as opposed to an Aston Martin, lol)
* Good sendoff for Q
* M captured for the first time (should have killed her while they were at it :) )
* Zukofsky is back- loved his line 'why do I suddenly feel like I'm not carrying enough insurance...?'
* Wade is NOT back- should have been freaking Felix in the first damn place...
* Bond kills Electra in cold blood- love when they have Bond do stuff like that!
Cons:
* Brosnan rivals Roger Moore in the horrible fisticuffs department... I felt like I could beat up James Bond in this movie. Bond vs Renard was the worst of all
* Robert Carlyle is a terrific actor, but you certainly wouldn't know it from watching this movie- I dunno, maybe he just needed to make a payment on his new vacation home... but pretty much ever line he said was with terrible delivery and boredom
* The fight at the caviar factory with the helicopter/saw blades could have been way better- most of it looked very 'staged', like the part where he runs towards the camera with the blades right behind him for example
* Didn't like Cleese as R- he got it right in DAD though
* Brosnan adjusting his tie underwater-- and this is at the beginning of the movie, no less!! Were they trying to make people walk out??
* Related to above in 'Pros' : they DESTROYED the cool car!
* Hardly needs mentioning: Denise Richards
* The film as a whole is bland and forgettable- I mean, what do you tell someone about this movie if they haven't seen it, other than, maybe, "it's the last one to have Q", or "this one has the worst Bond girl in the whole series"?
Die Another Day
Pros:
* Probably in the minority here, but I actually like the title song :>
* Made with the series 40th anniversary in mind, and filled with little nods to all the old films- that was fun
* Bond is in an Aston Martin again (but more on that later...)
* They legitimately tried new things and were daring- Bond captured for 13 (14?) months, long hair and beard, going rogue, etc
* Brosnan is pushing 50 but he still looked great, and was very comfortable in the role at this point
* Bond casually saying Buenos Dias to the girl in her hotel room after punching out that ass hole (she was probably relieved)
* Bond pushing that same guy in the wheel chair down the hallway- that makes me laugh everytime!
* Miranda Frost was hot- I was kind of bummed that she ended up being bad
* Speaking of her- that part when her and Bond keep making out after the guards leave also cracks me up
* Ice Palace was a cool set- no pun intended- and I still think the final battle should have taken place there, instead of on the plane
* Generally the whole first half is enjoyable- right up until the part in Bonds office- the VR scene- then it goes south-- and quickly
Cons:
* Halley Berry was atrocious- 50% bad script, 50% just... her. She did look great in that first scene though.... too bad she had to go and speak, and hang around for the rest of the movie lol
* Invisible car- you can give me all the 'it's really possible', 'scientifically' crap you want- it was stupid. That sort of thing belongs in a futuristic Sci-Fi movie, not a Bond movie
* Graves. He sucked. And I distinctly remember the entire theatre erupting with laughter when he turned around with that 'serious' face in that stupid outfit....
* Zao with the diamonds in his face. I get that they were trying to make a typical 'Bond henchman with unique disfigurement' but seriously, why couldn't they just pick the damn diamonds off?
* Movie dragged on waaay too long, by the time they snuck onto the plane near the end I was seriously itching to just go home already
* VR scenes- both of them, were stupid
* Mr. Kil. laziest attempt at a henchmen ever
* Wasted opportunity for an 'anniversary film'- they really should have had older Bond girls- AT LEAST Brosnan's girls-- show up for cameos (Wai Lin was even in the original script) But maybe that's just because I wanted Brosnan to end up with Natalya ;) But seriously, him and Jinx at the end was very 'business as usual' I thought.... they should have tried something new
* Last but not least, CGI surfing. CGI should be used to enhance stunt scenes in Bond movies, if at all- not the ENTIRE scene!!
However, DAD surpasses the TWINE atrocity tenfold. DAD is an absolute travesty and a rape of everything the Bond franchise stands for. The PTS is passable, the song is the worst ever heard in Bond, and it only gets worse. Brosnan is fat after what, 18 months in prison, where he supposedly was fed only sausages 6 times a day. The story is boring, the whole DNA thing is stupid and irrelevant, Graves and Bond act like 4 year olds playing in a sand box, and Jinx outdid Richards as the worst ever Bond girl acted and written. How many times does Bond need to save Jinx's life? 18? And how many times does he escape the ice palace to get back and escape and get back and escape and get back and escape? 48? Oh, and the CGI that looks like it was made by a flunked 12 year old who never saw a computer before. In short, DAD has absolutely no redeeming qualities, barely a few short tolerable moments highlighted by the Q scene.
DAD trumps TWINE in the dumpster.
X_X
ok worse is DAD much much much much much more better is TWINE
Also, I'd be curious to hear all of your thoughts on Roger Eberts 31/2 star review--the highest score he gave any of the Brosnan films:
He calls it a "a splendid comic thriller, exciting and graceful, endlessly inventive."
http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/19991119/REVIEWS/911190304/1023
http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/19870731/REVIEWS/707310304/1023
On the other hand, I found his ** take on FYEO refreshing and interesting:
http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/19810101/REVIEWS/101010326/1023
"FOR YOUR EYES ONLY is a competent James Bond thriller, well-crafted, a respectable product from the 007 production line. But it's no more than that."
(After coming back)
Between Xmas Jones and Jinx, Ms Richards wins everytime. She may have been too young and a pretty bad actress but at least she wasn't irritating like Jinx. I didn't like the whole "hip with the kids/Bond's equal" attitude Ms Berry displayed. Having an agent alongside Bond is a fine idea - in fact I rather liked the Wai Lin character in TND as well as Anya in Spy (despite her fairly poor acting) or Aki in YOLT. However with Jinx there was a whole "trying to be cool" philosophy. It felt juvenile and silly.
DAD's redeeming qualities are found in the first half of the film, but yes as Samuel says everything after Iceland is a write off.
- Maintitle. Nice idea to keep the movie in it.
- Title song.
- Sword fight Sequence.
- Judi Dench as M.
- Michael Kitchen (Tanner Sr.) not be in it, my favorite chacters of earlier movies be runed. I see the new Tanner as Tanner Jr and accepted the return, but only because there no Tanner in DAD.
- DVD. The best of all of them. CR mabey be close, but needed 3 dvd's and missing trailers of the movie. Die Another Day dvd have have higher DD 5.1 EX track it be the only movie with a English DTS, English and Dutch menu choose and this time all extra's have dutch subtitle's and dutch/English booklet. Only con is the datastream, dificult or not to play on Philips players and movie subtitles don't work when you select this option.
- Promotion. Whyle i think it be mabey a litle bit to much and i have liked to see it be done like Twine (4 movie posters, DAD only 2.) it whasn't bad. Atleast the Soundtrack be on time and with the title song, the video making of is on the dvd also. The making of who MTV made with Gargbage is not on the Twine dvd.
Con:
- Les rewatchable. Those days for me a big reasen why Die Another Day be rankt 16/18 of 22. Also there be things i don't make a problem about in the beginning but i do now. Like Bond/Brosnan's meeting with Jinx.
- Jinx and Cuba. She doing things Bond should do. Also there should have done more with it. Don't like it from the start and weak point of P&W. Because the end of QOS is way to short.
- Falco. Worse chacter of the movie. Time who better can have yused for a better Moneypenny and Charles part.
- Zoa. In specialy in the beginning.
- Madonna. Get a lot of atation, but if the movie whas better mabey she isn't the biggest problem.
- The End.
As said mabey a bit to much promotion.
61 minutes of missing music.
Happy Anniversary Mr. Bond. A official made for dvd documentry produced by Fox (who be responsible for all Bond documentry's include Shaken and not Stirred on Ice, From Script To Screen and Twine's James Bond Down River. ) with commentary of David Castell of 30 minutes is not on the dvd. In specialy back in 2002, because Martin Campbell is also seen in this one. Til the UE in 2005 there not be much things about Goldeneye. Also there don't release it on the far worse later Die Another Day ultimate edition. Let's hope there making a part 2 when Bond 23 is release with the last 10 years and at it on the Bond 23 DVD.
Also, TWINE doesn't have Madonna, Jinx, crappy CGI, invisible cars and cheesy 40th anniversary tributes.
Unlike DAD, it ain't fun or imaginative. Just stilted, dull and worthy. Like a Merchant Ivory production. That's its mistake. It can't laugh at itself, so the audience has to do it.
I only saw TWINE once, when it first came out. I said in an earlier thread that my first thought was "A for effort". They tried, they really did, had some great bits and ideas but it just never gelled. I'm rather curious to see it again now to see how I view it all these years later.
My problem with DAD is the first half is such a great Bond film and the second half is such a terrible Bond film. While TWINE is "meh" DAD kind of disappears down a black hole of the two halves canceling each other out.
And speaking of Ebert, remember that this is the guy who gave TLD a bad review and LTK a good review FOR THE SAME REASONS!