SPECTRE: So who's going to play Ernst?

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  • Posts: 3,333
    I understand you may not have been directing the other comment at me; I still am a bit in the dark as to why you felt the need to add it into your original comments.
    Well, if your scroll back and read @Murdock, @GSS, and countless other comments on threads found elsewhere on why Blofeld is considered passé you'll see the connection.
  • bondsum wrote:
    Well, if your scroll back and read @Murdock, @GSS, and countless other comments on threads found elsewhere on why Blofeld is considered passé you'll see the connection.
    I'll take your word for it. I'm sure you knew what you were trying to accomplish.

  • I had this idea that Bond 24 should open mirroring For Your Eyes Only, with Bond finally catching up with Mr. White after some kind of Bondian type chase sequence and dispatching him for his involvement with Vespers death. Mr. White's last words could hint at some truly massive diabolical scheme in the works from Quantum which is headed by a man that frightens even him. That man could be Blofeld or someone new.
    Perhaps he would be revealed in the final act of Bond 24 setting up a cliffhanger for Bond 25. Quantum would be determined to be just a funding arm of the villains true intentions which are some kind of Malthusian plot. At least that's how I'd write it.
  • robotsrule wrote:
    I had this idea that Bond 24 should open mirroring For Your Eyes Only, with Bond finally catching up with Mr. White after some kind of Bondian type chase sequence and dispatching him for his involvement with Vespers death. Mr. White's last words could hint at some truly massive diabolical scheme in the works from Quantum which is headed by a man that frightens even him. That man could be Blofeld or someone new.
    Perhaps he would be revealed in the final act of Bond 24 setting up a cliffhanger for Bond 25. Quantum would be determined to be just a funding arm of the villains true intentions which are some kind of Malthusian plot. At least that's how I'd write it.
    I think that's a pretty solid approach. I'd be interested in seeing it executed.

  • Posts: 122
    Blofeld should return maybe having some kind of meeting with Mr White plotting some evil deed but Bond should not meet him as they do not meet until later on but Blofeld should be part of the new films just in the background.
  • oorogers wrote:
    Blofeld should return maybe having some kind of meeting with Mr White plotting some evil deed but Bond should not meet him as they do not meet until later on but Blofeld should be part of the new films just in the background.
    Initially during Casino Royale I thought Mr. White might be the new Blofeld.

  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    I thought SPECTRE was returning (To my delight) when Mr. White said. "Money isn't as valuable to our organization as knowing who to trust." I dunno. I have mixed feelings about Blofeld and Spectre sometimes. In Dr. No though Thunderball and OHMSS they were realistic and had dangerous plans. In YOLT and DAF They were an OTT Joke who's plans later inspired the Austin Powers movies. The thought of Blofeld is interesting and Quantum is the new Spectre. But I'm just afraid that Bringing Blofeld back would be a bad move and a new reign of Bond Spoofs would come back.
  • Murdock wrote:
    I thought SPECTRE was returning (To my delight) when Mr. White said. "Money isn't as valuable to our organization as knowing who to trust." I dunno. I have mixed feelings about Blofeld and Spectre sometimes. In Dr. No though Thunderball and OHMSS they were realistic and had dangerous plans. In YOLT and DAF They were an OTT Joke who's plans later inspired the Austin Powers movies. The thought of Blofeld is interesting and Quantum is the new Spectre. But I'm just afraid that Bringing Blofeld back would be a bad move and a new reign of Bond Spoofs would come back.
    SPECTRE was, originally, basically a terrorist organization; it seems like that could really be made to play into today's environment.

  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    SPECTRE was, originally, basically a terrorist organization; it seems like that could really be made to play into today's environment.

    Well with Quantum it's pretty much the same. They fund Terrorism while also having a hidden agenda with Manipulating Governments and attempting to get a monopoly on water. We've only seen a small portion of what they are capable. I hope they shall return for Bond 24 and maybe by Bond 25 Craig will have them destroyed in time for his swansong.
  • Murdock wrote:
    I thought SPECTRE was returning (To my delight) when Mr. White said. "Money isn't as valuable to our organization as knowing who to trust." I dunno. I have mixed feelings about Blofeld and Spectre sometimes. In Dr. No though Thunderball and OHMSS they were realistic and had dangerous plans. In YOLT and DAF They were an OTT Joke who's plans later inspired the Austin Powers movies. The thought of Blofeld is interesting and Quantum is the new Spectre. But I'm just afraid that Bringing Blofeld back would be a bad move and a new reign of Bond Spoofs would come back.
    SPECTRE was, originally, basically a terrorist organization; it seems like that could really be made to play into today's environment.

    I could not agree more, Specter or Quantum are perfectly plausible organization in todays world of international terrorism and cyber war. I'm always amaze how skeptical people are about re-introducing Blofeld, even when they like the character and would like to see him again. Sure he would open himself to parody if he was bald and sat in a chair stroking a white pussy-cat, but only an idiot would use that template again. I'm confident that a writer like John Logan could come up with a very new and creative way of interpreting Blofeld as a more sensible, less camp villain who is still evil as all hell. Have some faith, he'll be back, and he'll be better than he ever was.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    edited November 2012 Posts: 16,351
    Bump. While I disagree with the idea of Blofeld returning, I do like the discussion. :)
    tumblr_m8yykrMiKB1r3tqll.jpg
  • Agree think this is an ideal time to bring back Blofeld and would love to see him brough back for the next film which i think is set up ideally and is the right opportuntity to bring him back. Would also love to see Anthony Hopkins portray him.

    Also in my opinion Donald Pleasence will always be Blofeld (up to now anyway ;) )

    + think Quantum should firmly be left alone and quickly forgotten about as with QoS.
  • Posts: 12,526
    MGW and Babs won't abandon Quantum. Whether you like them or not? They are established and will be explored and improved i'm sure. The mistake they made with JANUS was they stated straight away that Trevelyan was its head. Therefore it could not be used again. They will use them again and hopefully get quality villains played by quality actors/actresses to improve there profile.
  • RogueAgent wrote:
    MGW and Babs won't abandon Quantum. Whether you like them or not? They are established and will be explored and improved i'm sure. The mistake they made with JANUS was they stated straight away that Trevelyan was its head. Therefore it could not be used again. They will use them again and hopefully get quality villains played by quality actors/actresses to improve there profile.

    Agreed. I just hope that if they don't make Blofeld the main villain in Bond 24 that they will at least give us a brief introduction that he exists, like in FRWL and TB. Failing to do that would be a grave misstep...
  • Aziz_FekkeshAziz_Fekkesh Royale-les-Eaux
    Posts: 403
    I'm making a prediction now that Bond 24 and 25 will be focussed on the Quantum organization, following the trajectory of the first 5 Connery films. B24 will be a FRWL/TB hybrid where Quantum has a plot of blackmail NATO or something to that effect while trying to assassinate Bond for the damage he caused to the organization in the previous films. A faceless leader would be epic and the end of the film it's revealed the mastermind is Shatterhand. Then B25 concludes the saga and Bond defeats Quantum and Shatterhand once and for all. Craig then gets one last send off film with him battling an independant villain and he retires from the role at 50 in 2018. This would assume B24 is in 2014 and B25 in 2016
  • Posts: 12,526
    I'm making a prediction now that Bond 24 and 25 will be focussed on the Quantum organization, following the trajectory of the first 5 Connery films. B24 will be a FRWL/TB hybrid where Quantum has a plot of blackmail NATO or something to that effect while trying to assassinate Bond for the damage he caused to the organization in the previous films. A faceless leader would be epic and the end of the film it's revealed the mastermind is Shatterhand. Then B25 concludes the saga and Bond defeats Quantum and Shatterhand once and for all. Craig then gets one last send off film with him battling an independant villain and he retires from the role at 50 in 2018. This would assume B24 is in 2014 and B25 in 2016

    Don't know much about Shatterhand? However i would happily go with the rest of your post! :-bd And just too add to it? Use one if not two unused Fleming titles whilst Craig stays with the role? [-O<
  • I think the only good Fleming title left is Risico. Property Of A Lady would be alright too I suppose.

    I think the Hilderbrand (probably spelt wrong I know) Rarity sounds terrible and like QOS, would just be using a Fleming title for the sake of it. I think just because a title is Fleming, it doesn't make it better.
  • Blofeld is 007's greatest foe & Casino Royale was a reboot/remake, they could bring him back. But at the same time, Blofeld was Sean Connery's villan. I like to see fresh Bond villians in Bond films.
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    If they reboot Blofeld, I'd love to see a return of the Anthony Dawson Blofeld.
  • RogueAgent wrote:
    I'm making a prediction now that Bond 24 and 25 will be focussed on the Quantum organization, following the trajectory of the first 5 Connery films. B24 will be a FRWL/TB hybrid where Quantum has a plot of blackmail NATO or something to that effect while trying to assassinate Bond for the damage he caused to the organization in the previous films. A faceless leader would be epic and the end of the film it's revealed the mastermind is Shatterhand. Then B25 concludes the saga and Bond defeats Quantum and Shatterhand once and for all. Craig then gets one last send off film with him battling an independant villain and he retires from the role at 50 in 2018. This would assume B24 is in 2014 and B25 in 2016

    Don't know much about Shatterhand? However i would happily go with the rest of your post! :-bd And just too add to it? Use one if not two unused Fleming titles whilst Craig stays with the role? [-O<

    Shatterhand is the name which Blofeld takes on in YOLT the novel to hid his identity from the world, and I would love it if they used that name in a film for once.

    As for Blofeld being "Sean's villain" I think thats rubbish! Sean is the essential Bond character, and to bring some of that magic back is paramount to this new re-boot era! Sure a bald man with a white cat is old fashioned, but if they re-imagined the Blofeld character in a 21st century way, he could be the perfect villain. It is however all up to Lgan as the writer of Bond 24...
  • MurdockMurdock The minus world
    Posts: 16,351
    Here's an artist rendition of Blofeld as described in Fleming's novels.
    blofelds.jpg
    For the "Fat Bully" Blofeld I'd say John Goodman. His performance in The Big Lebowski shows he can play a rather crazy threatening Character. for the "Gameshow Host/Des Lynam" Blofeld, I'd say Brent Spiner. He can play a good villain too.
  • Posts: 3,333
    The Des Lynam illustration looks more like Richard Kiel with long white hair and a tash. Also where are the "dark-tinted glasses" that Blofeld wears in OHMSS?
  • I think the only good Fleming title left is Risico. Property Of A Lady would be alright too I suppose.

    I think the Hilderbrand (probably spelt wrong I know) Rarity sounds terrible and like QOS, would just be using a Fleming title for the sake of it. I think just because a title is Fleming, it doesn't make it better.

    I think there is another option available; they could use some of Fleming's chapter titles as movie titles. For example, Night Passage, Dragon Spoor, Killing Ground, or A Shower of Death might work as Bond movie titles.

  • edited December 2012 Posts: 135
    If they reinvent Blofeld for the Craig Era, they should re-imagine his white cat into an OCELOT. It's like a small, awesome lap jaguar!

    cute-ocelot.jpeg

    Salvador Dali even kept one as a pet back when it was legal to do stuff like that!
    dali_cat_2.jpg
  • bond50bond50 Banned
    Posts: 42
    BLOFELD IS THE BEST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • Posts: 15,125
    marymoss wrote:
    GSS wrote:
    Murdock wrote:
    Why does it have to be Blofeld? Why can't it be a new and more original villain? Blofeld had his chance. Reboot or not, EoN's not going to remake or reuse old villains. It's a step down really. Blofeld was Connery's villain. Bald guys stroking cats is a thing of the past and besides Blofeld inspired Dr. Evil. Younger people won't get it and only think Bond was ripping off Austin Powers now. We don't need to rehash old villains. But that's not to say EoN can't create a Blofeldesque villain. and no offence but today's generation of movie goers would laugh at a name like Blofeld. He was a 60's villain and seeing as he was used in 007 Legends, It's most likely he won't be appearing in Bond movies again fortunately.

    Totally agree with this, especially the point about newer audiences associating Blofeld with the Austin Powers films which would really undermine a serious 007 movie. No, I think that Ernst Stavro Blofeld should remain in the past I think.

    But is a young audience going to know that Dr. Evil was inspired by Blofeld? Also, Blofeld doesn't have to be bald, short, or have a pet of any kind. In fact, it's better that he's Blofeld in name only. But the numerous Sherlock Holmes have each had their own Morariaty's so I don't see why a modern audience can't have Blofeld.

    What he said. Modern audiences don't even know the name of Blofeld, they know the parodised image of Blofeld. You have a man named Blofeld looking like the novel's Blofeld, and nobody will make the connection but us Bond fans.
  • Posts: 15,125
    RogueAgent wrote:
    MGW and Babs won't abandon Quantum. Whether you like them or not? They are established and will be explored and improved i'm sure. The mistake they made with JANUS was they stated straight away that Trevelyan was its head. Therefore it could not be used again. They will use them again and hopefully get quality villains played by quality actors/actresses to improve there profile.

    So I am not the only one thinking it was the mistake with GE and the whole Brosnan era: failing to create a recurring enemy. Trevelyan could have easily been the commander in the field of Janus while the head of the organisation would have returned in a subsequent movie. With obviously some changes, TWINE could have easily been a follow up on GE (and maybe a better movie).
  • RC7RC7
    edited December 2012 Posts: 10,512
    Ludovico wrote:
    RogueAgent wrote:
    MGW and Babs won't abandon Quantum. Whether you like them or not? They are established and will be explored and improved i'm sure. The mistake they made with JANUS was they stated straight away that Trevelyan was its head. Therefore it could not be used again. They will use them again and hopefully get quality villains played by quality actors/actresses to improve there profile.

    So I am not the only one thinking it was the mistake with GE and the whole Brosnan era: failing to create a recurring enemy. Trevelyan could have easily been the commander in the field of Janus while the head of the organisation would have returned in a subsequent movie. With obviously some changes, TWINE could have easily been a follow up on GE (and maybe a better movie).

    I see where you're coming from but I guess, particularly during the Brosnan era, they were aware that the stability they had in the earlier films and the 80's (with Glen) had all but disappeared. It was obvious that they would be changing up Directors from film to film and they only really settled on P+W with TWINE (which may not have lasted).

    For that reason alone I think it's difficult to create a story element, be it an organisation or a specific character and expect future director's to step in and continue the through line. I mean, even the cutting of QoS by Forster was an admission that the then future director of Bond 23 may not want to resolve the issue of Quantum. This isn't to say Quantum won't return but unless writers and directors are locked in for multiple pictures I think it's hard to incorporate this level of continuity. The spectre of old was a cartoon cut-out to all extents, they never really nailed the wealth of detail Fleming had instilled in the organisation through his novels. The kind of detail that I believe would have to be incorporated to really grab a modern cinema audience.

    Basically, the pictures can't work like they did back in the day. They'd have to put some real work into making Quantum, Spectre, whoever, relevant and exciting for the audience. The simple fact that Quantum made little impact in QoS was reason enough for them to break away. All that being said, the character has to come first, the organisation and scheme second. If they can combine the two then they could be on to something great. In my personal opinion reviving Quantum just because they happen to have been established in previous films is not reason enough to bring them back. If it doesn't work, leave it and move on. If they have a great way to bring it back with a bang then I'm all for it.
  • Posts: 12,526
    RC7 wrote:
    Ludovico wrote:
    RogueAgent wrote:
    MGW and Babs won't abandon Quantum. Whether you like them or not? They are established and will be explored and improved i'm sure. The mistake they made with JANUS was they stated straight away that Trevelyan was its head. Therefore it could not be used again. They will use them again and hopefully get quality villains played by quality actors/actresses to improve there profile.

    So I am not the only one thinking it was the mistake with GE and the whole Brosnan era: failing to create a recurring enemy. Trevelyan could have easily been the commander in the field of Janus while the head of the organisation would have returned in a subsequent movie. With obviously some changes, TWINE could have easily been a follow up on GE (and maybe a better movie).

    I see where you're coming from but I guess, particularly during the Brosnan era, they were aware that the stability they had in the earlier films and the 80's (with Glen) had all but disappeared. It was obvious that they would be changing up Directors from film to film and they only really settled on P+W with TWINE (which may not have lasted).

    For that reason alone I think it's difficult to create a story element, be it an organisation or a specific character and expect future director's to step in and continue the through line. I mean, even the cutting of QoS by Forster was an admission that the then future director of Bond 23 may not want to resolve the issue of Quantum. This isn't to say Quantum won't return but unless writers and directors are locked in for multiple pictures I think it's hard to incorporate this level of continuity. The spectre of old was a cartoon cut-out to all extents, they never really nailed the wealth of detail Fleming had instilled in the organisation through his novels. The kind of detail that I believe would have to be incorporated to really grab a modern cinema audience.

    Basically, the pictures can't work like they did back in the day. They'd have to put some real work into making Quantum, Spectre, whoever, relevant and exciting for the audience. The simple fact that Quantum made little impact in QoS was reason enough for them to break away. All that being said, the character has to come first, the organisation and scheme second. If they can combine the two then they could be on to something great. In my personal opinion reviving Quantum just because they happen to have been established in previous films is not reason enough to bring them back. If it doesn't work, leave it and move on. If they have a great way to bring it back with a bang then I'm all for it.

    Although you make very good points RC7, the logic applies to Spectre and Blofeld surely? As this thread suggests it doesn't matter what Bond24 is? The villain HAS to be Blofeld? Makes no sense to me? Also you here Craigs Bond is a reboot, new timeline......etc. Then Blofeld will not appear in the Craig era. Especially seeing as the next one will be his 4th of 5. Why reintroduce an iconic charactor so late in a tenure? If they do it? It will happen with a new Bond.
  • DarthDimiDarthDimi Behind you!Moderator
    edited December 2012 Posts: 24,187
    I'm fairly neutral to the suggestion myself. I can see them bring back Blofeld AND make him terrific and unexpectedly menacing again. But I don't think it's mandatory to have Blofeld be the villain for Bond 24. With certain older elements now firmly re-established in SF, we must be careful not to overdo things. I'm sure there's a lot of things from the old days that make people's 'wanted' list but to systematically re-introduce everything feels a bit wrong to me. I still prefer some fresh material, you know. ;-) Also, when one works too much from nostalgia, things are bound to disappoint. We would all be bringing huge expectations to such a reunion with a very big element from the past, like Blofeld, and the final outcome, spawned from the minds of the screenwriters, couldn't possibly be exactly what we hoped it would and would thus only be a let-down.
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